1080i upconvert dvd player or Universal DVD player?

[Shane Martin]

Up until the Zenith came out I wasn't too intrigued with the 1080i thru component options for a dvd player. I wasn't convinced either and I'm still not that it makes a big difference.

However I need a new progressive dvd player and I can't justify having more than 1 in the rack to the S.O. FWIW, I currently use my Sony 530D non progressive player.

Now with my new audio and VIDEO upgrade this year I'd like to get a new dvd player. I've been really tempted to jump into DVD audio and SACD by getting a Universal but there is a voice in my head telling me I should get the Zenith and upconverting will be worth it more then DVD-A/SACD.

Given that Denon is going to release some new players in the next few months I'm willing to wait on those. The budget <$500 Uni players don't do much for me either.

I do have a DVI HDCP input on my Mits but I've been told that its not something I should use because when the digital signal comes in it gets converted back to analog anyway so I should stick to component.

So in your mind is the Upconverting more valuable to you than SACD/DVD audio? Keep also in mind I only have 1 system so I can't afford to have a music only system. If so then I'd get both But right now I can't justify that plus rack space in my rack is at a premium.

My Budget is maximum of $700 and I'm hearing that Denon will come out with a 2900 type player that MIGHT have DVI and might have the Denon link(not both If I read correctly) so I'm willing to wait for those as the current Denon's are either Too much $$ or don't excite me much(the 2200).

What should I do?

[aud19]

Personally I'd skip the upsampling players. You're better off using your DVI connection with a HD set-top box utilizing ACTUAL HD resolutions, not upsampled stuff :roll: Most HDTV's already do some sort of upsampling anyways. Not to mention HD-DVD is coming in a couple years. If you want upsampling go either the HTPC route or with an external scaler to scale ALL of your sources, not just one.

What were you not impressed with on the 2200? That'd be my pick for a player right now with it's reported better audio than the 2900 and 95% of the video quality at a fraction of the price. Bing just went through a ton of players and picked it because of it's stellar video and audio performance. Also, if you haven't heard SACD or DVD-A and you enjoy music, you will like them :P

Jason

[JonMarsh]

So many possibilities, so many options, what to do, what to do?


OK, I'm an audio fanatic; NO "universal" player I've heard cuts it for me- so far, in the $500 range or less, it's not worthwhile to get SACD or DVD-A unless your player has the resolution to do it justice- that means it has to have jitter and low level resolution that's nearly state of the art for CD, if the hi rez stuff is to be really good.

So, for me, I keep considerations of DVD video playback and audio seperate.

For various reasons that may not be practical for you... depends on your circumstances and system.

After messing around with the Zenith for a while, my opinion is that it's a good way to go, IF

1) You have a 1080i native display, such as CRT, or VERY high res digital display.

2) OR, if your display is an intermediate resolution digital display, which does better down converting 1080i than other resolutions (Sony 1XHT series comes to mind, considering the Gensis chips they use; it looks better on an HTPC downconverting from 1080i or 720P than up converting from 480P.

Playing with the Zenith on a CRT and LCD panel display I have to say that even some subtle things look better and have less line tweeter, such as scrolling text in the end credits, compared with driving the same display with 480P from another conventional player or HTPC. I don't know why, other than the scaler they have in this unit must be above average.

It's probably NOT a good way to go if you have a native 720P display, with digital or component inputs, because it's 720P is not as good as 1080i; more moire in test patterns.

I sort of p*ssed off some guys at BB tonight; told them I was interested in a particular RPTV model, CRT, which had one of the sharper pictures on the floor, and asked if I could check out it's picture with my own DVD player, both on 480P and 1080i. They'd never heard of the Zenith, of course. I was curious because I'm considering options in a new set for the bedroom, including a widerscreen HDTV. They didn't actually believe there were any DVD players with 1080i scaled component outputs on the market- guess they haven't heard of the Liteon 2001 either; not surprising.

The 1080i output on compenent was sharper, and more vivid, and yet smoother, too, than 480P fed into the same Toshiba set. The image had more fine detail, and a bit mroe pop, without even doing any calibration. We tried a Toshiba DVD player set to 480i, to try out the TV's scaler; that was the worst picture. Not too surprising, all in all.

For music I use an outboard DAC. A good one with good jitter rejection will have performance fairly independent of the source transport.

Regards,

Jon

[Adz]

If you go with an inexpensive upconversion DVD player (the $300 or under kind such as Zenith, Samsung, Bravo, etc,) would audio quality on DVD movies suffer using the same receiver/ pre-pro and cables? I would not have thought that the quality of the player would impact the digital coaxial/optical transfer from the player to the receiver.

[JonMarsh]

I'd expect that would vary somewhat depending on the jitter rejection of the processor.

OTOH, there have been a lot of positive comments about the audio quality of the Zenith on Dolby Digital and DTS; that their system sounds better than with XYZ brand player they had before. So, this player may have a pretty decent SPDIF output, based on those comments.

[b-tinker]

Will the upconverted DVD player produce a noticable difference?

I have a DLP projector and a 100 inch (diag) screen, and I was perfectly content watching DVDs on it until I got a HD receiver and am not able to watch high def TV. It puts the resolution of the DVDs to shame. So I was excited to hear about the development of "resolution upconverting" DVD players. However, that hope was dashed when I found out it only worked thru the DVI connection. When I bought the projector, I saved money by not getting one with DVI (it was brand new then), a decision I have already come to regret. However, that horse has left the barn, so I have to live with it.

Just this week I read that Zenith makes a DVD player that upconverts thru the component video connection. So now maybe this is something I could use. Waiting for true HD DVD is really not an option for the same DVI reason - as far as I have read, the movie studios will not allow those players to use anything that is not encrypted, like DVI with HDCP, and since I don't have DVI I won't be getting one of those, at least not until I get a different projector (and that will be quite a few years according to the wife).

So my question is, using the Zenith and the component video connection, will I see a noticable improvement in picture? Thanks.

[JonMarsh]

I think you may be going through too many conversion steps for a 1080i player to be useful with your XGA DLP. Plus, there's the aspect ratio thing - 1080i being 16:9.

If you want to fully enjoy OTA or cable HD, some day you're going to need a new projector, as the greatest number of vertical lines you can use for widescreen is 576; that's a bit of downconversion from either 720P or 1080i.

OTOH, if you're getting results you like from current HD signals, if you can get a player that you can try out before buying, why not try it at least?

Just be sure you use AVIA or some other test disk to reset levels, because almost all DVD players and displays are a bit different in where there actual response is for 0 IRE and 100 IRE. Shouldn't be, but even a small amount off makes a difference. On a player that has a slightly "hot" output level, black may not seem as black as it should be unless you set the brightness level specifically.


~Jon

[aud19]

Also you may want to consider purchasing a decent scaler (especially one that has optional output resolutions for your XGA DLP) that way ALL your sources will look good and DVI will be less of a concern, extending the life of your current rig. Not to mention, if you can find a scaler that will go to your displays native rate, it will love you for it :P Plus it will still be a usefull component when you do upgrade your FP.

Jason

[tojoe]

Sorry but I have read some earlier posts about upconverting (Zenith/LG) DVD players, display specs having effect on PQ. I have a Samsung plasma spl4225, w852x480, is it an an ED ? can this benefit fom the LG conversion, I'm also considering a Sharp LC32G, which is 1366x768, I think it's a 720p panel, can these 2 have improved PQ at 1080i, my current is a Tosh 1600 DVD..