Rsp-1069

[tboo72]

This is what I was wondering. Does 1069 have the abaility to enhance dynamic range?.

Yes, I believe there are three settings for Dynamic Range

yes True HD is very dynamic, but I notice it more so with the HDMI connection from my A1 to my 1069 then i did with the analog connection from my A1 to my 1068. Its my understanding that in theory it should be the same.

If I recall werent there issues with volume levels on the analog outs on the 1st generation Toshiba's

[Nolan B]

Yes, I believe there are three settings for Dynamic Range

I realize that and the 1068 had the same. I never used them on the 1068.

If I recall werent there issues with volume levels on the analog outs on the 1st generation Toshiba's

The only volume levels i was aware of was the sometimes True HD track needed to beslight turned up to reach the db level of the comparing PCM track. I personally never experienced any audio issues with the analog outputs on the A1.

[deranged76]

I just want to confirm that I´m right here... playstation 3 that decodes DD+.Dolby TrueHD and maybe DTS HD-MA in the future... I can transfer all those formats to RSP-1069 by PCM?

[Stevebez]

People are missing the point here. No compression = High dynamic range.Just like in real life you would not be able to hear yourself and others speak if an airplane came crashing through your roof. Thats the whole point! I used to be 'bothered' by dialog being lower so I had to re train my senses.

There are times when dialog enhancement can be useful for example watching a movie late at night in the bedroom etc. so processors often offer a night time mode to bring the dialog and special effects closer in volume. If this is what you seek during all of your movie watching then knock yourself out. Me I will take as much dynamic range as my equipment will allow.

Well I dont agree I should retrain my senses to enjoy a DD etc movie!

Nothing wrong with my hearing and I agree in passages of high volatility one is not expected to hear voices, but this is not what I mean ... its more of what Pez refers to - normal scene etc and the voices are well too quiet given the reference volume setting. I dont want to make a big deal about this but my point was rather if this is something typical of all processors or just Rotel?

I also dont think its due to speaker efficiency as this should be taken into account in the SPL setup.

This is perhaps the director sound engineer trying to make a dramatic impact by drawing you into the softer dialogue ... I guess I just don't appreciate it much. This is even more apparent when there is arbitary background noise drowning out important speech passages.

I agree more dynamic range is better but not at the expense of missing dialogue ... otherwise we may as well just turn off the centre channel all together and just listen to the sound effects, as this is what directors these days seem to concentrate more on than anything else. .... :huh: but I digress...

So is this typical of DD recordings in general or just Rotel processors? I cannot really compare as my only high end gear has been Rotel ...

[tboo72]

I just want to confirm that I´m right here... playstation 3 that decodes DD+.Dolby TrueHD and maybe DTS HD-MA in the future... I can transfer all those formats to RSP-1069 by PCM?

Yes you can except for DTS HD-MA. Currently the PS3 cant decode this internally but most likely will in the next firmware release.

[Nolan B]

Update

To give anyone who cares and update I think its getting pretty close to getting a solution to fix the issues with my 1069. There is a "chance" i am told they may be able to offer a 'bypass" mode for all video processing which would be AWSOME IMO. That alone will fix 80% of my issues. apparently I dont have the most up to date software so I will be updating to the new version as soon as they send. I also do not have a list of issues this software fixes

stay tuned

[Kevin D]

I also told them today that they really need to offer individual scaling modes per input (bypassed as an option would be a plus). If it works like my RVE-1060 does I'll have some issues installing it tonight with a global 1080i output. My Fireball CD manager looks 'twitchy' with anything over 480p since it's always a static image and the Wii gets cropped a little at 1080i.

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

I also told them today that they really need to offer individual scaling modes per input (bypassed as an option would be a plus). If it works like my RVE-1060 does I'll have some issues installing it tonight with a global 1080i output. My Fireball CD manager looks 'twitchy' with anything over 480p since it's always a static image and the Wii gets cropped a little at 1080i.

Kevin D.

even better kevin you're right, but Bypass as an option is a must, not just a plus.

didyuo get a 1069 tonight? Do you have a copy od DVE and an HD DVD player? If you dont havea copy i can send you mine.

[Kevin D]

Step one is getting a TV with HDMI! Actually I've got Moome's newest HDMI to RGB box on order. Should ship out of Taiwan this week. I'll be buying DVE and 'borrowing' an HD player soon. If my converter box doesn't get here by the time DVE does, I'll snag an LG flat from work to test with.

