Best electronic for 804D system

[leo2498]

Yes... Glass is the worst.. I didn't know you had a window, but if you are willing to block them it will do wonders...

I thought you would like the Oppo... It is really the bargain of home audio IMO...

Hi Stuart,
yes I didn't tell you about it, I'm sorry but I forget this little thing but maybe the curtain could Help with this reflection point, I post my HT complete en the thread of pictures of you B&W if you want to see it.

in this link I have all the pictures that I took and some of this evolution.

http://www.blu-ray.com/community/gallery.php?member=leo2498

[leo2498]

Hi Stuart,
I been trying some possible scenarios with the oppo but I have a doubt that the manual of the denon not answered. if I put the bass management in the receiver in (LFE+MAIN) Theoretically it will use the sub for low frequency (40 hz and below ) but I wondering if I do this the analog signal could be affect in some way for digital processor or in this case the AVR use some kind of analog filter?

I had to set the distance of my front in the oppo to get the right center image in stereo listen because I’m using its dedicate stereo output, are you set this distance in your oppo too?

[stuofsci02]

Leo

How are you going into the Denon from the Oppo? Are you using the 7.1 EXT Analog inputs from the analog outputs on the Oppo? If you will use the analog outputs on the Oppo, you do no want the Denon to do anything other then volume control.

[leo2498]

Leo

How are you going into the Denon from the Oppo? Are you using the 7.1 EXT Analog inputs from the analog outputs on the Oppo? If you will use the analog outputs on the Oppo, you do no want the Denon to do anything other then volume control.

I used the dedicated stereo output to listen cd in pure audio option and in the other hand I connected the hdmi2 for movie use(audio only), When I listen my CD I used the dac of the oppo but I see that with the option main+lfe I get more bass output but I wondering if the denon are reconfigured the analog signal to digital in this way.

[stuofsci02]

I used the dedicated stereo output to listen cd in pure audio option and in the other hand I connected the hdmi2 for movie use(audio only), When I listen my CD I used the dac of the oppo but I see that with the option main+lfe I get more bass output but I wondering if the denon are reconfigured the analog signal to digital in this way.

Any filtering that the Denon will do will most certainly be in the digital domain, so this is not good for sound.. Not only are you using the inferior DAC in the Denon, but you are also using a ADC when you go into the Denon.

So you get Oppo DAC -> Denon ADC -> Denon DAC.. Yikes!

[leo2498]

Any filtering that the Denon will do will most certainly be in the digital domain, so this is not good for sound.. Not only are you using the inferior DAC in the Denon, but you are also using a ADC when you go into the Denon.

So you get Oppo DAC -> Denon ADC -> Denon DAC.. Yikes!

yep that is exactly I trying to avoid, but I want be sure about it. if I will get the same thing with the pure audio option (whatever set up I do in the denon) is a big problem to me, by the way in this set up the sound is not bad at all.

Any tip with the distance in the oppo?

[Henry982]

Hola Leo,

My name is Henry and I'm a Venezuelan living in Chicago. I just checked this forum and I know exactly how you feel because I had the same problem. After visiting more than 3 different big audio stores here in Chicago and testing in my place a lot of different amps and pre-amp. I must agree that the pre-amp is one of the most important pieces in the sound quality. My budget which is lower than yours just cover two BW CM8 and a Rotel RC-1550 and RB-1552. The key here is synergy.

First Rotel is built by the same company who builds BW and Classe. Therefore, the BW which are tough to drive are designed with the Rotel Power. So, For what I have heard I would recommend to use your rotel amp with the RC-1080. This pre-amp sounds incredible. Believe me forget about your Dennon. Once you try this combo you will be amazed by what your BW can do.

Attached I'm sending you a pic of my setting. Once again, I'm not trying to step over others comments. However, all the things that I'm telling you, I've tried myself and I'm really happy with the result.

Have a great day

[Henry982]

Leo once I read again all your comments. Try to be consistent with the brand. Rotel pre and amp sounds incredible for BW. Finally, Audioquest analog cables have worked for me very well.

Saludos y cualquier ayuda estamos a la orden.

Henry

[leo2498]

Leo once I read again all your comments. Try to be consistent with the brand. Rotel pre and amp sounds incredible for BW. Finally, Audioquest analog cables have worked for me very well.

Saludos y cualquier ayuda estamos a la orden.

Henry

Hi Henry,
Thank for your advice, I like rotel gear a lot but it don’t have a preamp with bypass to use this like pure stereo preamp; I asking to my dealer a rc-1550 borrow this weekend to try this in my system and if I see that this it is the weak of my system maybe I will get the parasound P7 that could work in both world(stereo and multichanel), sadly rotel have discontinued the multi amp AB I will prefer buy a same brand amps instead of have mix of brand.

I'm thinking to get the P7 with the A52 and continue with the denon (for movie) and I forget the classe(saving some coins).

how could be this math between parasound and 800 series, are not much owner of B&W with this kind of set up.

[stuofsci02]

Hi Henry,
Thank for your advice, I like rotel gear a lot but it don’t have a preamp with bypass to use this like pure stereo preamp; I asking to my dealer a rc-1550 borrow this weekend to try this in my system and if I see that this it is the weak of my system maybe I will get the parasound P7 that could work in both world(stereo and multichanel), sadly rotel have discontinued the multi amp AB I will prefer buy a same brand amps instead of have mix of brand.

