Rsp-1069

[jrhaug]

http://www.audiophile.no/Visnyhet.asp?Id=183

Finally :-)

[Dmantis]

Can't wait to give one a test drive. If all goes well Out with the rsp1068 and in with the 1069

[bleeding ears]

Be sure to let us know how it sounds, if you get to test fly/drive it . :lol:

[june]

sound?

Hello All,

Any reason why no "DOLBY DIGITAL PLUS or DTS-HD" sound on this unit?

[Hdale85]

Because it's not an HDMI 1.3 pre/pro

[apodaca]

Does it have more than 2 optical inputs?

[nash]

Does it have more than 2 optical inputs?

My 1058 has 4 optical inputs, so I would assume the 1069 has the same - being the same architecture.

[JDH]

Seems to show 4 optical inputs from the rear photo shot, this is probably less important now that it has 4 HDMI inputs though.

Does it have more than 2 optical inputs?

[crowland]

Has anybody heard the new 1069?

[Kevin D]

Has anybody heard the new 1069?

It's not out yet. Should be available by the end of the month.

Kevin D.

[wb2fcr]

My 1058 has 4 optical inputs, so I would assume the 1069 has the same - being the same architecture.

Nash - can you tell me if the 1058 defaults to pass thru for one of HDMI inputs when not powered up? In other words does the device connected to say HDMI #1 input get passed to the HDMI output when the 1058 is powered off?

I'm asking cause I assume the 1069 would work the same way.

[BasementJax]

I can't wait to audition this unit when my dealer gets one in. I'm hoping the scaler PQ will be enough for me to give up my DVDO VP30 and simplify my setup. That may be wishful thinking on my part.

Maybe slightly off-topic, but I think still relevant is the fact that Lexicon just released the MV-5 processor $2999 which has similar specs to the RSP-1069, but with two HDMI inputs instead of 4 and a 1080i (vs 1080p on the Rotel) Faroudja based scaler. So, on the surface it looks like all the Lexicon has going for it over the Rotel is Logic7 (unconfigurable but still Logic7), auto calibration, and an iPod doc...

[nash]

Nash - can you tell me if the 1058 defaults to pass thru for one of HDMI inputs when not powered up? In other words does the device connected to say HDMI #1 input get passed to the HDMI output when the 1058 is powered off?

No, you need to power it up to get any output. FYI, when it powers up, you see a brief system status (the OSD basically) before it starts showing the input source. In other words, it has a very brief bootup.

There's no passive pass-through, even if the device is in standby (I never completely power it off).

[apodaca]

I can't wait to audition this unit when my dealer gets one in. I'm hoping the scaler PQ will be enough for me to give up my DVDO VP30 and simplify my setup. That may be wishful thinking on my part.

Maybe slightly off-topic, but I think still relevant is the fact that Lexicon just released the MV-5 processor $2999 which has similar specs to the RSP-1069, but with two HDMI inputs instead of 4 and a 1080i (vs 1080p on the Rotel) Faroudja based scaler. So, on the surface it looks like all the Lexicon has going for it over the Rotel is Logic7 (unconfigurable but still Logic7), auto calibration, and an iPod doc...

According to manual Lexicon can apply PLIIx, Logic 7 and standard bass management and tone controls for the PCM feed at up to 96khz/24bit so it definitely has more audio options/features but lacks the 1080p upscaling. To be honest using a pre pro to do this is not ideal because each video source should be calibrated separately and the oly way to do this is to either do it at the player level (difficult in some cases) or by switchng at the display level.

[Dmantis]

According to manual Lexicon can apply PLIIx, Logic 7 and standard bass management and tone controls for the PCM feed at up to 96khz/24bit so it definitely has more audio options/features but lacks the 1080p upscaling. To be honest using a pre pro to do this is not ideal because each video source should be calibrated separately and the oly way to do this is to either do it at the player level (difficult in some cases) or by switchng at the display level.

A true Videophile would believe this to be true. But todays HDMI sources are closer then ever for 1 video display calibration with excellent results. I calibrate tv's everyday and find this to be true. Not that a purest would want to video switch but it makes life alot easier, saves time (macro's and what not) and the gain in video performance is barely if at all noticable.