For what it's worth, my version is 1.1.2 but video is the same 1.40. If you do get a later version of either file, send it my way.

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

Step one is getting a TV with HDMI! Actually I've got Moome's newest HDMI to RGB box on order. Should ship out of Taiwan this week. I'll be buying DVE and 'borrowing' an HD player soon. If my converter box doesn't get here by the time DVE does, I'll snag an LG flat from work to test with.

For what it's worth, my version is 1.1.2 but video is the same 1.40. If you do get a later version of either file, send it my way.

Kevin D.

ok i expect it tomorrow.

Ill be interested to know if running component throught the processor clips the black levels or if its just HDMI.

[Nolan B]

Step one is getting a TV with HDMI! Actually I've got Moome's newest HDMI to RGB box on order. Should ship out of Taiwan this week. I'll be buying DVE and 'borrowing' an HD player soon. If my converter box doesn't get here by the time DVE does, I'll snag an LG flat from work to test with.

For what it's worth, my version is 1.1.2 but video is the same 1.40. If you do get a later version of either file, send it my way.

Kevin D.

Do you have a PS3?
can you test SACD via HDMI if you do?

[tboo72]

ok i expect it tomorrow.

Ill be interested to know if running component throught the processor clips the black levels or if its just HDMI.

Did Rotel tell you they are releasing a new firmware? I havent heard a peep from them since I sent them my serial # & firmware #s

[Nolan B]

Update from Rotel.

Did Rotel tell you they are releasing a new firmware? I havent heard a peep from them since I sent them my serial # & firmware #s

I just got this from Rotel.

"Hello Nolan,

Yes, I do have news, although I am not sure if it is good news. First, I want to thank you and the others on the forum for informing us of this issue. We received the Digital Video Essentials discs and have finally been able to identify the issue. You are correct that it is definitely “clipping” some of the black. We had the same results with the software that we have so sending you an update at this time will not rectify the problem. We tested all combinations of inputs versus output resolutions and found some interesting results. We have informed Rotel factory of the problem and they are now working on a software fix. This may take a little time because once they think they have it fixed we will have to run the full tests again and make sure. Once we have a definite fix I will contact you and advise you on the next step. Feel free to share this with the other forum people so that they are aware that due to your collective efforts we have been able to identify the issue and are working on a fix.

In the meantime, if you let me know what resolutions you are using in your system now I can maybe advise to specific setups that you can use until we have the final fix. I need to know what type of video input you are using and what resolution you are sending in and then what type of video output and at what resolution you are sending it out. From that information I can offer setups that will offer temporary solutions until we have a new software."

Here is my reply if you care:

"This is good news to me Shane. I can wait for a fix as long as I know its coming. Did you notice the problem of the image popping in and out of being blurry every 10-20 seconds? the easiest way to test this is to pop in the DVE disc on the HD side and watch some of the static lettering.


My current configuration is as follows, but I fear nothing can be done. The reason is because changing the video output resolution works globally. Meaning if I have my HD DVD/BD player hooked up to the Rotel VIA HDMI i have no choice but to set the output resolution to 1080i. Here is what I have set up



Sources:
Toshiba HD DVD A1 - hooked up via HDMI set to output 1080i
PS3 - hooked up via HDMI set to output 1080i
Xbox 360 - hooked up via HDMI set to output 1080i
Cable Box - hooked up via HDMI set to ouput 480p/1080i



All of the video runs through the RSP 1069. If I set the video output to any other video resolution I am not sending the best possible signal my Display can accept. I really think being able to set individual video output resolutions (including the option to bypass) for each input input is an important feature and one which will likey decide if I keep this product.


You mentioned you found a few video issues. Can you share them with me?

Thanks again for your help and I look forward to hear a response and upcoming fix.

Nolan"


and here is the reply to my reply:

"Yes, we saw it on the menu screen exactly as you stated. We could not see it when we were actually playing a video but on a static screen it seemed to be apparent. We are calling it “text jitter” and it only happens when you have the output set to 1080i so we expect this to be resolved as well. I am trying to locate a SACD in our building, I know we used to have a few, and I will take it home and test it with my system on my PS3.

