Wavecor Ardent Mid Priced Build

[Renron]

Thank you for the compliment Steve, coming from you, I appreciate your eye for details.

Tek, Both inside and underneath. Woofer XO inside cabinet but attached to topside of base platform, Mid and Tweeter XO on the bottom (inside) the Base.
I'm painting the grill MDF today. I'll wait until I'm completely finished with the Varnishing before I put the cloth on the grills. Keeps them clean.
I have many layers of Varnish to put on and sand off before I'm finished.

Bob, You Sir, saved my bacon. hmmmmmmmmmmmm bacon.................
I was paying attention to the sand thru because of your posts, I came close but not quite a heartache. Thanks! They are just sealed to prevent the veneer from drying out further and splitting. Many layers of Varnish in their future.

SDL2112, Thanks for the compliment, I want to see the glamour shots too. But patience is a virtue. (yeah right)

NOTE: While I was applying the 50/50 mix of Shellac and Denatured Alcohol as a sealer, the shade I was working in moved and exposed the top of one speaker to direct sunlight. It only took a few minutes for the veneer to dry out and start to split, I noticed this (fortunately) and moved it back into the shade and blew some compressed air onto the speaker to cool it down and the splits closed up a little. I caught it in time but it was close. Lesson learned. Sunshine is good for Tomato plants , bad for speakers.

Yes, we want to see glamour shots, break out your best camera, and we'll add them to the "official" Wavecor Ardent thread.

All in good time Doc, all in good time. You cannot rush quality work. Well you can, but it won't have the same results. (Doc is the exception to this rule)

We used to say; You can have it quick, cheap or high quality. Pick two.
Ron

[Evil Twin]

Neither quick nor cheap are consonant with high quality... Only one true choice is available.

[Renron]

Black is Back

In a Blatant attempt to honor and satisfy ET, I dedicate the following photo of Carbonite wrapped bases for the pleasure of the Dark One. May it please you.

In reality it is a 3/16" thick wrap of ABS plastic. Vacuum cleaner proof. Can't hardly damage this stuff. XO seen is for the woofers and will reside inside the cabinet space.

While preparing to spray the grills black I dropped one on the point. Being MDF, it puffed up and flaked like a piece of Baklava. I took a chance and tried something I've never tried before. I saturated the fractured area with a 50/50 % thinned mixture of De Waxed Shellac, and clamped it with an EL Cheapo C clamp. When dry, I removed the clamp and it worked! The fractured area is solid again and the original thickness. Sometimes you just get lucky.
I sprayed them with a Gravity HVLP gun I bought on sale from WoodCraft for $20. The spray gun is based off of a very popular high quality Sata design. It requires high pressure and fairly good volume to function properly. It's really a conversion gun marketed as a HVLP. That said the gun once tuned, works very well for the cost of the gun. It's not in the same quality as my Warwick 904HE, or Iwata or Sata spray guns. For non automotive quality needs, this is a great gun for the price.

Ron

[JonMarsh]

You're definitely moving the ball down the field, Ron! Congrats on the save for the grille panel! :T

It's good to see these coming along so well....

[dar47]

There you go Ron! your at a very exciting stage now, looking great.:T

[Renron]

Oh my, I should have known. Well I did, I just didn't want to think about it until now.
Jon and his Crossovers...........we all know his propensity for exuberance and over achievement concerning part counts. I knew the Job was dangerous before I took it!
Where Oh Where will all these pieces fit?
Seriously thou, Thank you VERY much for changing the XO just for me Jon. I'm truly honored. ;x(

[BobEllis]

Looks like you need to up your Tetris skills, Ron.

[Steve Manning]

Look at all that bare wood showing ..... you could up the parts count by at least 50%

[JonMarsh]

Somewhere in the first thread there is a picture of my base with crossover- do you see any bare wood in that? Not hardly... :naughty:

If you reall;y need some help with that, let me know... Maybe I can bribe ET to lend a hand by taking over some of the sweatshop work on his new project...

