Ardent D (aka Kurosawa Jr) Winter Camp

[Zvu]

Oh yeah - a 5th question is narrow(er) vs wide(r) dispersion in my room - with lots of clearance to the side walls, will narrower dispersion sound too dead? This is based on my Kef R3's sounding a bit dull in the space. Bare DA25Tx vs waveguided, potentially also vs something like the DXT. (knowing full well I won't actually make it through all these tests given available time)

Kef R300 is also a bit dull sounding. I don't think it is a product of dispersion though. The way their woofer is made makes me wonder if it is the cause for that, i'd define it as highly damped, sound. No matter what i did, the mids always seemed a tad quieter than i feel it should sound. When i modify the crossover to compensate for what i think is lacking, it gets shouty. Finally, since the midrange-tweeter unit is operating flawlessly, in my opinion, i concluded that it has to be the woofer that has very mild acoustic slope and highish crossover point. It sounds a bit dull and messes with the midrange too much - but since it overlaps the midrange quite a bit it is hard to pinpoint what is wrong.

I might be wrong about the cause of dullness though, but this is my opinion based on living with those loudspeakers (in factory variant and modified) for over a year.

[Evil Twin]

You are making clear progress, and if anything we have done has been a catalyst of sort, all for the better.

The bare DA25TX has wider and more uniform dispersion than typical of a lot of "direct tweeters", and I say this after buying and testing many tweeters in 2019... this was quite noticeable in testing the finished crossover design for the first SMJ MT, so I would suggest thinking about the tradeoffs- the SB15BAC has reasonable output capability, so reinforcing it's low end with a wider baffle is probably not really necessary- or useful. But in the end I suggest not taking my word for it one way or another, but since you have an active platform (planned? or on hand?) for concept evaluations, try it out, and go for real data using a lazy Susan setup (Woodcraft has bearing sets to build high capacity ones if you are inclined). You might want to take a look at the concept for the 554 driver- if you ponder a Duelund- the SB driver may work best with something relatively similar, not too much higher in center frequency or the off axis will suffer. However, you will have a more difficult time getting the HF phase aligned correctly, due to the difference in Z axis origins. For this, a waveguide loaded tweeter could help.







Yes, there are similarities between a three way composed of two LR2 networks, but the Duelund has higher ultimate roll off rates for HP and LP, and can work with a narrower midrange band pass. If implemented correctly, the Duelund will have all drivers in the same phase at least for levels down to -12 to -18 dB. The Duelund offers ease of calculating and implementing specific targets which will achieve a desired transfer function, and with dual LR-2 and "experimenting" one might have fun, but also wander in the wilderness, so to speak, not really reaching exactly the desired result.

But this is DIY, and if wandering in the wilderness suits your whims, why not?

[dwk]

Oh yeah - a 5th question is narrow(er) vs wide(r) dispersion in my room - with lots of clearance to the side walls, will narrower dispersion sound too dead? This is based on my Kef R3's sounding a bit dull in the space. Bare DA25Tx vs waveguided, potentially also vs something like the DXT. (knowing full well I won't actually make it through all these tests given available time)

[dwk]

This correlates well with the extensive measurements I've made for the DA25. I am primarily concerned about how difficult it will be to control the ultrasonic resonance and minimize resonance amplification of distortion products- that has been quite successful with the MT test design for Steve.

Thank you for the link to the other measurements- it's my usual practice to test at 90 dB and 96 dB for a tweeter like this...

Well, last digression on this for the moment. If nothing else, posting that Dueland alignment got me off my butt and I actually ordered some stuff. I've been locked in analysis paralysis for a while now, getting no closer to clarifying my plans. I ordered RS225-4, SB15NBAC and DA25Tx (the 32 is out of stock). (NBAC over CAC for purely aesthetic reasons) This isn't a final platform, but should help with evaluating the main questions I have:

- wide baffle (SF Elipsa / Troels PMS style) vs more conventional Ardent style cabinet. Does the wide baffle fit the space, and are there sonic downsides?
- how much output do I need? It's a large open space with high ceilings. Probably 10000 cu ft.
- bass options. RS225 (really a proxy for the WO24p) vs RSS265HO/RSS265PR, potentially the SDX10 depending on how it goes.
- is there any magic in the Dueland alignment vs LR2 or ET's modified 3rd order concept. Should be able to hit the posted Dueland alignment, although maybe not at full output.

