2-channel system with subwoofer calibration & connection.

[Isaac]

If you have a 2-channel system with a subwoofer do you let your front speakers run full range (even though they arn't large speakers) and then calibrate the sub to the rolloff? Or, if you have a separate Pre/Pro do you wire it through the subwoofer (4 rca-connections) so you can use the crossover to cutoff the front speakers also? I am trying to understand what most 2-channel people recommend.

[Kal Rubinson]

?? Neither. If you have a prepro, you let the prepro do the crossover for the main and sub and you use the EQ in the prepro or the sub, depending on what you have. If you do not have a prepro, then you use use the crossover and EQ in the sub. Alternatively, you get an external box, like the Velodyne SMS-1, to do both.

Kal

[miner]

What Mr. Rubinson said (just being respectful Kal). For my 2 channel setups (I have 2 - digital and analogue), my sub Xover is set at 10 Hz above the freq limit of my mains.

[evilskillit]

I am in the early stages of my stereo system. I finished a pair of mains late last year. Finished a pair of subs early this year and have been fiddling with integration for a while now. I have built and been involved in integration of subs in other peoples stereos before and I have found that on my system using some sort of active crossover to roll the mains off where the sub starts seems to be a better way to go all around. It uses the separate channel amplifiers more efficiently and so far, at least in my case, just sounds alot better together.

I personally am using a PC with an Audigy ZS2 and special drivers to handle the frequency splitting, time alignment, phasing and parametric eq for the sub. It sends the signal to a Parasound amp for the subs and an Arcam amp for the mains. It may not be the best solution but for someone with expensive tastes on a shoestring budget it was a great zero dollar solution for me.

[bigburner]

Isaac, I'm a 2-channel bloke and I use the crossover in my sub as Kal has suggested.

My floorstanders receive 80 Hz and above. Theoretically I should therefore set my sub to play 80 Hz and below. However I have found that varying this setting between 80 Hz and 120 Hz provides beneficial results, particularly for music DVDs. It really depends on the recording that you are listening to. In theory you shouldn't have the low frequencies coming from your sub and your speakers. It is frowned upon. However I suggest that you experiment and find out for yourself.

Nigel.

[wettou]

?? Neither. If you have a prepro, you let the prepro do the crossover for the main and sub and you use the EQ in the prepro or the sub, depending on what you have. If you do not have a prepro, then you use use the crossover and EQ in the sub. Alternatively, you get an external box, like the Velodyne SMS-1, to do both.

Kal

What about the JL Audio Fathom F113 do you still do calibration in the pre/pro?


So Kal on an other subject do you care to comment on Dave Nauber at Classé. "Automated EQ is rubish, and our SSP-800 is world leader"

[Isaac]

Thanks for everyone’s input. I currently use a rotel RSX-1056 with B&W 805s and ASW825 subwoofer. Used to be more into HT but slowly converting to 2-channel. I would like an integrated amp (Classe or Mcintosh) because of convenience but not sure how to integrate the subwoofer in the mix because the asw825 is not really designed for an integrated amp. For separates most subwoofer instruction manuals show the subwoofer connected PRE>SUBWOOFER>AMP but, unless the subwoofer is located right next to the equipment wiring could get pretty hairy (expensive and long interconnects). I am pretty happy with the sound I have now but, I am one of the many people who probably are under powering my 805s's and want to give my 805s's the power they deserve.

[Kal Rubinson]

What about the JL Audio Fathom F113 do you still do calibration in the pre/pro?

Yes or in other devices. The 1-band PEQ in the JL is capable but not so capable as others.

So Kal on an other subject do you care to comment on Dave Nauber at Classé. "Automated EQ is rubish, and our SSP-800 is world leader"

I have in the past. Perhaps I will again if/when I get my hands on an SSP-800.

[twitch54]

My floorstanders receive 80 Hz and above. Theoretically I should therefore set my sub to play 80 Hz and below. However I have found that varying this setting between 80 Hz and 120 Hz provides beneficial results

Not a very impressive bottom number for your main L / R speakers. Having a 'sub' perform beyond the second octave up to 120hz is not musicaly ideal, IMO. Very few subs are trully capable of that, it may be Ok for HT (sound effects, etc) but for accurate two channel music I doubt it.

I for one find it best to integrate the sub at the point where your main L / R speakers bottom starts to 'roll off' and do so with a fairly steep slope so as to allow the sub to get out of the way without any coloration into the midbass region.[/Quote]

In theory you shouldn't have the low frequencies coming from your sub and your speakers. It is frowned upon. Nigel.

it's totally dependent as to what you define as 'low freq'. It's best to seamlessly blend the sub into the mix (velodyne SMS-1, as mentioned before)

the real problem come from having the sub operate beyond the 80-100hz range, it is a 'sub' afterall, not a Upper Bass driver !

[bigburner]

the real problem come from having the sub operate beyond the 80-100hz range, it is a 'sub' afterall, not a Upper Bass driver !

Well Dave, what can I say?

"A mind is like a parachute. It doesn't work if it is not open."

— Frank Zappa

I just experimented a bit and that's what I discovered.

Nigel.

[miner]

Thanks for everyone’s input. I currently use a rotel RSX-1056 with B&W 805s and ASW825 subwoofer. Used to be more into HT but slowly converting to 2-channel. I would like an integrated amp (Classe or Mcintosh) because of convenience but not sure how to integrate the subwoofer in the mix because the asw825 is not really designed for an integrated amp. For separates most subwoofer instruction manuals show the subwoofer connected PRE>SUBWOOFER>AMP but, unless the subwoofer is located right next to the equipment wiring could get pretty hairy (expensive and long interconnects). I am pretty happy with the sound I have now but, I am one of the many people who probably are under powering my 805s's and want to give my 805s's the power they deserve.

Get an integrated with a set of pre outs to sun to your ASW825. I have a ASW800 and have the pre outs from my Rotel RC-1090 pre amp runiing to the sub - no cable run from sub back to amp. I set my cutoff on the sub at 10 Hz abouve the cutoff of my mains, B&W N804.

[twitch54]

Well Dave, what can I say?


I just experimented a bit and that's what I discovered.

Nigel.

Nigel,

No problem, whatever makes your ears happy with your system is all that matters !

I was just mearly stating that I know of no sub that is designed to work beyond the second octave, at least in a 'accurate musical' enviroment.

[bigburner]

Nigel,

I was just mearly stating that I know of no sub that is designed to work beyond the second octave, at least in a 'accurate musical' enviroment.

You're absolutely right Dave which makes it all the more strange that it sounds better.

I followed conventional wisdom for about 18 months until I received a PM from a fellow HTG member (who shall remain nameless) who suggested that I experiment a bit. I did and I've never looked back.

It could just be a peculiarity of my system.

I'm writing this while watching a Wilco DVD and it sounds fantastic...

Nigel.