Rsp-1069

[Kevin D]

I'll check. Keep in mind I'm running no center channel. Do you find it in movies or music or both? Just PCM from HD/BR?

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

I'll check. Keep in mind I'm running no center channel. Do you find it in movies or music or both? Just PCM from HD/BR?

Kevin D.

It does not happen with music in stereo or bypass. I notice it when im watching TV so in PLIIx mode and slightly but not as much when I am watching movies (SD DVD) so regular DD, and DD on TV.

I dont think in your case in your case not having a center will make a difference. I think it will either just sound thin or it wont. I will spend a bit of time playing with my SPL and sub settings. Can you please play with your "LF" nob and let me know if you notice much a of a difference between "0" and max?

[Kevin D]

Will do. Remember the knobs are temporary adjustments and revert back when switching inputs. Not sure if they effectr all speakers or just the fronts though. Notice any difference when changing it in the menu?

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

Will do. Remember the knobs are temporary adjustments and revert back when switching inputs. Not sure if they effectr all speakers or just the fronts though. Notice any difference when changing it in the menu?

Kevin D.

If you change them in the menue is it permanent? What exactly is it doing when you "increase" LF. Does it just increase the volume of singals 80 and below? Is it the same as just turning the volume up on my sub?

[Kevin D]

If you change them in the menue is it permanent? What exactly is it doing when you "increase" LF. Does it just increase the volume of singals 80 and below? Is it the same as just turning the volume up on my sub?

Menu is permanent. My LF knob seems to effect all speakers in every mode. I don't think it effects the LFE, but will effect the signal in the speakers before it goes through the crossover. I did have to turn my sub off to notice how big of a difference it made. I'm not sure if you need to have defeat turned off in the menu for the knob to have an effect.

I don't think it's a fixed frequency, I believe its been more spread out since they changed from BASS & TREBLE to CONTOUR.

I listened to a variety of male voices tonight and none sound thin or out of place. Normal programs I watch are not sounding different tone wise, not enough to notice at least.

I do think I found the issue with Dolby Digital being too low. It seems that the dynamic range control is stuck on regardless of the setting. Can you play a pretty dynamic track in Dolby Digital and hit the DYN button? No matter if its MAX, MID, or MIN I get no change in sound. Pretty much any disc with DTS & DOLBY is easy to hear the difference. Dolby needs to be 10 clicks higher to sound as loud and is completely different dynamically.

I did find an small bug with DVDA over HDMI. It doesn't change to MULTI CHANNEL xxK as you would expect. It stays at whatever surround mode you were at, but does change the xxK as expected. You can even select new surround modes, but it appears any 'surround' mode gives you full DVDA and any 'stereo' mode (2ch, PL3, etc) gives you a stereo downmix. It should give you the same display as PCM over HDMI, perhaps with an option for 2ch downmix.


Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

Menu is permanent. My LF knob seems to effect all speakers in every mode. I don't think it effects the LFE, but will effect the signal in the speakers before it goes through the crossover. I did have to turn my sub off to notice how big of a difference it made. I'm not sure if you need to have defeat turned off in the menu for the knob to have an effect.

I don't think it's a fixed frequency, I believe its been more spread out since they changed from BASS & TREBLE to CONTOUR.

I listened to a variety of male voices tonight and none sound thin or out of place. Normal programs I watch are not sounding different tone wise, not enough to notice at least.

Thanks for checking. I found that if I played with the LF I get to where I want to be. I guess I just expected the 1069 to act much more similar to the 1068.

I do think I found the issue with Dolby Digital being too low. It seems that the dynamic range control is stuck on regardless of the setting. Can you play a pretty dynamic track in Dolby Digital and hit the DYN button? No matter if its MAX, MID, or MIN I get no change in sound. Pretty much any disc with DTS & DOLBY is easy to hear the difference. Dolby needs to be 10 clicks higher to sound as loud and is completely different dynamically.

I think you are right. Changing the DYN from MAX, MID, or MIN doesnt seem to have an effect on DD tracks. When you say you think its "stuck on" do you mean stuck on at "MAX" meaning the 1069 plays the DD track normally or its stuck on at "MIN" where the track is compressed and there is no dynamic range (or very little). If its the latter perhaps that would explain my initial impressions of the audio sounding a little compressed?!

When I used my 1068 I always had it set to max.

I did find an small bug with DVDA over HDMI. It doesn't change to MULTI CHANNEL xxK as you would expect. It stays at whatever surround mode you were at, but does change the xxK as expected. You can even select new surround modes, but it appears any 'surround' mode gives you full DVDA and any 'stereo' mode (2ch, PL3, etc) gives you a stereo downmix. It should give you the same display as PCM over HDMI, perhaps with an option for 2ch downmix.


