Originally posted by beden1
They have cheap lines you are looking at one of the top lines
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They have cheap lines you are looking at one of the top lines -
Kal's prescription is a set of 800D's, James thinks I need the SSP-800...maybe it's the number 800 that's giving me a headache! Either that or my bike helmet is too tight. 8O If I win the Arizona lottery tonight I vow to honor both of your suggestions!Originally posted by Kal Rubinson
MisterDoggy, congratulations on your new toys. Absolutely awesome system. The only thing I have in common with you is the Mac processor, so I've got a lotta work to do!
Viper, your system is equally spectacular. Those front 3 make an impressive sight. I wish the AZ. Cardinals O-line looked as intimidating
Gump (aka-Envious)Comment
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Why does this picture give me the urge to go rent "March of the Penguins" ?Originally posted by RebelManHere is a perspective view of the two togther. Keep in mind I said perspective. This means objects further away will look smaller, still the photo gives some feel for the difference in overall sizes. You should notice that the 800D plinth is substantially larger between the two than the cabinet.
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SRT-10 Viper thanks for the link. They look good and more reasonable.Originally posted by SRT-10 ViperComment
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Gump, I think your system is great and very similar to mine. Their systems may be spectacular, but sometimes great is good enough! :TOriginally posted by GumpKal's prescription is a set of 800D's, James thinks I need the SSP-800...maybe it's the number 800 that's giving me a headache! Either that or my bike helmet is too tight. 8O If I win the Arizona lottery tonight I vow to honor both of your suggestions!
MisterDoggy, congratulations on your new toys. Absolutely awesome system. The only thing I have in common with you is the Mac processor, so I've got a lotta work to do!
Viper, your system is equally spectacular. Those front 3 make an impressive sight. I wish the AZ. Cardinals O-line looked as intimidating
Gump (aka-Envious)Comment
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Great looking system SRT-10 I am thinking of going with the 800D'S
I should have my new amps here in a few days then i will make my
decision. sure looks nice.Classe ssp-600
Classe CA-M400 Monoblocks
Classe CDP-100
B&W 802D :T ;x(
Velodyne DD-18 :TComment
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Gees I wish I was a B&W 800 series dealer right now. Business is good at the top it would seem.
sg2 - apologies for the Q - misread your handle due to the underline and being bat like (blind as that is .....can't complain about the ears however). And just to clear things up, my light hearted comment was referring to Mr D's 800s, as you were. I also often refer to any 800 series speakers as 800s (including nautil-i and signatures).Mac 8gb SSD Audirvana ->Weiss INT202 firewire interface ->Naim DAC & XPS2 DR->Conrad Johnson CT5 & LP70S-> Vivid B1s. Nordost Valhalla cables & resonance management. (Still waiting for Paul Hynes PS:M)
Siamese :evil: :twisted:Comment
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There are many great sounding speakers but for the money, there isn't a better one out there. It may not seem like a value proposition until you check the competition.Originally posted by Briz vegas"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today."Comment
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In that general price bracket the only other "off the shelf" speaker I have had the pleasure of listening to is the Watt Puppy 7 in this system.
Because so many variables were different I could not directly compare with the 802D etc. If you guys were local I would be the first to turn up on your doorstep with a bottle of vino (to make sure I was welcome back again) and some CDs - just to educate myself on the qualities of the 800D in the home environment you understand.
Given the big $$ being asked for some speakers I can understand the value for money arguement.Mac 8gb SSD Audirvana ->Weiss INT202 firewire interface ->Naim DAC & XPS2 DR->Conrad Johnson CT5 & LP70S-> Vivid B1s. Nordost Valhalla cables & resonance management. (Still waiting for Paul Hynes PS:M)
Siamese :evil: :twisted:Comment
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Resale Value is important too.....Originally posted by Briz vegas
When I buy anything HIFI thats more than a couple of grand, I like to know I bought it well and that when I will sell it, it will have either retained most or all of its value
When you buy from small brands, relatively little known makers of hifi, while they may produce outstanding pieces that perform, they may not fare well in the resale market.
Kinda like, if its Mercedes or Bmw, a known value with an active market place, you know when its time to sell there is an active marketplace.
Lets face it, when you have $10k in speakers, its money invested in the meantime. Maybe not wisely by some standards, but enough that you know when you want to upgradis, theres some or all of the value there.
