Computer music to your system.

[Dmantis]

Ok another craze is using a computer as your source in your HT or 2ch system.
There are many ways to get this done. I'd like to focus on music and wanted to know what everyone was using.

My idea right now is using a Mac Mini with a 7200hd or a solid state , using itunes with some software overtop of it to correct the output issues I have read and learned about , using a external DAC like this Audioquest USB DAC I found which seems to be kinda cool or going with a Peachtree or Cambridige DAC Magic.

Simple effective and clean. No tower , cards , etc . I'm a mac guy but if it's a much better way to go with a Windows based PC for music , I'm all ears.

On a side note , 95% of my music came from ripping CD's into iTunes using .wav or Apple Lossless. I never really heard any difference in them so I stuck with Apple Lossless. I really enjoy iTunes interface and once in a blue moon I'll purchase a song or old album from the iTunes store. I don't like to do that as they only offer 256k right now. I have compared 256k stuff from iTunes to the actual cd playing in my player and the rip in .wav or apple lossless. I prefer the cd and ripped version over the 256k. Shame as it would save a lot of disk space but who cares right? Space is cheap now and getting a 7200rpm 2T drive is very affordable. So space is no concern.

Right now I have 2 Apple Tv's as my main music sources.I have a 160g Apple Tv and a brand new Streamer 1080p. The older Apple TV I use mainly as I have my entire cd collection on it.I use the streamer mainly for movies and Airplay. I do however spin cd's , SACD's and DVD Audio disc's and want to move away from looking through my collection and putting in a single disc.

I would continue to use my Apple TV 160g IF it sounded as good or better then my Cambridge Audio BD560. Wiring wise I'm using both DAC's and prefer the sound of the Cambridge internal DAC's over my AVR's( SC-07 Wolfson 8740's which I'm planning on going back to separates).
Apple TV 160g is using HDMI(Audioquest Cinnamon) , Optical (Audioquest Optilink 1) and analog RCA(Audioquest custom ITA1.1). Apple TV Streamer is also using the same kind of HDMI and Optical cables.
I have them both wired up this way so I can compare HDMI and Optical to hear if one sounds better then the other.Honestly they sound exactly the same.I must not have any jitter issues with either connection. The analog connection was purely for zone 2 and 3 as I have speakers all over the house. I tried listening to the Apple tv 160 using the analog connection and I think it sounds better over digital meaning the internal DAC sounds better in the AVR over the Apple Tv's. I have no idea what Apple is using as a DAC.
I'm considering trying a external DAC with my Apple TV and seeing if I can get it closer to the quality I get from the Cambridge or equal to or even better. This is when I started to really consider getting a brand new Mac mini and going that route. Then I wouldn't need either of these Apple TV's. Maybe keep the streamer for guests and parties with Airplay and such.

Talk to me fellow users.

[Hdale85]

I use XBMC on Linux through a nice DAC.

[Silver1omo]

I have vortexbox and the onkyo tx-nr708 does the DAC duties.

[wkhanna]

Dan (PewterTA) had some parts lying around from his old server and rebuilt my pc to work as a NAS.

It has 8TB in a RAID configuration, with an old Audigy 2 XS Sound Card using ASIO4ALL v2 for the driver. I run glass Toslink SPDIF out from the card to my Schitt Gungnir DAC.

My SeeDee collection is ripped to FLAC via dBpoweramp. A nice feature is the way dBpoweramp imports the metadata & cover art. My laptop is remotely connected to the server via my router & I use Foobar to manage & play my files. I am trying out the trial version of Jriver now too.

[PewterTA]

Change it up, Bill now has my Wireworld UltraViolet USB cable and Musical Fidelity V-Link going to the SPDIF input on his Gungnir.

I upgraded to a Wireworld StarLight USB Cable and the Musical Fidelity V-Link 192. Very Very nice upgrade!

[PewterTA]

For music player I'm using a customized Foobar2000 setup. I love it as it does exactly what I want it too... and it's free. The iOS and Android app is decent, but can't wait till they add the album art when you browse through it all.

Bill and I have also been checking out JRiver and it's one heck of a player (all media)... so might go that route as the Android App is nice.

XBMC is good, but better geared for Movies I think (it's iOS & Android App is pretty darn nice).

Foobar2000 setup:

[Dmantis]

Any of you guys try out Channel D software? it supposed to work with Itunes very well.
What about the Audioquest Dragonfly USB DAC?

