New center channels for the Statements II and The Finalists!

[flamethrower1]

Jim, Curt, all I can say is thanks, this stuff sounds amazing.
Just added the new center,matches well.
To all of the other great and knowledgeable people who have helped me out, JM, k, and many others.
Your input, insight and desire to help fellow members is what makes this such a nice community that should be envied by anyone else.
Hope everyone here has a great and happy new year.

[Jim Holtz]

Jim, Curt, all I can say is thanks, this stuff sounds amazing.
Just added the new center,matches well.
To all of the other great and knowledgeable people who have helped me out, JM, k, and many others.
Your input, insight and desire to help fellow members is what makes this such a nice community that should be envied by anyone else.
Hope everyone here has a great and happy new year.

The system looks great and I'm extremely happy that you're enjoying the sound. A capable center makes a big difference for home theater!

Happy new year!

Jim

[flamethrower1]

better pic

Really like the midranges in these vs the originals, a little smoother to my ears.
I know that you can upgrade the Statements, what about the Mini Statements?

Thanks Greg

[Jim Holtz]

Really like the midranges in these vs the originals, a little smoother to my ears.
I know that you can upgrade the Statements, what about the Mini Statements?

Thanks Greg

Hi Greg,

Sorry, no upgrade option for the Mini's. No question the NE123's are step up sonically from the W4-1337's which are very nice to start with. Since the center carries up to 70% of the sound in a movie and the mains become effects channels, your system should sound very good as is. The Mini's and the Statements II center are voice similarly so panning should also be just fine.

If you want to upgrade 2-channel playback, the Anthology's, Finalists or Statements II are the solution.

HTH

Jim

[flamethrower1]

Jim, currently have upgradeitus, was just prognosed today.
Anyway, would like to upgrade from my Minis, most of the time Iisten to music, cds, vinyl and, some bluray/5 channel stuff.
Do not want to put you on the spot, but what is the most "musical" speaker in the line up ?

[Jim Holtz]

Jim, currently have upgradeitus, was just prognosed today.
Anyway, would like to upgrade from my Minis, most of the time Iisten to music, cds, vinyl and, some bluray/5 channel stuff.
Do not want to put you on the spot, but what is the most "musical" speaker in the line up ?

I'd be happy to share my opinion. Here's the order for music;

• Statements II
• Anthology/Finalists
• Statements (original)

If home theater dominates your use;

• Statements/Statements II/Anthology

If you have placement problems or want stand mounted speakers;

• Finalists

The previous Statements designs still sound excellent and are a good value but the newer designs improved the midrange enough that I find them a step up for music and would be my recommendation. Moving from Mini's to full size Statements or Anthology's will get you greater dynamics and significantly more bass. Home theater performance is comparable between the Anthology's and either full size Statement.

I hope that cures the upgradeitus!

HTH

Jim

[flamethrower1]

I'd be happy to share my opinion. Here's the order for music;

• Statements II
• Anthology/Finalists
• Statements (original)

If home theater dominates your use;

• Statements/Statements II/Anthology

If you have placement problems or want stand mounted speakers;

• Finalists

The previous Statements designs still sound excellent and are a good value but the newer designs improved the midrange enough that I find them a step up for music and would be my recommendation. Moving from Mini's to full size Statements or Anthology's will get you greater dynamics and significantly more bass. Home theater performance is comparable between the Anthology's and either full size Statement.

I hope that cures the upgradeitus!

HTH

Jim

Ok, one more question, Statements sealed vs vented ?

[flamethrower1]

Ok , my bad, I meant Statements II

[Jim Holtz]

Ok , my bad, I meant Statements II

Honestly, I don't see a reason to go sealed unless you have really accurate subs (2) and play lots of techno or pipe organ. The Statements do not lack bass capability ported. It's very clean, accurate and quite ample.

For home theater. I'd add a couple 15" subs to rock the house with explosions etc. but not for music.

My opinion of course.

Jim

[flamethrower1]

Thanks Jim, was just wondering as I would like to keep the overall height close to the Mini Statements

[Jim Holtz]

Thanks Jim, was just wondering as I would like to keep the overall height close to the Mini Statements

You really can't do that with Statements. All speakers need to have the tweeter about ear height to sound as designed. With the Statements, you have an 8" woofer above the ribbon. The Anthology's would come much closer to your height requirements at 48" tall vs 60" for the Statements. Normal seated ear height is about 40" give or take depending on your furniture and your height. The Anthology's are VERY close in sound quality to the Statements II. It'll take very good front end electronics to hear the difference and then only on really well recorded CD's.

The other option is the Finalists with subs. The Finalists don't have the bass impact of two 8" woofers per speaker but they're really quite good and have the same F/3 of 32 Hz. They do extremely well on nearly all music and with subs lack little if anything for home theater. They top out at about 110 db vs the statements/Anthology's at 115 db so all have excellent dynamics compared to most speakers.

HTH

Jim

[flamethrower1]

Thanks Jim, ended up with the same conclusion you have offered and ordered a set of Anthology components.
I think they will be what I am looking for, will keep you posted

[Jim Holtz]

Thanks Jim, ended up with the same conclusion you have offered and ordered a set of Anthology components.
I think they will be what I am looking for, will keep you posted

We're looking forward to following your build thread and of course, your thoughts when you're done and enjoying the new system.

