Ante's Statement II build Journey

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • DigitalMaven
    Member
    • Feb 2017
    • 36

    Originally posted by Renron
    D.M.
    You have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to QWTL. (Look it up)
    I've built my own QWTL design, updated from Joseph D'Appolito's original design, with help from an Electronic Acoustic Engineer who designs radar used in Submarines, he understands "special mathematical formulas". I do not.

    Ron
    Ron, Thanks for repeating what I just said above..."I do not have extensive experience with those designs..." All I can reiterate is what I've read on Internet websites and Internet articles. What point are you trying to make? I think my statement above qualifies in stating that I've never built transmission line speakers but have read some articles and have a general idea what they're trying to do. Unless you have something to add to my deficiencies in knowledge rather than criticizing my posts your becoming tiresome.

    "I've built my own QWTL design, updated from Joseph D'Appolito's original design, with help from an Electronic Acoustic Engineer who designs radar used in Submarines, he understands "special mathematical formulas"

    I'm happy for you but what does that do for me? I don't need to become an expert on QWTL to listen to others who have experience with those designs. I have no Desire to become an expert there because unless your building a straight tl pipe or voight triangle pipe the cost and complexity are not something I'm interested in.

    "The Voigt pipe is a type of loudspeaker enclosure that embodies a combination of transmission line, ported enclosure and horn characteristics. It is highly regarded by some speaker designers, as evidenced by established manufacturers such as Castle. Due to its relatively high efficiency the design is frequently employed in full-range loudspeaker designs. The concept is that the sound emitted from the rear of the loudspeaker driver is progressively reflected and absorbed along the length of the tapering tube, almost completely preventing internally reflected sound being retransmitted through the cone of the loudspeaker. The lower part of the pipe acts as a horn while the top can be visualized as an extended compression chamber. The entire pipe can also be seen as a tapered transmission line in inverted form, that is, widening rather than narrowing from top to bottom. The driver is usually positioned close to the middle of the baffle or slightly lower. Its relatively low adoption in commercial speakers can mostly be attributed to the large resulting dimensions of the speaker produced and the expense of manufacturing a rigid tapering tube. The Voigt pipe was designed in 1934 by Paul G. A. H. Voigt and is also referred to as a tapered quarter-wave pipe (TQWP) or tapered quarter-wave tube (TQWT)."



    "Transmission Line (TL)

    has either no taper, or is largest at the closed end and tapers down to the vent. The TL normally has the driver very close to the closed end. There may be an expansion chamber immediately behind the driver. The term transmission line comes from electronics where the ideal transmission line does not reflect power back into the source. To make a TL a true transmission line, it must be stuffed sufficiently to completely damp any output from the vent.

    Mass-Loaded Transmission Line (MLTL)

    is a term coined by Martin King that applies to a TL terminated by a port that is smaller in area than the area of the pipe at the termination.

    Tapered Quarter-Wave Tube (TQWT)

    is the reverse of a tapered transmission line, that is, it is smallest at the closed end tapering up to the open end. The driver is normally set about half way down the tube. The TQWT may also comes in a mass-loaded variety, the ML-TQWT. As with the MLTL, the port area is smaller than the pipe area at the termination.

    Voigt Pipe

    is a TQWT that comes to a point at the closed end. It is interesting that this configuration should be called a Voigt pipe, since it appears that Voigt himself did not advocate it. This configuration can have some very bad characteristics that require careful consideration. The most common implementation is the Lowther Club of Norway TQWT, which, unfortunately, is not the best of designs."

