New Build Thread - Ardent D by SMJ

[JimS]

Well, now that Steve's pile of oddly-shaped wood is looking much closer to a few really nice subwoofer enclosures (congrats Sven), it's likely time to begin to turn his attention to some Ardent D cabinets .

Plan for this build is based on what Jon is listening to in the living room right now, Ardent D in an Avalon-style cabinet with NOS DA25TX, RS52ANs, and AS168s with Duelund crossover. Cabinets will be built by Steve with rock maple baffles and I'm planning on tinted finish. Drivers are either in hand (or in Jon's storage) and will need to begin pulling parts together for crossovers soon.

For more backstory and education on the design and Duelund approach, the development thread is: Ardent D (aka Kurosawa Jr) Winter Camp

Looking forward.....

[theSven]

Looking forward to see this build develop. It's nice to see another Ardent D project from a forum member as well, especially one that lives close to me that I can go listen!

[JonMarsh]

I bet you're going to have some fun with this... I've enjoyed updating some of the crossovers, for the NOS RS52AN, and these are just a nice size system, IMO- sort of a "Goldilocks" level, not too big, not too small, not hard to move around, but pretty satisfying when setup with good gear and a reasonable room layout. Drivers are in my assembly work room (one of the secondary bedrooms in our house), and I'll do another QA checkout before sending them to you...

[Steve Manning]

Fortunately all that oddly shaped work is not in the scrap pile! 😁

There has been a little bit of progress on this at SMJ Central ...... a good chunk of the drawings are underway/done. Also all of the material is on hand, so we're not starting from zero.

[JonMarsh]

Just a heads up about buying parts from Europe in the current state of things- I have an order coming from Sound Imports in NL, that I placed in January, has just been shipped, a backorder until at least the beginning of May was expected when I ordered these; if I recall correctly, just two pairs of the DA25TX00-8 tweeter (matched pairs) and I just prepaid the tariff and brokerage charge to UPS, $137 altogether. I have older "stock" on hand for Jim, but it's clear buying drivers from Europe will be a problem for while...

[JonMarsh]

Just to update slightly, and review the DA25TX status, I have received the two pairs from Sound imports, from order placed in January, so they have been able to get parts- in due time.

I confess I may seem like a hoarder to some, but when reasonably priced high performance tweeters are so difficult to source regularly, what's a person to do?

Between Australia and Europe and past PE purchases my inventory for a variety of projects, including some HTG collaborations, is adequate, but hardly what I think of as excessive-

• Four matched pair sets boxed by Peerless for retail in a paired configuration (came from Australia and Netherlands)
• One matched pair of DA32TX- the larger diameter part. Never played with these, but got them at a good price from Australia.
• 7 NIB individually packaged parts, most old stock from the US and one driver from Australia that was part of a matched set, that the vendor sold one driver to someone else.
• 5-6 loose parts, two or so of them mounted in evaluation cabinets.

Now, I'll grant that may be more Peerless tweeters than some folks own pairs of underpants, but then, I'm similarly overweight in guitars, as I prize those more than pairs of underpants also!

[JonMarsh]

And, yes, checking and if needed, adjusting the crossover updates with the vintage RS52AN has been moving towards the head of the queue.

Pesky stuff keeps coming up- today, it was taking my wife's Lexus in for service, and then visiting the T-Mobile dealer where we got her two year old Samsung Galaxy S23+ to see if there was any assistance to be had for it quitting working late yesterday evening- they did a little input side diagnostics- the charging circuit and battery appear to be working normally, but other wise it's a "deadode". Situation for the phone is complicated also in that it's part of a family plan HQ'd in Seattle- going to have to contact her younger daughter. No service by T-Mobile or Samsung locally.

So, somedays it's basically one step forwards and two steps back!

[technodanvan]

Any concerns about the 'new' Peerless tweeters measuring the same as the 'old' versions?

[JonMarsh]

I always check parts before mounting in a system. To date, the DA25TX have been very, very consistent. Even just an impedance sweep will give good indications, such as Fs being off, impedance being off spec, having a surround resonance (will show up in impedance curve. I have a ridiculous number of test baffles and enclosures. Doesn't everyone else?

to the best of my knowledge there has been no change in the specification or construction methodology of the DA25TX008. Consistency of impedance curves attests to that, unlike, say, some Dayton Audio products.

