Ensemble - 7+ Channels feat. the King Coax and little brother Rex

[technodanvan]

Well, I'm still looking for adequate speaker feet and may have to settle for something made by a local machinist to match the base. However, I think I've found what I need to connect the base to the speaker itself. It's a bit 'thicker' than I would like at 3/4", but I'm thinking ~6 of these per speaker should fit the bill. The rubber is 50A durometer neoprene, at least on the model selected.




Current base model with no through holes for bolts and such.


And with the speaker on it. This provides a 1/2" lip around all sides, with 1.5" radius on all curves. Projected weight at 1" thick is 65 pounds, though I'm wondering if 3/4" would look better with the 3/4" gap that will be present between the base on the speaker. It'll probably depend on the selected feet.

[JonMarsh]

Interesting, Danny! Got a link?

[technodanvan]

This is the one I selected, but they have many others. https://www.mcmaster.com/9213K34/

Edit: I'm also thinking that if I countersink the dampers I could get the gap to around 1/4".

[JonMarsh]

I found some parts too, that I like, a male/female combo, more flexibility about the lower attachment hardware. Thanks for the link.

[technodanvan]

I think I looked at those as well and decided this would be better for lining things up. I ended up ordering a slightly different model with shorter threaded bits.

[technodanvan]

A bit closer. The intent here is to partially countersink the vibration dampers into the steel, with a corresponding countersink in the wood at the bottom of the speaker as well. This should minimize the gain in height from using the dampers. I may add a small countersink at the bottom of these holes to hide the washer that will be used with a vibration-resistant acorn nut. I still don't know what the feet will look like...I still like the idea of having the option to descend a spike from the inside of the foot, but I just don't have the skill in CAD to make that happen.



Edit: This is starting to look like something that would fit in my living room.

[technodanvan]

Man, I've had a rough week. Besides personal and work issues, I have discovered steel is, unfortunately, cost prohibitive (at least from the first local vendor to respond to me). I'm not quite giving up on it yet, but I am now looking at 6061 Aluminum too as it's about 2/5ths the price - and still not cheap, of course. But things are moving forward nonetheless, and I think I may have a solution for the feet that sort of follows Steve's methodology for speaker cabinets. Stacked disks of the same material as the base with neoprene between all metal parts, plus hard rubber on the bottom. I'm not a fan of the latter - rubber with adhesive is bound to fail eventually - so I'm trying to determine if solid rubber can be inserted in a hollow disk.



Edit: Perhaps I should add some color to the mix like KEF did...

[JonMarsh]

Sorry about the work and personal issues- life is something that raise the challenge level at times, doesn't it?

[technodanvan]

Life is certainly an interesting ride, sometimes akin to a rollercoaster.

[theSven]

Sending positive vibes over to you in the desert. The blue look with that is fantastic with the feet!

[JonMarsh]

Cool concept! As one can see, not a trivial effort at all, but very interesting! What sort of floor base will these speakers be installed at?

[technodanvan]

These will, at least initially, be resting on a tile floor. I have been trying to plan for other surfaces as well so it may be that I have the machine shop make some matching spikes for future use. At least in the case of the blue variant, I would use chromed hardware (nuts and bolts) throughout the rest of the design so I could just opt to use the chrome Dayton spikes, potentially.

The blue is growing on me, and my wife is supportive. I asked the CNC guy to provide some pictures of his blue though as these renders are probably too pretty to be real.

Edit: I have also been thinking about hiding a second set of dampers within the feet. I am uncertain if that would provide any value.

[theSven]

These will, at least initially, be resting on a tile floor. I have been trying to plan for other surfaces as well so it may be that I have the machine shop make some matching spikes for future use. At least in the case of the blue variant, I would use chromed hardware (nuts and bolts) throughout the rest of the design so I could just opt to use the chrome Dayton spikes, potentially.

The blue is growing on me, and my wife is supportive. I asked the CNC guy to provide some pictures of his blue though as these renders are probably too pretty to be real.