I'm thinking to get the P7 with the A52 and continue with the denon (for movie) and I forget the classe(saving some coins).

how could be this math between parasound and 800 series, are not much owner of B&W with this kind of set up.

I auditioned heavily the A21 (which is a two channel version of the A51) with my 804s. I ended up preferring the Chord amp which I bought, but I thought the A21 was very good also. But if I was to go for the A21, I think I would have gone for the JC1 instead.

I have not heard the A22/A52, but I imagine the sonic signature should be similar.

[leo2498]

I auditioned heavily the A21 (which is a two channel version of the A51) with my 804s. I ended up preferring the Chord amp which I bought, but I thought the A21 was very good also. But if I was to go for the A21, I think I would have gone for the JC1 instead.

I have not heard the A22/A52, but I imagine the sonic signature should be similar.

hi stuart, why you chose the Chord amp instead of parasound amp? some special features you drive to get this one? for the other hand, are you ever to listen prima luna 3 pre amp? my dealer call me today to say that he have a second hand of this preamp, I never hear of them.

[leo2498]

Leo once I read again all your comments. Try to be consistent with the brand. Rotel pre and amp sounds incredible for BW. Finally, Audioquest analog cables have worked for me very well.

Saludos y cualquier ayuda estamos a la orden.

Henry

Hi Henry,
what source are you using for feed your system? only the p.c?

[stuofsci02]

hi stuart, why you chose the Chord amp instead of parasound amp? some special features you drive to get this one? for the other hand, are you ever to listen prima luna 3 pre amp? my dealer call me today to say that he have a second hand of this preamp, I never hear of them.

It had nothing to do with features etc.. In fact the Chord is a pretty basic amp when it comes to features. And was more expensive for only 130 watts into 8 ohms.

But compared to every other amp I have heard with my speakers it is better for me. I just love it. I have not tried any Classe amps though.

[stuofsci02]

Leo,

I went back and found my first thread here which was when I was deciding what amp to get...

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=35238&highlight=Chord+SPM

[leo2498]

Leo,

I went back and found my first thread here which was when I was deciding what amp to get...

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthr...ight=Chord+SPM

thanks stuart, I read your thread and now I can see your point, you was getting the best for your music like I do, so I'm thinking that the best for me now is try different electronics and see what is the best for me like you did. the only problem is that I have to travel to do this, for now my dealer will me borrow his pre and let me try this in home so I will let you know.
Thanks again four you time. :T

[leo2498]

Hi Stuart,
I was trying two preamp that my dealer borrow me for audition and after two day of extensive listen both, I’m really worry for the result; my first thought was the rotel gear had an excellent amplifiers but its preamp is not enough good for my taste. I compared it with an atoll IN400 (what great product the atoll is) not my kind of amplifier but excellent preamplifier and this is why I'm worry , I will need a preamp soon but for my HT only I Know two option(your pre emotive and the P7 parasound) but I afraid that like with the rotel neither like to me taste. It’s possible get the same performance in stereo listening with a high end pre under 5000 usd budget?

Well my first thought that buy the best now and keeping for a least 10 year, it is not a good idea so the first answer is that I need try different gear because all component have its own sugar.

[stuofsci02]

Hi Stuart,
I was trying two preamp that my dealer borrow me for audition and after two day of extensive listen both, I’m really worry for the result; my first thought was the rotel gear had an excellent amplifiers but its preamp is not enough good for my taste. I compared it with an atoll IN400 (what great product the atoll is) not my kind of amplifier but excellent preamplifier and this is why I'm worry , I will need a preamp soon but for my HT only I Know two option(your pre emotive and the P7 parasound) but I afraid that like with the rotel neither like to me taste. It’s possible get the same performance in stereo listening with a high end pre under 5000 usd budget?

Well my first thought that buy the best now and keeping for a least 10 year, it is not a good idea so the first answer is that I need try different gear because all component have its own sugar.

I think this is why so many people are constantly shuffling gear. What may work at one time in your audio journey may not later on.

There are a lot of preamps that have HTbypass. From my search on the web I found a partial list of some. I have not checked these for accuracy though.