Kevin D.

Ineteresting. I wonder why it would be different. I mean how is the PCM track from DVD A any different to the 1069 then a PCM track from HD DVD/BD.

What DVDA player are you using curiously?

[Kevin D]

Stuck on MIN. No range at all.

According to Hifiguy, his rep said the PCM tracks are flagged based on origin. So an open PCM track could possibly have Cinema-EQ and Rotel XS applied. Do you know of any HD-DVD's with a PCM track? I may have to borrow a BH100 this weekend and some BR discs from work. So I would imagine DVDA origin PCM track could be flagged as well and they just aren't handling the flag correctly. I'm using the 1093 for DVDA playback.

Kevin D.

[nash]

There are no HD DVDs with a PCM track, that I'm aware of.

[Nolan B]

Stuck on MIN. No range at all.

that could explain the compressed sound I originally felt was present.

According to Hifiguy, his rep said the PCM tracks are flagged based on origin. So an open PCM track could possibly have Cinema-EQ and Rotel XS applied. Do you know of any HD-DVD's with a PCM track? I may have to borrow a BH100 this weekend and some BR discs from work. So I would imagine DVDA origin PCM track could be flagged as well and they just aren't handling the flag correctly. I'm using the 1093 for DVDA playback.

Kevin D.

There are no HD DVDs with PCM tracks. So you have confirmed yourself that TrueHD tracks converted to PCM can not be processed with Cinima-EQ etc?

On a side note according to a BluRay insider PCM tracks on BD are going away and being replaced with TrueHD.

[Kevin D]

There are no HD DVDs with PCM tracks. So you have confirmed yourself that TrueHD tracks converted to PCM can not be processed with Cinima-EQ etc?

Actually never tried. I'll snag the BH100 and some BR's from the office and see what's available on a PCM track versus others.

Kevin D.

[Mikael]

Hi Kevin

Thanks for the report.But what about the bass performence of RSP 1069 vs 1098 in bypass?
I'll think I 'll have to try RSP 1069 out at home.

[Kevin D]

Hi Kevin

Thanks for the report.But what about the bass performence of RSP 1069 vs 1098 in bypass?
I'll think I 'll have to try RSP 1069 out at home.

Slight increase in mid-bass with the 1069, but low end sounded the same.

Kevin D.

[TommyV]

Hey Kevin,

Glad you finally got yours hooked up. Have you guys made a final determination that the Rotel is doing proper bass management and speaker adjustments on decoded Dolby TreuHD and DD+ PCM signals? I know it is not adding the post processing. I do hope that Rotel gets these few issues ironed out with an update.

Have we confirmed that the 1058 is suffering from the same video issues? nash?

[Mikael]

Hi Kevin D

Thanks.
I have to try one at home now!

[nash]

Tommy,

I don't have the same video issues as reported... but I think that could be because I have the output set to 1080p. As noted above, the problems seem to come to light when using 1080i as the output. I am leaving out of town for a few days, but I will gladly test 1080i output when I get back to see if some of the same problems appear.

So far, I can report no problems using the 1058 in my setup/configuration, but I don't think I have put it through the same scrutiny as Kevin and Vancouver and others have done with their 1069s

[Kevin D]

Hey Kevin,

Glad you finally got yours hooked up. Have you guys made a final determination that the Rotel is doing proper bass management and speaker adjustments on decoded Dolby TreuHD and DD+ PCM signals? I know it is not adding the post processing. I do hope that Rotel gets these few issues ironed out with an update.

Assuming my new HD-DVE I got in today has some form of test-tones, I'll be grabbing the RTA meter from work and check this weekend. The stupid Dolby test disc has a different instrument for each channel in its test-tones, which doesn't lend well to metering.

Kevin D.

[TommyV]

nash, what is your setup and your display? Do you have a cable/sat box hooked up and if so what connections? Have a safe trip!

Kevin, DVE HD has some great test tones in Dolby True HD. Pretty much every test tone you could possibly want. I look forward to hearing your report.