[Renron]

NO, Don't ask E.T. !!! I don't want to bother him. Ever.
I was just pokin' fun at you Jon, the XO is no problem what so ever. I actually enjoy the process of Tetris - Jenga.
If I had to (I don't) I think i could put all the XO components inside the base. (Glad I don't have to thou) 8)
The next week's temperature are expected to drop about 10+ degrees and I'm going to start varnishing now that the temp. decided to co-operate.
I will post pictures and show exactly what I am doing. I've been testing many different formats this past week and will provide photos and why I've chosen the methods I will use.
Ron

PS. Was there a consensus change on the inductor for the woofers? 5.6 - 4.7 or 4.3?

[Renron]

XO are completed

Just so Bob doesn't think I've given up finishing before he does. LOL.

A couple of pictures of my completed XO. And Jon, they weigh in at a svelte 10.5 lbs per base. :T That should add stability to them.
I had to do a little head scratching to get these looking acceptable, but in the end they came out well. I'm happy and that's what counts.
After reading entirely too much information on applying multiple coats of Varnish, I think I'm ready to start. I'll give ya a pic of that too.
Ron

[BobEllis]

Looking good Ron.

I will order the balance of my crossover parts tomorrow after one last check of the BOM. We are about the same distance from completion.

[Renron]

First Coat of Varnish

Just to keep Bob on his toes and E.T. from thinking I'm slacking off here are some pics of my progress.
I'm using Epifanes High Gloss Varnish with modifications. As the Excellent Varnish is intended for Brightwork on boats it is extremely flexible and tends to be too soft for indoor use. That said, speakers do not receive as much abuse as other indoor furniture. At least they shouldn't. :E That's not to say that it doesn't harden well, it certainly does. The durability and quality of this varnish has been time proven for over 50 years on wooden boats that cost as much as some of our homes. I knew a professional boat mechanic and would frequently visit him at work just so I could admire the finish on these boats. A deep high gloss finish is a unique thing of beauty unto itself. It just begs you to touch it................

I have modified the Varnish for my for indoor requirements and have spoken with technical support from the manufacturer to be sure that my goals would be attainable. As recommended by tech support the first coat was thinned to a 50 / 25 /25 ratio with 25% turpentine and 25% Epifanes thinner. This varnish is described as a "Long" oil varnish. One of the properties of a long oil varnish is it's flexibility which makes it durable for a boat. Wood swells a lot simply by being warmed by the sun. A hard Poly finish cracks and peels.
However, by adding Cobalt salts drier the Varnish becomes a "Short" oil formulation which makes it much harder and scratch resistant.
Just what I wanted. :T Per 8 ounces of thinned varnish I added 20 drops of Cobalt drier.

The Veneer was sealed with two light coats of 1# lb. dewaxed shellac (SealCoat) and allowed to sit for 2 weeks. (SealCoat is a Forum lb cut from the can, I thinned it out 50 / 50 for a 1#cut) I lightly sanded it with 220 grit paper to give it some "tooth" and knock down the dust nibs.
Compressed air was blown on the cabinets to blow the dust off, then wiped down with Epifanes thinner and tack cloth wiped down just prior to rolling on the Varnish. I used a VERY short nap 3" foam roller and applied the varnish in vertical strokes, once the varnish was on the wood I rolled it at a 45* angle. Rolling it at a 45* angle fills in the open grain and pores of the wood where vertical rolling would pull it out of the grain. Once the varnish is leveled and THIN it is tipped lightly with a brush held at 45*. This levels it out nicely and flows flat in a few minutes.
Here are some pics for fun.
Ron

[Steve Manning]

Very nice Ron ..... that veneer is already looking amazing. How many coats are you planning on doing total?

[BobEllis]

WOW! Looking great, Ron.