Edit: I have also been thinking about hiding a second set of dampers within the feet. I am uncertain if that would provide any value.

Can you share the blue designs that you get. I and others may be interested in this as well.

[technodanvan]

Sure thing, I asked for both blue and gold, but they can also do red and black (and clear) at this location.

[Steve Manning]

Hey Danny .... sorry about the crappy week, I can relate on occasion.

On another note, you might want to check with 80/20 for aluminum machining and anodizing. They might be able to offer a better price than your local machine shop.

Also, as a thought for a little dampening you could consider placing some o-rings between those discs. Sort of like this ....

[technodanvan]

Can you share the blue designs that you get. I and others may be interested in this as well.

He actually had photo of 'swatches', of sorts. I think these are showing a bit of grain - I'd have everything bead blasted first then anodized for a smoother look.

On another note, you might want to check with 80/20 for aluminum machining and anodizing. They might be able to offer a better price than your local machine shop.

Also, as a thought for a little dampening you could consider placing some o-rings between those discs. Sort of like this ....

Does 80/20 do anything other than T-slot extrusions? That would certainly be a more affordable option, however it would look awfully industrial in comparison.

I am considering O-rings, but that would necessitate an extra step on the CNC - I am unaware if that has a negative cost impact. My original plan was to use neoprene washers. Not for damping really (I mean, the foot structure will be bolted together and should be fairly rigid) but to keep the metal from scratching.

In other bad - or potentially good? - news, the dampers I purchased have threads that are too short for the task of bolting the base to the speaker. However, I had been contemplating the use of dampers in the feet as well, so maybe I can repurpose them. Maybe.

[Steve Manning]

He actually had photo of 'swatches', of sorts. I think these are showing a bit of grain - I'd have everything bead blasted first then anodized for a smoother look.





Does 80/20 do anything other than T-slot extrusions? That would certainly be a more affordable option, however it would look awfully industrial in comparison.

I am considering O-rings, but that would necessitate an extra step on the CNC - I am unaware if that has a negative cost impact. My original plan was to use neoprene washers. Not for damping really (I mean, the foot structure will be bolted together and should be fairly rigid) but to keep the metal from scratching.

In other bad - or potentially good? - news, the dampers I purchased have threads that are too short for the task of bolting the base to the speaker. However, I had been contemplating the use of dampers in the feet as well, so maybe I can repurpose them. Maybe.

They will do custom machining based on your drawings.

[technodanvan]

I think I'm almost done with the design for the aluminum parts. Despite what is shown below, everything would be anodized blue. I really wanted to make decorative rings for each drivers and PR as well, but unless I figured out how to hide magnets and/or use adhesive to attach them I'm not sure it'd be possible. Running a bolt through the ring and the speaker could work for the Anarchy but not for the King Coax or PR. I'm open to ideas!

This is the first idea shown for the terminal plate. I wanted enough room that I could have something etched there. Unsure what that will be at the moment. Terminal spacing is exactly that from the Dayton Audio aluminum plates. Again, I'm open to ideas!

Edit: The plan is to no use these as dampers between the speaker and base: https://www.mcmaster.com/93945K132/
The threaded parts will be screwed into brass inserts at the bottom of the speaker, which will also be countersunk some 0.35" to help hide the damper. Then I'll run a bolt through the bottom of the base into the bottom of the damper.

[Scareurpasenger]

I am curious what the final cost will be. I am not excited about the other premade options out there. I was also thinking that a small slab of granite or marble might work well. You can find remnants pretty cheap/free and they are heavy, flat and workable with diamond cutting tools.

[technodanvan]

The cost is still prohibitive, even with the aluminum choice over stainless steel. I'm still looking into other options, but bottom line is we're probably looking at over a grand per side all told. This is largely due to the small quantities needed - the price per side drops significantly if I ordered, say, six sets instead of two (for surround sound towers). The only reason I'm considering this option is because these will be going in our living room, at least initially. I don't want to say cost is no object since obviously I didn't want to drop the cash for stainless, but it is kind of important for these end up looking pretty sharp.