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Ok we don't buy speakers for investment but for pleasure!!Originally posted by misterdoggyFarming looks mighty easy when your plow is a pencil, and you're a thousand miles from the corn field."Dwight D. EisenhowerComment
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Originally posted by wettou
?? What ?? :f>Comment
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Originally posted by misterdoggy
Kiss ;s@ love you tooFarming looks mighty easy when your plow is a pencil, and you're a thousand miles from the corn field."Dwight D. EisenhowerComment
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Lets keep it civilOriginally posted by wettou
I have no response anymore with you
Your first language is probably not English or if it is
you are Rude in your mannerComment
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You started it and why does' it matter if English is my first language or not just because other people disagree doesn't mean you have to be insulting. :EOriginally posted by misterdoggyFarming looks mighty easy when your plow is a pencil, and you're a thousand miles from the corn field."Dwight D. EisenhowerComment
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you insulted me with your tone
I won't answer anything you have to say anymore everComment
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I agree that one should select objects to buy with resale value in mind. IMO, B&W is one of the best speakers that is able to be re-sold without taking much of a bath (particularly if you bought a demo pair or used for example), and as the new speaker prices continue to rise.Originally posted by misterdoggyResale Value is important too.....
When I buy anything HIFI thats more than a couple of grand, I like to know I bought it well and that when I will sell it, it will have either retained most or all of its value
When you buy from small brands, relatively little known makers of hifi, while they may produce outstanding pieces that perform, they may not fare well in the resale market.
Kinda like, if its Mercedes or Bmw, a known value with an active market place, you know when its time to sell there is an active marketplace.
Lets face it, when you have $10k in speakers, its money invested in the meantime. Maybe not wisely by some standards, but enough that you know when you want to upgradis, theres some or all of the value there.
I collect Swiss watches, and all of my older Rolex watches, and my Patek Philippe can be sold at far greater prices than I purchased them for new.
And with boats for example, if you bought a Mercedes quality brand like a Regulator used, even in this market, you can typically sell them at or near what you paid for them.
Inflation is your best friend when trying to resale quality goods.Last edited by beden1; 05 August 2008, 22:54 Tuesday.Comment
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:later:Originally posted by misterdoggyFarming looks mighty easy when your plow is a pencil, and you're a thousand miles from the corn field."Dwight D. EisenhowerComment
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EXACTLY my point. I sell antique vintage posters, meaning collectibles. If they don't sell this year, they will sell for more next year. People who buy vintage posters enjoy the art and it appreciates in value.Originally posted by beden1
I just bought the 800D's and got 25% off the American price. After shipping and clever VAT handling I will own a NEW pair cheaper than Europeans sell a mint used pair.
Let's face it, it is recommended to buy speakers and cd players new.
You never want to buy a pair of speakers that are demos, these are the worst. They've been played mucho, handled a lot with wiring, and its risky. Better to buy speakers from a hifi person who has kept them in one place and taken good care of them with reasonable hours.
I bought my 802D's well, like I just bought my 800D's, and I sold my 802D's last week for MORE than I paid over 3 years ago.
So the money in speakers might not be important for some, but for me anything I put large amounts of Euros in to, I would like to know there is some value there.Comment
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Hey Guys :-)
This is not war and peace...
It's just about music and home theatre...
So lets not get personal! I don't want to have to lock what started out s a great thread! But I will if there is any more personal style comments...
GeoffComment
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John Lennon............... "There aren't any problems, Just solutions"
Probably the 1st time in over 1250 posts, that I took offence to someone, as everyone here knows me for years
Let's keep inputs friendly......Comment
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Well with the 800D's on the way of course I am questioning the need for maybe more power.
I have McIntosh MC501's which were fine for the 802D's, but there are many who think you need more power for the 800D's.
Many on another forum specializing in McIntosh, think that one would be happy with the 501's but in a side by side test with the MC1201's you would hear a difference.
Anyone want to weigh in on that one ???Comment
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How loud do you listen? I normally listen at about mid 70's (db) and sometimes into the 80's or even 90's. I have had N801's and S800's. Bryston 7B's and Classe 350's have always had more than enough power. (500 wpc and 350 wpc at 8 ohms).Originally posted by misterdoggy
If you are not using the extra power you should not notice a difference.
However, you do seem to be itching to upgrade to the big amps.
