Another Wavecor Ardent build

[BobEllis]

Will wonders never cease? A progress prediction actually came true for the first time this build. All of the large facets are veneered. That leaves the top, top facet and face veneer to go. Tomorrow I will trim the edges so I'll be ready to go when I return. Just five more days of veneering. A day or two of prep and I start spraying.

Hoping to be listening to these by July. That may be active, but the passive crossover should follow shortly.

[dar47]

Good things come to those that wait, or is that keep going! You stay as meticulous with the finish and it will be all smiles. I just added a new pre-amp and these just keep rewarding.

[Renron]

Those will be beautiful, I too can't wait to see them with some finish on them.

Jon, have you had the opportunity to re-evaluate the XO components yet? The CFO has given me the thumbs up on purchasing Caps and quality (read Mundorf) resistors.
Ron

[BobEllis]

Thanks, Ron. I'm really looking forward to listening to them. It's so quiet up here that I have heard hummingbirds more than 50' away. Even with shop quality speakers being fed from a computer's integrated sound card I'm hearing details that I don't remember hearing on the home system. The listening space is better at home but the noise floor is much higher. I'm pretty much here through October, so they're staying here until then. Trade offs...

[BobEllis]

Back at it. Veneering a top. The grain is so wild that epoxy is flowing up through the veneer, which punctured the release sheet so epoxy is in the breather mesh. Oh well, guess that's why the call it a consumable item.

Mastic on the front and in the folds of the plastic sheet, 3M blue tape (the other stuff doesn't hold well enough) on three sides and I was able to get 25" of vacuum. Bleeding down to 20". The weather went from really to cold for epoxy to glad I got the slow hardener in a week.

Why does the forum turn my portrait pictures to landscape?

[JonMarsh]

Happens only very intermittently to me- what do you take the pictures with?

[BobEllis]

These are iPhone shots.

[BobEllis]

Another lesson learned.

I'd noticed on Joe Woodworker's site a mention of putting the vacuum port off of the work surface when using the breather mesh instead of a caul. I'd had no issues with the facets I'd glued with the port right on the face. Yesterday, however, veneering the top some spots around the port did not adhere. I'm using the less expensive port which does not have a flush bottom. So, plenty of pressure at the center and a ring of no pressure surrounding it. Why a problem this time and not others? I think it has to do with temperature. When gluing the facets, the resin was chilled to around 50F overnight and was quite thick and tacky when applied. Yesterday was well into the 70s when applying the resin, so it was much thinner and not as tacky initially. So a confluence of watery epoxy and wild grain that wasn't terribly flat despite softening and I get to learn how to repair bubbles.

If you're using JWW's lower cost vacuum port either place it off of the veneered surface with a strip of mesh or use cauls. He has a flush port, but it must be glued onto the bag rather than clamped on. That wouldn't work as well with my new "bag" for each piece of veneer method.

[Steve Manning]

Ouch ...... That bites the big one Bob. Though I'm betting you will get it fixed and not even see it.

[BobEllis]

Still waiting for Ron's how to fix a bubble instructions.

[Steve Manning]

Still waiting for Ron's how to fix a bubble instructions.

I've had mixed results fixing bubbles, especially since you having used epoxy, you can't throw an iron on it and reactivate the glue. I'm interested in what you come up with.

[Renron]

Bob,
Bummer man, very sorry to hear / see your bubble trouble.
I was going to write up a short presentation on how to repair bubbles the correct way, but I didn't get the expected bubble in my last large sheet of veneer, so nothing to repair.
I'll write up a separate thread on how to repair bubbles this morning.
In the mean time, go find a #22 or smaller needle & syringe. I get mine used from "downtown" there all over the sidewalks in Sacramento. JK. (kinda)
You'll also need a heat gun / hair dryer, tiny bit of distilled water, and adhesive of your choice (aliphatic (white) glue may not adhere well to epoxy), sm. flat sheet goods (MDF, plywood, straight board) and a heavy weight (car battery) or cauls and platens if feasible. Parchment paper if available (not necessary)

I was able to score quite a few different size needles from an in-law in the medical profession, all the way down to insulin size (which is really too small).
I'll post a link here to the new thread when it's done.
Ron

[BobEllis]

Removed wonky net connection duplicate post

[Renron]

Veneer Bubble repair link;

https://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?43299-Fixing-Veneer-bubbles-the-right-way&p=614412#post614412

Ron

[BobEllis]

Thanks Ron

[TEK]

Still waiting for Ron's how to fix a bubble instructions.

