Denon AVR-4306 vs 1068 and 1075 Combo

[nikos]

Hello group,

I'm a newbie here and some (most) have read my recent threads.
I appreciate the warm welcome so far.
I've been on the verge of buying Rotel since last year this time and I was about to place my order (I found a dealer that will give me over 20% off retail) when I read about the AVR-4306.

I'd like to also clarify that I've been following the threads about top Mid-Fi to Hi-Fi classification of Rotel....debate (debacle).

I'd find myself voting that Rotel is on the Higher end of Mid-Fi or entry Hi-Fi...yet not to the absolute Hi-Fi standard of the big boys, yet offer most of the value my pocket can afford.

With that said....I'm still a newbie within this community. I don't have personal experience from equipment I've owned in above categories and having an opinion is almost irrelevant.

That's why I'm seeking advise from you *the group* since you've been around different setups and equipment. I also I'm aware that what it really comes down to, is what sounds good and right to me and other peoples personal opinions might be subjective to their environements and not apply to mine.

There is still the saying that "Ignorance is Bliss", and if you don't know any better you'll be happy where you are...

With all these clauses in effect...I'm still seeking your exprert advise in the comperative advantages/disadvantages between the above setup.

I don't want to make this a seperates comparison ...so maybe I should be comparing this to 1067. I was about ready to purchase the 1068 & 1075 combo since I understand the advantages of separates...and not the 1067...yet the AVR-4306 Multimedia features only come in this combo box.

I listen to mostly mp3's of newly recorded web radio shows of Electronic Music from around the world on a weekly basis. Music is a passion of mine.
In the US it's the only avenue of finding up to date tracks and current music in the genres that interest me. I have tons (thousands of hours of mp3)!!! Most of the time the tracks are even unreleased...
I'm also trying to use this setup as the centre of a my HT.
This will include a Panasonic AE-900 projector used for both DVD and cable TV and soon to add B&W speakers for the complete experience.
The features that really stand out from the Denon are the 3x multi room, being able to stream audio from my PC, plus the Ipod connectivity, 130Wx is not too shabby either.

I apologize for the long post maybe I shouldnt' have posted this after a rough night at the bars...or maybe that's what got my tongue loose

How do these compare in overall sound quality?? Am I going to be that ahead of the curve owning the Rotel equipment? or are the features mentioned above worth it??

I appreciate your thoughts on this. Please feel free to add anything I might have not mentioned.

Nikos

[eelco74]

It all depends on what sources you listen to and how good your speakers are.

I both had Denon and Rotel equipment. I have upgraded from a Denon 3801 (only used as a pre-amp) to a RSP-1068. Mainly because the Stereo performance of the Denon was bad, and with SA-CD even worse. I have a pair of high quality JMlab monitors, and you can hear just about any fault in the connected gear.

So my upgrade to a RSP-1068 to complement my RB-981/RB-985MKII, was mainly to improve Stereo and SA-CD playback.

So of your major source is MP3, than the 1067 of 4306 might not make any difference. Since the major improvement is in 2-channel playback.

Unless you have a big room or ineffecient speakers, the 4306 will run out of power. I found most Denon receivers to have a mximum of dynamics, especially in 6.1 setup. I simply lacks power when all channels are driven at the same time.

[Dmantis]

From you post I think the Denon is more suited for you. Needs are whats important when selecting gear.

Listening to Mp3 you don't need better sounding gear then Denon. hell I think you could go with the Denon 3806 and be cool. Spend the extra money on more music or improving your home theater with a better dvd player or cables.

Rotel doesn't have cool features, compared to Denon it doesn't have any. people who buy Rotel are looking for the "better sound quality" , not the coolest features.

Good luck with your quest. I see a Denon in your future.

Mantis

[shadow]

MP 3 is so low rez that any receiver will do the job.