An afterthought. If you are using your 800's for HT you may need teh extra power. I am strictly 2 channel.Comment
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I use them for both ht and hifi and dont listen to stereo cranked upOriginally posted by DM3000 Owner
Around 70db average high to 75
I actually like to listen a lot at 65 db and would like to hear details at low volumesComment
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I recently got the CAM-350s and love them. I auditioned the 800Ds with the CAM-400s and they sounded great. I also auditioned them with the MC501s and didn't care for the sound . . . it just was not as refined as the Classe amps, and the detail at lower volumes was not as revealing.Originally posted by misterdoggy
When I asked my dealer if the 800Ds benefit with more power than the CAM-400s, he said that they really sounded very dynamic at all volume levels with the MC1201's. He said that the bass drivers of the 800Ds really need ample power to drive them efficiently.
With this being said however, you would need to switch three amps for your front speakers, and if I were you, I would not make this investment unless you did some very serious auditions beforehand.
Your question about power is precisely why I am hesitant to move up to the 800Ds and HTM1D. I know myself, and I would be wanting for more power, and the investment would grow to the level of insanity.Comment
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BedenOriginally posted by beden1
I already am quite satisfied with the sound of the htm1d and 501 and would not consider a 1201 for the center.
However, 1201's for the front L&R is a serious consideration
Its always about cost of the upgrade. The difference would be the selling price of the 501's versus the cost of the 1201's.
Its interesting to hear your first hand comparison with the Cam400's which I have only heard good things about and the 501's.
Probably the real comparison would be the 1201 against the Cam400 and the cam350 against the 501, not judging watt for watt but amplifier for amplifier.
However the 501 does sound well in my system and there are other factors in the chain besides the amp and the speaker. It could be the source you were listening to, or the wires, were more favorable to the Classe.
I know B&W speakers are adjusted using classe products and they are a natural combination. However, I am a diehard McIntosh Amp man and prefer McIntosh for both looks and sound.Comment
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You have plenty of power with the 501's to drive the 800D's to sound like they are intended to in a small to medium room. I think only a large room and the need to listen to them at concert levels would be the only reason to have to get more power. I said "have to" because I am driving them with EVO 400's and it is plenty of power for my room but that doesn't stop me from lusting over and wanting the EVO 900's for the extra bass control they would provide. :TOriginally posted by misterdoggyI refuse to tip-toe through life only to arrive safely at death...
LouComment
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If you are happy with the MC501 for the HTM1D, then I guess I don't understand why you would want to upgrade the amps for the 800Ds?Originally posted by misterdoggy
My comment about having to upgrade three amps for the front speakers comes from articles I keep reading about how it's optimum to match the power for the L/C/R fronts. The logic behind this makes sense to me.
I look at the cost of upgrades a bit differently then what you have described . . . I look at it as the total amount of dollars invested.
I'm not sure about the wires making a noticeable difference, but I totally agree with the source. During my auditions, the same source was used in listening to the Classe and the McIntosh amps with the 800Ds. It was a Meridian pre-pro and some music server during the first audition. My other audition between the two amps with a different dealer was through a Classe pre-amp and CD player.
I kind of got the same feeling that something was missing and not as overall pleasing with the McIntosh amps versus the Classe amps during both auditions.
I agree with you though that I love the look of the McIntosh amps.Comment
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I'd say let the new speakers break in and try the 501's. I have never though that I needed more power than the Brystons or Classe amps. You will need to run on the 4 ohm tap and your autoformers will give you 500 wpc. That should be enough for your listening habits.Originally posted by misterdoggyComment
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This is what I am thinking. I spoke with my tech friend at B&W and he suggested only using the 8ohm taps as there was no benefit or difference using 8 or 4 ohm.Originally posted by DM3000 Owner
I too always thought I was getting more out of the 4 ohm taps but at B&W they don't believe thats true ??
At the mac forum they think I would be happy with the 501's but if I put the 1201's in comparison the 501's wouldnot be as strong in the bass.Comment
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As I told you before, I have both amplifiers and also the 800D & the 802D.
