RSP-1098 Question

**grit** · 12 July 2006, 06:36 Wednesday

The large/small setup determine if the lower end of the signal gets sent to a subwoofer. In "large", the full signal goes to the speaker, and nothing goes to the subwoofer. In "small", the signal is crossed over to the subwoofer at the range which you specify (eg, 80 hz is a typical THX requirement). So, if you have no sub installed, you'll not hear anything after the crossover.

Problems I can think of that would result in limited bass:
- not enough power from an amplifier
- bi-wire set up incorrectly
- trim set to soften/eliminate bass

**len73** · 12 July 2006, 06:48 Wednesday

Hi Garett,

First of all thank you for your answer !

Looking at your suggestions :

1) Power-amp is a RMB-1075, so not sure this could be a power-problem ?!
2) Bi-wire - I will check again my installation, but do not think this may be the problem
3) "Trim set" is not that clear to me ! Could you please develop a bit ?

Thanks

Len

**PewterTA** · 12 July 2006, 10:42 Wednesday

Trim is the HF & LF contour on the 1098, it's in the menu (or press the TONE button on the remote -- under the sliding cover).

First thing I'd try is swaping the biwiring (High and Low) on a speaker and see what that does, that way it definitely removes the possibility that there's something with the wires.

ALSO, make sure that you check to make sure there's NO cross connections on your speakers, putting them out of phase, that will KILL bass. IE... one speaker is positive to positive and negative to negative, while the other is positive to negative and positive to negative. It only takes one set of wires being crossed to ruin it all! I can't tell you how many times I've done that by pure accident and have no clue why I did it (knowing I always connect things in a certain order)...so it CAN happen.

Second thing I'd do is remove one of the bi-wires and replace it with a normal wire to one speaker and see what that does (remember to put in your bracket or whatever to allow both of your terminals to get the power).

The 1098 either is or isn't going to play play a sound not just cut out the bass (unless you have the LF contour all the way to min. The 1075 will push out whatever sound is given to it, it won't seperate the highs/mids and lows. One thing I noticed with my 1098 is the bass did seem a little weak the first month I had it, but it eventually came in super strong. Mind you, I still HAD bass, just seemed less than what i was used to until it "broke in."

I'd just have a tough time believing it's not residing in how your cables are set up.

There is a slight chance it's something with the 1098... a good way to test this is to run a DD source through it, see if there's bass, then run an analog (by-pass) source through it and see if you get bass. If you get bass from the analog bypass mode, then there could indeed be something wrong with the digital board in the 1098. This isn't a typical thing, it either doesn't play, or does though.

I will say you do have everything set correctly on your 1098 in the setup menu.

Your room could be killing the bass from your speakers (though if it's all set up how it was before you got the 1098/1075...then maybe there is something wrong...but having lots of glass and hard wood floor KILLS acoustics. Try to get some curtains for the glass and a couple rugs for the hard wood floor and see how that does.

With both of the Rotel units being new, you might have a lack of bass due to the "break-in" period they seem to need. I know when I got my 1095 I felt there was a lack of bass in it, luckily I had the 1095 for 6 months before I got the 1098... had I had both at the same time, I might have thought the same thing. Keep the units playing for a couple days/week and see if it starts to get better (another option).

**len73** · 12 July 2006, 11:04 Wednesday

Thank you so much PewterTA ! ;x(

So the break-in period could also be an option...Sounds very interessting, as all my installation is brand new, from the electronics, to the cables and even the speakers...

Well.
I will first try with the cables and check if everything is ok (phase check). Then, as you suggest it, I will use another simple cable to see what is going on.

I will let you know after these firsts tests !

Cheers and thanks again for your help !

Len

**Kevin D** · 12 July 2006, 21:23 Wednesday

Originally posted by len73

What trouble me most is that there is NO difference when I switch from Large to Small speakers in my RSP-1098 Setup ! WHY ? I mean, highs and meds a absolutely great but there is no bass !

Len

To add, the 40hz setting you set it to only enters in when you have your speakers set to small. Honestly, unless you have gobs of power and true full range speakers, I wouldn't expect much of a difference between LARGE and SMALL/40hz.

Kevin D.

**len73** · 13 July 2006, 02:07 Thursday

Kevin,

I agree with you. My only concern is that Monitor Audio GS20 are TRUE full-range speakers (By the way they sounded fabulous at my dealer) !

Is there then any other tuning you would recommend ?

I played yesterday evening a special bass-cd and even it is not really what I would expect, bass seems to come with the time (you were also right PewterTA). Still had no time to check the cables proprely...Will do it this evening !

"I'll be back..."

Thank you all for your great support !

Len

**grit** · 13 July 2006, 03:56 Thursday

I'd really have to see the speakers to tell, but my guess at this point is that unless there's a wiring SNAFU, the 1075 won't kick enough power out to control inefficient speakers.