If you can set the output of your players to 720p and leave the output of the 1069 on 1080i, this will resolve the issues. We were able to pass the pluge test with this configuration. Or if you can set the output of the RSP-1069 to 1080p while leaving the sources on 1080i, then this should also help. That is assuming that your fujitsu can accept a 1080p input.

I agree that the bypass option is the best way to go and we have requested this from Rotel. They have said that they should be able to do this with an update so hopefully this will solve all of our issues."

[tboo72]

I just got this from Rotel.

"Hello Nolan,

Yes, I do have news, although I am not sure if it is good news. First, I want to thank you and the others on the forum for informing us of this issue. We received the Digital Video Essentials discs and have finally been able to identify the issue. You are correct that it is definitely “clipping” some of the black. We had the same results with the software that we have so sending you an update at this time will not rectify the problem. We tested all combinations of inputs versus output resolutions and found some interesting results. We have informed Rotel factory of the problem and they are now working on a software fix. This may take a little time because once they think they have it fixed we will have to run the full tests again and make sure. Once we have a definite fix I will contact you and advise you on the next step. Feel free to share this with the other forum people so that they are aware that due to your collective efforts we have been able to identify the issue and are working on a fix.

In the meantime, if you let me know what resolutions you are using in your system now I can maybe advise to specific setups that you can use until we have the final fix. I need to know what type of video input you are using and what resolution you are sending in and then what type of video output and at what resolution you are sending it out. From that information I can offer setups that will offer temporary solutions until we have a new software."

Here is my reply if you care:

"This is good news to me Shane. I can wait for a fix as long as I know its coming. Did you notice the problem of the image popping in and out of being blurry every 10-20 seconds? the easiest way to test this is to pop in the DVE disc on the HD side and watch some of the static lettering.


My current configuration is as follows, but I fear nothing can be done. The reason is because changing the video output resolution works globally. Meaning if I have my HD DVD/BD player hooked up to the Rotel VIA HDMI i have no choice but to set the output resolution to 1080i. Here is what I have set up



Sources:
Toshiba HD DVD A1 - hooked up via HDMI set to output 1080i
PS3 - hooked up via HDMI set to output 1080i
Xbox 360 - hooked up via HDMI set to output 1080i
Cable Box - hooked up via HDMI set to ouput 480p/1080i



All of the video runs through the RSP 1069. If I set the video output to any other video resolution I am not sending the best possible signal my Display can accept. I really think being able to set individual video output resolutions (including the option to bypass) for each input input is an important feature and one which will likey decide if I keep this product.


You mentioned you found a few video issues. Can you share them with me?

Thanks again for your help and I look forward to hear a response and upcoming fix.

Nolan"


and here is the reply to my reply:

"Yes, we saw it on the menu screen exactly as you stated. We could not see it when we were actually playing a video but on a static screen it seemed to be apparent. We are calling it “text jitter” and it only happens when you have the output set to 1080i so we expect this to be resolved as well. I am trying to locate a SACD in our building, I know we used to have a few, and I will take it home and test it with my system on my PS3.

If you can set the output of your players to 720p and leave the output of the 1069 on 1080i, this will resolve the issues. We were able to pass the pluge test with this configuration. Or if you can set the output of the RSP-1069 to 1080p while leaving the sources on 1080i, then this should also help. That is assuming that your fujitsu can accept a 1080p input.

I agree that the bypass option is the best way to go and we have requested this from Rotel. They have said that they should be able to do this with an update so hopefully this will solve all of our issues."

Yeah, I got an email from Rotel as well today.

[Kevin D]

Moved off-topic posts to a new thread on lossy vs lossless:

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=27850

Less please limit the discussion to the RSP-1069.

Thanks,

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

Moved off-topic posts to a new thread on lossy vs lossless:

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=27850

Less please limit the discussion to the RSP-1069.

Thanks,

Kevin D.

did you get yours set up? what do you think of the audio?

[Kevin D]

did you get yours set up? what do you think of the audio?

I added a RLC-1080 at the same time, so I've been in rack arrange mode the last two nights. First impressions is PLIIx modes are much improved over the 1098. It's my primary music listening mode so I'm happy about that.

My DVE is on the way and I'm hoping to pick up that cheap Toshiba HD-DVD at Walmart tomorrow. I can say the video issue is present on the component outputs as well. Changing the source to 720p doesn't help in my case.

