Grill on diamond, yes or no?

[Aquarius]

What's your experience using cover grill on diamond tweeter? Did you notice some major differences if you take it off or leave it on?

Thanks for sharing.

[DM3000 Owner]

Really hope you are kidding.

[BWLover]

My dealer who has a pretty serious system comprised of B&W 802D, Classe CA-M400 Mono Blocks X 4, Classe CDP-502 CD, Classe CP-700 Preamp, NBS Statement X-treme Cables, Classe Amp Stands, Solid Tech Rack of Silence.

I asked him the same question and he told me (while i was in the showroom) to take the grill off the diamond tweeter, put it in front of my mouth and talk. then move it away from my mouth and talk. He asked if I could hear any difference. If you can hear a difference between the two, then yes remove the grills (ONLY FOR LISTENING) and replace them when not in use. That being said be EXTREAMLY CAREFULL when putting them back on because it is a magnet holding them on. If you loose your grip on that grill its going to hit that dome and your going to be crying

hope this helps

[Aquarius]

Really hope you are kidding.

Yes, I'm aware that my question can seems stupid, but than again... there's no stupid questions, only stupid answers.

[Aquarius]

My dealer who has a pretty serious system comprised of B&W 802D, Classe CA-M400 Mono Blocks X 4, Classe CDP-502 CD, Classe CP-700 Preamp, NBS Statement X-treme Cables, Classe Amp Stands, Solid Tech Rack of Silence.

I asked him the same question and he told me (while i was in the showroom) to take the grill off the diamond tweeter, put it in front of my mouth and talk. then move it away from my mouth and talk. He asked if I could hear any difference. If you can hear a difference between the two, then yes remove the grills (ONLY FOR LISTENING) and replace them when not in use. That being said be EXTREAMLY CAREFULL when putting them back on because it is a magnet holding them on. If you loose your grip on that grill its going to hit that dome and your going to be crying

hope this helps

Thank you for sharing this...

I've done some serious listening and I noticed differences between grill on and off. The thing is that listening with grill off discover the beauty of sound of diamond tweeter and enormous resolution, but in rooms which are not acoustically treated some times diamond tweeter can draw attention to it's self. Leaving the grill on can reduce this effect. Of course, whit the lack of resolution.

I do have treated room, but i noticed on many pictures of systems presented here, that most of the guys doesn't have treated room, neither I noticed grills off the diamond tweeter.

One more thing... On tweeters like (for ex.) Accuton (ceramic or diamond) there's no possibility of removing the grill. How's that?

[emig5m]

Thank you for sharing this...

I've done some serious listening and I noticed differences between grill on and off. The thing is that listening with grill off discover the beauty of sound of diamond tweeter and enormous resolution, but in rooms which are not acoustically treated some times diamond tweeter can draw attention to it's self. Leaving the grill on can reduce this effect. Of course, whit the lack of resolution.

It's crazy but even on my 683's I prefer the taming effect of the grills being on where most people say they prefer the grills being off and that the stock grills effect the sound too much.

[Tweir]

To my ear they sound better off! But if you asked me to close my eyes and did
the grills on or off maybe maybe not. I keep mine on my 803d just in case
something happens (accident) very expensive to replace.

[ChrisssB]

To my ear they sound better off! But if you asked me to close my eyes and did
the grills on or off maybe maybe not. I keep mine on my 803d just in case
something happens (accident) very expensive to replace.

Doesn't B&W recommend to leave the grills where they are when it comes to tweeters?
Doesn't that means that they are indented to be used with grills on?

I honestly believe that if you can hear a difference (when it comes to tweeters grills) it is psychoacoustics and not golden ears at work...

[Tweir]

Yea, that's why I said but! I don't think it can have as big of an effect like a speaker
behind a mirco perf screen.

[ChrisssB]

Yea, that's why I said but! I don't think it can have as big of an effect like a speaker
behind a mirco perf screen.

Given that the frequencies a tweeter handles are high and the sensitivity of our ears at those frequencies is lower ....I'd bet my money that it won't be any difference...
Also we should keep in mind that while B&W say to leave those grills (tweets) where they are, they recommend to remove ones that cover the other drivers...
These people at B&W have a know how (long time on the market) and use (their own) technology and do (their own) research, to make their products...so they must know what they're talking about!

EDIT: I know mate, and I am only stating that this but is where the truth lies :-)

[DM3000 Owner]

Yes, I'm aware that my question can seems stupid, but than again... there's no stupid questions, only stupid answers.

I did not mean it to be insulting as to say that you are stupid, just risky.

Here is my point, even if you can hear a difference, it will be very slight and those tweeters cost $1200 each to replace. Not worth the risk. Even if you are careful, what about your maid, friends, etc.

My guess is that B&W voiced the tweeters to be used with grills on anyway.

[multivac]

...One more thing... On tweeters like (for ex.) Accuton (ceramic or diamond) there's no possibility of removing the grill. How's that?

Because the diamond dome is very fragile and can be easily destroyed.

I think that the grill should be permanenlty attached/glued to the diamond tweeter . I have already proposed that to B&W.