Abrahamsen Audio PA-1
Abrahamsen Audio V3.0
Adcom GFP 750
Advantage S2
Arcam Alpha 9C
Arcam FMJ C30
Arcam FMJ C31
Atoll PR300
Audio Analogue Bellini
Audio Analogue Maestro Stereo Line Preamplifier
Audio Research SP16L
Ayre K-5xe
bel canto PRe1
Bel Canto PRe3
Cambridge Audio Azur 840E
Cary Audio cpa 1
Cary Audio SLP-2002
Cary SLP03 (tube)
Cary Audio SLP-5
Chapter Audio Preface
Classè CP65
Classè CP-500
Classè CP-700
Conrad Johnson CT5
Conrad Johnson CT6
Conrad Johnson Premier 18LS
Conrad Johnson PV14L
Conrad Johnson PV15
Densen B-200
Densen B-230
Densen B-250
Dodd (tube)
Emotiva USP-1
GamuT D3
GamuT D3i
Jeff Rowland Capri Preamplifier
Jeff Rowland Coherence II
Jeff Rowland Concerto Preamplifier
Jeff Rowland Synergy IIi
Krell KCT
Krell Evolution two
Krell Evolution 202
Krell Evolution 222
Krell KAV-250p
Krell KPS-25SC (inkl. CD-spiller)
Krell KRC 3
Krell KRC-HR
Linn Klimax Kontrol
Linn Kolektor
Mark Levinson N° 32
Mark Levinson N° 320
Mark Levinson N° 320S
Mark Levinson N° 326S
Mark Levinson N° 38
Mark Levinson N° 380
Mark Levinson N° 380S
McCormack RLD-1
Micromega PA-20
Modwright 9.0 and 36.5
Musical Fidelity A5cr Premplifier
Musical Fidelity kW Tube (6112) Line Preamplifier
Naim NAC 112x
Naim NAC 122x
Naim NAC 202
Naim NAC 252
Naim NAC 282
Naim NAC 552
Nuforce P8/P9 (SS)

Odyssey Candela
Odyssey Tempest (SS)
Odyssey Kismet LS (new - tube)
Parasound Halo P7
Parasound NewClassic Model 2100
Primare PRE30 PreAmplifier
Proceed Pre
PS Audio GCP 200 (SS)
PS Audio PCA-2
Roksan Platinum PR150B Pre Amplifier
Rotel RC-1580
Rouge Audio Perseus
Sim Audio MOON P-3
Sim Audio MOON P-5
Sim Audio MOON P-7
Sim Audio MOON P-8
Supratek Chardonnay
VTL TL-2.5
VTL TL-5.5
VTL TL-6.5
VTL TL-7.5
Wyred 4 Sound STP (new - SS)
Yba Passion 400 PRE
Yba Passion 600 PRE
Yba Passion 1000 PRE

[leo2498]

I think this is why so many people are constantly shuffling gear. What may work at one time in your audio journey may not later on.

There are a lot of preamps that have HTbypass. From my search on the web I found a partial list of some. I have not checked these for accuracy though.

thanks stuart for this complete list, but I wondering if is possible get the same result with a HT processor under 5000 usd budget, for example rotel, NAD or Anthem or something like that.

[stuofsci02]

thanks stuart for this complete list, but I wondering if is possible get the same result with a HT processor under 5000 usd budget, for example rotel, NAD or Anthem or something like that.

Hmmm... You mention the "same result", but what result are you referring to?

I have not spent much time with pre/pros as I have myself given in to the fact that I do not require absolute "top performance" for my multichannel applications which for me consist of movies, blu-ray concerts and MC DVD-A and SACD. For me a good ($1k-$2k) pre/pro does the job for the amount of time I spend on this.

Since there is only so much $$$$ to go around I have decided to put it where I spend most of my time and that is on stereo listening (so transport, DAC, preamp, amp, speakers and maybe a TT someday).

If you stick with pre/pro then I think you need to spend 5x to equal a good stereo preamp. Then at some $$$ point the pre/pro just won't be able to match. Where that is, I am not sure and I think will depend on user and equipment.

What I can say is if I could get the same performance out of a pre/pro for $1500 as I do out of my $350 Emotiva USP-1 I would get the pre/pro, but so far the USP-1 has given me every reason to believe I would have to spend a lot more.

So I have made the decision that when I have more time I will sell my HTM3s center channel and all my HT gear (pre/pro, center channel amp, rear amp etc.) and focus on stereo only. This will allow me to focus my resources on 5 things.

The only thing that I am sure I will miss is my HTM3s... For movies a good center really is something to appreciate.

[leo2498]

Hmmm... You mention the "same result", but what result are you referring to?

I have not spent much time with pre/pros as I have myself given in to the fact that I do not require absolute "top performance" for my multichannel applications which for me consist of movies, blu-ray concerts and MC DVD-A and SACD. For me a good ($1k-$2k) pre/pro does the job for the amount of time I spend on this.

Since there is only so much $$$$ to go around I have decided to put it where I spend most of my time and that is on stereo listening (so transport, DAC, preamp, amp, speakers and maybe a TT someday).

If you stick with pre/pro then I think you need to spend 5x to equal a good stereo preamp. Then at some $$$ point the pre/pro just won't be able to match. Where that is, I am not sure and I think will depend on user and equipment.

What I can say is if I could get the same performance out of a pre/pro for $1500 as I do out of my $350 Emotiva USP-1 I would get the pre/pro, but so far the USP-1 has given me every reason to believe I would have to spend a lot more.

So I have made the decision that when I have more time I will sell my HTM3s center channel and all my HT gear (pre/pro, center channel amp, rear amp etc.) and focus on stereo only. This will allow me to focus my resources on 5 things.

The only thing that I am sure I will miss is my HTM3s... For movies a good center really is something to appreciate.

With the same result I mean that with a stereo high-end preamp the sound is much more clear with better presentation, the voice and instrument in the right place, it’s like more focused and well define; I’m not an audiophile but I want to become one. The denon when it was release cost about 1,5 k and now the new version are about 1,2k I guess, so in this ballpark I think that it not do well the job. When I compared the rotel RC1550 with the Atoll the main difference was that the atoll have better midrange and the highs were less strident more warm and this is what I wanted.