It's right here ;-)

https://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?43299-Fixing-Veneer-bubbles-the-right-way

Edit: strange, a lot of posts before mine that I did not see. Might be that I did botnoticethere was another page in tge thread...

[Wayman]

Bob, sorry about your "bubble trouble" but you have successfully overcame every other challenge so I have no doubt in the end this will be unnoticeable.

I built mine with a questionable skill-set and a limited window (not my workshop) to complete them. This is the kind of thing I was trying to avoid with my quick & dirty build.

Doesn't affect the sound tho!!!

Cheers, Wayne

[BobEllis]

Off topic, but it's my thread.

I suffered a minor lightning strike this weekend. Minor in that I can post here, and I walked away with just sore muscles and a copper taste in my mouth after a surge hit me through my iPhone charger and pulled a 1/2" spark as I involuntarily hurled the phone across the room. Afterwards, I exchanged emails with Jon to satisfy intellectual curiosity about charger failure modes. (Thanks again for taking the time to respond) From that discussion, I became more aware of surge protection requirements. While not yet as dedicated to surge protection as Jon, I do have several suppressors for the computers and audio visual equipment. All are several years old and none of the "Protected" lights are lit. Time to buy new.

Monday night I put a Tripp Lite ISOBAR ULTRA8 in my Amazon cart, waiting to order until I got home last night and surveyed the rest of my protectors. Yesterday morning the price had gone up $5. As things like that go for those of us in our late 50s, when I got home last night I completely forgot about ordering surge protectors. Today, the price is up another $12. Is there a run on surge protectors or something?

Besides a rant complaining about price increases, I guess the point of this is check your surge protectors. They use consumable MOVs, and will need to be replaced after a certain number of surges. Those of us who have been on the forum a while may remember a discussion on this topic. I am now beginning to be more like Jon, protecting almost everything short of heavy duty power tools and getting the suppressors on a replacement rotation.

[Steve Manning]

Off topic, but it's my thread.

I suffered a minor lightning strike this weekend. Minor in that I can post here, and I walked away with just sore muscles and a copper taste in my mouth after a surge hit me through my iPhone charger and pulled a 1/2" spark as I involuntarily hurled the phone across the room. Afterwards, I exchanged emails with Jon to satisfy intellectual curiosity about charger failure modes. (Thanks again for taking the time to respond) From that discussion, I became more aware of surge protection requirements. While not yet as dedicated to surge protection as Jon, I do have several suppressors for the computers and audio visual equipment. All are several years old and none of the "Protected" lights are lit. Time to buy new.

Monday night I put a Tripp Lite ISOBAR ULTRA8 in my Amazon cart, waiting to order until I got home last night and surveyed the rest of my protectors. Yesterday morning the price had gone up $5. As things like that go for those of us in our late 50s, when I got home last night I completely forgot about ordering surge protectors. Today, the price is up another $12. Is there a run on surge protectors or something?

Besides a rant complaining about price increases, I guess the point of this is check your surge protectors. They use consumable MOVs, and will need to be replaced after a certain number of surges. Those of us who have been on the forum a while may remember a discussion on this topic. I am now beginning to be more like Jon, protecting almost everything short of heavy duty power tools and getting the suppressors on a replacement rotation.

That's crazy Bob ...... now the OCD part of me, since your experiencing sore muscles and some other minor stuff ...... did you go get checked out by a doctor? I've been around electrical stuff and seen a number of people get bit, they were always sent to get checked out. That crap can do damage to your internals like nobodies business.

Oh ...... good idea on the surge protectors as well

[BobEllis]

Thanks, Steve.

