Help choosing a 2 channel system for $20,000

[DelRay]

OK, It looks like I'll be getting some $ about mid year. I am hoping to allot about $15,000 to $20,000 of this for my audio setup. Here's what I'm looking for. Front speakers, 2 channel pre amp, 2 channel power amp, and a source. Will probably need good ic's and speaker wire also. I'm kinda looking at the used market (audiogon) for some of the gear. The one thing that I do have my sights set on are the speakers. I really want a pair of Revel Ultima Salons. I have heard these and just love the sound. They can be had for about $8,000 to $9,000 or so used. Other than that I really don't know what I want or need. This will probably be my last big audio purchase, cause I ain't getting no younger. My room size is 19'X15'X7'5". BTW, I'll be incorporating this into my home theater setup. So I may be looking at a new center and surrounds also. Thanks.

[r100gs]

Two Parasound JC1's @ $7000
One Parasound JC2 @ $4000
One Cambridge Audio Azur 840C @ $1375
Tyler Acoustic Woodmere II's @ $6500
And money left over for cables. :B

[spyboy]

How about Wilson Watt-Puppies, and the electronics of your choice.

Or, Aerial 10Ts.

[Chris D]

Actually, Jay had an EXCELLENT recommendation there. If you haven't heard, the new JC2 2-channel pre-amp that's about to be released is already receiving reviews that it's in the top 3 consumer pre-amps ever made. I'd definitely look into going the direction that Jay recommended.

[David Meek]

Or, Aerial 10Ts.

Actually, it's the 20T now. ;x(

[Andrew M Ward]

Actually, Jay had an EXCELLENT recommendation there. If you haven't heard, the new JC2 2-channel pre-amp that's about to be released is already receiving reviews that it's in the top 3 consumer pre-amps ever made. I'd definitely look into going the direction that Jay recommended.

Number 3 Ever ever ever, of all time...!

where's the list, I'm curious to see it....

-

[twitch54]

You are looking to spend 10-12k after your Revel speaker purchase, congrats ! First and foremost DO NOT purchase anything with those dollars based soley on anybodys recomendation, including mine !!!!!

Listen with your own ears, for the dollar amount you are speaking of demands NOTHING less !!

But for my .02 worth...... I'm an "ABC" guy......... ARC, BAT, CJ, Cary Audio
Throw Macintosh in there as well. One thing for certian, those in the know may have their favorites but nobody will "poo-who" all of the aforementioned !!

[Bob]

Vandersteen 5's on Audiogon- http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ull&1175839594
$7000!!!! Much more musical than the Revel's

Hovland Preamp, incredible preamp on Audiogon- http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ube&1178118538
$3300

Audio Research VTM100MKIII on Audiogon- http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ube&1177525118
$2700

For source, don't waste your money on CD or SACD player. They will both soon be as old news as a cassette player. For digital, I-Pod for while on the move, including your car. For home digital, USB DAC and a computer.
For the real deal in music appreciation, and all around audiophile fun, you must have a turntable.

This would be a system for life.

[Victor]

Delray,

Put your money into speakers. If you like dipoles, - get Orion, see www.linkwitzlab.com for details. It'd be difficult, if not impossible to get anything better for the money. You will need a sub, - I’ll get back to you on this.

I would go with pre-made UcD amp modules. See here

http://www.diycable.com/main/default.php?cPath=140&Cid=baa2064f18094754db7c8783f148057b

Choose however many channels of amplification you will need.

Get any CD or DVD player you like and the Benchmark DAC. You will not need a pre-amp, as the Benchmark has volume control

[DelRay]

I knew you 2 channel guys would come through. :T I like the audiogon suggestions. SE Ohio isn't the greatest place to audition gear, without driving 100 miles or so. What about Mark Levinson stuff and does it mate well with Revel. Or maybe Krell. Sorry for my ignorance but alot of the gear mentioned I haven't even heard of. But I'm checking it out. I have heard good things about the Aerials.

[twitch54]

What about Mark Levinson stuff and does it mate well with Revel. Aerials.

DelRay, First off, you mentioned from the get-go you were impressed with the Revels you had heard, great !! for there lies part of your answer !!! ...... what were the up stream source components (CD, Turntable, Pre-amp, Amp) that were associated with that positive experience ?? For those item's should be firmly on your 'Radar Scope' !!

[DelRay]

DelRay, First off, you mentioned from the get-go you were impressed with the Revels you had heard, great !! for there lies part of your answer !!! ...... what were the up stream source components (CD, Turntable, Pre-amp, Amp) that were associated with that positive experience ?? For those item's should be firmly on your 'Radar Scope' !!