    Comment

    • flamethrower1
      Senior Member
      • May 2008
      • 392

      Anti, nice progress, those are going to be some nice looking cabinets.
      I really like the curved cabinet look.
      Curts designs as well as Jims advice are solid, I have built several of the designs they have provided for the DIY community.
      All were exceptional with the BOMs and materials as they were originally designed.
      And this has been over several years, perhaps longer.
      To bad YOUR thread kind of got derailed

      Comment

      • csmielke
        Senior Member
        • Jan 2015
        • 109

        Anti,
        I agree with flamethrower1's comments completely. (Sorry Flamethrower1 I don't know your name) Anti, super job and stay the course.
        Chris

        Comment

        • Ante
          Member
          • Dec 2016
          • 67

          A littel progress. .
          The base and the mdf sides of the cabinet

          Click image for larger version

Name:	20170422_162241.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	56.1 KB
ID:	862916Click image for larger version

Name:	20170422_162106.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	43.0 KB
ID:	862917Click image for larger version

Name:	20170422_124816.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	64.2 KB
ID:	862918

          Comment

          • Renron
            Senior Member
            • Jan 2008
            • 749

            I'm sorry, it won't happen (in this thread) again. Derailment was not my intent.
            Ante, you are making excellent progress, the pictures are appreciated. Glad your having fun.
            Ron
            Ardent TS

            Comment

            • TEK
              Super Senior Member
              • Oct 2002
              • 1670

              Nice base plate Ante!
              What are you using to glue the MDF in place with? I notice that you have not distributed the stuff out on the plate - something I would have done to get maximum contact area - given that I was gluing wood-to-wood.
              Last edited by TEK; 29 April 2017, 15:36 Saturday.
              -TEK


              Many of the great achievements of the world were accomplished by tired and discouraged men who kept on working...

              Comment

              • flamethrower1
                Senior Member
                • May 2008
                • 392

                Where have I seen a shape like that before?
                Kind of funny, here is the deck I am currently building.
                Nice progress by the way, getting closer

                Click image for larger version

Name:	100_1411.jpg
Views:	1095
Size:	52.1 KB
ID:	862925
                Last edited by theSven; 09 April 2023, 03:32 Sunday. Reason: Update image location

                Comment

                • TEK
                  Super Senior Member
                  • Oct 2002
                  • 1670

                  I'm confused. Looks really cool, but what IS that?
                  -TEK


                  Many of the great achievements of the world were accomplished by tired and discouraged men who kept on working...

                  Comment

                  • flamethrower1
                    Senior Member
                    • May 2008
                    • 392

                    Its the start of a turntable, the plinth with the platter and bearing mounted any way.
                    The thing on the top is a protractor for setting the tone arm mounting distance.
                    I will start a different thread so as not to pollute Antis

                    Comment

                    • Ante
                      Member
                      • Dec 2016
                      • 67

                      HI all

                      Thank you Im pritty happy with the outcome of the base myselfe, Im exitet to se whet the spikes wil do to it

                      Im not sure what glu it is, but it should hold Im toald its realy comiung together now, and its starting to get heavy.. Hope the sound is to

                      That turntabel look awsome, place put the link here to the thread Im in the progress of getting ome my selfe, but I do not have the skills to built one Im looking fore an used Thecnics SL 1210. I had one when I was a DJ and have always missed it

                      Here is the speakers last stop before painting

                      Click image for larger version

Name:	20170430_220114[1].jpg
Views:	1
Size:	23.0 KB
ID:	862931Click image for larger version

Name:	20170430_220220[1].jpg
Views:	1
Size:	40.7 KB
ID:	862930Click image for larger version

Name:	20170430_215926[1].jpg
Views:	1
Size:	22.2 KB
ID:	862929Click image for larger version

Name:	20170430_220411[1].jpg
Views:	1
Size:	23.3 KB
ID:	862928Click image for larger version

Name:	20170430_220350[1].jpg
Views:	1
Size:	23.3 KB
ID:	862927

                      Comment

                      • flamethrower1
                        Senior Member
                        • May 2008
                        • 392

                        Those cabinets are so cool looking.
                        And an inspiration.
                        Nice work.