I use the HTM-1D as center.My first setup was 501 on the front and center.I changed the 800D from 501 to 1201's but as I'm using the setup not only for 2 channel but also much for surround, I needed a 1201 on the center channel too.There was too much difference with the fronts, it seemed as if my center always hided behind those fronts.So I sold one of my 501's and placed the two others on my surround channels (802D)Comment
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The autoformer matches impedence and will put out 500 wpc at 4 ohms. It wil lalso put out 500 wpc at 8 ohms, but if you hook a 4 ohm speaker up to the taps that expect to see 8 ohms, well that explains it, the amp will be ready to put out 500 wpc into 8 ohms, not into 4 ohms. It may be too low of in impedence for that tap. 800's are a tough load. Read the Stereophile review.Originally posted by misterdoggy
Will the 1201's have more bass at low volume or just at high volume (where you really do not use your system).Comment
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So to recap:Originally posted by jericho
You had 501's on the Fronts and Center, switched to 1201's on the Fronts and that made the Center driven by the 501 seem less detailed in comparison.
So you needed 1201's across the Fronts and The Center.
So that would mean if I bought 1201's for my Fronts I will have the same experience and won't be happy unless I have 3 x 1201''s across the front
or
Stick with 501's across the 3 front and center speakers as they are all the same and no differences will become apparent.
So what you are saying is ALL 501 or ALL 1201 across the FLC ....Comment
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MD, I'd keep the 501s , as was mentioned before, until break-in, then determine if you need additional power.
On another topic, I just removed my Velodyne DD18 and added a JL Audio F113. I also bought a second F113 that I should have next week. Looking forward to running (2) F113 in my setup. I am impressed with the JL compared to the DD18 it's close. I am sure 2 will easily surpass one DD18.Comment
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Ditto, and on the 4 ohm tap. The 8 ohm tap quickly loses gas when impedance drops below 4 ohms.Originally posted by SRT-10 Viper"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today."Comment
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Two JL F113 I have been thinking about the same!:T How big is your roomOriginally posted by SRT-10 ViperFarming looks mighty easy when your plow is a pencil, and you're a thousand miles from the corn field."Dwight D. EisenhowerComment
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I think that it is an issue of gain and not one amp being more detailed than the other. The three amps need the same gain to be at the proper volume at any given setting.Originally posted by misterdoggyComment
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My room is 22X16X8... Not large but others that have f113s thought two
would work well in my room.Comment
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Two subs gives you a balanced presentation, and you'll find that the directional sense you get with only one sub will disappear. The bass output also seems to engulf you with two subs versus one.Originally posted by SRT-10 Viper
I have played a lot with room positioning using two subs, and have found for my situation at least, that their best placement is to the inside of each main speaker.
I know you will enjoy and appreciate the difference.Comment
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I might try adding a second sub, I usually can get a good dealsOriginally posted by beden1Farming looks mighty easy when your plow is a pencil, and you're a thousand miles from the corn field."Dwight D. EisenhowerComment
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I would see how you go with the 501's first. You may be really impressed with the sound and feel you don't need the upgrade.Originally posted by misterdoggy
However if you ever needed somewhere to store your 501 amps whilst demoing the 1201 I could help :PComment
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I am surprised no one has suggested the MC2KW :B :PComment
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Yeah Right.....Originally posted by Allegiance
With your credit card that is ?Comment
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Sure send me your address and I will send them right out :rofl: :rofl:Originally posted by AllegianceComment
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I thought you would :BOriginally posted by misterdoggyComment
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Hi,
My system consists of B&W 800Ds L&R, HTM1D, 803Ds surrounds and in the future, possibly a pair of 802Ds or another pair of 803Ds for 7.1 sound.
Yet, all this time I have been using an PWS 3500 KEF subwoofer from my previous system but it is not that capable... -
After I replaced my 803S I found the HTM3S unbearable to listen to along side the towering Marlan headed 800D so I was forced to sell it. I desperately wanted to keep it but no amount of tweaking could appreciably circumvent the prevailing tonal smearing across the obverse sound field.
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Hi all,
as the title states, I was just wondering what your thoughts were on either a pair of 800Ds or 802D and 2×ASW855s for front duties for a system that is designed for 50% HT and 50% music. The surrounds are 802D and the centre is HTM1D. Amps would be Denon POA-S1 or equivalent.... -
I'm slowly building up my surround setup and I'm trying to decide whether to go with 802Ds on the rear channels (I currently have 2 already) for the purpose of matching the sound for surround, or moving the 802Ds I have to the real channels and purchasing 800Ds for the front L/R channels. I plan on... -
Hi,
I am a new forum member and this is my first post. I have been a two channel kind of a guy for a long long time and I am about to make the just to a 5.1 system. I plan on adding a HTM1D center channel and two Signature 8NT's for my rear speakers. The existing system includes a pair...
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