[Evil Twin]

Just to keep Bob on his toes and E.T. from thinking I'm slacking off here are some pics of my progress.
I'm using Epifanes High Gloss Varnish with modifications. As the Excellent Varnish is intended for Brightwork on boats it is extremely flexible and tends to be too soft for indoor use. That said, speakers do not receive as much abuse as other indoor furniture. At least they shouldn't. :E That's not to say that it doesn't harden well, it certainly does. The durability and quality of this varnish has been time proven for over 50 years on wooden boats that cost as much as some of our homes. I knew a professional boat mechanic and would frequently visit him at work just so I could admire the finish on these boats. A deep high gloss finish is a unique thing of beauty unto itself. It just begs you to touch it................

I have modified the Varnish for my for indoor requirements and have spoken with technical support from the manufacturer to be sure that my goals would be attainable. As recommended by tech support the first coat was thinned to a 50 / 25 /25 ratio with 25% turpentine and 25% Epifanes thinner. This varnish is described as a "Long" oil varnish. One of the properties of a long oil varnish is it's flexibility which makes it durable for a boat. Wood swells a lot simply by being warmed by the sun. A hard Poly finish cracks and peels.
However, by adding Cobalt salts drier the Varnish becomes a "Short" oil formulation which makes it much harder and scratch resistant.
Just what I wanted. :T Per 8 ounces of thinned varnish I added 20 drops of Cobalt drier.

The Veneer was sealed with two light coats of 1# lb. dewaxed shellac (SealCoat) and allowed to sit for 2 weeks. (SealCoat is a #2 lb cut from the can, I thinned it out 50 / 50 for a 1#cut) I lightly sanded it with 220 grit paper to give it some "tooth" and knock down the dust nibs.
Compressed air was blown on the cabinets to blow the dust off, then wiped down with Epifanes thinner and tack cloth wiped down just prior to rolling on the Varnish. I used a VERY short nap 3" foam roller and applied the varnish in vertical strokes, once the varnish was on the wood I rolled it at a 45* angle. Rolling it at a 45* angle fills in the open grain and pores of the wood where vertical rolling would pull it out of the grain. Once the varnish is leveled and THIN it is tipped lightly with a brush held at 45*. This levels it out nicely and flows flat in a few minutes.
Here are some pics for fun.
Ron

Clearly we are in the presence of a true woodworker with critical insight into the chemistry of finishes. If only I had one quarter the knowledge of finishing materials as I do Kyber crystals, my own work would certainly go much faster.

I look forward to seeing the final results of your dedicated efforts...

[sdl2112]

Those are looking really nice Ron.

[scottvalentin]

Stunning! Superb craftsmanship can't wait for the glamour shoot, and even more important, the feet up and listening pic!

[Steve Manning]

So Ron ...... out of curiosity, why this type of finish over say spray or some other wipe on? The results are obvious, but me not knowing squat about finishing, trying to learn more.

Steve

[Renron]

Thanks all for the kind words, it really means a lot to me because of the fine people on this forum. No, really!
I've been asked by the wife unit how many coats I've got planned, my answer is the same as John Carmack, "When it's done". I'll know when I get there. Epifanes recommends 8 coats. 8)

E.T. If it pleases you, upon completion I would like to bring them to your secret lab on Coruscant, with your permission of course.

Steve, This is a high build varnish designed to put a lot of material on in a few coats. The depth and clarity of the varnish is stunning. The color is pleasing to the eye, and it's UV properties are off the scale for indoor use (one will receive morning sun everyday) I love the look of a finely crafted wooden boat.
I am considering spraying the last one or two coats, depends on how it looks "off the brush". I'm pretty good with a spray gun but this method is UBER easy, even a Wookie could do it!
Heading out right now for coat Forum
Ron (That's not my boat)

[JonMarsh]

(That's not my boat)

Do you wish it were? you probably know the classic joke about the two happiest days of a boat owner's life...


That is a very nice looking finish... but it looks like 75% engine space and 20% passenger space... is that the best ratio?

[Renron]

Do you wish it were? you probably know the classic joke about the two happiest days of a boat owner's life...


That is a very nice looking finish... but it looks like 75% engine space and 20% passenger space... is that the best ratio?

