$3000 Challenge! $3800 Solution

**Kit** · 10 September 2004, 00:49 Friday

Hey Brian,

I've a budget that's in your area as well - so I'm looking forward to how it all sounds and looks once you've got it put together. Let us know how it all works out!

**Brian Barnes** · 10 September 2004, 02:14 Friday

Kit,

Will do. I should have everything @ my house by end of next week. I can't wait to set it up!

Brian

**Shane Martin** · 10 September 2004, 07:21 Friday

Well Done!

I would advise that your purchase a calibration disc like Video Essentials or Avia and setup your new system. You should also need an SPL meter. Or perhaps you can talk some local forums guys to help you or loan you the meter and disc. If you haven't already, I'd get the sub cable from SVS. IT's well made and nicely priced.

**number17** · 10 September 2004, 09:31 Friday

Looks like an excellent setup ... you definitely have done your homework around here.

**Brian Barnes** · 10 September 2004, 10:32 Friday

Shane

The Denon 2805/985 receiver comes with an auto EQ function. Will I still need the SPL meter? If so, are they easy to use? Also, how does the Avia or video essentials disc work?

Thanks,

Brian

**aud19** · 10 September 2004, 11:29 Friday

Looks like you got some good quality gear for a minmal of cost :T I'm sure you and your family will get LOT's of enjoyment out of it :yesnod:

As for the SPL meter.. With the Auto-EQ you don't really need one but it would still help for fine tuning. I probably wouldn't buy one, having Auto-EQ, but if you have somebody close you can borrow it off of... not a bad idea

Definitely pick up Digital Video Essentials for calibrating your display though! :yesnod:

Jason

**Shane Martin** · 10 September 2004, 11:32 Friday

Will I still need the SPL meter?

I don't trust they are accurate. They are all different. They don't setup your sub correctly IMHO.

They are extremely easy to use and if you have trouble, we are all here to help.

Avia or VE works like this:

VE(I haven't used avia in a long time): Has a setup guide that walks you thru your video setup. How to adjust brightness, contrast etc. It's Extremely easy.

**Brian Barnes** · 10 September 2004, 12:15 Friday

Excellent! I will get the Video Essentials and see if I can borrow the SPL meter from a buddy.

Thanks,

Brian

**number17** · 10 September 2004, 13:07 Friday

Here's my 2 cents on SPL meter ... they definitely help, but I think it's more important you trust your ears rather than a number on a meter. The meter gives you a guideline, but I always give my ears the final say when calibrating my system.

Thus, when your system already has the auto-eq function, and you use your ears to fine-tune, do you really need the SPL meter?

Tough call. Then again, SPL meter ain't expensive ... and one is all you need for your entire life.

If you can borrow one from a friend though, then that's even better.

I also have a question about VE, DVE, or AVIA ... I think if you can get into the service menu and make more adjustments from there, it might be worth it. If not though, then all you're adjusting is just the contrast, brightness, color, tinit, and sharpness. When you already have THX optimizer (for free!) how much more would these video calibration kits do over and beyond the THX Optimizer, given you're still playing with the same 6 or 7 settings? I am a little skeptical on that.

So again, if you can borrow the calibration kit from a friend or something, then it's a no-brainer. But if I have to pay $50 or $60 or even $90 for these kits, then I don't think it's a "must-have".

**Brian Barnes** · 10 September 2004, 19:00 Friday

17

Please elaborate with regard to the THX. How does this work and does it replace the need for the video essentials disc?

I agree, if I cannot locate a SPL for free I will trust my ear coupled with the Auto EQ function.

Brian

**Brian Barnes** · 10 September 2004, 19:46 Friday

number17

I have another question for you. I know you have recently dealt with rear speaker placement. I also have some constraints. I am attaching a few pictures of my living room. You will notice that the back of the room is open to the kitchen/breakfast area. There is a colum in the middle and then there is a wall 10' to the left and a corner wall apprx 14' to the right. If I place the rears on the center wall and the left wall, the speakers will be directly behind the edge of my sofa. Not sure if this closeness will be a problem. If I place one speaker in the corner position and the other to the back left wall location one rear would be at the edge of the sofa, unless I moved it out further, and the corner speaker would be a good 14' outsided the sofa.

Confused? I am!

Please advise how you would place the rear speakers.

Thanks,

Brian

Attached Files

**Andrew Pratt** · 10 September 2004, 19:53 Friday

I agree, if I cannot locate a SPL for free I will trust my ear coupled with the Auto EQ function.

Brian

Brian there's several HTGuide members that live in Huston so one of them should be able to help out out in that regard...and likely offer in house suggestions as well if you bribe them with a beer or three

**Brian Barnes** · 10 September 2004, 20:18 Friday

There is never a beer shortage at my house so if they work for beer, I am in business! lol

Brian

**Burke Strickland** · 11 September 2004, 22:44 Saturday

Brian -

I might be able to help with your speaker placement and setup calibration. I have set up several systems using my SPL meter and both AVIA and Video Essentials, and I am in the Houston area. Lets' continue the discussion via private messages.

Burke

**Gene Simmons** · 12 September 2004, 00:00 Sunday

Wow Brian, thats great!! I'm very happy for you, just make sure you give us some pictures when you get it all set up. Aw heck, even when you have the fresh new boxes delivered! I need to live vicariously thru someone!