I went to the Tymphany site this AM and downloaded the current published data- there are small differences, but well within the tolerance of what to expect from different samples of the same design.








I know this has got to be boring to hear from me, but the DA25TX008 is my "go to'" part. I would use it even more widely, but for the availability problem. I've even considered testing it in the Saint-Saëns configuration... may still do that.

Current data at PE indicates availability in mid August, but who knows, and of course pricing will be up in the air.

[JonMarsh]

when I can find a little spare time I'll do a few impedance checks.

[theSven]

I can say I have no test panels, I'm sure you make up that for me and many other members on the forum.

[JonMarsh]

You may find this interesting... of course, what matters is 1kHz and above.

DA25TX, 2017 Vintage, one of the oldest I have:





DA25TX, 2025 Vintage, as recently received this week:


I find this quite acceptable for "randomly" selected parts...

[technodanvan]

Looks pretty good, either they haven't stopped making them or their tooling and processes are rock solid. Or both!

I also have an odd number of older versions. Unsure what to do with the spare...unless actually treat it as a spare in the case of a failure?

[letiennam]

I am also waiting for some DA25TX products that I purchased since PE announced it would be available in May and was re-announced shipping date in August. Hopefully it will arrive as scheduled

[JonMarsh]

Looks pretty good, either they haven't stopped making them or their tooling and processes are rock solid. Or both!

I also have an odd number of older versions. Unsure what to do with the spare...unless actually treat it as a spare in the case of a failure?

spare in case of failure is a good idea, but then I have one like that which I just move around to different test projects- like an update of the Kii inspired concept.

You know, I don't think I've ever had one of these die for any reason.

[theSven]

Looks pretty good, either they haven't stopped making them or their tooling and processes are rock solid. Or both!

I also have an odd number of older versions. Unsure what to do with the spare...unless actually treat it as a spare in the case of a failure?

From my point of view it's always good to have a spare! I blew my coax on the center channel and had to order a new one. Thankfully it was readily available. After such an experience I'm definitely in favor of having spares now... Yes they collect dust, but one never knows what can happen.

[technodanvan]

Related: Those coaxes are considered on clearance by Parts Express right now. There's only 3 left and the 20% discount works on them.

[JonMarsh]

That's curious, because someone must have bought a bucket load, as when I checked in 2024, they had about 50 in stock! Thanks for the tip.

[JonMarsh]

Picked up one more for a spare... Minvera Tangband is fairly likely to happen.

[JonMarsh]

OK, a little bit of an LF modeling update, in consideration of changes being considered by Steve and Jim.


Quick review of the original configuration with two AS168-9-470 with two RSS265PR in Unibox...







With 2x RSS210PR no weights...



IMO, 2 - 8" PRs is a less than optimum ratio of woofer area to PR area.

But what do I know?











Now, my preferred alternative if the 8" PR are to be used...



With one weight disk added...

[Steve Manning]

Good thing I hadn't started cutting any wood yet. So, what did the three of us miss when we signed off on the change a while back? Oh well we will adapt. 🙃

[JonMarsh]

That's about the only thing I'm aware of that has come up, and it was just in response to Jim's question to me this week. Asking why I originally had 10" PR's, and explaining the area ratio thingie and how it relates to frequency tuning an extension versus flatness.

one can use the extra disk on just two of the RSS210PR, tuning to the same Fb, but you don't get the same coupling and output, where the woofer output starts to roll off, the whole system output declines. One can only change PR mass in disk weight increments, so no disks is 110g, 1 disk is 185g.

Also, the Fb tuning is a function of individual PR mass and the number of PR's and net compliance.

[JimS]

Thanks Steve and Jon. Six of the RSS210 PRs are acquired and inbound 👍

[Steve Manning]

With Sven's subs complete and home safe and sound things are starting to move along on Jim's Ardent D's. All the crossover components have been ordered though only about 60% have been delivered. The remainder are supposed to ship later this month.

Today I did get some sawdust created and got the blanks cut for the cabinet sides. Outer shell is 18mm Baltic Birch and the inner is 1/2" mdf.