[Hdale85]

Foobar is pretty nice, I think XBMC does a great job SQ wise and makes it easy to manage and go through your music collection. The new nightly build is based around a completely new audio setup called Audio Engine. It's still kind of buggy (I am using it as my main though) but the SQ is very nice with it especially through a nice DAC for 2 channel. With that said I'm not sure if I'll run XBMC with my 2 channel system that I'm going to start working on or not?

There was a windows based program I was using a while back that sounded just as good as foobar but offered the media management as well. The only thing I don't like about using something like foobar is the need to use a keyboard and mouse to scan through and use your music.

[wkhanna]

.........
What about the Audioquest Dragonfly USB DAC?

Lots of chatter & opinion on the D-fly over at 'Computer Audiophile'.
Stereophile also did a review last month.
It has been well received.

Not something I would consider using in my main system, but for portable /laptop &/or headphone/earbud use, it seems quite practical along with being a V good value compared to the performance it delivers.

[Dmantis]

Lots of chatter & opinion on the D-fly over at 'Computer Audiophile'.
Stereophile also did a review last month.
It has been well received.

Not something I would consider using in my main system, but for portable /laptop &/or headphone/earbud use, it seems quite practical along with being a V good value compared to the performance it delivers.

Why wouldn't you use the Dragon fly in your main system? It has ESS Sabre DAC's and seems to be very well built in a completely compact design. Not to mention no external power supply as it gets power from the USB port.

I'm hoping it sounds great as I'm gonna bring home a few DAC's to compare it to.

[Hdale85]

The ESS Sabre is supposed to be pretty awesome, I've been wanting to build a TPA Buffalo III DAC for a while and it'll likely be what goes into my 2 channel system.

[wkhanna]

IMHO, far too much emphasis is placed on the particular Brand of chip.
It is all about implementation.

Regarding the D-fly in my main system……well, you will have to call me an audio snob.
But it would be an unfair comparison to expect it to perform at the same level as my current gear.
If, however I were contemplating a second system, it would be of great interest.

I am anxious to hear how you rate it in comparison to the other units you have avalible.

[baniels]

I would stick with a spinning disk. If you have a very small collection, then SSD would be okay, but even then the real advantages a solid state aren't going to be realized in a music server. Yes, you will save some time when dumping data to a from the disk, but it stops there.

Music will be accessed plenty fast from a 7.2k drive, and you can amass much more space for the dollar.

... with a 7200hd or a solid state...

[Dmantis]

Ok guys I got a strange problem and need some help figuring it out.
I have 2 USB DAC's here Audioengine D1 USB and Peachtree IDAC using USB.
I set up the sound out to the given DAC I have connected , also set it up in the Midi section. Now all computer sounds go out , internet sounds , youtube , everything works just fine except iTunes. I don't get it. If I open a Itunes file in Quicktime , it plays out the DAC , why wouldn't itunes have the ability to play out the USB DAC? What happens is Itunes plays out my Macbook Pro's internal speakers. Strange right?


Any Ideas?

[Dmantis]

Nevermind , I figured it out , I have Bit perfect software running which runs behind iTunes and it was set to internal speakers. I had to reconfigure it to the USB dec.

Cool on with my testing.

[aud19]

I've got all my cd's encoded in flac on my nas playing to a wdtv on my main (Rotel) system via optical (wdtv gets surprisingly good reviews and sounds pretty good to my ears) and through a custom pc to an older Pioneer receiver in my secondary system.

[Dmantis]

I just got Channel D software today running with Itunes and it works really well. Supports up to 384 files.

[aud19]

Still uses itunes though :P

[aud19]

Listened to a bunch of tunes last night through the WDTV and I'm still shocked at how good it sounds for how little it costs. Some of the tracks off of Ben Folds Presents: University A Cappella! gave me the neck hair tingles :T

[aud19]

Listened to that last night in DPL II...like being in the room :T

[Hdale85]

Hmm...I haven't been all that impressed with our WDLT but it's the older model. Also I imagine you have it going through HDMI or something so it should be using the DAC in your receiver or whatever you use.

[aud19]

I've got an older Rotel pre/pro so it's just going via optical using the Rotel DSC as you said...don't seem to have any issues with jitter etc though. Really sounds great :T

[Dmantis]

Very cool,
quick question , where are you guys picking up your High rez files? I joined HD tracks , I'm checking out Blue coast records , where else should I look? I'd like to find some Lorenna Mckinett on 24/96 , that would be awesome.