                        Comment

                        • wkhanna
                          Grumpy Old Super Moderator Emeritus
                          • Jan 2006
                          • 5673

                          Originally posted by flamethrower1
                          I will start a different thread so as not to pollute Antis
                          i will be looking forward to this with great anticipation.
                          _


                          Bill

                          Practicing Curmudgeon & Audio Snob
                          ....just an "ON" switch, Please!

                          FinleyAudio

                          Comment

                          • wkhanna
                            Grumpy Old Super Moderator Emeritus
                            • Jan 2006
                            • 5673

                            beautiful work, Ante!
                            _


                            Bill

                            Practicing Curmudgeon & Audio Snob
                            ....just an "ON" switch, Please!

                            FinleyAudio

                            Comment

                            • Renron
                              Senior Member
                              • Jan 2008
                              • 749

                              Ante,
                              What did you decide on for paint? Color? Type? Base Coat? Gloss Level?
                              Very nice job on the build Ante, you will be proud of your creation for years to come. Nice Job.
                              Ron
                              Ardent TS

                              Comment

                              • Ante
                                Member
                                • Dec 2016
                                • 67

                                Well Im going fore a White finish. Im not sure uf the bace plate is going to be White, grey Ore black.
                                Proberley a matte finish. But first some layers with bace coate to Even out the surface.

                                Im glad if my built can be an inspirasjon. Ive been very mutch inspierded by all of your work. So Thank you very mutch.

                                I hope to get some sound from them by the end of this mouth.

                                Comment

                                • Renron
                                  Senior Member
                                  • Jan 2008
                                  • 749

                                  Matte finish is a good idea, I'm looking forward to your next set of pictures. Go ANTE.
                                  Ardent TS

                                  Comment

                                  • Ante
                                    Member
                                    • Dec 2016
                                    • 67

                                    First layer of bace coate

                                    Click image for larger version

Name:	received_10154301824546809.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	28.6 KB
ID:	862939Click image for larger version

Name:	received_10154301824541809.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	30.9 KB
ID:	862938Click image for larger version

Name:	received_10154301803941809.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	42.9 KB
ID:	862937Click image for larger version

Name:	received_10154301803896809.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	34.6 KB
ID:	862936

                                    Comment

                                    • Renron
                                      Senior Member
                                      • Jan 2008
                                      • 749

                                      I'm not a fan of white speakers usually, but those DO look nice. White doesn't show dust either!
                                      They're going to sound Sooooooooooooo good.
                                      Ardent TS

                                      Comment

                                      • Ante
                                        Member
                                        • Dec 2016
                                        • 67

                                        This is onely the bace coate. Its a bit gray. The White paint coming on in a few days I hope. Then it real is getting close

                                        Comment

                                        • flamethrower1
                                          Senior Member
                                          • May 2008
                                          • 392

                                          Nice work, damn dude , those are going to be some nice looking speakers.
                                          Kind of got me thinking, I have all of these components laying around.
                                          Maybe I should rethink that project and see what I could do to incorporate your curved side design.
                                          Hmm, Ante Ardent, ineresting

                                          Comment

                                          • Ante
                                            Member
                                            • Dec 2016
                                            • 67

                                            Wow Im honord
                                            Im so happy that our work can be an inspiration.

                                            Weve got the first coate of paint today aften four layers of bace coate.
                                            Click image for larger version

Name:	20170505_155304.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	60.1 KB
ID:	862949Click image for larger version

Name:	20170505_155154.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	47.9 KB
ID:	862948

                                            Comment

                                            • flamethrower1
                                              Senior Member
                                              • May 2008
                                              • 392

                                              Looking good.
                                              I see enough material in the background to build a whole bunch of things.

                                              Comment

                                              • Ante
                                                Member
                                                • Dec 2016
                                                • 67

                                                Hi everyone

                                                Im soon to get the speakers home and mount the drivers They are looking awsome !!!

                                                What is the ideal speaker positioning in the room? My room is aprox 6X7.5m and 2.3m hight.