Again Stuart you are right, I use my HT about 80% for music and 20% for movie since my baby was born, mainly use is for Cd’s playback and some bluray concert. So I’m thinking that I need put my money in the right place (stereo listen) so in your list is my answer so for now I will discard the idea of CA5300 and I’m thinking to buy a CA2300 when I could audition this and for the pre maybe something that match well between both world like the parasound or something like the classe CP800(i just see you other answer).

p.d what is TT?

[stuofsci02]

With the same result I mean that with a stereo high-end preamp the sound is much more clear with better presentation, the voice and instrument in the right place, it’s like more focused and well define; I’m not an audiophile but I want to become one. The denon when it was release cost about 1,5 k and now the new version are about 1,2k I guess, so in this ballpark I think that it not do well the job. When I compared the rotel RC1550 with the Atoll the main difference was that the atoll have better midrange and the highs were less strident more warm and this is what I wanted.

Again Stuart you are right, I use my HT about 80% for music and 20% for movie since my baby was born, mainly use is for Cd’s playback and some bluray concert. So I’m thinking that I need put my money in the right place (stereo listen) so in your list is my answer so for now I will discard the idea of CA5300 and I’m thinking to buy a CA2300 when I could audition this and for the pre maybe something that match well between both world like the parasound or something like the classe CP800(i just see you other answer).

p.d what is TT?

TT = Turn Table

I am also in the same boat.. Now I have a 5 year old daughter and a 2 year old son. I don't have near the time to sit down and watch a whole movie or concert. So if I can squeeze 20-30 min with the stereo, then it has to do. As a result my focus has changed.

Also when I mention 5x the price I picked that number as an example. I know someone will come on to this thread and flame me for making such a statement. But the fact is, a pre/pro with similar audio performance will be much more expensive then a stereo preamp. At some price point the preamp will become better then the best pre/pro due to it's dedicated design..

[leo2498]

TT = Turn Table

I am also in the same boat.. Now I have a 5 year old daughter and a 2 year old son. I don't have near the time to sit down and watch a whole movie or concert. So if I can squeeze 20-30 min with the stereo, then it has to do. As a result my focus has changed.

Also when I mention 5x the price I picked that number as an example. I know someone will come on to this thread and flame me for making such a statement. But the fact is, a pre/pro with similar audio performance will be much more expensive then a stereo preamp. At some price point the preamp will become better then the best pre/pro due to it's dedicated design..

I understand perfectly your point with the kids . In my audition I can perceived that with different preamp I could get better performance with the same apm(rotel) but I wondering if in the amplifier is the same, if I will get the classe preamp with my rotel it will be a waste of money? I talked with my dealer and the price for both(classe pre with CA-2300) is near to 14k so I'm thinking in get the pre first and the new amp down of the road.
It's a bad idea?

I can see that you put your money first in the amp side, for your ears in the amp side was the major upgrade?

Also when I mention 5x the price I picked that number as an example. I know someone will come on to this thread and flame me for making such a statement. But the fact is, a pre/pro with similar audio performance will be much more expensive then a stereo preamp. At some price point the preamp will become better then the best pre/pro due to it's dedicated design..

That is an affirmation that I can see with this forums, some guys have the SSP800 that supposedly can performance excelent in both HT and stereo audio, they are buying the CP800 for stereo listening so I think that you are not at all wrong.

[stuofsci02]

I understand perfectly your point with the kids . In my audition I can perceived that with different preamp I could get better performance with the same apm(rotel) but I wondering if in the amplifier is the same, if I will get the classe preamp with my rotel it will be a waste of money? I talked with my dealer and the price for both(classe pre with CA-2300) is near to 14k so I'm thinking in get the pre first and the new amp down of the road.
It's a bad idea?

I can see that you put your money first in the amp side, for your ears in the amp side was the major upgrade?



That is an affirmation that I can see with this forums, some guys have the SSP800 that supposedly can performance excelent in both HT and stereo audio, they are buying the CP800 for stereo listening so I think that you are not at all wrong.

I don't think getting a great preamp first and upgrading the amp later is a bad choice at all.

I know I did it backwards, but I think this was a rookie mistake on my part. If I had to do it all over again, I would get a great preamp first and get something like a Emotiva XPA-2 or something like that, until I could match my amp with the preamp.

I am finding that once you reach a certain level of amp the differences can be quite small. I have an Emotiva UPA-2 which is 125 wpc and when I compare to my Chord SPM-650 at 130wpc, I for sure like the Chord better, but the differences are not night and day as some might assume. The Chord is faster, less grainy and has better overall control of the speakers IMO, but I think the preamp would make a bigger difference.. At least that is what I have noticed.

Here is another thread I wrote after testing my Emo USP-1 vs. an entry level Chord preamp.

http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=prepro&action=display&thread=15403

[Henry982]

Leo

Sorry about the delay in my answer but I've been packed at work. I use the PC as one source with some good quality mp3 but my main source is the PS3 and my DVD and Bluray Concerts. I have connected my PS3 through an HDMI cable to the TV (same for comcast the cable company) and then using the TV as a bridge using the analog output from the tv directly to my rotel pre-amp.