Right. I was impressed with the Revels. Big dynamic sound. Accurate with nice imaging. I like my music somewhat loud also. When I heard the Revels, they were driven by Mark Levinson pre and power amp. Don't remember what the source was. This was awhile back though. I'm sure others have heard the same speakers being paired with other gear. I would imagine that I might need a power amp with at least 200wpc. I would like to find a pre with a HT passthrough. I may look into the Parasound stuff also.

[spyboy]

I like full range ribbons. If you can find a pair of Apogee Studio Grands that are in near mint condition, you might like them. Of course, the Apogee Grands for $85,000 are probably as good as any dipole you can find.

Still, if you like considerable dynamic range the Wilson Watt-Puppy is way up there.

Aerial 10Ts are much less than the 20Ts.

[twitch54]

I would like to find a pre with a HT passthrough.

As I stated earlier, Audio Research, Great stuff. I'm presently using an LS-26, not only does it have HT passthrough but it does so with 'Unity Gain', some thing that most but not all have, yet it is important, IMO

[Karma]

HI,
Are twitch and I brothers in sound? I think so. I am also an Audio Research sort of guy but only their tube products. I'm less impressed by their or anyone elses SS offerings. I have a tendency to like their earlier designs from around the early 1990's but I wouldn't kick any of them out of bed. Great stuff, IMO. Good luck.

Sparky

[bigburner]

Source: CD or DVD player plus an external DAC like the Benchmark DAC1.

Preamp: Rotel RC-1082. Although the Benchmark DAC1 has a volume control it doesn't have a remote control and it doesn't have tone controls. The RC-1082 has both. A remote control is essential if you are a lounge lizard like me. If you listen to a wide range of music then tone controls are handy, regardless of what audiophiles who don't listen to much music tell you.

Amp: Rotel RB-1092. With 500 watts per channel into 8 ohms you will be able to approach the most important part of your quest - the speakers - safe in the knowledge that no matter how big, inefficient, or hard to drive they are the RB-1092 will control those speakers with ease.

Speakers: You now know exactly how much money you've got left. Because you've been sensible and haven't overspent on source, preamp and amp, you have plenty of money left to buy the most important component. Go and listen to lots of different speakers.

If the speakers you like only need 50 watts, then go to step 2 and start again!

Nigel.

[whoaru99]

Save some of that money for room acoustical treatments. This will improve the sound in your room regardless of what other components you end up getting.

Room treatments may be the one and only universally agreed-upon improvement that makes a difference with all music under all conditions. IMHO, the system can be no better than the acoustics of the room allow it to be.

Now, when will I wise up and take my own advice? Yes, it's hard to do because buying the latest gadget is alway more fun than buying foam and fiberglass with no knobs, buttons, or myriad of settings to fiddle with.

[twitch54]

Save some of that money for room acoustical treatments. This will improve the sound in your room regardless of what other components you end up getting.

Now, when will I wise up and take my own advice? Yes, it's hard to do because buying the latest gadget is alway more fun than buying foam and fiberglass with no knobs, buttons, or myriad of settings to fiddle with.

Good advise !!! Yes 20k would be a waste if not put in a 'proper' enviroment. I have seen some excellent results , acoustically speaking, where natural furnishings did the trick.

[Karma]

Good advise !!! Yes 20k would be a waste if not put in a 'proper' enviroment. I have seen some excellent results , acoustically speaking, where natural furnishings did the trick.

HI,
Again, I agree with twitch. For example, my listening room is treated with normal home stuff very carefully selected and placed. Curtains, carpets, wall hangings, etc. can give very good results. I do have several things that are specifically audiophile. Tube traps are installed in each corner and I have wide band diffusers behind each of my CLSIIA speakers. Of course, the CLS's are electrostatic speakers with a bipolar radiating pattern. Controlling the back wave is an important consideration. Box speakers typically don't need something that exotic.

Sparky

[DelRay]

Speakers: You now know exactly how much money you've got left. Because you've been sensible and haven't overspent on source, preamp and amp, you have plenty of money left to buy the most important component. Go and listen to lots of different speakers.
Nigel.

Hmmm. sensible, a word I don't usually hear when being spoken towards me. :B
OK, I have to agree on the use of acoustics. My panels can be moved around pretty easy. It helps with the sound. The one thing I haven't thought about treating is the ceiling. I will check into that. And I also want to try experimenting with bass traps.

[Jim Swantko]

Aerial 10T's - $3k used
Arc LS-26 Pre - $5k new
Linn Unidisk 1.1 - $6k used
Levinson 336 amp - $4500 used

This is my system - and I love it!

[EAmin]

All Usher Audio Setup

BE-10 Floorstanders
P-307 Stereo Preamplifier
R-1.5 Stereo amplifier
CD-1 Redbook CD Player

This is all new of course.