Jim

[flamethrower1]

Parts shipped from Meniscus and will be here tomorrow, will start a thread once I get started.
Hopefully they fulfill my desires

[Tony ray]

Has anyone measured the FR of the Finalist centre?
Would it suit running full range? Would the Yamaha 3020 have enough juice? Its not running the mains. I listen at about -15 the highest usually -20 to 25

I have started running my mains at full range and like the extra impact the low end is giving me. They run off a XPA-2

[Jim Holtz]

Has anyone measured the FR of the Finalist centre?
Would it suit running full range? Would the Yamaha 3020 have enough juice? Its not running the mains. I listen at about -15 the highest usually -20 to 25

I have started running my mains at full range and like the extra impact the low end is giving me. They run off a XPA-2

Hi Tony,

I wouldn't run any of the Statements (original & II's), Anthology's, Finalists or the centers (Finalist & Statements II) any other way than full range. They are all dynamic speakers designed to handle 110 - 115 DB on normal source material and all have an F/3 of 32 Hz.

HTH

Jim

[Tony ray]

Have been running the Finalist centre full range for a few days now and it has more impact and punch. Even the voices seem better
Was running at 80Hz and now with the mains full range awesome front end.

The moral is just cause they say to cross over at 80hz you should give a quality speaker a chance at full range.

[Jim Holtz]

Exactly Tony. 80 Hz. crossovers are for small speakers not full range.

I'm glad you're enjoying the center!

Jim

[dsl1]

@Jim Holtz, the plans show the Foundek NEO3 cutout to be 4-1/8" - the Statement Tower build lists the same tweeter as 4-11/32"

I am guessing the latter is correct as Madisound says it's diameter is 110mm which comes out to ~4-11/32"

[Jim Holtz]

@Jim Holtz, the plans show the Foundek NEO3 cutout to be 4-1/8" - the Statement Tower build lists the same tweeter as 4-11/32"

I am guessing the latter is correct as Madisound says it's diameter is 110mm which comes out to ~4-11/32"

Yep, that's a typo on the plans. 110mm is correct. 4 11/32" is an exact measurement. I normally add a little for paint, glue etc. so I cut the recess at 4 3/8".

Sorry about the confusion and thanks for catching it!

Jim

[dsl1]

Yep, that's a typo on the plans. 110mm is correct. 4 11/32" is an exact measurement. I normally add a little for paint, glue etc. so I cut the recess at 4 3/8".

Sorry about the confusion and thanks for catching it!

Jim

Cool thanks for clarifying. Built a pair of Statements back when you first released them. Time for a center now.

Put together a quick solidworks model if anyone would like it for CNCing their own Statement Center.





It's fully adjustable so you can input your material thickness and everything will auto adjust to keep the internal dimensions the same and the dado / rabbet fit correct.

[dsl1]

Jim, any recommendations for stuffing / lining? Same 2" lining in the woofer chambers as the Statement mains? Stuff the area behind the mid's box well so it doesn't act like a port? What about the mids chamber?

Thanks!

[Jim Holtz]

Jim, any recommendations for stuffing / lining? Same 2" lining in the woofer chambers as the Statement mains? Stuff the area behind the mid's box well so it doesn't act like a port? What about the mids chamber?

Thanks!

Yep, use the same 2" foam for the woofers as you did the Statements. I also lined the walls in the mid chamber with 2" foam and then added polyfill to fill it about 1/2 full. Make sure the polyfill can't get into the back of the drivers. They need room to breathe but the back wave reflections need to be killed to ensure midrange clarity.

BTW, I'd also suggest using polyfill behind the mid chamber and the back wall of the cabinet. Stuff amply but make sure it can still breathe between chambers. I hope that makes sense.

Since you live in Iowa, if you have a Hobby Lobby store close, buy the poly fill from the upholstery section. It's much cheaper than online.

Jim

[vinceb]

Hi Jim, thanks for all the statements designs, I built the minis years ago and have enjoyed them a lot, and in our new house can finally have them fully out from the walls and they sound amazing. Actually have been running without the center and the imaging is so good I almost hesitate to put the center back but I think the new center would be an improvement. I have the original center and would like to build a variation of the new center using my 7" woofers and the new mids. It looks like the woofer network is the same from the old center to the new one so I think I can do that and also build a slightly shorter or smaller box.

Just a clarification, on the bom I found (on pe I think) some of the resistor values seem incorrect, I think the schematics here are correct but the values listed in parallel don't add up on a couple of them. My main question is, if there is a single resistor with the correct value can I use that or did you design them in parallel to increase power handling?

Here's an old picture of the minis with our unfortunate green carpet

[Jim Holtz]

Opps! the 2.7 parallel values is incorrect. However, the 8.5 parallel vales are correct based on online calculators. I'm attaching an updated BOM that has been the go to forever. I'll see if I can get to the one on PE and change it.