[Briz vegas]

I asked him the same question and he told me (while i was in the showroom) to take the grill off the diamond tweeter, put it in front of my mouth and talk. then move it away from my mouth and talk. He asked if I could hear any difference. If you can hear a difference between the two, then yes remove the grills (ONLY FOR LISTENING) and replace them when not in use. That being said be EXTREAMLY CAREFULL when putting them back on because it is a magnet holding them on. If you loose your grip on that grill its going to hit that dome and your going to be crying

hope this helps

:rofl: I can't believe that a dealer said this. There are so many things you can do to improve the sound before doing something risky like this. The B&W manual advises not to remove the grill cover.

[ChrisssB]

:rofl: I can't believe that a dealer said this. There are so many things you can do to improve the sound before doing something risky like this. The B&W manual advises not to remove the grill cover.

I bet he sells replacement tweeters too!

And if he really believes it makes a difference, then he surely underestimates the power of psycho-acoustics

l'eau du robinet anyone? :lol:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2qydjVbLJk

[wgriel]

There's no doubt that there will be a measurable difference with/without the grill. Whether that's audible is another question of course.

I do note that in John Atkinson's excellent review of the B&W 705, he preferred them with the tweeter grill off. I have 700 series speakers (703s) but even with those I'm not comfortable taking the grill off the tweeter. If I had diamonds, no way would I take that grill off!

[sunshdw]

What's your experience using cover grill on diamond tweeter? Did you notice some major differences if you take it off or leave it on?

Thanks for sharing.

Leave it on!!

You do realize that the diamond tweeter diaphram is the most expensive part of the D series right?? A cloth grill may change the sound but the diamond grill is see through, how would it change the sound?

[wgriel]

Leave it on!!

You do realize that the diamond tweeter diaphram is the most expensive part of the D series right?? A cloth grill may change the sound but the diamond grill is see through, how would it change the sound?

I agree that it should be left on.

However, imo, it will affect the sound in a measurable way (diffraction if nothing else). This may not be audible of course. And, even if it is audible, it's entirely possible that it sounds better with the grill in place.

[bigburner]

l'eau du robinet anyone?

L'eau du robinet is excellent where I live but just to make sure I like to add a little Scotch and ice.

Nigel.

[ChrisssB]

L'eau du robinet is excellent where I live but just to make sure I like to add a little Scotch and ice.

Nigel.

The same here mate!
I always prefer Leau du robinet chez moi :T

[KODG MAN]

grills on/off

What's your experience using cover grill on diamond tweeter? Did you notice some major differences if you take it off or leave it on?

Thanks for sharing.

Please leave the grills on the Daimond tweeter!! there is no sound difference & when our speakers are tested prior to leaving the manufacturing facility they are tested to specs with ALL grills on.

I just put my cloth grills on for a change of pace, but I can't imagine a difference in sound from grills to no grills. I have ask tech support that very question & their answer is the grills were made for a reason & that was to be placed on the speaker!

People that leave the GRILLS OFF because they sound better ARE IMAGING THINGS & just not accurate. Now if you like the cool look of the kevlar midrange & bass then take them off, but from a sonic stand point the difference is minute at best.


But with out a doubt leave the covers on the Daimond tweeter!! You will always get those people when you say the tweeters are made out daimonds, they will instantly go right up & touch them!! with the tweeter grill on hopefully they will think twice before touching them or you will be able stop them & politely ask them to please not touch the Daimond Tweeters!! Unless their willing to write a check for $1,500.00!!

Kodg man

[Gremal]

When your little nephew comes over and puts his finger through the tweeter, I think you'll agree it sounded better with the grille on.

[KODG MAN]

What's your experience using cover grill on diamond tweeter? Did you notice some major differences if you take it off or leave it on?

Thanks for sharing.

I added my opion below. Just to verify I called B&W & asked Eric McBride the Tech. Supervisor. He said yes there is an audable difference with the tweeter covers & dust covers removed, but the difference is so slight it only shows up on a scope. That a computer scope signal analizer.

He said he leaves his dust cover on about 80% of the time & only takes them off when he is doing really critical listing. He however did not mention if he removed the daimond metal covers during critical listing?

Kodg

[wgriel]

I added my opion below. Just to verify I called B&W & asked Eric McBride the Tech. Supervisor. He said yes there is an audable difference with the tweeter covers & dust covers removed, but the difference is so slight it only shows up on a scope. That a computer scope signal analizer.

He said he leaves his dust cover on about 80% of the time & only takes them off when he is doing really critical listing. He however did not mention if he removed the daimond metal covers during critical listing?

Kodg

Interesting and thanks for contacting B&W.

I'd be surprised if he takes off the metal covers - I think it's just too risky with those fragile tweeters!

I leave my dust covers off my 703s most of the time, but that's to ensure that the cherry wood veneer aged evenly. They had a pair at my local hi-fi shop that had the covers on most of the time, and you could see a difference in the finish where the covers were (they were lighter than the surrounding veneer). The cherry veneer has darkened over time and it looks gorgeous -- I think it's more attractive than when new!