Further I'm going to write some lines about my short-story that maybe can be helpful.

The reason why I change my set-up:

I started with two BW685 connected pure stereo to my pioneer elite receiver vsx-52. I liked the sound but I always knew that I needed more. Then, my wife was complaining because the dialog in the movies was missing (the least of my concerns but she was right) and that’s how I decided to buy the HTM1 center. After a couple of months and endless hours fixing the system, I decided that the receiver was the problem. So, I borrowed a SC-55 from my uncle. Much better sound, in this one you can set-up the equalizer for each speaker.

After a while I decided that I needed a better speaker. So, I sold my 685 and I bought two 683. A total disaster. The pioneer and the 683 did not sound good for me. So, I went to an audio store, and I bought the NAD 356BEE integrated amp. Great Sound. A totally different story.

Two months later I was assigned to work here in Chicago. So I brought all my gear and I was happy until the day that I went to the biggest audio store in town. When, I auditioned my speakers with the rotel rc-1520. I was so fascinated that I bought it right away. The sound was incredible but after a couple of hours the amp use to go into protection. So, I went back to the store and the guy gave me the RC-1550, and RB-1552. Man, my life change after that moment. I was trying not to spend more money, my wife was ready to kill me but it was all worth it. I just loved the sound. Up to the point that I trade my 683 and I bought the CM8 just to get the purest sound I can afford.

My result. After having in my house some of the greatest receivers in the market (Onkyo NR-1008, Pioneer Elite SC-55, Pioneer Elite VSX-52) which drives dts-THX etc. Guys this rc-1550 sound better for movies, concerts and music in general is just superb.

By the way I have a Rel T3 but I'm thinking on going forward to the Rel T-1 to close my system for now.

Have a great day. Long answer Leo but I hope it helps you.

[mjb]

Further I'm going to write some lines about my short-story that maybe can be helpful.

Nice story Henry. Its not just about spending, but spending wisely on quality components that work well together :T

[leo2498]

I don't think getting a great preamp first and upgrading the amp later is a bad choice at all.

I know I did it backwards, but I think this was a rookie mistake on my part. If I had to do it all over again, I would get a great preamp first and get something like a Emotiva XPA-2 or something like that, until I could match my amp with the preamp.

I am finding that once you reach a certain level of amp the differences can be quite small. I have an Emotiva UPA-2 which is 125 wpc and when I compare to my Chord SPM-650 at 130wpc, I for sure like the Chord better, but the differences are not night and day as some might assume. The Chord is faster, less grainy and has better overall control of the speakers IMO, but I think the preamp would make a bigger difference.. At least that is what I have noticed.

Here is another thread I wrote after testing my Emo USP-1 vs. an entry level Chord preamp.

http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/i...y&thread=15403

I spend my day listen again different combo between atoll integrate amp and the rotel gear, after listening few hour I have not doubt that the preamp is the bigger element in a stereo system(After the speakers), mi first impresion about the atoll amp was a mistake, the problem was not the amp it was the preamp to amp combo; you could call me crazy but I think that the pre amp of rotel have better match with the amp atoll that the atoll itself(the bass is more powerfull and articulate), but for personal taste I preffer atoll pre with rotel amp.

I read your post about the preamp chord and here are a real true inside, our ears are adapted easily to our system mainly because we are used to it but that a high end preamp are better I not have doubt this. another thought I had was how the preamp influences in the final sound. this affect high, mid and bass performance. I thought that in the amp is the sugar but the real thing is share between both of them.

for know I will seek info about the classe CP800 but I'm highly motivated to get one, the last year I spend a lot of money in my room so maybe this will be the last change in my system and the amp will be waiting for a least one a two year(the only way that I could afford it would be if I can sell my 805D that have only 3 month old).

the next saturday is possible that I can audition the ssp800 with ca5300 and 802Di if I would maybe I will be putting my advance for the CP800 the next week.

I will let you know the result.


Leo,
Saludos
My HT: B&W 804D fronts, HTM4D center, 805D rears, Rotel RB1582 Main amp, pre Denon AVR 3310, Source Oppo BDP-95 screen Samsung 55" ue55d8000 sub definitive pro1000
Stereo: B&W 804S fronts, Pre: Yamaha AVR 663, Source Marantz CD5004.

[leo2498]

Leo

Sorry about the delay in my answer but I've been packed at work. I use the PC as one source with some good quality mp3 but my main source is the PS3 and my DVD and Bluray Concerts. I have connected my PS3 through an HDMI cable to the TV (same for comcast the cable company) and then using the TV as a bridge using the analog output from the tv directly to my rotel pre-amp.

Further I'm going to write some lines about my short-story that maybe can be helpful.

The reason why I change my set-up:

I started with two BW685 connected pure stereo to my pioneer elite receiver vsx-52. I liked the sound but I always knew that I needed more. Then, my wife was complaining because the dialog in the movies was missing (the least of my concerns but she was right) and that’s how I decided to buy the HTM1 center. After a couple of months and endless hours fixing the system, I decided that the receiver was the problem. So, I borrowed a SC-55 from my uncle. Much better sound, in this one you can set-up the equalizer for each speaker.

