Sonically, would a Classe' CAP-2100 outperform my Rotel RC-1090/RB1092 combo OR would I better off replacing one of my current components with something else? My speakers are B&W N804 & ASW800 sub.
Opinions welcomed....
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Originally posted by minerSonically, would a Classe' CAP-2100 outperform my Rotel RC-1090/RB1092 combo OR would I better off replacing one of my current components with something else? My speakers are B&W N804 & ASW800 sub.
I'll try to listen to the stuff in a couple of weeks, but I think I'll do blind testing to avoid influences from look/feel/perception.- Bottom
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Originally posted by minerThanks for your inputs. For cabling I am using Catcables Kingcats which did improve over my previous straightwire symphony ICs. Unfortunately my dealer does not have my pre/amp combo set up to A/B with the Classe' CAP-2100.- Bottom
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Originally posted by Mig17Rotel is more dynamic than Classe- Bottom
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Originally posted by minerAre you serious? B&W uses Classe for their speaker testing - Abbery Road Studios uses Classe for their front end on B&Ws. At this time I am not sure Ican justify the outlay fo rthe improvements. After selling my current front end I expect my net outlay would be $2500
And still: do a/b testing with the Classé gear. What does it help if you spend a lot of money and don't get a REAL benefit? I don't say, you won't get, I'm just not sure whether you really get a benefit and whether it justifies the expense. Probably spending the same amount of money in new CDs and DVDs will give you more pleasure ... :P- Bottom
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Originally posted by hifiguymiThe CAP-2100 is now $5,500.00US (retail on a new one).- Bottom
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Originally posted by cugYeah, totally sucks. I think that this piece is way overpriced. "Audiophiles" are just willing enough to spend that much money. And there are too many with too much money.
Eric- Bottom
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Originally posted by hifiguymiI don't think it's overpriced. The CAP-2100 is the exact same amp as the CA-2100 with the CP-500 preamp built in.
Originally posted by hifiguymiIf anything it's a deal compared to its line mates.
And I'm not a cheapo guy - I pay decent money for decent equipment. I only think that the gain you get is not nearly on par with the price difference.- Bottom
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Originally posted by cugI only think that the gain you get is not nearly on par with the price difference.
Eric- Bottom
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Originally posted by hifiguymiSomeone spending $4000.00 usually isn't the same person as the one spending $8000.00. It's twice the money (and usually a similar increment in performance) and a totally different price bracket.
The increment in performance is normally smaller the higher the prices of the equipment you compare. Saying you might get 20% more for 100% price increment, but only 30% more for a 200% price increment.
This is everywhere the case and nothing to be worried about from your perspective as a sales person. The Hi-Fi world is just the only one not being honest about that. It would be far more honest to handle it the same way the car industry does: "the increment from a Mercedes SLK to a small Porsche might not be double the performance with double the price, but it is sooooo much cooler to drive the Porsche ..."
But Hi-Fi-world is often ridiculous in its claims. And I'm not talking about snake oil, I talk about products that do deliver a performance increase but they are not talking about WHY price differences exist:
- Rotel uses standard modules for their amplifiers. These can be massproduced on a budget.
- Classé sells just a fraction of the numbers Rotel does, therefore production and development broken down to sold units are WAY HIGHER without giving the same increment in performance.
- Because of more units sold ALL parts are cheaper, the case, even the power cord.
- Classé probably uses some very specific components and the same "number of units sold effects price" effects the components and therefore the end result.
But still, many people claim that get twice the performance for equipment twice as expensive - which is just not true. The truth is, that getting to the last 10% always takes another 90% effort. Or more.
In my work (software engineer), there is the saying that it takes 90% of the time to finish 90% of the project and another 90% of the time to finish the last 10%. And the same is true (or worse) for audio performance.
Okay, this reflects my opinion, but not only mine and is based on some solid experience. I'm not pulling that out somewhere ...- Bottom
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cug , while your points are valid , the manufacturer will also source cheaper parts based on larger production runs (generally-not intended to be case-specific). Saving $.30 on a part is minimal when you sell 500 units per year-if you sell 5000 units per year the profit increases significantly.
Some manufacturers are not publicly owned , which makes them less beholden to accountants.
This is everywhere the case and nothing to be worried about from your perspective as a sales person. The Hi-Fi world is just the only one not being honest about that. It would be far more honest to handle it the same way the car industry does: "the increment from a Mercedes SLK to a small Porsche might not be double the performance with double the price, but it is sooooo much cooler to drive the Porsche ..."
Having said all that , your post was very good. It offered a lot of insight into the business. :TLee
Marantz PM7200-RIP
Marantz PM-KI Pearl
Schiit Modi 3
Marantz CD5005
Paradigm Studio 60 v.3- Bottom
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Originally posted by AlaricUsing the car analogy , speed costs money-how fast ya wanna go? (and second place is the first loser) :lol:
And again: the last 10% are the hardest to achieve. Like, how many people in the world can run 100m in 11 seconds? We had even one in my class at school. Now, how many can run the same distance in 10 seconds? And that's just the ten percent increase too.
The one thing I'd really like to see in Hi-Fi or High-End world is more honesty. From manufacturers, sales persons (okay Guido, dream on), reviewers and even owners.- Bottom
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The one thing I'd really like to see in Hi-Fi or High-End world is more honesty.Lee
Marantz PM7200-RIP
Marantz PM-KI Pearl
Schiit Modi 3
Marantz CD5005
Paradigm Studio 60 v.3- Bottom
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