[77engineer]

I broke down and upgraded my 1066 to a 1069 and I think I am pleased so far. I haven't had much of a chance to listen to much because I spent most of the night trying to get the thing setup. I have had some hit or miss luck on getting everything to work and I was interested to see if anyone has any suggestions. I have a Sony HS 20 projector that displays 720P.
1. I hooked up my Hughes HD Directv box via component and optical cables and everything worked fine.
2. Hooked up my XBOX in the same fashion and everything worked fine.
3. Now for the piece that I spent most of the night on and that is trying to hook up my Panasonic BP-10a Blu Ray player. I can not get the video to work over the HDMI cable at all...the audio hooked up and worked fine but I get a input out of range on my projector. I have set the video output to all possible formats 480P, 720P, and 1080i and no luck. I have the ability to set my output for the HDMI on the Panasonic to 480P, 720P, 1080i and 1080P still no luck. I can hook up straight to my projector and everything works fine.??? Since my projector has a DVI and HDMI I even switched to the DVI with an HDMI converter and I get the same message. Finally I went to component outs and a coax audio and everything works. Does this sound like a bug that I can hope they fix or does someone have a suggestion.

Looking forward to playing with this thing over the weekend.

Thanks in advance
Adam

[dbaer]

New System Design RSP-1069

I'm about to plunk down some serious dough on a brand new system and was wondering what everyone thinks of my current selection. The only issue I'm really concerned about is the bluray audio and video and the fact that the Rotel is not HDMI 1.3. Can anyone make some suggestions regarding buying the right bluray player that will play through my rsp-1069 and perform true-hd and master and also Blueray 1.1 or future 2.0 or do I skip passing it through for video and go straight to the TV and hope the optical out processess the higher version audio? This design is for my 2 rooms and upstairs bedroom/bathroom. Media room with 5.1 and Kitchen/Living room that has a set of generic in ceiling in each. I can't go cat5 to the bedroom/bath upstairs so I am forced for the purpose of getting to all zones the use of the sonos and a seperate reciever upstairs to amp the 4 speakers there.


TV Sony KDL52XBR5
2 X B&W 705
1 X B&W HTM7
2 X B&W CWM 800
Velodyne DD-12 )
Rotel RSP-1069
Rotel RMB-1075
Rotel RB-1050
Rotel RCC 1055
Pioneer BDP-95fd
Panamax Max 5400PM
Comcast Cable HD-DVR
XBOX 360
Mac 802.11N Network Extreme for Mac Book Pro
2 x Sonos-80 and Controller for pair of speakers upstairs in Bedroom and Pair in Bathroom

Thanks.

[TommyV]

I broke down and upgraded my 1066 to a 1069 and I think I am pleased so far. I haven't had much of a chance to listen to much because I spent most of the night trying to get the thing setup. I have had some hit or miss luck on getting everything to work and I was interested to see if anyone has any suggestions. I have a Sony HS 20 projector that displays 720P.
1. I hooked up my Hughes HD Directv box via component and optical cables and everything worked fine.
2. Hooked up my XBOX in the same fashion and everything worked fine.
3. Now for the piece that I spent most of the night on and that is trying to hook up my Panasonic BP-10a Blu Ray player. I can not get the video to work over the HDMI cable at all...the audio hooked up and worked fine but I get a input out of range on my projector. I have set the video output to all possible formats 480P, 720P, and 1080i and no luck. I have the ability to set my output for the HDMI on the Panasonic to 480P, 720P, 1080i and 1080P still no luck. I can hook up straight to my projector and everything works fine.??? Since my projector has a DVI and HDMI I even switched to the DVI with an HDMI converter and I get the same message. Finally I went to component outs and a coax audio and everything works. Does this sound like a bug that I can hope they fix or does someone have a suggestion.

Looking forward to playing with this thing over the weekend.

Thanks in advance
Adam

Can you get the OSD to come up over the HDMI?

[77engineer]

Yes I can get the OSD for the Rotel to come up over HDMI but not the OSD for my Blu Ray player unless I hook directly to my projector. Once I switched to componenet between my Blu Ray and the Rotel I was able to get everything to work. The only thing that I have not tested is running a new HDMI cable to make sure that is not the problem.

[Kevin D]

3. Now for the piece that I spent most of the night on and that is trying to hook up my Panasonic BP-10a Blu Ray player. I can not get the video to work over the HDMI cable at all...the audio hooked up and worked fine but I get a input out of range on my projector. I have set the video output to all possible formats 480P, 720P, and 1080i and no luck. I have the ability to set my output for the HDMI on the Panasonic to 480P, 720P, 1080i and 1080P still no luck.

Looking forward to playing with this thing over the weekend.

Thanks in advance
Adam

What firmware are you running on the BD10? Looks like 2.4 is the latest. Might fix some compatibility issues. I know the BD10 has issues running through some Onkyo receivers, don't know if those got resolved yet or not. Might have to call Rotel to see if they're seeing similar issues from other BD10 owners.

Definitely want to get it working HDMI as you're loosing some good audio just running the coaxial. If the HDMI takes a while to get working, I would hook up the 7.1 analog outputs to the mutli-channel inputs of the 1069.