                                                Thank you

                                                Ante

                                                Comment

                                                • Steve Manning
                                                  Moderator
                                                  • Dec 2006
                                                  • 1879

                                                  Give this a try to get you started, http://www.cardas.com/room_setup_main.php
                                                  Hold on to your butts - It's about to get Musical!



                                                  WEBSITE: http://www.smjaudio.com/

                                                  Comment

                                                  • scottvalentin
                                                    Senior Member
                                                    • May 2015
                                                    • 175

                                                    Highly recommend trying out the placement that Steve's link will give you - it makes a huge difference even for lower end speakers like my Tarkus or Overnight Sensations

                                                    Comment

                                                    • BobEllis
                                                      Super Senior Member
                                                      • Dec 2005
                                                      • 1609

                                                      You sort of need to be single or have a dedicated room to use Cardas positioning. It's amazing how well it works and will give you a good reference for how good your speakers can sound. The difficult part will be finding a compromise between sound quality and livability in a multi function room. My girlfriend loved the sound in Cardas positioning, but not enough to give up the whole living room.

                                                      Comment

                                                      • Ante
                                                        Member
                                                        • Dec 2016
                                                        • 67

                                                        That I see
                                                        I dont think Im allowed to have them in the livingroom But I have a photo studio that Im planning to have them. Its a bit tricky as wel do to the floor having two differnt hights (2.4m and 2.3m) and I alsow have to have them on the longest wall so Ill try to use the Horizontal and Square Listening Rooms by George Cardas and see if this wil work fore me.
                                                        Thanks for the tips

                                                        Comment

                                                        • Jim Holtz
                                                          Ultra Senior Member
                                                          • Mar 2005
                                                          • 3223

                                                          Hi Ante,

                                                          Don't forget that for best listening experience, you need to position them with about 18" from the back of the speaker to the wall behind and similar clearance or more on the sides with no large furniture or objects between the speakers taller than the woofers. We're looking forward to hearing your listening impressions once you've got 20+ hours break in on them.

                                                          Jim

                                                          Comment

                                                          • Ante
                                                            Member
                                                            • Dec 2016
                                                            • 67

                                                            Jupp

                                                            Ill take some messurements and make a scetch when I get back home

                                                            Comment

                                                            • Renron
                                                              Senior Member
                                                              • Jan 2008
                                                              • 749

                                                              Bob = Whipped

                                                              Ante, unless you used an automotive paint for those speakers, make SURE you give them at least 7 days to dry (longer for Latex) before mounting the drivers. The paint is soft underneath even thou it doesn't feel soft.

                                                              Looking with anticipation for your listening impressions and some photos.
                                                              Ron
                                                              Ardent TS

                                                              Comment

                                                              • Ante
                                                                Member
                                                                • Dec 2016
                                                                • 67

                                                                Thank you Ron, Ill see if I can ceep my hands off fore a while when they are painted

                                                                Im trying to get this room placement, but I dont find it easy, Im looking fore a good starting point, but there are always something in the way

                                                                Does this look like it is something I can start with?

                                                                Dont know what happend with that picture.. but I think you could zoom.. Sorry fore that. Dont know how to fix it Ill tru to make another one tomorow


                                                                Click image for larger version

Name:	romoppsett1.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	10.7 KB
ID:	862965

                                                                Comment

                                                                • Jim Holtz
                                                                  Ultra Senior Member
                                                                  • Mar 2005
                                                                  • 3223

                                                                  Hi Ante,

                                                                  1st of all, Statements (any), Anthology's, Finalists do not require to be toed in. They're designed to have the flattest frequency response 15-20 degrees off axis which allows for the normal triangular shaped listening position about 1 1/2 times the distance between the speakers.

                                                                  I'm not sure what the object is between the speakers on the wall but depending on height, could cause some disruption of the reflected back wave. A little isn't audible but large items will not allow the speakers to sound as designed.