[grit]

Wow, lesse... Yeah. the Denon amp (despite it's numbers of 130 watts) isn't really going to drive speakers very well, and probably not B&W's. I had a similar Denon and a dealer tried to tell me I could drive B&W 803's on it. So I took them home and they sounded WORSE than my Boston Acoustics VR floor-standing speakers. Morale - match the electronics to the speakers.

As for mp3 format, a better DAC will give you a better sound (assuming you're transfering the music to the stereo in digital format). So the Rotel will help there too. As for lossless formats vs mp3s, I don't have too much knowledge, but I do know that mp3 can lose a lot of quality depending on the compression. You'd have to tell us more about how your mp3s are encoded to get a more accurate estimate on that apsect.

[soundhound]

System synergy resides between the lines on all above posts. I believe all 3 posts,
just chiming in because of the "dvd player or cables" comment. Putting silver cables between a Yorx reciever and an Apex dvd player would be a complete waste of money.
As has been allready said if one is looking for features, convenience, thats a path of its own, if your'e looking for "sound quality", thats another path.

[DelRay]

System synergy resides between the lines on all above posts. I believe all 3 posts,
just chiming in because of the "dvd player or cables" comment. Putting silver cables between a Yorx reciever and an Apex dvd player would be a complete waste of money.
As has been allready said if one is looking for features, convenience, thats a path of its own, if your'e looking for "sound quality", thats another path.

Agreed, but why is that other path so damn expensive. :rofl:
Isn't the Denon more $ than the 1068/1075 combo?

[soundhound]

Is it really DelRay? Shoot, that makes it all that much easier of a descision......The finer things in life have a pricetag, hell, Iv'e been married to mine for 15+ years.

[garyandroes]

Hello gary here I don't want to throw anybody off track but we are comparing Denon to the other this will be short and just stumbled on . I use the denon 2805 which is denons till now I think most successful AV. I think I think it sounds better than the 3806 . What the heck could be my ears are shot . No I really believe and feel that the 2805 in my opinion sounds better than the 3806 . well I hope that don't kink the conversation in anyway
GARY

[aud19]

Pretty simple if you want sound quality, go Rotel. If you want features, go Denon. If you can wait, there should be upgraded pre/pro's coming with the likes of HDMI, room correction etc though I can't promise you it's this spring.... One option could be to get a less expensive 2805 and the 1075 (or something along those lines) and then upgrade to the 1068's replacement when it becomes available...?

[eelco74]

Hello gary here I don't want to throw anybody off track but we are comparing Denon to the other this will be short and just stumbled on . I use the denon 2805 which is denons till now I think most successful AV. I think I think it sounds better than the 3806 . What the heck could be my ears are shot . No I really believe and feel that the 2805 in my opinion sounds better than the 3806 . well I hope that don't kink the conversation in anyway
GARY

Aclutally I had a 3801, and tried the 3802. It sounded a bit less powerfull. So I waited untill the 3803. I tried it, and the 3801 blew it away. So there is no guirantee for a better sound, If you buy a newer model.

That was the moment I descided to go for the 1066. By the time I got the money, the 1068 was on the horizon. This was probalby the best upgrade I have done.

[Dmantis]

System synergy resides between the lines on all above posts. I believe all 3 posts,
just chiming in because of the "dvd player or cables" comment. Putting silver cables between a Yorx reciever and an Apex dvd player would be a complete waste of money.
As has been allready said if one is looking for features, convenience, thats a path of its own, if your'e looking for "sound quality", thats another path.

Not sure I follow you here. I get the point about using cheap gear and silver wire but is that what your saying here? Seems like he is going to get into a nice receiver or seperates. Good wire is nessary in my opnion. Plus a better DVD player is always nice when your into Home theater. no brand names I said. My point was if he goes with the Denon avr3806 , he would have more money left over then the avr4806 or Rotel seperates. Also that exta money could go towards B&W speakers he wants. Just my opnon here.

mantis

[soundhound]

The point taken was just that simple Dmantis.

[nikos]

Re:

Thanks for everyones input...
You've answered my questions and provoked new ones.

In a nutshell I got that...

Rotel has superior sound.
Rotel has inferior features.