Kevin D.

[Kevin D]

I'm about to plunk down some serious dough on a brand new system and was wondering what everyone thinks of my current selection. The only issue I'm really concerned about is the bluray audio and video and the fact that the Rotel is not HDMI 1.3. Can anyone make some suggestions regarding buying the right bluray player that will play through my rsp-1069 and perform true-hd and master and also Blueray 1.1 or future 2.0 or do I skip passing it through for video and go straight to the TV and hope the optical out processess the higher version audio?

Thanks.

Well no current player I know of will decode DTS MA. From reading about the panasonic BD10A, it looks like it can decode DTS-HD (but not MA). No real need for 1.3 as the 1069 will play whatever your player can decode at high-resolution. In any case, the optical/coaxial outputs will never provide the better audio, just the core DD/DTS.

Kevin D.

[77engineer]

Kevin,

Thanks for the tips I am definitely using the external outputs while I am working through this. I did check my firmware version and I was still running 2.0 so I am in the process of upgrading to 2.4 and hopefully it will help things out. I will post my finding once the upgrade is complete.

Adam

[77engineer]

Well not luck on the software upgrade. I still get a "frequency out of range" on my projector. The thing that is odd on the Panasonic is I can set the output to 480P, 720P or 1080i and as long as I hook it up to my projector it remembers that setting. However, as soon as I hook it up to the Rotel it reverts back to an Auto mode where the Panasonic is trying to display the best image for the TV. The other thing I am going to look at is I may try another HDMI cable just to make sure that is not the culprit (seems like a long shot).

Adam

[TommyV]

You said you are using component on your DirecTV HD box. Does it not have HDMI as well? Is the Panny player your only HDMI source?

[77engineer]

Yes the Panny is my only HDMI source. I have another Directv box that I may move just to make sure my HDMI inputs aren't messed up.

[dbaer]

So what you're saying is....

Well no current player I know of will decode DTS MA. From reading about the panasonic BD10A, it looks like it can decode DTS-HD (but not MA). No real need for 1.3 as the 1069 will play whatever your player can decode at high-resolution. In any case, the optical/coaxial outputs will never provide the better audio, just the core DD/DTS.

Kevin D.

Kevin,

Thanks for the feedback. If I've got this right... don't worry that the Rotel is not 1.3. Get a player like the Samsung BD-UP5000 (when it comes out) that decodes the 2 high res audio signals,,,but how will I plug this in. Do I go from the player to the pre using the hdmi? Wouldn't I give up what 1.3 does? The XBR has 1.3 so should I go direct to the XBR for video and send the audio to the Rotel? If I do shoot the audio over to the rotel which connects should I use since you say the optical is only good for DTS?

I'm only thinking about the BD-UP5000 b/c I don't want to deal with some movies not being in Bluray that I can't wait to see like Top Gun and I want the ability to update the firmware over ether. I don't see any other standalone players allow this option. It would have been nice if Sony would have stepped up too since they just released their players under the Oct. deadline gun.

I wish Rotel would just get into the BD/HD DVD game and produce an all in one player like the other big box guys are doing now. I like uniformity in my equipment.

You can see I'm kinda confused about all this stuff and quite frankly a little PO'd that Rotel didn't use 1.3 in the 1069 nor did they add the two audio processes HD and MA? I guess in a couple of years I'll just sell the piece and go for the upgrade. By then if you aren't watching tv in holigram form with smellavision your viewing experience will be so last century.

Much oblidged.

David

[TommyV]

The only advantage to HDMI 1.3 in the display is Deep Color and x.v.Color. No HD DVD/Blu Ray software takes advantage of this yet and it is said they may never. Deep Color and x.v.Color are pretty much marketing hypes at the moment.

It is something to consider though that if you fed the Rotel a 1080p signal w/ Deep Color that it would not be passed to your display. I would assume this is true since the Rotel is only 1.1.

So basically to answer your question, you would just use HDMI for audio and video to the Rotel.

[Kevin D]

Kevin,

I wish Rotel would just get into the BD/HD DVD game and produce an all in one player like the other big box guys are doing now. I like uniformity in my equipment.

You can see I'm kinda confused about all this stuff and quite frankly a little PO'd that Rotel didn't use 1.3 in the 1069 nor did they add the two audio processes HD and MA? I guess in a couple of years I'll just sell the piece and go for the upgrade. By then if you aren't watching tv in holigram form with smellavision your viewing experience will be so last century.

Much oblidged.