This is all probably due to myself being a audiophile who loves HD Blue Ray DVD etc.

[nash]

What's the harm in video switching if you don't process/upscale the video at all in the switcher and use HDMI?

I've had my DLP set ISF calibrated, and all the HDMI inputs are essentially tied together - any changes you make in the service menu affect all the HDMI inputs. Essentially there's no difference between plugging my HD DVD into HDMI1 and Blu Ray into HDMI2 or just plugging both into my 1058 and using it as an HDMI switcher (1080p in, 1080p out).

I consider myself a purest for the most part when it comes to video, and I would always avoid analog video switching in the past.

[Steady Teddy]

Because it's not an HDMI 1.3 pre/pro

Not HDMI 1.3? I would have assumed all separates and AVRs coming out in the near future would be 1.3.

[Dmantis]

Not HDMI 1.3? I would have assumed all separates and AVRs coming out in the near future would be 1.3.

I believe they should be. Actually most are. Denon, Yamaha , Onkyo , Integra , Pioneer Elite . Nad , just to name a few. Being a Audio driven company, I'm alittle supprised Rotel decided not to go 1.3. Unless they know something we don't.......

Dan

[Steady Teddy]

Not to dispute what's written here but, is the NO HDMI 1.3 confirmed? I was seriously considering this unit to go with perhaps a 1095. I might decide to go with an AVR now, maybe the Denon 4308CI, and use that as a Pre/Pro perhaps. There's no point in waiting for the 1069 to be released if this is the case.

[Kevin D]

Not to dispute what's written here but, is the NO HDMI 1.3 confirmed? I was seriously considering this unit to go with perhaps a 1095. I might decide to go with an AVR now, maybe the Denon 4308CI, and use that as a Pre/Pro perhaps. There's no point in waiting for the 1069 to be released if this is the case.

100%, it works just like the 1058 receiver.

Kevin D.

[Steady Teddy]

100%, it works just like the 1058 receiver.

OK thanks. Looks like there's one less item on my wishlist.

[davewolfs]

OK thanks. Looks like there's one less item on my wishlist.

I am still trying to understand why we do need HDMI 1.3?!?

[calmac]

I am still trying to understand why we do need HDMI 1.3?!?

Dave , from the reading I have done it appears there is no need for anything above hdmi 1.2 unless you want the reciever or pre pro to decode the compressed bitsteam signal from a hd-dvd or blue ray player.From what I understand bitsteam decoding must be done in the player rather than the amp ,as part of the BR and HD-DVD spec, making this feature of 1.3 redundant.
1.3 also includes 'Deep Colour' in the spec however this again appears to be of very limited usefulness because of the lack of software and hardware that can make use of it now and for some time to come.
I think a lot of consumers are getting caught up in the specmanship and hype surrounding all this new technology and perhaps forgetting what's at the core of this hobby: ie , imo, the enjoyment of the source material in the best possible audio and video quality!
Gordon
PS: here is a useful link for those wanting more info on what the various version of hdmi offer : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#HDMI_1.3a

[Pez]

Dave , from the reading I have done it appears there is no need for anything above hdmi 1.2 unless you want the reciever or pre pro to decode the compressed bitsteam signal from a hd-dvd or blue ray player.From what I understand bitsteam decoding must be done in the player rather than the amp ,as part of the BR and HD-DVD spec, making this feature of 1.3 redundant.
1.3 also includes 'Deep Colour' in the spec however this again appears to be of very limited usefulness because of the lack of software and hardware that can make use of it now and for some time to come.
I think a lot of consumers are getting caught up in the specmanship and hype surrounding all this new technology and perhaps forgetting what's at the core of this hobby: ie , imo, the enjoyment of the source material in the best possible audio and video quality!
Gordon
PS: here is a useful link for those wanting more info on what the various version of hdmi offer : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#HDMI_1.3a

You can count me as one who was on the 1.3 bandwagon. I thought I had to have it and when the new rotel stuff was announced months ago I was ready to jump ship when I upgrade my pre/pro to something other than rotel. Once I got a better understanding of hdmi versions I began to realize that 1.3 could be a good thing but certainly not required. If I can get the next gen audio and 1080p with lesser versions of hdmi who cares if its 1.3. Deep color would be nice but then I would have to upgrade my tv as well which is less than a year old and already can do 1080p. 1080p looks so much better than what I had before and honestly getting a minor improvement for the cost involved is not worth it right now.