I would not own a boat that requires that much effort to maintain. My boat has a 1/4" thick aluminum hull and decades of scrapes to prove her worth.
Yes, I do know that joke. For some it's the truth! (not me)
Picture was to show off the finish only. Best ratio? Maybe for two on a twilight slow cruise with a pitcher of one's favorite adult beverages.
Wouldn't know from personal, I don't drink solvents.
Boats are holes in the water into which you throw money.
Ron

[Steve Manning]

Thanks all for the kind words, it really means a lot to me because of the fine people on this forum. No, really!
I've been asked by the wife unit how many coats I've got planned, my answer is the same as John Carmack, "When it's done". I'll know when I get there. Epifanes recommends 8 coats. 8)

E.T. If it pleases you, upon completion I would like to bring them to your secret lab on Coruscant, with your permission of course.

Steve, This is a high build varnish designed to put a lot of material on in a few coats. The depth and clarity of the varnish is stunning. The color is pleasing to the eye, and it's UV properties are off the scale for indoor use (one will receive morning sun everyday) I love the look of a finely crafted wooden boat.
I am considering spraying the last one or two coats, depends on how it looks "off the brush". I'm pretty good with a spray gun but this method is UBER easy, even a Wookie could do it!
Heading out right now for coat #2.
Ron (That's not my boat)

One can hardly argue with the reason why with a picture like that ....... the Wookie thing though ..... they can be pretty bad ass from what I hear.

[BobEllis]

Be careful about dissing wookies. My Navy call sign was Chewie.

[Evil Twin]

E.T. If it pleases you, upon completion I would like to bring them to your secret lab on Coruscant, with your permission of course.

We would be honored and pleased to have an opportunity to exam the results of your skilled labor, and verify the electrical and acoustical performance if needed.

[Renron]

Steve, I take back what I said about Wookies, I'm sorry. (Furball.........)
Chewie. Care to elaborate on how that name was acquired? Given? Ass chewed out so many times? Chewer and Chewie?

E.T. I would be honored if you could find the time to inspect and suggest improvements based upon your experience and superior technologies of the Dark Side.
Please no Frozen Carbonite if I disappoint you, Dark One. At this point we (royal we) are unsure of the completion date. Chewie is definitely ahead of us in terms of completion.
Ron

[BobEllis]

Call sign progression: Bigfoot based on size 15. Qualified in Tomcat, reported to VF-143 (The World Famous Pukin' Dogs) where Commander "Bullet" Bob Ellis had just been the CO. There already was a Bigfoot. My feet were bigger, but he had the name first. I was assigned the callsign "Pellet" - a little Bullet. A few months later we were at sea and the evening movie was "Star Wars". When Chewbacca appeared on screen Fat Jack Horner yelled out "It's Pellet!" Chewie stuck. Could have been a lot worse.

[Steve Manning]

Yep one thing about the military ...... you don't have much say in the pet names your given.

[BobEllis]

At least in the old days the names were frequently not suitable for use in mixed company.

[Steve Manning]

At least in the old days the names were frequently not suitable for use in mixed company.

So very true ..... and to be honest I think I don't think we have improved things any with all of our political correctness either.

[Renron]

Thank you Commander Ellis. size 15??? I'll call you "Sir" from now on. Whoa.
I personally thank both you and Steve (Troublemaker) for serving our country. You were more courageous than I, I missed out on a free trip to the South China area by a few lottery #s. Figuratively dodged that bullet. Not smart enough to enlist, but I'm not a dodger either. It was a different time back then.........
Thank you Both.
Sincerely,
Ron

[benthe8track]

They look amazing Ron, thanks for the update!

[Steve Manning]

Thank you Commander Ellis. size 15??? I'll call you "Sir" from now on. Whoa.
I personally thank both you and Steve (Troublemaker) for serving our country. You were more courageous than I, I missed out on a free trip to the South China area by a few lottery #s. Figuratively dodged that bullet. Not smart enough to enlist, but I'm not a dodger either. It was a different time back then.........
Thank you Both.
Sincerely,
Ron

Thank you Ron and your welcome ..... I need to get a shirt with Troublemaker on it and a Cheshire Cat grin under the label .......