After a while I decided that I needed a better speaker. So, I sold my 685 and I bought two 683. A total disaster. The pioneer and the 683 did not sound good for me. So, I went to an audio store, and I bought the NAD 356BEE integrated amp. Great Sound. A totally different story.

Two months later I was assigned to work here in Chicago. So I brought all my gear and I was happy until the day that I went to the biggest audio store in town. When, I auditioned my speakers with the rotel rc-1520. I was so fascinated that I bought it right away. The sound was incredible but after a couple of hours the amp use to go into protection. So, I went back to the store and the guy gave me the RC-1550, and RB-1552. Man, my life change after that moment. I was trying not to spend more money, my wife was ready to kill me but it was all worth it. I just loved the sound. Up to the point that I trade my 683 and I bought the CM8 just to get the purest sound I can afford.

My result. After having in my house some of the greatest receivers in the market (Onkyo NR-1008, Pioneer Elite SC-55, Pioneer Elite VSX-52) which drives dts-THX etc. Guys this rc-1550 sound better for movies, concerts and music in general is just superb.

By the way I have a Rel T3 but I'm thinking on going forward to the Rel T-1 to close my system for now.

Have a great day. Long answer Leo but I hope it helps you.

Henry thanks for sharing your experience with me, I'm in the same boat like you since I bought my 804S in 2010 and it's never end. you will need to take my advice just get your ears away of the high end store :B jajaja the result will be your pocket empty and a bigger smile in your face with this. :T


Leo,
Saludos
My HT: B&W 804D fronts, HTM4D center, 805D rears, Rotel RB1582 Main amp, pre Denon AVR 3310, Source Oppo BDP-95 screen Samsung 55" ue55d8000 sub definitive prosub 1000
Stereo: B&W 804S fronts, Pre: Yamaha AVR 663, Source Marantz CD5004.

[leo2498]

Nice story Henry. Its not just about spending, but spending wisely on quality components that work well together :T

hi Mike, I wondering how is your SSP 800 in the stereo field? are you compared it with a high end stereo Preamp?

Leo,
Saludos
My HT: B&W 804D fronts, HTM4D center, 805D rears, Rotel RB1582 Main amp, pre Denon AVR 3310, Source Oppo BDP-95 screen Samsung 55" ue55d8000 sub definitive prosub 1000
Stereo: B&W 804S fronts, Pre: Yamaha AVR 663, Source Marantz CD5004.

[mjb]

hi Mike, I wondering how is your SSP 800 in the stereo field? are you compared it with a high end stereo Preamp?

All my sources are HDMI, the SSP-800 suits me very well for that, the only improvement I can think of is perhaps adding a CP-800 for pure stereo - but I think any improvement would be minimal. I stand to be corrected

[leo2498]

All my sources are HDMI, the SSP-800 suits me very well for that, the only improvement I can think of is perhaps adding a CP-800 for pure stereo - but I think any improvement would be minimal. I stand to be corrected

thanks for your answer, Mike what are you using like source for your music? I know the SSP800 have XLR stereo input you never was used that before?

Leo,
Saludos
My HT: B&W 804D fronts, HTM4D center, 805D rears, Rotel RB1582 Main amp, pre Denon AVR 3310, Source Oppo BDP-95 screen Samsung 55" ue55d8000 sub definitive prosub 1000
Stereo: B&W 804S fronts, Pre: Yamaha AVR 663, Source Marantz CD5004.

[Henry982]

Nice story Henry. Its not just about spending, but spending wisely on quality components that work well together :T

Thanks mjb

[leo2498]

I spend my day listen again different combo between atoll integrate amp and the rotel gear, after listening few hour I have not doubt that the preamp is the bigger element in a stereo system(After the speakers), mi first impresion about the atoll amp was a mistake, the problem was not the amp it was the preamp to amp combo; you could call me crazy but I think that the pre amp of rotel have better match with the amp atoll that the atoll itself(the bass is more powerfull and articulate), but for personal taste I preffer atoll pre with rotel amp.

I read your post about the preamp chord and here are a real true inside, our ears are adapted easily to our system mainly because we are used to it but that a high end preamp are better I not have doubt this. another thought I had was how the preamp influences in the final sound. this affect high, mid and bass performance. I thought that in the amp is the sugar but the real thing is share between both of them.

for know I will seek info about the classe CP800 but I'm highly motivated to get one, the last year I spend a lot of money in my room so maybe this will be the last change in my system and the amp will be waiting for a least one a two year(the only way that I could afford it would be if I can sell my 805D that have only 3 month old).

the next saturday is possible that I can audition the ssp800 with ca5300 and 802Di if I would maybe I will be putting my advance for the CP800 the next week.

I will let you know the result.


Leo,
Saludos
My HT: B&W 804D fronts, HTM4D center, 805D rears, Rotel RB1582 Main amp, pre Denon AVR 3310, Source Oppo BDP-95 screen Samsung 55" ue55d8000 sub definitive pro1000
Stereo: B&W 804S fronts, Pre: Yamaha AVR 663, Source Marantz CD5004.