Can you check something for me? If you have a normal DVD with a Dolby and DTS track, do an A/B and see if the levels are close to the same. The one disc I tried had to have the Dolby track almost 10 ticks higher on the volume (and approaching 90+) to get the same level as 80 on DTS. Trying to figure out if there's a bug when running a phantom center.

Otherwise I've found some issues in usability that should be addressed. Mostly dealing with the scaler when only using the component outputs for video.

Kevin D.

[Stevebez]

I have to say a big thank you to you guys ... I blindly ordered the 1069 believing it would be up to par with previously released new Rotel gear ... well it does not seem like it is ... yet. I have had time to cancel my order in the interim and play wait and see.

If it were not for the forum I would be severely annoyed with my purchase!!!!

[Nolan B]

I added a RLC-1080 at the same time, so I've been in rack arrange mode the last two nights. First impressions is PLIIx modes are much improved over the 1098. It's my primary music listening mode so I'm happy about that.

ill agree with that. When I first listened to MP3s and apple lossless track streaming from my mack I noticed an improvement. I posted that and then later realized that it has partially come from PLIIx.

My DVE is on the way and I'm hoping to pick up that cheap Toshiba HD-DVD at Walmart tomorrow. I can say the video issue is present on the component outputs as well. Changing the source to 720p doesn't help in my case.

Trying to change the video to 720p did not help me either. I guess I just have to wait for a complete fix.

Can you check something for me? If you have a normal DVD with a Dolby and DTS track, do an A/B and see if the levels are close to the same. The one disc I tried had to have the Dolby track almost 10 ticks higher on the volume (and approaching 90+) to get the same level as 80 on DTS. Trying to figure out if there's a bug when running a phantom center.

I have noticed quit a few audio level issues and im not really sure what to think. Yes I have to crank DD up much more then i used to to get the same sound level, but as posted before at that level to hear the dialog the dynamics get way to laud. That comment started a small discussion about dynamics in movies. All i can say is that I have been listening to DD through Rotel and enjoyed dynamic range at its fullest. Its until now that I feel there is an issue with volume settings.

I have not fed DTS direct to my 1069 thou to make the comparison you are asking for. The reason is because all my sources are set to PCM not bitsream. I wish I could choose which audio codecs get bitstream and which get PCM but its a global setting. I only have my cable box sending DD bitsream. I will find a DTS disc and change the settings for your test thou.

For what its worth I also have to have the volume past 80 to get a comforatable listening level with PCM from HDMI.

I really wish rotel would keep keep audio gain consistant with product to product. It would make it much easier to make comparisons.

[Kevin D]

Well I'm now an owner of a Toshiba HD-A2, I'll get to hear my first high-res PCM track this weekend (on my system at least).

I haven't played around enough to notice if the dialog is hard to hear or not. We've got a couple of movies to watch this weekend though. I do have the Dolby and DTS HD-DVD demos discs, so I'll have a few selections to test that with.

I really believe there is a bug in the DD processing though. While DTS might be recorded a tad hotter, it shouldn't be 10db louder. It really shows up in local OTA's that flip to PCM for commercials and back to DD for shows. There's always a volume difference due to the better dynamic range of DD, but it's gone from commercials are louder to commercials will kill you.

I have noticed a lot more mid-bass sound then my 1098, and I like it. My CDM9's have always been a little week in that area, but kick-drums and higher-end bass have really come alive. At this point I can say the 1069 is slightly better then the 1098 on DD and DTS tracks, having a little better steering but close sound. Moving to stereo sources with PLIIx applied the 1069 kicks the 1098's butt. I'm not sure how the DSP chips are different in that regard but it's the first time I've been wowed at a difference in a while. Perhaps the new DACS are better at getting the signal out.

Right now aside from the video issues and possible DD level issues, I would have to say this unit at least equals and in several areas surpasses the 1098 in sound quality. It's $800 less and you get a whole lot more useful features as well.

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

Well I'm now an owner of a Toshiba HD-A2, I'll get to hear my first high-res PCM track this weekend (on my system at least).

I haven't played around enough to notice if the dialog is hard to hear or not. We've got a couple of movies to watch this weekend though. I do have the Dolby and DTS HD-DVD demos discs, so I'll have a few selections to test that with.