[Renron]

Thanks for having a sense of humor.
It's you! It's you!

[Renron]

Two steps forward.................

Sometimes it just seems that the world is out to get you. Well it's not really that bad. But, sometimes we take three steps forward and two steps back just to see where we are going. :??

I had three nice even coats of Epifanes Clear Varnish on the speakers it was looking Very good, but I wasn't happy. Other builds in the past I would have put one more on, and called it good. But, that's not good enough for the Ardent TS.
Here it comes, :E, I put a 120 grit velcro back Mirka on the fantastic Porter Cable 1066: really 7.1? sander that Jon recommended and took a deep breath and attacked the Ardents. 8O
The photos show why. I am going to call it a guide coat, like in the auto paint world. It shows Exactly where the high and low spots are even though everything LOOKS smooth and flat to the eye.
After the 120, I used 150 then 180 then 220, then 220 hand sanded with the grain to remove any swirl marks, just in case..........Back to bare wood in some spots.
The photo with the can of Epifanes is three coats, before sanding.
Middle photo shows the "guide coat" where the dense part of the grain (summer growth) was higher than the (Spring growth) Summer Growth is the dark ring and usually harder too.
The last photo is after ONE coat of Epifanes Varnish. I couldn't be happier. They just Glow. The line across the tweeter hole is the driveway expansion joint reflection. I've got 3 more coats to go! :B
Thank goodness (or E.T.) that solid veneer is 40 mils thick and could take the extra abuse. Flat as a pancake now. Just how I wanted.
Ron

[Evil Twin]

Sometimes it just seems that the world is out to get you. Well it's not really that bad. But, sometimes we take three steps forward and two steps back just to see where we are going. :??


Thank goodness (or E.T.) that solid veneer is 40 mils thick and could take the extra abuse. Flat as a pancake now. Just how I wanted.
Ron

This is all too common a feeling- and in your case, a clear example of why thick veneer is worth every credit paid for it. :yesnod: But even I must stay that starting with 120 is boldly aggressive - clearly, you too are strong in the Dark Side! :storm:

[Steve Manning]

Very nice Ron ..... I thought the same thing when you said 120 grit, I figured you would be staying at 320 - 400 at that point. Apparently you have the skills because they look killer. I still don't understand why they don't have thicker wood with paper backed veneer. I found that out with my equipment rack build that it was not forgiving of aggressive sanding .... that was a PIA to fix.

[BobEllis]

Looking great, Ron.

[sdl2112]

They look fantastic Ron...I can only imagine how they look in person.

[TEK]

Hmmm, when I sanded trough mine I got color differences due to the shellac - and I did not dare getting that corrected by sanding it all off. I figured out some kind of dirty fix, but it never got 100%
Glad it worked out for you! Looks stunning!

[Renron]

Tek,
I used a 1lb cut of dewaxed shellac, it darkened it a tiny bit but not much. I cannot tell where I took it back to raw (almost) wood. I used the shellac to seal and fill some of the monstrous pores in the Sapele Pomelle, worse than Mahogany. Because I had such large side panels (not book-matched) there are some splits / cracks that need to be filled with Varnish. Nothing is perfect. Perhaps it's the difference in wood species? Dunno.
If mine look as good as yours I'll be happy. Really like the Hickory.

Second coat.

[scottvalentin]

Wow, jaw-dropping Ron. Beautiful.

[Renron]

4th Coat

Here is a picture after the 4th coat has dried. I'll get another coat on them today.
The aggressive sanding earlier was to flatten them out after the pores were filled in. You can see the benefit of this in the reflections.
Thanks for the complement Scott.
Ron

[BobEllis]

Can't imagine how sweet that will look when polished up.

[Renron]

I think you'll be listening to them before I am Bob, it's been a good cat and mouse. (I like cheese)
Because Varnish by it's nature is soft(er), I'll have to let them sit at least a week before polishing the dust nibs out.
That's going to be a long week, watching varnish dry............................
Ron