I could feel the path through my shoulder and out my shoulder blade. Grounded through the bed was better than those who get zapped on their feet. I didn't really expose vital organs to current. My doc said to keep an eye on kidney function and recommended copious quantities of 18 year old scotch to ensure that there was enough for the kidneys to do. An old college friend, he gave me beer to wash down my oxycodone post back surgery. Definitely not a defensive practitioner.

[jwanck11]

I have been zapped by 110 several times and even 220. It's not fun at all though I cannot imagine what a lightening strike would be like.

I have surge protectors or GFCIs on everything.

Hope you are OK!

[BobEllis]

Thanks. I'm as good as before. A bit disappointed I didn't get a super power yet. Maybe it just takes a while.

It didn't feel like as much as the 750 V I hit in my tube amp days. Then again that went through my seat.

[Renron]

Bob,
Wow, what a story. Very glad your alright and no damage was done to your internal organs. (we hope)
I've had my hair and skin tingle from near miss strikes but never sparked like you. Gheesh man, you enjoy living on the edge. Fighter pilot and all.
Here is a good article with recommendations for a quality whole house lightening strike / surge protector and it's $115 on Amazon Prime. You can install it yourself too!

http://www.stevejenkins.com/blog/2014/10/whats-the-best-whole-house-surge-protection/

http://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B005C5NQTA/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=B005C5NQTA&linkCode=as2&tag=stejenblo-20&linkId=PCOEWQYQZFIUZLLC

Glad you weren't seriously hurt.
Ron

[BobEllis]

Whole house is on my to do list. Thanks for the links, Ron.

[BobEllis]

Finally the weather returned to reasonable temperatures and I'm able to get going again. Tries Ron's 80 grit on a piece of plywood method of flattening the top facet. Worked great except for nicking a corner and rounding it over. Would have been ally of sanding to fix, so I set up the vacuum rig. Veneer wrapped perfectly along the rounded edge until... Power outage. No power, no vacuum. My band clamps are 2 hours away. So I came up with this, hoping the bag and breather would provide some flexibility to get that round over wrapped.



Also used as much of Ron's veneer patching advise as possible. Epoxy bubbles aren't going to get wet. I used a heating pad with my caul on top to warm the veneer. It was much more flexible and the bubble seemed to want to be flat. Clamping by lead weights.



About half an hour after going out the power returned. Back under vacuum with clamps as a backup.

[TEK]

Power outage?
That happening just when you were doing this seems to me lile a really freak happening. I cant remember the last time we had a power outage here - mabye 5 years ago (not counting me blowing fuses then of course ;-))
Does that happend often around you?

[BobEllis]

Unfortunately it happens pretty regularly, especially with thunderstorms. Today is a beautiful sunny day, but in a town with less than one person per square mile I guess you can't expect too much. At least I decided to inspect my bike tires for wear. I was in the middle of replacing one when the power went out. Had I not decided to change it, I'd have been gone when the power went out and not had a clue why things had slipped.

[Steve Manning]

Looking good Bob, though it sounds like you working hard for it.

[BobEllis]

Thanks, Steve. I have hope for the bubble repair seeing how flat it got under the heating pad.

[JonMarsh]

Unfortunately it happens pretty regularly, especially with thunderstorms. Today is a beautiful sunny day, but in a town with less than one person per square mile I guess you can't expect too much. At least I decided to inspect my bike tires for wear. I was in the middle of replacing one when the power went out. Had I not decided to change it, I'd have been gone when the power went out and not had a clue why things had slipped.

Are you in upstate NY? I have a friend that lives outside of Westport... she has frequent power problems, including outages and surges that have damaged equipment. I think she made some comment recently that some offshore company had bought the local utility as an investment, and things had gone downhill since...

[BobEllis]

I'm in Essex NY for the summer. It is the next town north of Wesport. Hadn't paid attention to who owns the power company, but it's been blinky for years. Last year we were here weekends only and were sometimes surprised to find that the power had stayed on the whole week. This was the first outage since I've been here this year, though.

Since the lightning experience I've installed several Tripp Lite isobar Ultra surge protectors. I unplug during thunderstorms just to be safe.