Some of you reffering to costs are not quite right.

The AVR-4306 (all-in-one) Retails for about $2000
The 1067 about $2200
The 1068 $1700 + RMB-1075 $1000 = $2700
(keep in mind I have a source for Rotel at about 20% off)

Also the superior sound is found mainly in Stereo mode. It's much closer in surround modes... (I guess still better with Rotel but marginally).

The features that are intriuging are the networking (streaming mp3 from PC) ability of the Denon, ipod connectivity, plus the analog to HDMI , multiroom etc etc... (basically features not found on ANY other denon or any other brand/price range that I know of for that matter) Thats why I was picking on this Denon model and not any other cheaper units.

If the above statement that the superior sound is found in Stereo...I did the math and I could get the AVR-4306 for $2k, plus a 1070 130x2 $700 and spend the same as the 1068+1075 combo of $2700. And use the 1070 for Stereo!

It's unfortunate that most of my music comes from mp3 usually 128/192 kbps. Does anyone play on their system mp3's that reside on their PC's?
How do you achieve this? Moded xbox? other peripheral? Will this affect sound quality compared to playing directly from PC as in the case of the 4306? or am i overanalyzing this...mp3 is mp3 and it will sound the same?

Does anyone have more info than aud19 or would like to make a wild guess when Rotel is going to release the next gen 1068 and what are the realistic upgrades (features) it will offer? (I've been looking at the wishilist thread)

I know I'm going to have to audition both before my final decision and unfortunately I doubt I'll find anyone around my area that carries both brands to do a side by side comparison.

Nikos

On a side note does anyone know if Denon has the same ability as the Rotel as far as power conversion goes? All I have to do is change a jumper on the board to go from 120/230?? I must have this capability and it might make my decision to stick with Rotel much easier.

[lvhung]

If you bought denon and it'd take you many years to re-find the right way again !

[DelRay]

For some reason I thought you were referring to the 4806, not the 4306. My bad. The 4806 is about $3500 while the 4306 is about $2000.

[nikos]

I talked today to my Rotel dealer....and also stopped in a Denon dealer.

The Denon dealer didn't even know the model I was talking about (no slack given-even though it just was released in November) and insisted it doesn't exist, even though I kept naming off all its features... he finally admited I was right after looking it up.

Even if it makes me sound cheap...I hate to pay retail on electronics, maybe because I know what kind of margins they work with... yet he wouldn't move at all from retail. I'm on a very strict budget, so every penny counts.

Well the Rotel dealer put me to ease when i explained my dilemma....
He advised me to wait !!! and said that at CES (first week of 06) Rotel is showing off their new separates and one of them is a video switcher(I think). I had mistakenly understood that they will only be offering the new mono amps.

So I shouldnt have to waste my time with Denon just to get HDMI now.

He expected that the new gear will be available at the stores soonafter without a long inbetween period ( I hope the chatter over HDMI 1.2 doesn't mess this up...hurry up and finalize 1.2 if you haven't already )

So...I'm not going to sell out to Denon. Instead I'll get my Panasonic AE-900 projector now, to keep me going...and keep my eyes peeled here at the forum for KevinD's and others posts of what they see first hand at CES.

Anybody have any more info on whats to come??


Nikos

[Kevin D]

You sound so reassured and I hate to drop this on you, but did he tell you the price of the video switcher? It's most likely going to be around $2000.

Kevin D.

[Shane Martin]

Considering CES is next month, you are best off not purchasing anything until then. Atleast then you know what is coming for the next year and can plan accordingly that way buyers remorse doesn't set in.

Going Aud's route of a mix of Rotel and Denon might do the trick. The 3806 has the room correction you want(audyssey) + hdmi but lacks streaming ability that the 4306 has. Then again you could get a Roku soundbridge and wire it in to your system and be done with it and have money left.

3806+ amp is a good idea but I'd wait until after CES to make up your mind. Other manufacturers will have stuff out and you can see what appeals to you and your budget.