I can't comment on substituting RS180's for the RS225's. Yes, it would require a smaller cabinet but the Statements II cabinet is sealed and there's really no place for a port. Your F/3 sealed would be 70 Hz. with RS180's and 57 Hz. with the RS225's but much greater ability to move air with the RS225's. The NE123's take up a lot more room than the single W4-1337 driver.

Yes, the purpose for paralleling is to increase the power handling. I like 20 ohms and above to make sure there's a safety margin. If you never stress the speaker, paralleling isn't necessary. It seems like many Statements builders like to crank them up and let them roar so we've made an on going up grade in resistors to add a margin of safety.

Check with Curt for his input on swapping woofers.

Jim

Statements II Center Crossover (Meniscus) BOM.pdf

[jeevcat]

No problem...here you go!

Statement II Center:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/18135949/Statement%20Center%20CAD%20Drawings.pdf

Finalist Center:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/18135949/Finalist%20Center%20CAD%20Drawings.pdf

I always appreciate learning that I'm not the only challenged cabinet builder out there!

Sorry to post on a bit of an old thread, but I would love to have a look at these drawings if you still have them available, kevinm. The links no longer appear to work.

Sam

[GLF]

I am working on a build of the statement center and I was wondering if anyone had a clearer crossover diagram that they could share. I am having trouble making out which resistors go where.

Thanks!

[Jim Holtz]

I am working on a build of the statement center and I was wondering if anyone had a clearer crossover diagram that they could share. I am having trouble making out which resistors go where.

Thanks!

Sorry, I've been traveling for the last week. Do you need the original statements or Statements II crossover?

If you PM me with your email address I can attach whatever you need.

Jim

[GLF]

PM sent. Thanks!

[Jim Holtz]

I didn't get your email address but let me see if comes through any clearer when posted here.

Jim

[GLF]

Jim,

That image is still a bit blurry. I took a screenshot and filled in the values that I think I am seeing by the values that are hard for me to read. Can you take a look and let me know if I got anything messed up?



Thanks!

Andrew

[Jim Holtz]

Jim,

That image is still a bit blurry. I took a screenshot and filled in the values that I think I am seeing by the values that are hard for me to read. Can you take a look and let me know if I got anything messed up?



Thanks!

Andrew

It looks good Andrew. You have the correct values in the right places.

Jim

[GLF]

Thanks Jim!

[Jim Holtz]

Thanks Jim!

One other thing, pay close attention to the reverse polarity on the mid and ribbon.

HTH

Jim

[boinger]

Do you have measurements for the center ii?

I am trying to help a friend pick a center channel design to match his existing 2.0 system. So I am trying to match his FR graphs roughly.

[Jim Holtz]

Do you have measurements for the center ii?

I am trying to help a friend pick a center channel design to match his existing 2.0 system. So I am trying to match his FR graphs roughly.

I'm sorry but I don't have any of the measurements. Check with Curt ( http://speakerdesignworks.com/ ) to see if he still has them.

Jim

[xsilverjag]

Jim, could 3 of these be used as a LCR?

[Jim Holtz]

Jim, could 3 of these be used as a LCR?

I wouldn't recommend three of the centers in a L-C-R configuration. I'd suggest the L - R be the travelers. Less money and outstanding performance, IMHO.

Jim

[nickoli]

Question about crossover mounting and wiring, I haven't seen any discussion or comments about this.

The statements II center has woofer compartments on left/right sides, a sealed chamber in the middle for mid/tweeters, and three crossover boards. Should I split the boards between left/right woofer compartments in attempt to maintain volume balance between the two?

If boards are all placed in same compartment, wiring will be easier/shorter, but one woofer compartment will have lower air volume vs the other due to the crossover components taking up volume. Does it matter?

Thanks in advance! This is only my 2nd speaker build, so apologies if the solution is obvious.

[Jim Holtz]

Question about crossover mounting and wiring, I haven't seen any discussion or comments about this.

The statements II center has woofer compartments on left/right sides, a sealed chamber in the middle for mid/tweeters, and three crossover boards. Should I split the boards between left/right woofer compartments in attempt to maintain volume balance between the two?

If boards are all placed in same compartment, wiring will be easier/shorter, but one woofer compartment will have lower air volume vs the other due to the crossover components taking up volume. Does it matter?

Thanks in advance! This is only my 2nd speaker build, so apologies if the solution is obvious.

The sealed compartment has a 1/2" gap between the back of it and the rear of the cabinet to feed wires from one woofer to the other. The crossover can be placed either side depending on which side of the cabinet is closest to your electronics. The binding posts should also be installed on that side.

The crossover takes up very little room and the two woofer compartments are calculated as one because of the 1/2" gap behind the mid/tweeter compartment.

The mid/tweeter wiring needs small holes drilled into the mid cabinet for the wiring to enter the cabinet. It is MUCH easier to drill the holes before cabinet assembly than after. :W

HTH

Jim

[nickoli]

Hmm, the 1/2" gap is supposed to be foam filled though, right? I thought that would effectively isolate them, or that was the intent.

I can't attach photos, but here's a link to my planned board mounting...

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bfVk_20rDXxbF_y5PaJ4qrRbBbODjvsl/view?usp=drivesdk

Thanks for the tips! And happy new year!