Yay! The facet is properly bonded and the bubble repaired. I'll post pictures once I've cleaned up the excess glue. That was too nice a piece of veneer to sand off. OK, now that it worked, I'll admit I used a razor blade. The bubble was half an inch wide, and the only syringe I could get was one of the ones from Rockler, with a large plastic tip. I did slice horizontally, thanks to Ron's advice. I can't find the cut, so everything worked out well.

[Renron]

Very happy to hear things are working out for you in spite of having the deck stacked against you! I'd like to see pictures as well. Man, these speakers are more difficult in more ways than one. I suspect this is why we (who build these with solid veneer) chose to take on this project. Learning purposes! If it's easy, your not learning!
Glad the bubble was repaired. You are a determined man.
Ron

[JonMarsh]

Learning purposes! If it's easy, your not learning!
Glad the bubble was repaired. You are a determined man.
Ron

Boy, isn't that the truth! DIY speakers as a competency building activity... and occasionally we get to listen to them, too!

[BobEllis]

Here it is - from a foot away I can't see the slice, but it is visible if you look hard enough. The radius pg the curved section is about 1 cm Brushed on a little GF to add contrast, and I couldn't wait to preview the finished look.



As a reminder, it looked like this:

[Steve Manning]

Very nice fix Bob :T

[TEK]

Unfortunately it happens pretty regularly, especially with thunderstorms. Today is a beautiful sunny day, but in a town with less than one person per square mile I guess you can't expect too much. At least I decided to inspect my bike tires for wear. I was in the middle of replacing one when the power went out. Had I not decided to change it, I'd have been gone when the power went out and not had a clue why things had slipped.

You place:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clifton_Park,_New_York

Land area: 126 km2
Population: 36 750
Number of outbreak pr year: many

My place:

https://no.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vestvågøy

Land area: 407km2
Population: 11 198
Number of outbreak pr year: 0.2

;-)

[BobEllis]

Thanks, Steve.

And thanks to Ron for his admonition against vertical razor blade cuts.

[sdl2112]

Bob...the veneer fix looks great. I can't wait to see them finished. I lost track, what finish do you plan for these?

Btw...I might just know where to get a back-up power solution...we could use the business.

[BobEllis]

Next time I visit my son in Austin, I'll check you out. He's sysadmin at Rooster Teeth.

I'm planning to spray General Finishes High Performance Gloss. Not sure if I will leave it satin as I buff it up or bring it up to gloss.

[sdl2112]

Cool...small world. Maybe I'll be finished with mine by then.

I just applied GF HP to my base by foam brush and it applied beautifully. Are you going to apply any sealer first?

-Scott

[BobEllis]

I'm using the epoxy as a sealer.

[Renron]

Thanks for the photo Bob, great save on the bubble, can't see it! Perfect! The picture with the bubble looks like lizard skin....
This will be very interesting, different finishes we've chosen. I'm currently leaning towards the Epifanes Gloss Varnish used on old wooden boats.
SDL2112, got a picture for us?
Ron

[BobEllis]

The lizard skin look is a result of the epoxy bubbling through the veneer, and taking the shape of the breather mesh. I'd scraped lightly to get what I could before it hardened completely.

Well, Ron, you gain a day on me. Trimming the edges of the top facet I lifted a chip. A trip to the hardware store to get some super glue. Get home and the glue has hardened in the tube. Mixing up a bit of epoxy to glue it down properly, so no front face today.

[sdl2112]

Thanks for the photo Bob, great save on the bubble, can't see it! Perfect! The picture with the bubble looks like lizard skin....
This will be very interesting, different finishes we've chosen. I'm currently leaning towards the Epifanes Gloss Varnish used on old wooden boats.
SDL2112, got a picture for us?
Ron

Will do...I'll upload some to my SSA-WG thread.

[BobEllis]

Then, for no reason at all, things go well. One front face glued on and many sides have received a sealing coat of epoxy. The epoxy started to go before I could get to the last top facet. Not quite ceding a day to Ron, since I have so much of the sealing completed.

Here's the top that did not need a bubble repair now sealed.