[theSven]

Great to read and see photos that the sawdust has begun on Jims Ardent D's. It's also great that Jims live close so I can hear these bad boys once they make it to his house.

[JimS]

Cool, excited to see these move forward 👍

[Steve Manning]

Another small update ....turning blanks into parts. After doing some PM work on the CNC, I was able to get the inner side walls cut out today.

[Steve Manning]

Work has continued on the cabinet sides.

Weather has been nice so I can enjoy the shop being open.



A little sanding of the MDF to rough up the surface prior to glue up.



Many clamps required as usual.






After clean up of things.

[Steve Manning]

Also managed to get things started on the baffles.

Breaking the maple pin block down to rough length.



Rough break down of panels next to a set of sides.



Things broken down to final width and rough length for the CNC

[JonMarsh]

Steady progress, good to see. I just got back to some actual crossover assembly stuff yesterday, (2nd midrange crossover board) then had to go to ACE Hardware because my Stanly hot glue gun was glitching... lets see how far I get today!

[Steve Manning]

Been making some wood chips over the last few days. Turned the maple blanks into some parts.

The outer layer of the baffle.



As Jon has mentioned this stuff machines very well. None of the chipping and splintering of bamboo or Baltic Birch. Too bad it doesn't come in more useful sizes and less abusive on the wallet!



Test fitting some of the drivers.

[Steve Manning]

Then started on the bottom layers.



Since the woofer mounting holes are so close to the edge of the driver cutouts, using standard threaded inserts was not an option. Sp I went with an offset option that will live in between baffle layers.

Here are the recessed pockets for them.

[Steve Manning]

As with most parts, unless one has a vacuum table, there are machining tabs that need to be cleaned up.





The usual pile of cutout plugs left over.



Starting to build up a good pile of parts ....

[JimS]

Looking good Steve!!

[JonMarsh]

Slow work takes time but yields precision results, in Steve's case!

[Steve Manning]

Well after building a number of Ardent baffles over the years, I opted to forgo the table saw approach which is a pain, unless you have a 14" slider. I decided to give it a whirl on the CNC.

It was a bit of a pucker factor, but things turned out rather well.

The start of the roughing process.





Like building a set of stairs.



First side done.



Both sides roughed.

[Steve Manning]

Then came the cleanup ....



The first side finished .....



All done.



The before and after comparison.

[technodanvan]

Wooooooow, that looks good!

[JimS]

Whoop, looking good Steve!!

[Evil Twin]

A most satisfactory result at this point... I am anticipating further progress soon... I expect Jim is most pleased at these construction results...

Then came the cleanup ....



The first side finished .....



All done.



The before and after comparison.

[Gerald Jansen]

Genuine engineering apparently leads to impeccable results!
BRAVO !

[Steve Manning]

Genuine engineering apparently leads to impeccable results!
BRAVO !

Thanks for the kind words Gerald

[Evil Twin]

In this case, Steve's construction engineering and philosophy produce uniformly excellent results- and without tapping the power of the Dark Side...

With only more basic tooling available, calculated consistency it not available- it requires the inspiration of the Dark Side...

[theSven]

Those are some gorgeous looking baffles for this build. Looking forward to see how they come out finished.

[Evil Twin]

A Data Item update for Mr. Manning, regarding the LF alignment and PR configuration with one weight disk on each RSS210-PR (2x) - Jonmarsh was unduly tied up with health advocacy issues for others...

[Steve Manning]

Well speaking of said PR's .....

Parts for the rear panels have been cut out.





A test fit of one of the PR's and a reason to have parts on hand. I discovered the the flange thickness was ~0.1" off from the manufacturers drawing!



Also got the top and bottom pieces cut as well.



Of course lots of gluing and trimming to the correct length are next on the agenda.

[Evil Twin]

Now, does not this hard rock maple ply machine exceptionally nicely?

[Evil Twin]

Your progress to date on the 2nd build of the Kurosawa Jr. is most impressive...

[JimS]

Good progress Steve, looking great 👍

[Steve Manning]

Getting layers trimmed to length with 10 degree bevels on the ends and then glued together. As Jon is fond of saying about slow work and all that .....











I can see where a 5 axis CNC would come in handy for stuff like this. That however, is waiting on a Lotto win!