I really believe there is a bug in the DD processing though. While DTS might be recorded a tad hotter, it shouldn't be 10db louder. It really shows up in local OTA's that flip to PCM for commercials and back to DD for shows. There's always a volume difference due to the better dynamic range of DD, but it's gone from commercials are louder to commercials will kill you.

I have noticed a lot more mid-bass sound then my 1098, and I like it. My CDM9's have always been a little week in that area, but kick-drums and higher-end bass have really come alive. At this point I can say the 1069 is slightly better then the 1098 on DD and DTS tracks, having a little better steering but close sound. Moving to stereo sources with PLIIx applied the 1069 kicks the 1098's butt. I'm not sure how the DSP chips are different in that regard but it's the first time I've been wowed at a difference in a while. Perhaps the new DACS are better at getting the signal out.

Right now aside from the video issues and possible DD level issues, I would have to say this unit at least equals and in several areas surpasses the 1098 in sound quality. It's $800 less and you get a whole lot more useful features as well.

Kevin D.

I do notice the sound level difference in DD and commercials as you describe. Are you going to let Rotel know about your findings? Do the have the ability to compare the stereo bypass mode with the 1098? When I had a 1098 on lown i noticed the 1098 was much better then the 168 in this area even though I dont know how that could really be possible. I notice the 1069 is definately better then the 1068 and im curious to know if its on par with th 1098,,,its been since I have heard it.

I know not many people use this function, but I find 5 channel stereo to be considerable better with the 1069 thn 1068. I use it for parties and over halloween i had it goin for a party and it sounded great.


congrats on your A2 by the way. Its going make watching all your favorite movies like seeing them for the first time again. HD is very addicting!

[garak]

Well I'm now an owner of a Toshiba HD-A2, I'll get to hear my first high-res PCM track this weekend (on my system at least).

I haven't played around enough to notice if the dialog is hard to hear or not. We've got a couple of movies to watch this weekend though. I do have the Dolby and DTS HD-DVD demos discs, so I'll have a few selections to test that with.

I really believe there is a bug in the DD processing though. While DTS might be recorded a tad hotter, it shouldn't be 10db louder. It really shows up in local OTA's that flip to PCM for commercials and back to DD for shows. There's always a volume difference due to the better dynamic range of DD, but it's gone from commercials are louder to commercials will kill you.

I have noticed a lot more mid-bass sound then my 1098, and I like it. My CDM9's have always been a little week in that area, but kick-drums and higher-end bass have really come alive. At this point I can say the 1069 is slightly better then the 1098 on DD and DTS tracks, having a little better steering but close sound. Moving to stereo sources with PLIIx applied the 1069 kicks the 1098's butt. I'm not sure how the DSP chips are different in that regard but it's the first time I've been wowed at a difference in a while. Perhaps the new DACS are better at getting the signal out.

Right now aside from the video issues and possible DD level issues, I would have to say this unit at least equals and in several areas surpasses the 1098 in sound quality. It's $800 less and you get a whole lot more useful features as well.

Kevin D.

I'm glad to hear that there's actually some positive news about the 1069. I ordered mine the first day that my dealer was accepting orders for it, and was beginning to wonder if it would be worth it. Based on what you've said, and once they get the bugs worked out, it seems like this will be a worthwhile investment.

BTW, does anybody know how much supply they have? I ordered mine on 9/27 and has yet to come in. I live in a smaller city and I'm sure my dealer is not a high volume store, so I know they're not first priority. So I'm just wondering how much longer I'm going to have to wait.

[Mikael]

Hi Kevin D

Could you do an A/B test in bypass stereo mode 1069 vs 1098,and tell us if the 1069 has the same bass output as the 1098 and how are the mids and highs. please.

best Mikael

[Kevin D]

I do notice the sound level difference in DD and commercials as you describe. Are you going to let Rotel know about your findings?

Talked to them Wednesday. I'll be doing tests all weekend and see if I find anything else.

Do the have the ability to compare the stereo bypass mode with the 1098?

Could you do an A/B test in bypass stereo mode 1069 vs 1098,and tell us if the 1069 has the same bass output as the 1098 and how are the mids and highs. please

Shouldn't be a problem. I'll post my results.

I know not many people use this function, but I find 5 channel stereo to be considerable better with the 1069 thn 1068. I use it for parties and over halloween i had it goin for a party and it sounded great.