I'm also not super thrilled about the consumer stands/bases/feet that are available, despite designing something that is basically a glorified version of this: https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton...772?quantity=1

Granite or marble could be nice as well, and possibly something I could DIY.

[technodanvan]

Another day, another render (or two!). My wife suggested that we need something on the front to break up the vast open spaces of white, and she okayed my solution below. Also shown in gray, as she seemed hesitant about the white itself. These would, of course, be mirrored on the other speaker.

Edit: My wife likes the gray "100% better" than the white. Guess I'm making more changes...except that the coax is also white, so maybe in the end that would look odd.

Edit 2: Updated the second pic with a better one. Note that the accents would be made from 1/4" aluminum rod.

[theSven]

Another day, another render (or two!). My wife suggested that we need something on the front to break up the vast open spaces of white, and she okayed my solution below. Also shown in gray, as she seemed hesitant about the white itself. These would, of course, be mirrored on the other speaker.

Edit: My wife likes the gray "100% better" than the white. Guess I'm making more changes...except that the coax is also white, so maybe in the end that would look odd.

Edit 2: Updated the second pic with a better one. Note that the accents would be made from 1/4" aluminum rod.

You already have the big white sub towers... What about a slightly lighter gray?

[JonMarsh]

The cost is still prohibitive, even with the aluminum choice over stainless steel. I'm still looking into other options, but bottom line is we're probably looking at over a grand per side all told. This is largely due to the small quantities needed - the price per side drops significantly if I ordered, say, six sets instead of two (for surround sound towers). The only reason I'm considering this option is because these will be going in our living room, at least initially. I don't want to say cost is no object since obviously I didn't want to drop the cash for stainless, but it is kind of important for these end up looking pretty sharp.

I'm also not super thrilled about the consumer stands/bases/feet that are available, despite designing something that is basically a glorified version of this: https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton...772?quantity=1

Granite or marble could be nice as well, and possibly something I could DIY.

Not necessarily, re white and gray- the soft light gray allows the other colors (drivers, accents, etc) to draw more attention, and I think that's a positive.

[technodanvan]

Thanks for the comments guys. I've been playing around with various grays and have determined I like most of them. I think a medium to light satin gray is the path forward. This is probably a cost savings as well - I was going to go glossy white, but I'm pretty certain I wouldn't like that finish with gray. Final drawings submitted to the CNC folks to get some quotes.

[JonMarsh]

This is a very nice looking concept. I'll be very curious to hear what it ends up costing you to implement. Me, I have a low buck idea I'm going to try out initially, that will use wood to enhance the cosmetics but not for the basic strength. A nascent idea, but some of the parts are here already.

I've been catching up on a lot of domestic stuff since spending so much of the last six weeks on the road- starting to do serious re-org on the workshop portion of the garage. I'm itching to get going on the LF cabinets..

[technodanvan]

Well Jon, like most of my work this project is still in a state of flux. I've been chatting with Steve Manning and we discovered a few things about the baffle. First, I had the diameter wrong for the woofers - I suspect I had the Misco dimensions in this model, which are notably smaller. Second, I had not taken into account the height of the base when positioning the coaxial, resulting in it being located a bit higher than preferred. These two fixes have resulted in a bit of a different look for the speaker. Attached is an image Steve sent me, I have not gone to the effort of developing the rest of the cabinet at this time.

[JonMarsh]

Well, my sympathy for sure; it's another real life example of "slow work takes time"!

The workshop re-arranging is finished, and tomorrow will start some of the fresh wood working! With updating one of the MF-HF cabinets for the SMJ-40.

[Steve Manning]

Here ya go Danny .... some sawdust has been made! Getting the blank pieces cut to rough size for the baffles.