I have to say, having placed my order the RS225/SB15NBAC/DA25Tx strikes me as a remarkably high-value lineup. About $350 or so in drivers for what should be a very competent 3-way. I'll be using either a PC based DSP setup or a MiniDsp nano-digi for initial experiments as I come up to speed with VituixCAD.

Based on what comes out of this, I'll either decide that just running with an Ardent-D variant is the best plan, or I'll dive in and finalize my own design with a hybrid active/passive approach using the MiniDSP SHD that runs our main system (passive M/T, active between M and W). I'm hoping to target mid-Sept to start that project in earnest.

[Evil Twin]

It compares very well, and may have a slight edge in dust collection. But the DW621 has a slightly smoother motor.

of course, there is a certain "esthetic" attraction for me...


Which do you think looks more at home in a Seinar Research Laboratory?

[chrisn]

I love the smell of Porter Cable Routers in the morning...

New router? How does the Porter Cable compare with the Dewalt DW621?

[Evil Twin]

708 are in stock, and I ordered 8 for Steve in VA for his stock.

I recommend spending sometime modeling combinations of drivers and PR's- you may be quite surprised about the limitations of some specific PR's considering the MMS and CMS versus Qms and achievable resonant frequency in some configurations.

Let me just say that some PR's are "more equal" than others in being able to address a wide range of applications. And there is also the matter of how they work in parallel, and how much Sd is usable with the lumped paralleled parameters.

I have found the following to be quite useful in a range of applications with various woofers:

• ScanSpeak Discovery 26W/0-00 10" PR
• Dayton RSS265PR
• Seas SL26R 10" PR
• Dayton RSS315PR 12" PR
• Wavecor PR223BD02 8-3/4" PR ( used in the Kurosawa)

[technodanvan]

Very curious of your findings with the Anarchy. I had a smidgen of of thought to use four of those with either a Seas MR18REX/XF or SB Acoustics SB16PFC25 in an attempt to make a 'value-ish' KEF R11-style speaker with matching center that could get by without a subwoofer. I'm about to begin my Ardent journey but those will be located in the master bedroom (if my wife agrees) and our living room is in need of some upgrades.

Of course, one of the reasons I never pursued this earlier was due to lack of stock for the Anarchy. If that continues to be the case, I'm a little afraid I'd drop the 'value' portion of this and move ahead with the Seas Excel C18EN002/A and four Wavecor SW182 woofers instead....assuming they can reach the potential of their larger brothers.

[Evil Twin]

More test cabinets in process

LF test cabinets are being prepared...

A design target has been set for 21L per driver... using an RSS265PR with 275 grams of mass







Of course, hardware verification prior to completing a cabinet build is mandatory...



Test cabinets were built, and holes for PR and main driver candidates (AS168, Anarchy 708) prepared this weekend....

The modeled configuration of 21L per driver, with a 275gram weight for the PR is fairly promising- here, showing the expected response with 40W of drive power.





A driver mount check for the RSS265PR...




And quick driver mount check for the AS168

[Evil Twin]

-beware of any little-people furry convention happening in the area. ..apparently they will (j)ump anything that moves. :P

That is indeed a wise warning, one I have been on the alert about...

And that is not even considering the coyotes and raccoons in the immediate area who at times are overly curious...

[Scottg]

-beware of any little-people furry convention happening in the area. ..apparently they will (j)ump anything that moves. :P

[Evil Twin]

The weather is quite pleasant at my secluded workshop...






Endor is so relaxing on the weekends...

[Evil Twin]

interesting - searching around doesn't turn up a lot on the DA32, but what is there seems to be at least tentatively positive. will be interested to see what ET measures.

Looking again though, that Dueland alignment doesn't seem to put any more stress on the tweeter than LR2@2k - both are -20dB at ~600Hz. There are some preliminary measurements of the DA25 and DA32 LR4@1.4Khz here http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...10#post1381410 and both seem to be holding up ok, if not exactly spectacularly. level is 103dB @6", or about 88dB@1m (I think). The 32 definitely is looking more comfortable between 1k and 2k, but the 25 isn't waving the white flag just yet.

(LR4@1.4k seems to be about as demanding as the Dueland target down to 700Hz; since we're already 20dB down, hopefully this is a relatively valid comparison)

This correlates well with the extensive measurements I've made for the DA25. I am primarily concerned about how difficult it will be to control the ultrasonic resonance and minimize resonance amplification of distortion products- that has been quite successful with the MT test design for Steve.