I'll have to check it out, see what it sounds like with the 1069.

congrats on your A2 by the way. Its going make watching all your favorite movies like seeing them for the first time again. HD is very addicting!

I was going to hold out for the LG BH200 since I could get it at cost, but for $99 I couldn't pass up the A2.

Kevin D.

[Kevin D]

BTW, does anybody know how much supply they have? I ordered mine on 9/27 and has yet to come in. I live in a smaller city and I'm sure my dealer is not a high volume store, so I know they're not first priority. So I'm just wondering how much longer I'm going to have to wait.

I would think they should have it by now. Did you get black or silver? Black usually lags behind a bit. Since the 1080i issue is pretty serious, I'm not sure if they're holding new ones or not.

Kevin D.

[garak]

I would think they should have it by now. Did you get black or silver? Black usually lags behind a bit. Since the 1080i issue is pretty serious, I'm not sure if they're holding new ones or not.

Kevin D.

I ordered it in silver. Hopefully it will come in soon.

If I'm reading the video issues correctly, it seems that it's most serious if the 1069 is set to output at 1080i.

Has anybody had issues when the 1069 is set to output at 1080p?

[Henk]

Quote:

Stevebez

Nothing wrong with my hearing and I agree in passages of high volatility one is not expected to hear voices, but this is not what I mean ... its more of what Pez refers to - normal scene etc and the voices are well too quiet given the reference volume setting. I dont want to make a big deal about this but my point was rather if this is something typical of all processors or just Rotel?

I had the same problem with my 1098. Changed interconnects, new speaker cables, tested my centre speaker, the lot - no difference. The 1098 has outputs for two centre channels, and eventually I added an additional centre speaker. I now have my Rotel 1075 driving both centres speakers, and the rears. The front speakers are driven by a 1090. Adding the extra centre speaker made an enormous difference - in fact I had to reduce the default centre setting by 6db. All dialogue is now as clear as you want it to be, with much improved soundstage.

[Mikael]

I am looking forward to hear your findings of 1069 vs 1098 in bypass stereo mode.

[Nolan B]

I was going to hold out for the LG BH200 since I could get it at cost, but for $99 I couldn't pass up the A2.

Kevin D.

Did you hook it up to the 1069 via HDMI? wha do you think of the PCM tracks?

What movies did you buy when you picked it up?

[Kevin D]

Did you hook it up to the 1069 via HDMI? wha do you think of the PCM tracks?

What movies did you buy when you picked it up?

Just Transformers. Might have to get some more since the Dolby and DTS demo discs are pretty disappointing.

I hooked it up temporarily last night to update the firmware and make sure it works. I'm trying to find a spot for it in the main rack right now. It's a little difficult to deal with the HDMI audio, but I'll rig it up and test tomorrow. Which brings me to some usability issues the 1069 has when using the component video outputs. Rotel is looking at fixing these:

1: You can only select to pull audio from the HDMI port when you select HDMI for your video. In my case (without my converter box) I have to use component for the HD output on the player, but have to select HDMI vidoe to get audio from HDMI. but then when using HDMI for video, I have to select 480p resolution to get video out of the component.

2: No priority for selecting component or HDMI for main video output. The RVE-1060 had this and should be easy to add. Basically the 1069 assumes you're using HDMI only. Being able to tell it you're using the component output would allow logic when encountering copy protection issues. IE, when component is set to priority and you select and signal that has copy protection enabled (some DVD's, some HD discs) it would automatically drop to 480p. When the CP flag is gone it would go back to the resolution you have set. If I play a protected DVD through my RDV-1093, the 1069's scaler is still on at 1080i but it shuts down the component outputs. I have to go in the menu, change to 480p, watch the movie, then change back to 1080i.

So they will have to give us output priority or selectable resolution per output (plus native) since the unit downscales as well. For a customer who is annoyed the video goes black on 10% of his discs, you just can't tell him to change to 480p as that will convert HD sources to 480p as well.

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

Kevin,
Any chance you can request that the 1069 displays if the is audio track is 16 or 24 bit for mulitchannel PCM? Would it be possible for the it to detect that? Right now it just says either 48k or 96k.

[Nolan B]

1: You can only select to pull audio from the HDMI port when you select HDMI for your video. In my case (without my converter box) I have to use component for the HD output on the player, but have to select HDMI vidoe to get audio from HDMI. but then when using HDMI for video, I have to select 480p resolution to get video out of the component.