**Drew_W** · 12 September 2004, 01:05 Sunday

An SPL meter is like $30 at Radio Shack. For what it does to theatres (mine at least anyways) and the fact that it's so cheap, I really don't think this is something that requires much thought...buy it, use it, enjoy its benefits, and become the cool guy on the block with the SPL meter. It'll pay for itself in beer soon enough.

**Brian Barnes** · 12 September 2004, 16:51 Sunday

Burke,

I could definately use your help. I sent you an email to your hotmail account. I appreciate the offer very much.

Brian

**Sonnie Parker** · 13 September 2004, 09:45 Monday

Brian, sounds like Burke has you covered on the speaker placement issue.

Concerning the SPL Meter... no, it is not accurate as far as measuring the response but there are corrections values for the Radio Shack meter which will compensate for the inaccurate response. I would go ahead and invest in one if you can find one. You might want to check your levels against the auto-setup function of the 2805, although I suspect it's fairly accurate. The SPL meter will come in handy if you decide to equalized your sub via a BFD... which I think you'll probably end up doing.

You can see the correction values on the BFD page in my sig link. I think I have a link on the page to the values. You can also download the Microsoft Excel Workbook which will automatically correct the values for you when measuring 1/6 octave on your sub.

**number17** · 13 September 2004, 10:52 Monday

Please elaborate with regard to the THX. How does this work and does it replace the need for the video essentials disc?

THX optimizer is a tool you'll find on some DVD's, such as Indiana Jones and Star Wars. It basically helps you calibrate your TV's video and audio settings. Does it replace the AVIA or DVE kits? No. But if you can't / don't plan to get into the service menu of the TV, then the THX tool is pretty damn close.

My friend had the DVE kit and I borrowed it after I calibrated my TV with the THX optimizer. What I found was the setting with the THX Optimizer was already good enough I didn't have to make any change to my setting while calibrating with the DVE kit. Since I can't get into the service menu, all I could change was the contrast (which is a moot point in my setup, because of the white crush problem of the Zenith 318 DVD player, and I enable the automatic contrast on my TV), brightness, colour, tint, and sharpness. If I could get into the service menu I suspect I could fine tune a little bit more with the DVE than the THX-O.

I agree, if I cannot locate a SPL for free I will trust my ear coupled with the Auto EQ function.

I do agree the SPL meter is not a bad investment at its cost, but since your 2805 already has auto-EQ I think the combination of auto-EQ and your ears is good enough.

Since it looks like Burke will be able to help you calibrate though, the combination of auto-EQ, SPL meter, and your ears (and Burke's ears) is obviously the best combo.

I have another question for you. I know you have recently dealt with rear speaker placement. I also have some constraints. I am attaching a few pictures of my living room. You will notice that the back of the room is open to the kitchen/breakfast area. There is a colum in the middle and then there is a wall 10' to the left and a corner wall apprx 14' to the right. If I place the rears on the center wall and the left wall, the speakers will be directly behind the edge of my sofa. Not sure if this closeness will be a problem. If I place one speaker in the corner position and the other to the back left wall location one rear would be at the edge of the sofa, unless I moved it out further, and the corner speaker would be a good 14' outsided the sofa.

I think your layout is a lot better than mine for speaker placement.

I wouldn't worry about placing the surround speakers on speaker stands directly behind your sofa. You can compensate for that with the adjustment on your receiver. My father-in-law has the same setup and I didn't notice any problem. Your surround speakers also won't get in the way of heavy traffic area and they won't even be obstructing the view from the kitchen (because there's a column / half-wall there anyways).

I'd say try that, and if you don't like how that sounds then I'd say another placement you can try is to hang them from the ceiling ... but running of speaker wires could be a pain. It most likely will also have a lower WAF.

Enjoy!

**Geoff** · 13 September 2004, 15:43 Monday

Tho the D-EQ feature is nice and most likely will do a good job, I would still purchase an spl meter and a cali disc at some point!

You will later, find yourself using it much more than you ever thought.

While Burk is their, I'm sure he can and will show you how these tools can be used for so many things aside from basic system set up-calibration.

If and when you get into speaker & or sub FR measuring along with best in room sub placement & phase settings (and you probaby will at some point), these can be a very very helpfull tools. The D-EQ should get you by, but I've heard/read of some receivers ~{in all the brands having some type of Auto-Calibration/Eq-set up}~ not working correctly. Most "always work quite well" so the odds are in your favor the D-EQ should be very close.
BUT, it's nice to have the tools to check & see how your receiver did it's job.

System tweaking later on is something nearly all eventually look into, then the meter and test disc/s are definite nice goodies to have. Of the 6-Test or System Set Up discs I have, Avia and the NO longer available Stryke Freq/IMD disc are what I seem to use the most often. A min once a year re-cali system checkup is something I always do.

Just a Note:
SVS now carrys in stock the new Rat Shack Analog spl meter and can be ordered with the sub. It's also cheaper than in store bought 98% of the time and the (price break could be more with a sub purchase).
Thats not a for sure, but between you and SVS if you looked into picking one up...

Fine tuning by ear is great for some, but I prefer to know what my ear thinks is fine!

Regards
Geoff

$3000 Challenge! $3800 Solution

$3000 Challenge! $3800 Solution

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