Hi Stuart long time my dealer took to set an appointment but finally today I was auditioning the combo classe that I told you and it sound greats but I have some doubt because I will go for the two channel version so I asked to my dealer for borrow the pre Atoll again for try to clear my mind but after all set up in my system I get the improvement in bass and midrange that I saw the last time; what difference a pre can do, but just for curiosity I put my ear close to the tweeter and I hear some static noise, this noise never had been in my system before so only one component have this problem (the pre obviously). If I turn off the pre with the amp in on, the noise go away but when I turn on it, the noise coming back; it could be a problem of the Atoll pre or it is a problem with the rest of system?
I’m wondering if I will get the same problem with the classe?
Are you had this problem before?

thanks for you help

[stuofsci02]

Hi Stuart long time my dealer took to set an appointment but finally today I was auditioning the combo clase that I told you and it sound greats but I have some doubt because I will go for the two channel version so I asked to my dealer for borrow the pre Atoll again for try to clear my mind but after all set up in my system I get the improvement in bass and midrange that I saw the last time; what difference a pre can do, but just for curiosity I put my ear close to the tweeter and I hear some static noise, this noise never had been in my system before so only one component have this problem (the pre obviously). If I turn off the pre with the amp in on, the noise go away but when I turn on it, the noise come back; it could be a problem of the Atoll pre or it is a problem with the rest of system?
I’m wondering if I will get the same problem with the classe?
Are you had this problem before?

thanks for you help.

A small amount of hiss when your ear is within 6" of the speaker is not abnormal, and will not be audible when you are listening.

I am not sure what might be causing this for you.

I notice I get a very small amount with my Analog pre amp, but non with my pre/pro.. It could be because the pre/pro work entirely in the digital domain until then end, so there is not much circuitry to pick up a little bit of noise.

[leo2498]

A small amount of hiss when your ear is within 6" of the speaker is not abnormal, and will not be audible when you are listening.

I am not sure what might be causing this for you.

I notice I get a very small amount with my Analog pre amp, but non with my pre/pro.. It could be because the pre/pro work entirely in the digital domain until then end, so there is not much circuitry to pick up a little bit of noise.

thanks stuart for your quickly answer, yes is only a noise when I'm very close of tweeter(1,5" max), so it's not a problem, it's good to know. it's possible get out this noise? I'm using audioquest cables that it suppose to remove this noise and I can't hear it when I listen music but it get me attention.

thanks for the info. :T

What do you think about the SSP800 with a amp like the Parasound A52 or emotiva xpA-5, I could get the same quality audio with this combo? Or never a AVR can overcome to stereo pre amp?

I could get a budget of 12500usd for de classe stereo combo but I wondering if I can get something better under this budget with the same result.

[stuofsci02]

thanks stuart for your quickly answer, yes is only a noise when I'm very close of tweeter(1,5" max), so it's not a problem, it's good to know. it's possible get out this noise? I'm using audioquest cables that it suppose to remove this noise and I can't hear it when I listen music but it get me attention.

thanks for the info. :T

What do you think about the SSP800 with a amp like the Parasound A52 or emotiva xpA-5, I could get the same quality audio with this combo? Or never a AVR can overcome to stereo pre amp?

I could get a budget of 12500usd for de classe stereo combo but I wondering if I can get something better under this budget with the same result.

I think the SSP800 is very nice.. Is the CP800 better? Probably a bit...

[leo2498]

I think the SSP800 is very nice.. Is the CP800 better? Probably a bit...

Yes my dealer are thinking in the same way, well I have my answer. :T

[leo2498]

I'm bringing this thread again because almost 8 month took me save the 12K for the classe combo stereo but I have seriously doubts about this movement, Why? well first I love listening cd's in pure stereo mode of my Denon and my multichannel listening is a few bluray concerts and movies(I have a 200 Bluray library); I wondering if an AVR like Arcam AVR-600 could give me the same performance in two channel of the CP800(obviously not the same but close enough) and still get good performance in five channel reproduction. if with this budget I will get a ca5300 instead of a ca2300 then I will need save for a least two years to could get a SSP800 so this option not like me a lot.

other option that I could get is the rotel RSP1572 and the CA5300 but in this option I'm think that I will get out of the high end stereo listening, I'm wrong with this statement?

any tips about new combo in this budget is welcome but remember that I prefer a musically preamplifier that options like 4K and airplay.

Kal had reviewed the marantz pre 8801 in his last colum in stereophile, I wondering how this pre will approach to the performance to the SSP800?

thanks for any tips!

[PewterTA]

In my opinion, the CP-800 is more worth while getting than missing out on that and spending the money on a lower end processor for Audio.

I was going to go with the SSP-800, however, I think the CP-800 is a decent bit better (DACs are better and it's more geared for 2ch audio). So my compromise for this is to go A LOT cheaper. Getting the CP-800, I'm going to add an Emotiva UMC-200 or XMC-1 to the mix. This route saves about $4k to the price tag of the SSP-800 and gives about 97% of the surround "quality" of the SSP-800.

For me, 2ch is a lot more critical for listening and weaknesses are much more easily heard. Surround sound duty (even with multi-ch audio) isn't quite as noticeable. It's the old, the more information you have to pay attention to...you can't focus on individual aspects as easily.

The thing I like about the CP-800 is it has a complete bypass (volume and everything) so that the signal coming in from a HT pre will completely bypass anything in he CP-800, so that means there's NO volume matching required. Just hit the button (well set it for the input) and no worries. Only thing you'll have is a little extra power consumption of having two units on vs one.