So you cant just run all of your audio and video to the 1069 through HDMI then have the 1069 transcode the video to component for output?

[tboo72]

Just Transformers. Might have to get some more since the Dolby and DTS demo discs are pretty disappointing.

I hooked it up temporarily last night to update the firmware and make sure it works. I'm trying to find a spot for it in the main rack right now. It's a little difficult to deal with the HDMI audio, but I'll rig it up and test tomorrow. Which brings me to some usability issues the 1069 has when using the component video outputs. Rotel is looking at fixing these:

1: You can only select to pull audio from the HDMI port when you select HDMI for your video. In my case (without my converter box) I have to use component for the HD output on the player, but have to select HDMI vidoe to get audio from HDMI. but then when using HDMI for video, I have to select 480p resolution to get video out of the component.

2: No priority for selecting component or HDMI for main video output. The RVE-1060 had this and should be easy to add. Basically the 1069 assumes you're using HDMI only. Being able to tell it you're using the component output would allow logic when encountering copy protection issues. IE, when component is set to priority and you select and signal that has copy protection enabled (some DVD's, some HD discs) it would automatically drop to 480p. When the CP flag is gone it would go back to the resolution you have set. If I play a protected DVD through my RDV-1093, the 1069's scaler is still on at 1080i but it shuts down the component outputs. I have to go in the menu, change to 480p, watch the movie, then change back to 1080i.

So they will have to give us output priority or selectable resolution per output (plus native) since the unit downscales as well. For a customer who is annoyed the video goes black on 10% of his discs, you just can't tell him to change to 480p as that will convert HD sources to 480p as well.

Kevin D.

Where did you get a firmware update for the 1069?

[Nolan B]

Where did you get a firmware update for the 1069?

I wouldnt worry about it. the firmware update doesnt address any of the major issues. You are better off waiting a few weeks until one comes out which fix all the known issues.

[Kevin D]

Kevin,
Any chance you can request that the 1069 displays if the is audio track is 16 or 24 bit for mulitchannel PCM? Would it be possible for the it to detect that? Right now it just says either 48k or 96k.

I'm sure I can request it, and that's not a bad idea. Since the external input displays MULTI with BYPASS below it, they should be all right with shortening MULTI CHANNEL 48k to MULTI 48k-16bit.

Kevin D.

[Kevin D]

So you cant just run all of your audio and video to the 1069 through HDMI then have the 1069 transcode the video to component for output?

At this time, not with-out setting the resolution to 480i/p. I can't even run all component in / component out without issues with certain SD-DVD's or getting sound from HDMI.

I do have to say I'm loving the fact that video inputs are completely separate from audio inputs. Previously component video's were locked to video 1-3 (or 1-4 with the 1098), composite 1-5 was locked to video 1-5, etc.. My CD is an Escient fireball with the video display, so I always had to take up a video input. With the HD-DVD I'm up to 6 video sources, so now I've moved the fireball to the CD input, but with video coming from s-video 3. But composite video 3 is still free for video-3 on zone 2.

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

I'm sure I can request it, and that's not a bad idea. Since the external input displays MULTI with BYPASS below it, they should be all right with shortening MULTI CHANNEL 48k to MULTI 48k-16bit.

Kevin D.

Over even just PCM 48k-16bit.

[Kevin D]

Where did you get a firmware update for the 1069?

Well it's no secret that Rotel knows and follows us and the forum. When I ordered my 1069 it went through an extensive QC (for obvious reasons) where the newest firmware was applied. I believe 1.1.2 is a beta/test version and that's why I don't have a hard copy. As Vancouver said, it didn't change anything significant enough to be publicly released at this time.

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

Kevin,
Do you have a PS3? If so can you please try to play an SACD while hooked up to the 1069?

[Kevin D]

Sorry, no PS3. I'll see if anyone at work has one. I did verify DVDA over HDMI does work.

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

Sorry, no PS3. I'll see if anyone at work has one. I did verify DVDA over HDMI does work.

Kevin D.

cool...i realy miss listening to my DVD A discs. I am thinking of trading in my 1072 to get a 1093 for CD and DVD A playback.

[Kevin D]

I am looking forward to hear your findings of 1069 vs 1098 in bypass stereo mode.