Thank you for the link to the other measurements- it's my usual practice to test at 90 dB and 96 dB for a tweeter like this...

[dwk]

While the measurements haven't been provided, there have been comments that the larger unit just doesn't perform to the same level as the 25mm version.

interesting - searching around doesn't turn up a lot on the DA32, but what is there seems to be at least tentatively positive. will be interested to see what ET measures.

Looking again though, that Dueland alignment doesn't seem to put any more stress on the tweeter than LR2@2k - both are -20dB at ~600Hz. There are some preliminary measurements of the DA25 and DA32 LR4@1.4Khz here http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...10#post1381410 and both seem to be holding up ok, if not exactly spectacularly. level is 103dB @6", or about 88dB@1m (I think). The 32 definitely is looking more comfortable between 1k and 2k, but the 25 isn't waving the white flag just yet.

(LR4@1.4k seems to be about as demanding as the Dueland target down to 700Hz; since we're already 20dB down, hopefully this is a relatively valid comparison)

[Evil Twin]

Now, the best part of the week....

I love the smell of Porter Cable Routers in the morning...

[Evil Twin]

While the measurements haven't been provided, there have been comments that the larger unit just doesn't perform to the same level as the 25mm version.

I do plan my own investigation of that.

[Bear]

Yeah, that transfer function puts a lot of stress on the tweeter. You don't think the DA32Tx could handle it? IMHO this is a very interesting Dueland alignment - I think there are a fair number of woofers/mids that could handle this if you can figure out the tweeter.

While the measurements haven't been provided, there have been comments that the larger unit just doesn't perform to the same level as the 25mm version.

[dwk]

These test cabinets will be employing Dual Accuton AS168, RS52AN, and the DA25TX00-08. The intent is completing a stereo pair in the relative near term, so I have better music listening while still living in California.

There is another test mule cabinet somewhat farther along (the complete rear shell is fabricated, only the front panels remain) which was created to also test cone midranges, (though RS52 can also be used) and it will be used to evaluate configurations with the A708 and the PTT6.5W04-01A. The SB15CAC was/is a candidate, but now I am also curious about the 554, and have a tentative Duelund configuration for that driver... but it would require one of the BlieSMa tweeters, in my opinion...

[ATTACH=CONFIG]29950[/ATTACH]

Yeah, that transfer function puts a lot of stress on the tweeter. You don't think the DA32Tx could handle it? IMHO this is a very interesting Dueland alignment - I think there are a fair number of woofers/mids that could handle this if you can figure out the tweeter.

[Evil Twin]

The blade I have been using with the DWS780 is the DEWALT 12" DW7661 80T laminate blade; this is a thin kerf version with a 12 degree tip angle and 0 degree hook, selected for the ability to produce very smooth cuts, especially in laminate or material like laminated bamboo ply, for which it was primarily purchased. It has worked very well with maple ply for the Kurosawa build and this new experiment.

[Bear]

Actually, 3" of maple ply...

after cutting that material, as I remarked to Steve Sunday night, 3/4" LBL bamboo is like a hot knife through butter, and BB ply seems like tissue paper.

The Dewalt SCMS certainly did some good work. What blade did you use?

[Evil Twin]

Actually, 3" of maple ply...

after cutting that material, as I remarked to Steve Sunday night, 3/4" LBL bamboo is like a hot knife through butter, and BB ply seems like tissue paper.

[Browncoat]

Cross-cutting a couple inches of maple on angle without burns? Imperial technology tuned and handled with precision.

[Evil Twin]

There is another...

These test cabinets will be employing Dual Accuton AS168, RS52AN, and the DA25TX00-08. The intent is completing a stereo pair in the relative near term, so I have better music listening while still living in California.

There is another test mule cabinet somewhat farther along (the complete rear shell is fabricated, only the front panels remain) which was created to also test cone midranges, (though RS52 can also be used) and it will be used to evaluate configurations with the A708 and the PTT6.5W04-01A. The SB15CAC was/is a candidate, but now I am also curious about the 554, and have a tentative Duelund configuration for that driver... but it would require one of the BlieSMa tweeters, in my opinion...




Additionally, both woofer and midrange test cabinets are nearing completion for doing IM distortion tests. with my Audio Precision analyzer to evaluate BL force linearity and surround behavior, as was done by HiFi Compass. The woofer test cabinets will be using the RSS265PR as planned in some of the assembled systems, and this phase will include verification of the modeled LF system response generated by Unibox and VituixCAD.