I heard this combo at HE2006. It was awesome. I went to a lot of rooms...Wilson Audio/Audio Research, MBL, Vandy/Ayre, and the likes. I kept coming back to the Usher Room because of the great sound. I thought it was the best of the show. And you get a lot for what you pay for.

[bigburner]

BE-10 Floorstanders
P-307 Stereo Preamplifier
R-1.5 Stereo amplifier
CD-1 Redbook CD Player

This is all new of course.

I heard this combo at HE2006. It was awesome. I went to a lot of rooms...Wilson Audio/Audio Research, MBL, Vandy/Ayre, and the likes. I kept coming back to the Usher Room because of the great sound. I thought it was the best of the show. And you get a lot for what you pay for.

Hi EAmin,

What would the all-Usher combo cost in the U.S.?

Nigel.

[Race Car Driver]

Two B&W N802s $280.00


Oh wait.. Ill stop right there.. :lol:

[EAmin]

Hi EAmin,

What would the all-Usher combo cost in the U.S.?

Nigel.

Hi Nigel! From usheraudiousa.com

14,400 BE-10s
2,280 Pre
2,520 Amp
800 CD Player*

*Price from http://blog.stereophile.com/ces2006/010506usher1/.

[Joey_V]

You have a lot of options, I think you should set about $10K +/- a few for speakers and the rest should be reserved for upstreams.

A few good speakers at the $10-ish range:
1. Sonos Faber Cremona
2. Martin Logan Summit
3. Magnepan 20.1
4. BW 802D
5. Wilson Sophia
6. Vandersteen 5A at about $14.6K, very close to using up too much of the budget.
7. Thiel 7.2 might be right at the tip of the budget at $13K-ish
8. JM Labs 1037Be
9. Quad 2905
10. Dynaudio C4 are a bit out of range at $14K-ish
11. Aerial 20T are way out of budget at $24K-ish
12. Vons Schweikert VR4Sr
13. Legacy Whisper a stretch at $14K-ish

You gotta save up for the amps (which should be around $5-7K for this setup) and a preamp that should be no less than $3K for this league of gear. Then you gotta worry about your source, you got 2 ways to go:
1. Digital - Go with a Squeezebox3 or a Transporter or a Sonos and then use the digital output to input into an external DAC/CDP with digital inputs... cost would be around $3-5K-ish when all is said and done. OR go with a CDP, probably something like the Cary 306SACD or Krell Standard SACD or Ayre C5xe and look to spend about $5-6K.
2. Analog - Probably the best source choice. A decent TT will cost you about $2-3K and after you add a cartridge and accessories, you should be looking to spend about a total of $4-5K.

Conclusion:
As you can see, it gets up there real quick and real fast. So dont start thinking about spending all your budget on the speakers, you need the rest for the supporting cast.

Joey

[DelRay]

Funny, not one post about how crazy I am to want to spend alot of money on stereo gear. You are all SICK. And are supposed to talk me down. :twisted: My wife doesn't like you guys. Anyways, all good replys, thanks. I checked out the Usher site. Awesome stuff. :E And I have heard some of the speakers mentioned, like the Sophia's, Thiel 7.2's, and the N802's. Some might be too big and pricy for my room (cough)Whispers(cough). I have heard alot of good things about the Aerial 10T's.
Even though It will be a few months before I can really start shopping. I will be checking out audiogon frequently. As for as electronics go, Garbage in Garbage out. Do you agree with that.

[Chris D]

Funny, not one post about how crazy I am to want to spend alot of money on stereo gear. You are all SICK. And are supposed to talk me down. :twisted: My wife doesn't like you guys.

Well, I think you've realized that if you want somebody to talk you OUT of the home theater sickness/hobby, you're in the WRONG place. We're like alcoholics here, encouraging other alcoholics to have another drink, because "hey, dude, you've GOT to try out the high you get from speaker model X" or such.

[Joey_V]

Well, I think you've realized that if you want somebody to talk you OUT of the home theater sickness/hobby, you're in the WRONG place. We're like alcoholics here, encouraging other alcoholics to have another drink, because "hey, dude, you've GOT to try out the high you get from speaker model X" or such.

Yup... and the beauty is, we're never in that hang over phase.... it's like we're all perpetually drunk!

[Jim Swantko]

I truly think that a pair of used 10T's are one of the best deals on the planet!

You need some SERIOUS amplification for them however as they are inefficient.
If you are looking for a speaker that will not fatigue - but still is very detailed - the 10T certainly should be a consideration.

The bass is simply phenomenal... they do everything very very well and STILL stack up quite nicely against the newer stuff IMO.

If she thinks this thread is crazy ... just start telling her about the $3k+ power cords!!