[mjb]

My idea right now is using a Mac Mini with a 7200hd or a solid state , using itunes with some software overtop of it to correct the output issues I have read and learned about , using a external DAC like this Audioquest USB DAC I found which seems to be kinda cool or going with a Peachtree or Cambridige DAC Magic.

I'm a Mac guy too... and I've just replaced my living room Mac Mini with the 2012 i7 model and Fusion drive. The Fusion drive is superb, and makes a huge difference to performance, but the base model is no slouch either. I'm still waiting to hear if there have been other significant circuit modifications in the 2012 version, but I'm totally happy with my upgrade. A new improved version of iTunes is supposed to be released by the end of the month.

As far as Dac's are concerned, I'm not much help. I just feed the Mac's HDMI output directly to an SSP-800 which processes the audio from it.

[aud19]

Very cool,
quick question , where are you guys picking up your High rez files? I joined HD tracks , I'm checking out Blue coast records , where else should I look? I'd like to find some Lorenna Mckinett on 24/96 , that would be awesome.

The majority of my stuff is ripped CD's to lossless flac...I've downloaded a couple "HD" albums (Pink Floyd...can't remember what else..maybe it was Neil Young...?) but I can't say for certain where it was from.

I think it was HD tracks (as you mentioned)...?

https://www.hdtracks.com/index.php

If they don't have it though, try just "googling":

"Lorenna Mckinett 24/96"

..and see what comes up

[Dmantis]

Have any of you learned or experienced the quality of some Higher rez files offered on HD tracks or elsewhere?
What I learned is that not all of the tracks are mastered in 24/96 or 24/192. Some of them are just 16/44.1 up sampled.
I have a few sample tracks from a friend of mine and I'm comparing them to the ripped version off the CD I uploaded to .wav and Apple Lossless.
So far I found Norah Jones to sound Identical to the CD version from 24/96 .
Rush I actually found to sound a bit clearer and more dynamic then the CD rip.

[wkhanna]

More than a few people have been disappointed by some of the files form HD Tracks.

This link may be hellpfull DR Database

I also have been ripping all my SeeDees to FLAC. One thing Dan (PewterTA) & I have noticed is (depending on the efficacy of implementation of the hardware, software & settings) some of the ripped files can actually sound better than the same material played via a CDp.

For those using windows, here is an article with some interesting info: link

[JonMarsh]

Running the HD Tracks stuff through Audessey or something similar that can do sprectral analysis will tell the story. Some of there stuff is pretty good, and in general, they do seem to be addressing issues as they go along.

My favorite source for HD is SACD extracted from a modified universal player (Pioneer, Oppo) using a Vanity AudioPraise board, and imported into my Mac and track edited into AIFF or FLAC for playback on my Macs.

[Dmantis]

IMHO, far too much emphasis is placed on the particular Brand of chip.
It is all about implementation.

Regarding the D-fly in my main system……well, you will have to call me an audio snob.
But it would be an unfair comparison to expect it to perform at the same level as my current gear.
If, however I were contemplating a second system, it would be of great interest.

I am anxious to hear how you rate it in comparison to the other units you have avalible.

I have yet to hear the Dragon Fly but I have tested 4 other DAC's that are all in different classes and levels of reproduction.
Just on a side note , I for one am of the mind that if you have a DAC of well built quality , it should do it's job correctly and sound identical to any other DAC as in this position , sound quality shouldn't change. But it does.
This will be short.
1)Audioengine D1- nice little DAC that uses your USB for power. It has a Optical input on it but you would still have to power it USB , strange yes but it is what it is. For the money , this guy really outshines the internal DAC's on both my MAC and PC laptops I'm using to test. Over USB it has the ability to replace up to 96k files , so no 192k correctly. Not a big deal unless your music is in 192k then this DAC might be worth skipping over. Overall nice tonal balance and clarity.
2)PeachTree IDac- sweet looking Dac with a Apple feel and built quality. This is another up to 96k Dac . This one compared to the D1 really out shined it in a few ways. It was clearer , more detailed and seem to allow more dynamic range to come through. How or why is a mystery to me but thats what I heard when I ran the same song over and over between the 2 dac's. It was pretty easy to tell them apart as they sounded different.
3) Cambridge Dac Magic- I really took to this DAc the way it sounded. I was a bit surprised it was a bit punchier then the PeachTree running 96k files. Same song over and over bt reviled a bit more clarity and seemed to allow more of what was recorded to be heard. This IMO should not be from Dac DAC but from some reason or another it is.
4)Cambridge DAc Magic Plus- This Dac has a sound all of it's own. It kinda sounded like a system upgrade. Even Compared to the Dac Magic , the Plus had a very open and analog sound. It was very organic to say the least. I really enjoyed it.