But the benefit is having the better quality in 2ch and better DACs (the DACs in the CP-800 are as good (if not better and probably are better as I've not A/Bed them) as my modified Cambridge Audio CDP 840c (which is identical to the Schiit Gungnir and other sub $1.5K DACs).

My opinion is if you really love music and listen to mostly 2ch... it's worth getting the CP-800 and then getting a "cheaper" HT pre to fill in that duty for surround and multichannel.

[leo2498]

In my opinion, the CP-800 is more worth while getting than missing out on that and spending the money on a lower end processor for Audio.

I was going to go with the SSP-800, however, I think the CP-800 is a decent bit better (DACs are better and it's more geared for 2ch audio). So my compromise for this is to go A LOT cheaper. Getting the CP-800, I'm going to add an Emotiva UMC-200 or XMC-1 to the mix. This route saves about $4k to the price tag of the SSP-800 and gives about 97% of the surround "quality" of the SSP-800.

For me, 2ch is a lot more critical for listening and weaknesses are much more easily heard. Surround sound duty (even with multi-ch audio) isn't quite as noticeable. It's the old, the more information you have to pay attention to...you can't focus on individual aspects as easily.

The thing I like about the CP-800 is it has a complete bypass (volume and everything) so that the signal coming in from a HT pre will completely bypass anything in he CP-800, so that means there's NO volume matching required. Just hit the button (well set it for the input) and no worries. Only thing you'll have is a little extra power consumption of having two units on vs one.

But the benefit is having the better quality in 2ch and better DACs (the DACs in the CP-800 are as good (if not better and probably are better as I've not A/Bed them) as my modified Cambridge Audio CDP 840c (which is identical to the Schiit Gungnir and other sub $1.5K DACs).

My opinion is if you really love music and listen to mostly 2ch... it's worth getting the CP-800 and then getting a "cheaper" HT pre to fill in that duty for surround and multichannel.

Yes indeed I'm planning to use CP800 in that configuration but I wondering if when I use it to play concerts maybe the center and surrounds will not match to the fronts and I fear that it sound bad, I tested differents stereo preamps in the past and I Know that It will affect huge the final sound so I'm in a cross road. if I will go with the stereo classe combo I will keep my denon 3310 like multichannel pre and amplifier to my center and surround speakers.

[kcsun]

The Arcam AVR600 is on its way out, it will be replaced with a new model in the next two months (hopefully!)
I would wait for the new model, I have a 600 and love it

kc

[leo2498]

The Arcam AVR600 is on its way out, it will be replaced with a new model in the next two months (hopefully!)
I would wait for the new model, I have a 600 and love it

kc

Hi Thanks for your input, How was sonically the Arcam? are you using this like Pre or AVR? I read many post from people that have much problem with bugs in video and poping noise when change from different inputs, you had this problem? you are using B&W speaker with this?
Thanks for your help.

[PewterTA]

The surrounds should not be out of place... at least hardly if at all.

The key here is the "sound" or coloration of the music coming from all speakers will be more based off the HT Pre you're using... not the CP-800... it it's bypass mode, it's just that, it's supposed to disappear. So it should not color or change the sound over what the other speakers are getting. That's sort of the beauty of what they've done with that... So with that in mind... for surround music listening it should be the same.

For 2 channel and using just the cp-800, I would hope it sounds better... otherwise, there's no reason for it!

[leo2498]

The surrounds should not be out of place... at least hardly if at all.

The key here is the "sound" or coloration of the music coming from all speakers will be more based off the HT Pre you're using... not the CP-800... it it's bypass mode, it's just that, it's supposed to disappear. So it should not color or change the sound over what the other speakers are getting. That's sort of the beauty of what they've done with that... So with that in mind... for surround music listening it should be the same.

For 2 channel and using just the cp-800, I would hope it sounds better... otherwise, there's no reason for it!

yes, if I will no get better performance in two channel the CP800 it will be a waste of money. personally I never hear the CP800 sound only the SSP800 and I like the sound was better that my actual setup. I hope that a least I can get a high end sound in two channels.
Pewter what do you think about CA2300 vs CA5300, I wondering how the sound will be from a 5 channels amp when only reproduce two channels, many people say is better a two channel instead five, any thoughts?

BTW if any one has experience in this last statement please enlighten me.

[leo2498]

Hi guys well I finally will go with the stereo option and the CP800 coming soon, I put my advance and it will come in a few weeks.

[PewterTA]

Hey great to hear! You do know that they are making an update for the CP-800 that will do network streaming and allow full 24/192 from the DAC (firmware update on this, but from what I understand it's integrated so you need the network streaming board)... So you might want to inquire about that, I heard they will also be doing something for people that already have the CP-800. That's one of the reasons I'm holding off (that and finish paying off the 802Dis & HTM2Di.... Hopefully get a good 0% for 24 Months again just to easily make the payments.

You will love it though, I have no doubt about that... It's going to blow you away how much better it is than what you had And will probably caus eyou to want to do a new amp and keep upgrading. lol.

Can wait to hear you opinions once you get it (and it breaks in). It'll take a good 100hr to break in.