Ok, did some testing. Keep in mind I typically don't listen in stereo mode, much less bypass. So what I find better or worse might be just be me.

I used my RDV-1093, hooking the stereo output to one and the FL/FR multi outputs to the other using the same type cables. I then moved the pre to amp cables back and forth between them. I played a test-tone and balanced both units (1069 only need to be one click higher). I also repeated my listening with the 1093's outputs swapped (to rule out differences between the two outputs).

Both units had a very similar sound. I noticed to same slight increase in mid-bass from the 1069 which works out well for my CDM9's. Also noticed a little more crispness to the treble with the RSP-1069. Wasn't louder, just more pronounced maybe?? Midrange and overall tone was similar between the two.

Biggest difference that was noticeable was better imaging with the 1069. Center image was the same on both but when you get to sounds with width the 1069 seemed to be more precise; extending out a little farther and not being smeared as much.

Honestly though if I had waited more then 5 minutes between each one it would be difficult to pick a winner. So very close to the same sound that I wouldn't complain either way.

Kevin D.

[Nolan B]

Ok, did some testing. Keep in mind I typically don't listen in stereo mode, much less bypass. So what I find better or worse might be just be me.

I used my RDV-1093, hooking the stereo output to one and the FL/FR multi outputs to the other using the same type cables. I then moved the pre to amp cables back and forth between them. I played a test-tone and balanced both units (1069 only need to be one click higher). I also repeated my listening with the 1093's outputs swapped (to rule out differences between the two outputs).

Both units had a very similar sound. I noticed to same slight increase in mid-bass from the 1069 which works out well for my CDM9's. Also noticed a little more crispness to the treble with the RSP-1069. Wasn't louder, just more pronounced maybe?? Midrange and overall tone was similar between the two.

Biggest difference that was noticeable was better imaging with the 1069. Center image was the same on both but when you get to sounds with width the 1069 seemed to be more precise; extending out a little farther and not being smeared as much.

Honestly though if I had waited more then 5 minutes between each one it would be difficult to pick a winner. So very close to the same sound that I wouldn't complain either way.

Kevin D.

Trusting your ears i would say the 1072 is still better then the 1093. I did the same test with my 1072 and 1069, and found the 1072 to be better. I will say that similar to your commenets comparing the 1093 to the 1069 living without a 1072 (in bypass) for the stereo of the 1069 wouldnt cause you to miss too much.

With that said however the 1093 is 3 times (???) the price of the 1072? yes it plays DVD, but I have said it before and will say it again I wouldnt pay $100 for the world's best DVD player now that HDM available.

I wish rotel would make a CD/DVD A player which was the quality of the 1072 CD but added no upconverting video bringing the price to something equal to a 1072 plus an extra $500 for the abilty to play DVD A.

There is a marketing for an audi player like this no?

[Stevebez]

I had the same problem with my 1098. Changed interconnects, new speaker cables, tested my centre speaker, the lot - no difference. The 1098 has outputs for two centre channels, and eventually I added an additional centre speaker. I now have my Rotel 1075 driving both centres speakers, and the rears. The front speakers are driven by a 1090. Adding the extra centre speaker made an enormous difference - in fact I had to reduce the default centre setting by 6db. All dialogue is now as clear as you want it to be, with much improved soundstage.

I have come up with a similar scenario ... I have my 1075 driving the HTM2D in biamp mode using both Centre outputs on the 1068 (centre on 1075 unused and other two channels driving surrounds)...

This format is not giving the same SPL increase overall (even in biamped mode) since the output on the 1075 is steps behind the 1092 in my case, the slope of volume increase will be invariably different ... maybe a 1091 will be needed to balance things out more - or even a 1080 bi-amped? Any thots?

In audio / music it is perfect as it is.... its just DD tracks that do my (and my wife's) head in ... she complains that even with my new fandangled speakers she cannot hear speech.... and I have to agree.

There is possibly something wrong with the built in test tone ... mbe over DD the centre becomes suppressed or something - last night I still had to bump the centre around 8db (!!) just to make it inteligible.

Sorry to keep bringing this issue back - but if the 1069 is any worse in this regard - I could never be able to even consider it then.

[Nolan B]

Kevin,
Can you please confirm something for me? I swear that male voices seem very thin, airy and lack any base. If I try putting the "LF" up to max for a test is makes absolutely no difference. Any suggstions?