The whole notion of 1.3 is so screwed up and being very poorly implemented and marketed. And its to bad because I really could have been a good thing. The looks my friends give me when I try and give them the ins and outs of it is priceless.

All I know is come next year (ie tax return refund) the 1069 will be sitting in my tv stand and I can get next gen audio from both my PS3 and HD-DVD player. Currently I can only do the HD-DVD player audio via multi-channel connection.

[Dmantis]

You can count me as one who was on the 1.3 bandwagon. I thought I had to have it and when the new rotel stuff was announced months ago I was ready to jump ship when I upgrade my pre/pro to something other than rotel. Once I got a better understanding of hdmi versions I began to realize that 1.3 could be a good thing but certainly not required. If I can get the next gen audio and 1080p with lesser versions of hdmi who cares if its 1.3. Deep color would be nice but then I would have to upgrade my tv as well which is less than a year old and already can do 1080p. 1080p looks so much better than what I had before and honestly getting a minor improvement for the cost involved is not worth it right now.

The whole notion of 1.3 is so screwed up and being very poorly implemented and marketed. And its to bad because I really could have been a good thing. The looks my friends give me when I try and give them the ins and outs of it is priceless.

All I know is come next year (ie tax return refund) the 1069 will be sitting in my tv stand and I can get next gen audio from both my PS3 and HD-DVD player. Currently I can only do the HD-DVD player audio via multi-channel connection.

It would be better for everyone if HDMI 1.3 was fully explained where everyone could understand and make a decesion based on that clear info. I work in the field and I don't even have a clear understanding. I have what manufactors have told me and from them it's nessary to have for now and into the future. Buying gear without it is a waste of money etc. But gear just released a year ago r even 6 months ago , most was version 1.1 or 1.2 so what the hell????

It would be nice If Rotel would just release it in 1.3 or at least have the full ability to upgrade VIA software when the time comes when 1.3 is nessary.

[JDH]

Seems like there really are not a great deal of improvements with the RSP-1069 over the current RSP-1068, based on the minimal improvements offered, I wondering why Rotel couldn't release the RSP-1069 a year ago?

Obvously they didn't look at the poll on this site with some of the users prefered requests

JDH.

[Kevin D]

Considering the 1058 was shown at CES this year, chances are it's been in the works for over a year.

Rotel is a very small company relative to others. They can't afford to release a new model every year and stay in business. They will always be behind and low on bells/whistles. They would have to sell thousands more product and at a higher price to afford the R&D and licensing needed to stay on top of every new features (features that seem to be being introduced at an exponential rate).

Kevin D.

[calmac]

Considering the 1058 was shown at CES this year, chances are it's been in the works for over a year.

Rotel is a very small company relative to others. They can't afford to release a new model every year and stay in business. They will always be behind and low on bells/whistles. They would have to sell thousands more product and at a higher price to afford the R&D and licensing needed to stay on top of every new features (features that seem to be being introduced at an exponential rate).

Kevin D.

Specialist manufacturers like Rotel , Arcam and Cyrus etc have always been far slower to release products with all the latest features compared to their mass market competitors however what they do usually provide is better sound quality.
It seems to me that in all these discussions of features and facilities many have forgotten just how important core performance is?
Gordon

[gd]

It seems to me that in all these discussions of features and facilities many have forgotten just how important core performance is?

Agreed... too much reliance on cnet reviews, and too little time spent on serious listening.

Very reflective of the computer business model that HE companies have adopted... constant upgrading with decreasingly noticeable improvements.

[UFObuster]

Considering the 1058 was shown at CES this year, chances are it's been in the works for over a year.

Rotel is a very small company relative to others. They can't afford to release a new model every year and stay in business. They will always be behind and low on bells/whistles. They would have to sell thousands more product and at a higher price to afford the R&D and licensing needed to stay on top of every new features (features that seem to be being introduced at an exponential rate).

Kevin D.