                                                                  HTH

                                                                  Jim

                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • Ante
                                                                    Member
                                                                    • Dec 2016
                                                                    • 67

                                                                    Hi Jim

                                                                    The Object behind the speakers are a drawer messuring H:97cm D:43cm W:200cm will it affect the quality of the sound?

                                                                    Do you know the speakers sensitivity and overall impedanse? I tryed to figure it out but cant seem to find it anywere.

                                                                    Thanks fore the heads opp on the distance and angeling of the speakers I hope its not long now before Im Abel to Mount the drivers

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • Jim Holtz
                                                                      Ultra Senior Member
                                                                      • Mar 2005
                                                                      • 3223

                                                                      Originally posted by Ante
                                                                      Hi Jim

                                                                      The Object behind the speakers are a drawer messuring H:97cm D:43cm W:200cm will it affect the quality of the sound?

                                                                      Do you know the speakers sensitivity and overall impedanse? I tryed to figure it out but cant seem to find it anywere.

                                                                      Thanks fore the heads opp on the distance and angeling of the speakers I hope its not long now before Im Abel to Mount the drivers
                                                                      The height of the drawers should be acceptable as long as the Statements II's aren't snugged up against it. If you can position the speakers with room between them and the drawers, it should be OK.

                                                                      Sensitivity is about 88-89 DB and the impedance does dip to 4 ohms but most of the frequency range, its well above. Call it a 6 ohm and that would be conservative by commercial standards.

                                                                      HTH

                                                                      Jim

                                                                      Comment

                                                                      • Ante
                                                                        Member
                                                                        • Dec 2016
                                                                        • 67

                                                                        WOW!!!

                                                                        They sound emasing!!

                                                                        Ive played them now for about 50 hours and I have to say... WOW!!

                                                                        I wil try out some different amount og foam in the mid tubes and different locations, but for now I just want to sitt and lissen to this good looking, good sounding big bloks that I have in my studio. Thank you all for great help in this prosess, I never would have been Abel to do this without Your help.

                                                                        Ill try to get some mussurements done and wil take some Pictures of the speaker for you, but I need to just spend some days in front of theese lisening to some good Music

                                                                        Spesial thanks to Jim and Ron, You have kind og becoming my mentors, thak you so moutch

                                                                        Ante

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • roadrune
                                                                          Junior Member
                                                                          • May 2017
                                                                          • 23

                                                                          Do you have any pictures of them finished?

                                                                          If possible i would love to listen to them one time (i live at Stord )

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • Jim Holtz
                                                                            Ultra Senior Member
                                                                            • Mar 2005
                                                                            • 3223

                                                                            Originally posted by Ante
                                                                            WOW!!!

                                                                            They sound emasing!!

                                                                            Ive played them now for about 50 hours and I have to say... WOW!!

                                                                            I wil try out some different amount og foam in the mid tubes and different locations, but for now I just want to sitt and lissen to this good looking, good sounding big bloks that I have in my studio. Thank you all for great help in this prosess, I never would have been Abel to do this without Your help.

                                                                            Ill try to get some mussurements done and wil take some Pictures of the speaker for you, but I need to just spend some days in front of theese lisening to some good Music

                                                                            Spesial thanks to Jim and Ron, You have kind og becoming my mentors, thak you so moutch

                                                                            Ante
                                                                            Hi Ante,

                                                                            Excellent! That's the feedback we always hope for. :T

                                                                            Enjoy the music!