To ensure consistency of procedures and results, all the test DUT's will be readied and tested at the same time. A complete renovation of the test hardware has been underway with an update in the audio test interface to a more modern Motu 4 using SABER DACs, also with reasonably high grade microphone preamps (which the TC Konnekt was selected for and did have) and a new MacBook Pro with Thunderbolt 3 to replace the 6 year old model with Thunderbolt 2, which had to use a dongle interface to connect to the Firewire TC Konnekt that I have been using over 10 years. I have two ACCO 1/2" calibrated microphones now, and this may open some additional testing options.

For midrange evaluations, I propose to double or quadruple the test frequency- for example, instead of 30Hz + 255Hz for the woofers, 60 or 120Hz for the low frequency, and 510 or 1020 for the upper frequency.

I will also attempt CSD comparisons, to develop a wider base of objective measurements for driver comparison.

This is merely an experiment, and may not produce any definitive results... but my Force Intuition says it may be interesting... most interesting.

[ergo]

"It is a time consuming and expensive way to "generate sawdust"."

Yes, but the by product of the sawdust is beautiful and very promising indeed. Now that I have a Bosch gliding miter saw I really should take up one of these tapered projects again too. When making Wavecor Ardent I did not have one yet and without it was even more time consuming.

Btw, I'm not sure what is the combo of drivers you did cut this out for in the end?

Waiting eagerly for further progress

[Evil Twin]

Be careful not to choke on your aspirations...

Clearly we are making progress today... but there there is much left to do, and many opportunities for error before completion.


Rough sanding and shaping the top surface is quite straightforward...




The upper facets were cut so precisely they still had a bare trace of the pencil lead showing on the front before starting sanding...

If my light saber had been available, that small error might not have occurred...




A minimal effort was required to rough sand the bottom bevel and facets and edges, and now these front panels are complete...




completely ready for the next assembly step...

[Evil Twin]

I am altering the design. Pray I don't alter it any further.

Circumstances beyond my control have delayed certain work phases, but now matters are moving forwards once again...

I am making running changes to the design based on my Force Intuition and inspection of materials and capabilities.


As there will be no top bevel in this design, and to put the acoustical center of the midrange driver higher up, the positions of all drivers on the front panel have been raised. Additionally, after review of the materials and available working dimensions, the length of the front baffle and cabinet panels has been increased from 40" to 41". This was implemented in the top and bottom bevel cuts.




The tooling was carefully checked before being employed, and square results were verified, along with the finish of the cut.




The lead lines and dimensioning for the facet cuts were carefully transferred from the printout to the baffle, along with the angular setup, and the illuminated cutting guide used as always to assure precision results...





On both sides.





It is a time consuming and expensive way to "generate sawdust".

[Evil Twin]

That sounds like a reasonable plan... one can spend too much time overthinking things, and not working with any hardware or listening to the results...

The BlieSMa T25 could be ideal, but only if it is actually available for purchase... I have pairs of both the aluminum and beryllium original model, but have been holding off on using them for some planned high efficiency designs in the queue. I also have Anarchy woofers of all types. Some people have the temerity to suggest that I am some kind of hoarder... I consider myself a conserver of resources that plans ahead for future projects...

[Bear]

Considering your concerns and restrictions on space, I would even be inclined to recommend dual Anarchy 558's with the RS52 and DA25. After some recent testing, this is now a serious consideration for a small but effective center channel. However, the tweeter form factor is not ideal... so, small, is a relative concept.

I had hoped that the T25 series would be available by now. They look like a pretty magical combination of form factor, performance and price. However, they are currently only a little less available than the 7" Anarchy woofers. Which is to say, I can find neither for sale new at the moment (though DIYSG does have the 5" available... lack of specifications notwithstanding).Yevgeniy and Brandon have each mentioned a waveguide for the T25, so that may prove interesting at some point in the future. The upcoming MD60N mid dome will fit into the RS52 cutout, but it, too, is not yet on the market. And then there's the TX series of Satori woofers. Yeah, I may just have to go through some inventory reductions. Moving sale, anyone?

Humor aside, I have heard someone say that at some point, you just need to build something. I'm in Vancouver this week (eh!), then back to SD. I need to swing by the SDFWA shop to get some more details, and then I'll hopefully decide on a direction. I'll probably start with a stereo pair of TMs that can be moved to surrounds as I fill in the more complex fronts.