I was an "early adopter" of the HDMI/Video switching/scaling last year when it first came out (owned a Yamaha RX-V2600). It took a while for me to figure out that the core capability of what the box was built for was more important than features. Switching is a convenience..it doen't improve anything. Scaling can be done in a player such as my Denon 3910 or various others such as Oppo. The new screens are feature loaded with multiple HDMI inputs so switching becomes less and less necessary.

Last spring, I really wanted to improve the sound of my system and went "retro" by dumping the Yammi and getting the RSP-1068 (w/amps).....and no HDMI. The work-arounds are easy and my system sizzles now. I'll be happy to stay with the 1068 until some really significant improvements show up....a year?...years?...etc. away. BTW....I'm not paying any $25/disc for HD-DVD discs either. I'm betting that Oppo is just the tip of the iceberg in how far techies will milk the best from available media...especially if your screen size is under 40 inches. The sound in the sound system is what this is about. There are too many ways to count to get a decent video. Stop fretting and enjoy what you've got!

[apodaca]

I agree with the comments regarding sound quality and that it is more important than features but what I still dont get is the price on the 1058. Its way overpriced FOR WHAT IT DOES now, if they had priced it the same as the 1056 there would be less complaints at least none from me but for $2K I expect perfection. At that price I might as well get Lexicon gear - perfection AND Logic 7. The older series 1068 and 1058 are very outdated especially with only 2 optical inputs I need at least three of those or HDMI since coaxial is being phased out. Maybe price is not an issue for most here as Rotel is more for upscale folks but thre are few like me who feel that cost/performance ratio is important.

[Kevin D]

I need at least three of those or HDMI since coaxial is being phased out.

Got any links to back that up? I've actually seen an increase in the number of devices we sell having a coaxial output in the last few years.

Maybe price is not an issue for most here as Rotel is more for upscale folks but thre are few like me who feel that cost/performance ratio is important.

I do agree the price is too high, but Rotel has to roll the HDMI licensing fees into every unit they sell. Every new item made by someone else costs money to put that emblem on. We were great with PL, DD, & DTS. Then they had to pay for DD-EX, DTS-ES, PLII(and x). I would say the next line would be cheaper, but that will have to include DD+, DD-HD, & DTS-MA fees.

Kevin D.

[UFObuster]

Got any links to back that up? I've actually seen an increase in the number of devices we sell having a coaxial output in the last few years.



I do agree the price is too high, but Rotel has to roll the HDMI licensing fees into every unit they sell. Every new item made by someone else costs money to put that emblem on. We were great with PL, DD, & DTS. Then they had to pay for DD-EX, DTS-ES, PLII(and x). I would say the next line would be cheaper, but that will have to include DD+, DD-HD, & DTS-MA fees.

Kevin D.

Well said..
..This is getting ridiculous. "Hi-def" audio is some version of a 96/24 recording or some SACD version of the same thing. That's it. You can dress this pig up any way you want...it won't get any prettier...and it will get more expensive.
Consumers have to learn when you're buying "fluff" and also when you're being denied full use of your software purchase without a lot of clever copy protection or use restriction added to it. Going overboard in spending for this stuff makes me think that the eccentric old farts on the Klipsch forum are right: get a set of "tubes" and do 2 channel audio.....watch TV for news....screw the video market until this sand castle falls and start picking up what's left over.

Disclaimer: (content is everything) if you're the guy that is watching "Batman Returns" in hi-def video a zillion times...then this will make no sense to you. Read on until the thread gets back to "normal".

[alebonau]

well I own both a blu-ray player and a hd-dvd player and the sooner the likes of rotel get with the program the sooner the better for both the consumer and rotel who will make a few more sales as a result !

[Stevebez]

Putting my name on the order list right now ....

[Nolan B]

Has ayone heard an official reason from Rotel as to why they decided not to allow the 1069 to add processing the PCM signal?

[calmac]

Has ayone heard an official reason from Rotel as to why they decided not to allow the 1069 to add processing the PCM signal?

V , I think it would be great to see Rotel giving a bit more info generally to the forum members.Imo they should explain many of their recent product decisions even if only to help out their enthusiast customers with planning their upgrades.
Gordon

[Nolan B]

V , I think it would be great to see Rotel giving a bit more info generally to the forum members.Imo they should explain many of their recent product decisions even if only to help out their enthusiast customers with planning their upgrades.
Gordon

I agree.