[technodanvan]

Glad to see some progress! I'm sitting with the rest of the pieces cut down and glued up but not shaped to size yet. I'm starting to have my doubts I can get this done by October...cabinets shouldn't be too much of a problem (though they may go 'naked' without paint) but the crossover will be an issue unless I get this turned around quickly. Also, the bases may take longer than I thought, I'm having a few communication issues with the vendor.

[Steve Manning]

I have the first set in clamps while the glue dries now. I'm bouncing back and forth while epoxy dries on Sven's crossovers and these baffles. I'm hoping to get them through the CNC by the end of the weekend ..... assuming Mr Murphy stays away!

[Steve Manning]

Despite the heat some progress has been made. Fabrication, glue up's are done and threaded inserts installed. Shipping boxes have arrived so hopefully these will get picked up by UPS This week.

[masterofnone]

NICE work on the baffles Steve Manning!

[theSven]

NICE work on the baffles Steve Manning!

LoL, posted that with the admin account 😂. But yes the baffles look great. How heavy are they? They look 1.5" thick, or is it more?

[Steve Manning]

LoL, posted that with the admin account 😂. But yes the baffles look great. How heavy are they? They look 1.5" thick, or is it more?

There are actually 3 layers of 18mm BB so just under 2.25". I'll let you know on the weight .... I bought an inexpensive set of scales for shipping, I just haven't weighed them yet.

[JonMarsh]

I'm guessing shipping will be a bit "painful"... but considering the quality of work, well worth it.

[technodanvan]

Beautiful work as always Steve, can't wait to see them in person.

[theSven]

Beautiful work as always Steve, can't wait to see them in person.

Early Christmas!!

[Steve Manning]

Thanks gents ..... and to answer the question, they weigh 22.5 lbs each.

[JonMarsh]

Now, if only I can get all the "Honey do's" out of the way and finish up the shop area re-org and make some progress like this!

[technodanvan]

Well it's been about a month so I suppose I should give an update. I received the baffles Steve made for me and, despite the best (worst?) attempts from UPS, they arrived in 99.9% perfect condition. The remaining 0.1% is an inside corner that got roughed up a bit, but it shouldn't matter since they're oversize anyway. I currently have them clamped together, as per Steve's suggestion, to hopefully alleviate any warping due to some fairly extreme differences in humidity between production sites. Steve doesn't know it yet, but I might go ahead and have him make me three more baffles. Or five more. Need to count how many Anarchies I still have since it kinda seems like they're out of production these days...or I need to find an alternative.

I have many other parts cut down to size, including the braces, but I need to carve out some holes and such yet. That'll be my first step (probably) when I pick this up again. I need to trim the sides to size and realized either I'd need to use my tracksaw to do it on the floor with 'meh' precision and repeatability (and an increase in associated back pain), or I could get another MFT table from Festool to give me enough room for consistent repeatable cuts. I went with the latter. Boy are they proud of their tables, I swear they've gone up in price by 50% since I got my first one. But they look really nice together and the extra space will certainly help in other projects too.

I don't think I'm shooting for completion by IowaDIY anymore, and I might not even go at all this year. Between work, the extra heat Las Vegas is starting to get known for, health stuff, and other personal things it's been difficult to get out to the garage. I'm hoping to work on it tomorrow morning but don't want to force myself - that'll just lead to mistakes and stress. I also need to figure out how to measure/test everything in such a fashion that JonMarsh can help with crossover design. Not a trivial task for my feeble little brain to handle!