[Evil Twin]

Considering your concerns and restrictions on space, I would even be inclined to recommend dual Anarchy 558's with the RS52 and DA25. After some recent testing, this is now a serious consideration for a small but effective center channel. However, the tweeter form factor is not ideal... so, small, is a relative concept.

[Bear]

Is this a center channel for the Ardent D build that This thread is about?

Let's not get us both force-choked. I'm simply musing out loud about what would be a significant divergence. Spiritually linked, but ultimately a different design. Pick an aphorism:
It's easy to think that you're tall when you're standing on the shoulders of giants, or
This is my grandfather's axe. My father replaced the handle, and I replaced the blade. This is my grandfather's axe.

My relocation from TX to CA has also required me to start over with my sound system, and the sound bar I thought might be an interesting intermediate solution... isn't.

To shed some additional light because I'm feeling guilty about having derailed what will be another of the reference-quality designs: I was lucky to grab a few SW223s on-sale at Solen (perhaps their last sale since Parts Express has picked up Wavecor) based upon the success of the Ardent Wavecor design and subsequent discussion of an even lower cost version. The Ardent Wavecor is not a large speaker as a tower goes with its capabilities, but it is deeper than I would like. And that was before relocating from the Land of Large Houses to perpetually housing supply-constrained San Diego. When you are paying $500+ per square foot of living space, living spaces tend to be small, and that has to factor into the design considerations (taller is okay, but giving a speaker "space to breathe" is problematic).

My prior system had Clearwave (Jed, before he exited this forum) Minuet5 MTMs across the fronts (SS 15W4531G + SS 6600) and ER18DXTs for surrounds. I was never quite satisfied with the price/performance ratio of the center channel (laid-down MTM, with $600 in drivers plus almost as much in a crossover). One can get a more traditional WT/MW center channel design, but those tend to be pretty large (woofers need volume). The Wavecor SW223s seem to break that barrier a bit, though with a substantial sensitivity penalty (81dB/84dB sensitivity vs 88/91dB typical for 8" woofers).

My easiest path forward is to build a set of TMs for Left, Right and Surrounds. For a center, I can build an shorter TM flanked by the SW223s, and use a standard electronic crossover to just treat them as normal subwoofers until I can work out a three way passive crossover. That way, I can bin the soundbar quickly, while heading toward "version 2.0". Those familiar with software development will understand what my expectations are with that effort...

So, in the spirit of the *Camp threads, where there's typically been a lot of teaching involved, I'll be mindful of not giving people the impression that I know what I'm doing with respect to crossover design. EvilTwin's rough drafts are better, and more thoughtful, than my finished products.

Bear is bringing his hopes and dreams based on drivers and options we have discussed; this thread is not primarily about a center channel solution, but can also include one or two possible efforts on that path also.

The POC crossover evaluations have been done with the specific Wavecor woofers he is interested in, but the primary build is using Accuton AS168. A secondary evaluation is underway with Anarchy 708.

The center channel concept is probably better suited for a separate thread or for a much further time in the future once the core design has achieved a higher level of completion. Of course, I am always grateful for any knowledge of The Force that milord is willing to impart. I feel like I've learned a lot over the years, but have much, much more to learn.

[Evil Twin]

Bear is bringing his hopes and dreams based on drivers and options we have discussed; this thread is not primarily about a center channel solution, but can also include one or two possible efforts on that path also.

The POC crossover evaluations have been done with the specific Wavecor woofers he is interested in, but the primary build is using Accuton AS168. A secondary evaluation is underway with Anarchy 708.

[theSven]

Is this a center channel for the Ardent D build that This thread is about?

[Bear]

Continuing to pedal in EvilTwin's slipstream...



Going with doubled-up walls would make this no less than 12" high. Dashed lines are individual sections of LBL, with a 3/4" roundover on all edges. As-drawn, this would be 11.25x26x11.25 (HWD). However, depth is obviously the most variable, depending upon volume needed. To that end, I'd potentially replace the 'BD03s with BD02s. Hmm.

The downside of further pedaling (before getting shelled out of the peloton and abandoning) is that several of those smaller inductor values are ... challenging. Unwinding is possible, but the combo of inductance and DCR may prove fatal to my curiosity.

[Bear]

Two caveats.


One. The driver sets must be in separate acoustic spaces, as regards the rear chamber.