I ran B&W 700 series (703's up front) with my 1075, and had NO problems whatsoever. I upgraded my speakers. The test was between B&W 803S's and Aerial Acoustic 7b's. The Aerials are far less efficient than the B&Ws. The 803's COULD have survived with the 1075, but I'd not have been happy about it. The Aerial's simply couldn't make it with the 1075. I prefer the Aerial's (similar in sound to the Monitors), and thus upgraded my amp to the 1095.

Most of the Aerial's resistance is in the 4 ohm range. Quick amp lesson (which was news to me) - 100 watts at 8 ohms = 200 watts at 4 ohms. MOST amps won't double power, so you lose some. The 1095 does 200 watts at 8 ohms, but only 330 watts at 4 ohms (so, equivalent to 165 watts for 8 ohms). The 1075 does 120 watts at 8 ohms, but drops to 200 watts at 4 ohms (so, equivalent of 100 watts at 8 ohms).

My *guess* is that your Monitors need more power to control those woofers. Any idea what amp was being used when you demoed them?

**len73** · 13 July 2006, 06:25 Thursday

Very good question...

It was a RB-1080, so well 200Watts/8 Ohms !

Maybe should I go for an upgrade !? My dealer could maybe accept an exchange as the amp is just about 6 days old !?

Do you think an upgrade from 1075 to 1095 worth is ?

**Aussie Geoff** · 13 July 2006, 10:06 Thursday

Originally posted by len73

Do you think an upgrade from 1075 to 1095 worth is ?

Yes... In your case - ves... The other choice (which I went for) was to upgrade my RMB-1075 to the RMB-1077 - same power as the RMB-1075 but sounds at least as powerful as the RMB-1095.. However this is more expensive (but 7 channels so you can bi-amp the fronts for stereo or move to a 7.1 system. Some of our members (including my co-moderator Kevin D) have upgraded from an RMB-1095 to the RMB-1077 (but he's a special case

)

Geoff

Fixed a model # typo, and what do you mean special case??

**WI Rotel** · 13 July 2006, 12:57 Thursday

One big reason you may have no bass is you have no sub, thus, unless all the speakers are set to large your bass output is getting routed into electronic oblivion! Remember in all speakers set to small the bass is routed to the sub. For the time being set the sub to NO SUB. In my setup with BW xt4 the front's are large but I gave them a cutoff of 40hz all other speakers are set to 80. Works great for me.

**grit** · 13 July 2006, 15:54 Thursday

Originally posted by len73

Very good question...

It was a RB-1080, so well 200Watts/8 Ohms !

Maybe should I go for an upgrade !? My dealer could maybe accept an exchange as the amp is just about 6 days old !?

Do you think an upgrade from 1075 to 1095 worth is ?

I'd hope he'd be willing to let you do that, and yes, it's worth the upgrade in this case.

**len73** · 20 July 2006, 09:36 Thursday

Me again

I just had an interesting proposals (indecent ?) from my dealer regarding an upgrade from my current RMB-1075 (brand new with 2 years warranty !) to a RMB-1095 (used).

My dealer is currently upgrading his system with RB-1092 units (lucky guy !) and made me a proposal to take back my current RMB-1075 with a -15%, and to sell his used RMB-1095 for about 2000 us$, with 1 year warranty.

So, what to do ? I am not really kean on buying used electronics. In the case of such an amp, could it be any fatigue or power-loss with the time ? What should I care about ?

What you guys would you do in this situation ?

Sorry, but I need fast answers as this porposal is really short in time !

Thank you so much for your help !

Cheers,

Len

**ICEMAN70** · 20 July 2006, 11:04 Thursday

Hi len73,

If i where you, i would stick with your RMB-1075 for a while longer and later on maybe upgrade to the RB-1092. Keep the $2000 U.S in your pocket for now and put extra Cash on top later and get the 1092. I really like the RMB-1075 and the next upgrade i will be making is going to be the new RB-1092.

Good luck with your decision.

**PewterTA** · 20 July 2006, 11:38 Thursday

You can buy a used 1095 for about $1350 US.... So paying $2000 for a used 1095 isn't worth it. I paid closer to the used price on my NEW 1095.

**len73** · 20 July 2006, 15:54 Thursday

All right !

I think it is clear to me now. I will keep the 1075 for the moment and will later upgrade to a digital. So I will enjoy the change, as I will be more able to note a difference (my current amp is about 2 weeks old !!)

On the other side, I will recieve soon (end of this month) an excellent sub (Marting Logan !) and will therefore relieve a part of the energy from the 1075...

I think this is the best way to follow right know.

Thank you all for your help !

Cheers,

Len

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