Despite a few setbacks, I do have some accomplishments/acquisitions to report:

1. I believe I have the CNC shop identified that will craft the bases and terminal plates for me. Waiting on a quote today. This is important as I had previously been worried I couldn't find a shop that would do small orders at reasonable cost...meaning back to the drawing board on the bases. I was thinking about doing a hardwood thing but I'm sticking with the original plan for now.
2. I've lost 45 pounds over the last three months. I want to lose another 45+ to hit my target weight (I'm basically at pre-COVID weight now) but in general I feel a lot better already. Semaglutide is something of a miracle drug, but between the drug itself and the 1,000-1,200 calories per day I'm consuming I don't have much extra energy for garage stuff.
3. I recently received a little inheritance. Instead of speakers or tools, I have invested in a newer, larger Synology NAS for all my media. Synology is also very proud of their products, and I made the difficult decision to even spring for their branded enterprise drives to ensure no problems with warranty service over the next five years. I am still in the phase where I'm wondering if I made the right decision...an Asustor NAS plus Seagate Exos enterprise drives would have been far more cost-effective...but I'm familiar with the Synology environment and have been impressed with the products and services I've received over the last ten years. I'm currently migrating all my media to the new system which will take at least another week as I have around 100TB to move from various other drives. I have a backlog of 4K media to rip so I'm looking forward to getting back to that. If anyone is looking for an older NAS or a bunch of 16TB hard drives, let me know!

I think that's all the updates for now. No pics unfortunately, so apologies for all the text.

[technodanvan]

Minor progress! Just providing pics since there isn't all that much to show...just some braces getting cut down.

[JonMarsh]

Slow work takes time, but you’re making progress!

[technodanvan]

More progress!


Laying things out...


Drilling a 1/8" hole...


Getting everything ready...measuring once, cut twice, right? That's how it goes?


PR measure about 266mm, but I need a hair more than that since these will be painted. Looking good...



PR measure about 36mm thick (according to a busted caliper - otherwise it's around 9), so I needed a full depth hole at my stop point. Going a little deeper...

[technodanvan]

Checking hole depth....looking good. Dunno why this thing is reading wrong, but here we are.



And we have the beginnings of a hole! I probably shouldn't have gone full depth in one pass, got a little tearout here and in others before I started doing a two pass thing. No matter.

[JonMarsh]

Hey Danny,

How do you like your Digital calipers? I bought one, but then found my original decimal and fractional dial calipers, and I find the latter so much easier to use (color me old school, I suppose!

[technodanvan]

Hey Danny,

How do you like your Digital calipers? I bought one, but then found my original decimal and fractional dial calipers, and I find the latter so much easier to use (color me old school, I suppose!

I like them enough I suppose, though this is certainly not top of the line. It is, however, large enough to use on larger drivers which is nice. I really like being able to swap between metric and imperial as it can make life easier.

Mine must have dust or something in it though, leading to the odd measurements. It only happens at that one spot though - longer measurements are dead on as far as I can tell.

[Steve Manning]

I like them enough I suppose, though this is certainly not top of the line. It is, however, large enough to use on larger drivers which is nice. I really like being able to swap between metric and imperial as it can make life easier.

Mine must have dust or something in it though, leading to the odd measurements. It only happens at that one spot though - longer measurements are dead on as far as I can tell.

Danny, spray and wipe the body of the calipers down with a good coat of WD40. I had mine (same brand) do the same thing. Fired off an email to manufacturer and that's what they told me to do. Works like a charm, no idea why?

[JonMarsh]

Trust the machinist mate.

[technodanvan]

Interesting, that seems to have worked. Thanks Steve!

[technodanvan]

We're starting to get somewhere. I really don't like making holes. I don't know why...maybe just too many times busting a cheap router bit while doing it or something. Either way, it takes me a bit to do this part as I only do 1-2 holes per 'session', though there may be several such sessions per day. This is a big reason I like having Steve help out with multi-element baffles.

Edit: I also tend to do each step "all at once", meaning once I choose the step (in this case, cutting the PR holes) I pretty much stick to doing that until it's done. What I should do is start gluing up braces on the completed sides, but then I have to manage multiple paths simultaneously. While that is technically my day job...I prefer simple and less stress here. Too many times I just wing things and find out that maybe I should have done something else first.

[technodanvan]

First rabbet was complete, so I had to do a test fit....looks pretty good! I see some room for improvement in my workflow but I can't really argue with the end result. Too hot to continue tonight, have to do a few more in the morning.