Two. A key point behind the .5 way concept is reducing the effective CTC distance by having only one driver work all the way up to the midrange crossover frequency. By that reasoning, the one driver should run up to the midrange crossover, and the two drivers should be the 0.5 crossed lower. Getting the balance right might be tricky...

Thanks for the heads-up. Using the singleton as the "main" woofer makes sense definitely makes sense, and I hadn't drawn the right conclusion. By my math, the paired 'BD02s are about ~2dB more sensitive than the single BD03, and that's the opposite of what I'd desire from a 0.5 driver. This looks like it would work in about 35L net with about 1.75lbs of stuffing if my math isn't off. Handling the DCR on the woofers is making a big variability in my numbers.

This is continues to be intriguing.

[Bear]

Bear, as an inspiration...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SPJu7OUSZU0

Thanks! Those subwoofers look familiar...

[Zvu]

Bear, as an inspiration...

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SPJu7OUSZU0

[Evil Twin]

Very much appreciated! One follow-up: in a volume/baffle area/budget unconstrained galaxy, would a 2xSW223BD02 in series + a single SW233BD03 for bafflestep be interesting/viable? Asking for a Stormtrooper with bad aim.

I might as well throw another follow-up into the mix (so I understand how Unibox is doing the math): would this be in a ~50L cabinet fully stuffed, or would the sim work in smaller (holding to a BW alignment)?

Two caveats.


One. The driver sets must be in separate acoustic spaces, as regards the rear chamber.

Two. A key point behind the .5 way concept is reducing the effective CTC distance by having only one driver work all the way up to the midrange crossover frequency. By that reasoning, the one driver should run up to the midrange crossover, and the two drivers should be the 0.5 crossed lower. Getting the balance right might be tricky...

[Bear]

This may be illegal technology to use in this quadrant, bypassing the normal net systems, but the quality should be better...

Note that this is the 3.5 way configuration with "warm" voicing...

Very much appreciated! One follow-up: in a volume/baffle area/budget unconstrained galaxy, would a 2xSW223BD02 in series + a single SW233BD03 for bafflestep be interesting/viable? Asking for a Stormtrooper with bad aim.

I might as well throw another follow-up into the mix (so I understand how Unibox is doing the math): would this be in a ~50L cabinet fully stuffed, or would the sim work in smaller (holding to a BW alignment)?

[Steve Manning]

That was a great series, a shame how it was handled on cable- love the disks, and there are rumors of a possible revival!

And, yes, he should be saying that, as should Steve Manning!

I'd say it but Steve Manning is covered in sawdust at the moment ...... cutting out ribs for Sven.

[Evil Twin]

This may be illegal technology to use in this quadrant, bypassing the normal net systems, but the quality should be better...

Note that this is the 3.5 way configuration with "warm" voicing...

[Evil Twin]

Most excellent news, your Lordship! As your latest cheaper-and-more-deadly-than-a-Death-Star-but-perhaps-include-slightly-code-in-the-navigation-system weapon continues in its development, is there an opportunity for a Bothan spy to acquire the Proof-of-Concept plans? Wavecor is on the Rebel Approved Manufacturer List, while Accuton is not (yet)...

The transmission incurred some unavoidable data loss...

[Browncoat]

-shouldn't Browncoat be replying: "oohh, shiny!"? :P

My opportunity for a witty comment missed. Gorramit.

BTW, it's humbling to see this level of work coming from what looks to be a spare bedroom and a little patio.

[Bear]

Most excellent news, your Lordship! As your latest cheaper-and-more-deadly-than-a-Death-Star-but-perhaps-include-slightly-code-in-the-navigation-system weapon continues in its development, is there an opportunity for a Bothan spy to acquire the Proof-of-Concept plans? Wavecor is on the Rebel Approved Manufacturer List, while Accuton is not (yet)...

[Evil Twin]

Ripping operations complete

In spite of several disturbances in the Force, some progress was made and I can now report that all piece part ripping operations are complete, and the table saw is being taken to off site storage.





Additional fabrication support hardware and more tools have been obtained...

Events are unfolding at last as I have foreseen...

[JonMarsh]

-shouldn't Browncoat be replying: "oohh, shiny!"? :P

(..this requires watching Firefly.)

That was a great series, a shame how it was handled on cable- love the disks, and there are rumors of a possible revival!

And, yes, he should be saying that, as should Steve Manning!