Having an insider here would be a great asset.

Kevin have you had conversations with rotel about having someone from their join us? It would be a huge value seeing this is the #1 place to go on the net to talk rotel.

[Kevin D]

I agree.

Having an insider here would be a great asset.

Kevin have you had conversations with rotel about having someone from their join us? It would be a huge value seeing this is the #1 place to go on the net to talk rotel.

Well, it's an issue of having someone 'officially' messaging on Rotel's behalf without this being a Rotel website. There's too many liability issues there to contend with. They have their 800# and email if someone needs an official comment.

That said, there are several employees that are on the forum incognito. Mostly they read, but they are here.

As far as HDMI processing, I don't think they chose to not allow it. Rather a limitation found in the DSP chip. The beta version of the 1058 didn't even allow sound from the HDMI at first. Whether they knew and found that acceptable or found the limitation after the design I don't know. It's not unheard of for a chip manufacturer to stretch the truth of what it's capable of (The scrapped RVE-1070 is a good example, the scaler chip didn't do what they were told it would).

Kevin D.

[scient]

Has ayone heard an official reason from Rotel as to why they decided not to allow the 1069 to add processing the PCM signal?

It does not? So that means any DTS-MA or DD-TrueHD signal decoded in the player and sent as PCM over the HDMI can not be processed, right? So no bass management on any HD sound sources, that sucks! :M

And I am so close to picking up a 1069, looks like I might have to reconsider... :E

[JDH]

I sold my RSP-1066 and picked up a secondhand RSP-1068 as a stop gap measure until something better comes along with features I need. (only a $100 AUD upgrade after selling the RSP-1066).

Seems like the RSP-1069 will offer nothing really worthwhile in th short term to me over the RSP-1068. Maybe when HD-DVD or BD souces are more mainstream with appropriate movie titles I'll consider it, my main focus is 2ch music anyway.

I guess when/if I need more than one 5.1/7.1 input the RSP-1069 would be a winner due to the inclusion of HDMI switching.


JDH.

[Stevebez]

No DD-TrueHD or DTS-HD is a bummer .... also less bandwidth with the 1.2 vs 1.3 makes future upgrades less likely ... basically a 1068 with basic HDMI functionality and upscaling... not bad I guess but not ideal .. maybe they saving it for the 1099?

[crowland]

I think it should be a better sounding unit with the upgrade to the DAC's which seem's wothwhile.

[UFObuster]

No DD-TrueHD or DTS-HD is a bummer .... also less bandwidth with the 1.2 vs 1.3 makes future upgrades less likely ... basically a 1068 with basic HDMI functionality and upscaling... not bad I guess but not ideal .. maybe they saving it for the 1099?

Excuse me, again, but I'm confused here. Most (or all) of the HD video players will pass their "HD" sound sources thru analog cables ala DVD-A/SACD. The 1068 handles it just "peachy". Those formats are still shaky to say the least. What already exists in so-called HD sound format: DVD-A, SACD, DTS 96/24, is su-*#%&ing-perb already. Movies are not really a music source; they are a sound-effect source which doesn't exploit the higher attributes of hi-def sound anyway. The key here is to wait and see what the MUSIC industry will do with these options. My bet is they will not ignore any avenue for hi-def reproduction including the existing formats. More likely, they will focus on wide distribution formats to sell units; ie, the existing formats and likely (IMHO) 96/24 for convenience. The newer "hi-def" formats will be hard pressed to improve on what's already available now (in music) at a much cheaper price considering all of the licensing fees, etc.

Disclaimer: (again) If you're the guy watching "Batman Begins" a god-zillion times in some HD format, this will not make sense to you. Read on until the thread gets back to normal. Rotel sells music stuff!

[Stevebez]

OK thanks help me out here then ... so will a bluray / ps3 output DD-TrueHD or DTS-HD via their analogue outputs ... ? Or can they be passed through as PCM and be processed by the RSP processor.

So there are 3 ways to get this source then from a suitable player, HDMI 1.3 (1069 cannot do it), PCM (1069 cannot do it) and anologue output (1069 can do it) correct?

So you would use the TrueHD source via anolgue through the 7.1 analogue inputs?

Trust me I want reason to buy this unit ...