David

As Tommy said, the video portion of HDMI 1.3 will not have an effect on your current setup. If you TV supports Deep Color and x.v.color, your BR player won't. There is the question of whether all devices need to be HDMI 1.3, or if this information will pass through an HDMI 1.1 connector on the way. Worse case scenario in the future is an HDMI splitter and run HDMI to the 1069 and your TV.

As far as Rotel not using 1.3 and not having a BR/HD player, you have to understand how small a company Rotel actually is. They are no where near the size of the big guys and have no where near the money of the small high-end guys. They could do things faster, but the price would go up. No one would pay $5000 for a Rotel pre-amp or $4000 for a Rotel combo player.

Rotel needed new products and their R&D time is usually a year. They were 11 months in when they could finally purchase decoder chips to work with the new formats. They could start over and lose more market share or just continue on with something that will pretty much do the same thing in a different way.

They could design products around 'future' chips, but they got burned before with chips that wound up not doing everything the manufacturers claimed.

So basically they will release product that has all the newest stuff as soon as it is a financially viable solution (for them and the consumer). They can't price themselves out of the market nor lose money on some pieces just to have it out there.

Kevin D.

[Mark_C.]

The problelm is turnaround time. Used to be, a company like Rotel could take its time in deciding which technology would "stick" in the consumer electronics world. Not anymore. Now there is constant pressure to release new models every six months rather than every two or three years. Companies like Rotel are in a pickle, because much of the consumer base wants the next "big thing" now, regardless whether it's a real improvement; and most don't care about build or audio/video quality.

[77engineer]

You said you are using component on your DirecTV HD box. Does it not have HDMI as well? Is the Panny player your only HDMI source?

Well I moved my Directv boxes around so that I could check the HDMI with another source. I hooked up the Directv box via HDMI to the Rotel and everything worked as it should so it appears I am having some sort of issue between my Panny and the Rotel on the HDMI video. I have sent Rotel an email over the weekend and hopefully I can get some helpful suggestions. One of the big reasons I purchased this reviever is am striving to get to the one wire hookup solution.

Adam

[windshear]

I dont think your problem lies with the Rotel in the chain.It could be the Panny HDMI implementation. I read an online article the other day that more or less indicates this....

[Pookie007]

Has anyone noticed a delay with the 1069 detecting the audio track? For example, when changing channels on the HD Cable Box, is there a 2 - 3 second delay after the picture shows up for the audio to kick in? I was told this by the guy trying to sell me a Lexicon processor this was an issue, so I haven't given it much credibility.

[Kevin D]

Not here. Either HDMI or optical pops right up when I change the channel.
That's on a Dish 622.

Kevin D.

[77engineer]

Has anyone noticed a delay with the 1069 detecting the audio track? For example, when changing channels on the HD Cable Box, is there a 2 - 3 second delay after the picture shows up for the audio to kick in? I was told this by the guy trying to sell me a Lexicon processor this was an issue, so I haven't given it much credibility.

On my 1069 the audio pops up at the same time that the picture does.

[Nolan B]

Has anyone noticed a delay with the 1069 detecting the audio track? For example, when changing channels on the HD Cable Box, is there a 2 - 3 second delay after the picture shows up for the audio to kick in? I was told this by the guy trying to sell me a Lexicon processor this was an issue, so I haven't given it much credibility.

mine is fine too

[Pookie007]

I figured there were no audio problems. Now since that dealer tried to pull a hustle, I can't shop there for anything. My 1069 will be on order this week.

[mmutz]

Hi there,

Here in Europe, the RSP-1069 just came out last week and I consider buying one . Yet, I have some trouble figuring out if this unit supports 1080p24 mode. Although the fact that it doesn't have HDMI 1.3 is no big issue, missing 24p support is a bit more annoying.

[Kevin D]

If fed a 1080p signal, the 1069 should pass it through unaltered. So 1080p in any format will pass through fine.

Kevin D.

[birdman]

Hi,

What remote comes with the 1069?

TIA

[77engineer]

Hi,

What remote comes with the 1069?

TIA

It comes with the RR-1060 which is a learning remote.

[Nolan B]

Just a heads up to those interested in the 1069, but are waiting until an answer comes regarding the video issues. I have been in touch with Rotel a few times, and have been told a fix is coming. I dont really know to much at this point other then it will be within the next couple of weeks and i will have a chance to run all the video tests, and confirm the fix actually adresses all the issues.

[TommyV]

Did y'all ever test the bass management on decoded Dolby TrueHD etc?

[Kevin D]

Yes, verified with an RTA that bass management and level controls are applied to high-res PCM tracks over HDMI. Delay s as well, but I have no method of verifying.

Kevin D.