Now what really Intrigued me was the Internal DAC on our SC-68. If you don't know , the new Pioneer Elite SC-68 has a internal USB DAC. This is the first of it's kind as I have never seen this on any pre or receiver.
On top of that the receiver actually sounds amazing. I have a pair of Maggie 1.7's connected for just 2 channel and ran some 24/192 stuff and was blown away on the sound I was getting. What an amazing receiver. This is something that really shocked me and now I'm seriously considering getting one.
Currently for my HT , I have a old SC-07 from 2008-9. it's been in my system longer then anything else I can remember. I replaced a Rotel RSP-1068 with it as a pre then later started using it as a stand alone receiver. The internal amps I felt where that good.
I'm running Definitive Technology Mythos ST fronts with a Mythos 10 center and surround channels. I really enjoy them but I have had the upgrade bug for quite some time. I'm considering replacing them with Klipsch Reference or B&W Cdm series. I think this receiver would be a very sweet replacement for my current SC-07. I have been considering going back to separates but as good as this new Elite SC is , I'm really thinking this might be a great double duty piece.

[wkhanna]

Dan, (PewterTA) just finished a total rebuild of my system.
It is all full of shiny cooper & blue pieces now.
This thing is quiet as a thief in the Louvre & fast as Belichick after a loss.

4 TB RAID for my music & all the software goodies to make it sound oh so sweet!

Thanks Dan!

[mjb]

Looks good Bill. I gave up on DIY PC's and got a Mac Mini with bluetooth keyboard and mouse to drive it from the sofa. You can stream to an iPad/iPhone or use them as a remote controls. I think it looks really slick next to my Classé gear too!

[kcsun]

The new silver mac mini must look really cool with your Classe gear
have you posted a pic??
kc

[wkhanna]

Yes, please !

We want a photo!!!

[mjb]

I'm out of town now, but I can post a pic when I'm back - but just imagine a Mac Mini sat on top of an SSP-800... you almost can't see it, but when you look, it has the same lines! I use a 12 inch HDMI cable into the processor, and thats it!

[wkhanna]

....... got a Mac Mini with bluetooth keyboard and mouse to drive it from the sofa.

Dan has me set up so I have wireless control from my laptop or my Samsung tablet.

[ellisr63]

I have been using JRiver Media Center on my PC and just downloaded the Gizmo app for my Samsung Galaxy note and it works nicely controlling JRiver as a remote or playing movies and music over the phone.

[wkhanna]

I tried the JRiver demo.
It worked fine.
I could tell no difference in sound quality between the two.
I could see how if you had lots of video, photos & music it could be V nice.
Samsung apps are nice too, since most are free.

I stll like Foobar better for just handling music, though.

[PewterTA]

Looks like someone is happy to have their computer back!!!! hee hee. Great Pictures Bill, looking good, and sounding and running even better! Still irritates me that hot-swap backplane died, it'd look better with that all cleaned up, but oh well it works! I think I should've done more cleanup with the wires though... My server case looks empty compared to yours... and I have 36TB more! ha ha



..and some day you'll have 8U (or 44 HDs) of goodness! Course by then that same thing will fit on something the size of your thumbnail..... lol



I have to agree... I definitely am a fan of foobar for music... might not always be the easiest to use, but I've figured out how it works pretty well. Yes it might be nice to have some of the "nicer" features of Jriver and I would probably go to that at some point. I'd really like the XBMC group to put forth an effort with the music cataloging and wow... then nothing would beat that for an almost perfect all media renderer.

[Hdale85]

Well the next version of xbmc has a completely new from the ground up audio structure called AudioEngine.

[PewterTA]

Yep, I've already played around with AudioEngine.... It's nice.

[mjb]

The new silver mac mini must look really cool with your Classe gear
have you posted a pic??

As promised, a pic of the very small Mac Mini sitting on top of a much larger SSP-800.

[Chris D]

Wow, what a great system!

[Dmantis]

As promised, a pic of the very small Mac Mini sitting on top of a much larger SSP-800.

[ATTACH=CONFIG]21408[/ATTACH]

Beautiful system , very very nice.

[wkhanna]

V Nice, Mike!

[aud19]

No doubt, that's some nice kit!