                                                                            Jim

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • Renron
                                                                              Senior Member
                                                                              • Jan 2008
                                                                              • 749

                                                                              Ante,
                                                                              What the Hell?
                                                                              You build up the suspense and then NO pictures???
                                                                              Just kidding. That's a wonderful compliment that your too busy to take a picture.
                                                                              Their sound is excellent, and YOU made them! Be proud of your accomplishment and enjoy the music. Jim would be a good mentor.
                                                                              Ron
                                                                              Ardent TS

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • Jim Holtz
                                                                                Ultra Senior Member
                                                                                • Mar 2005
                                                                                • 3223

                                                                                Originally posted by Renron
                                                                                Ante,
                                                                                What the Hell?
                                                                                You build up the suspense and then NO pictures???
                                                                                Just kidding. That's a wonderful compliment that your too busy to take a picture.
                                                                                Their sound is excellent, and YOU made them! Be proud of your accomplishment and enjoy the music. Jim would be a good mentor.
                                                                                Ron
                                                                                Ha! Thanks to you and Ante for the kind words but in fact, I'm the "nuts & bolts" guy. Curt is the one with all the brains that takes my ideas and turns them into reality. Curt and I collaborate on the drivers, concept, define end goals for each project then I build the cabinets and take them to Curt so he can make them produce beautiful music. It is a partnership that has worked well for over a decade now. In addition to a project partner, he's a good friend.

                                                                                I'm very happy Ante's build turned out well and he's enjoying the sound quality. The Statements (original & II) have been my reference for a long time. The Anthology's are another one of my favorites that is very cost effective and a speaker that does everything really well. Excellent sound quality and very dynamic so they're a great match for home theater at an affordable price.

                                                                                Jim

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • Renron
                                                                                  Senior Member
                                                                                  • Jan 2008
                                                                                  • 749

                                                                                  Hey Ante,
                                                                                  How about some pictures of the finished speakers? I'm sure your still listening to them and smiling.
                                                                                  How do you like them now?
                                                                                  Ron
                                                                                  Ardent TS

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • Seattle
                                                                                    Junior Member
                                                                                    • Sep 2017
                                                                                    • 16

                                                                                    hey Ante,
                                                                                    Would love to see more pictures!

                                                                                    Hope you're enjoying the 2's

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • Absinthe
                                                                                      Member
                                                                                      • Sep 2021
                                                                                      • 48

                                                                                      Originally posted by Jim Holtz
                                                                                      Sorry, I've been out all day. Here's my suggestion due to the different shape of the cabinet. I would line the front compartment behind the RS225's with the foam and also place foam on the vertical center brace leaving the holes open. I'd also line the front compartment below the bottom RS225. That should leave you with plenty of foam for both speakers. Then, go to a local hobby shop or upholstery shop and buy a few bags of poly fill and moderately (not wadded) stuff the back of the cabinet behind the center vertical brace with the poly fill. be sure to leave the holes open in the brace and have an unobstructed path to the port.

                                                                                      Now, lets talk about cabinet depth. The actual internal depth of the Statements cabinet as designed is 14 1/2". Curt has suggested varying the mid tunnel depth no more than +/- 10% which works out to be about 1 1/2". With your internal depth of 18" you are over the recommended maximum by 2". I've been thinking about this and you should be able to compensate for the additional length by varying the depth of the foam lining in the mid tunnels. This will be the DIY part as you will have to adjust it by ear once you have them set up and broken in (about 20 hours) to achieve the balance between the mids and woofers. The changes will be subtle but will make a difference.

                                                                                      HTH

                                                                                      Jim
                                                                                      Jim
                                                                                      This was a critical tidbit for my build plan. Thanks for being so open with your suggestions/recommendations.

                                                                                      Ante,
                                                                                      I know this is an series of old posts but your design considerations are the basis for my target Statement build. Thanks for asking so many of the same questions Ive had of late

                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                      Working...
                                                                                      😀
                                                                                      😂
                                                                                      🥰
                                                                                      😘
                                                                                      🤢
                                                                                      😎
                                                                                      😞
                                                                                      😡
                                                                                      👍
                                                                                      👎
                                                                                      Searching...Please wait.
                                                                                      An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because you have logged in since the previous page was loaded.

                                                                                      Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                                                                                      An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because the token has expired.

                                                                                      Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                                                                                      An internal error has occurred and the module cannot be displayed.
                                                                                      There are no results that meet this criteria.
                                                                                      Search Result for "|||"