Setup Prolbem: 1066, DVR, and no sound from non-dolby channels

[chrisbr40]

I've found this problem posted before but didn't seen resolution.

Setting up newly purchased 1066 with Comcast DVR and 5.1 speaker systems. Default surround mode is DPLII. I get sound from HiDef channels but no sound from standard channels.

Advice appreciated.

[Kevin D]

There might be something in the setup menu to set the digital out to allow PCM and Dolby. IT's probably set to just output Dolby only.

Kevin D.

[TimGRA]

I am running the same comcast with a 1068. You need to hook up some analog cables from your tv to the......either....I think the processor. The reason you are not getting any sound from other channels is becuase the are not digital. Hence the reason for Pro Logic in the analog mode. Make sense? I do not want to pull all of my stuff out to find where I routed the analog cables. If you need me to though I will.

tim

You know what.....? There are analog outs on the back of the comcast. Analog comcast out, to the processor in, and there is your analog source for sound. Yep, I think that is it.

[chrisbr40]

Comcast Update

Tim,

Thanks for reply and sorry for delay. I did have analog audio cables connected along with digital (I've tried both SPDIF and TOSS). It turns out Comcast service in my area is analog from channels 2-99 and digital >100. If I have both digital and analog cables connected I get no audio on analog channels. I've swapped out the Motorola/PVR box but it didn't help.

I have the 1066 configured for digital audio as default. I think what is supposed to happen is that the prepro checks for Dolby/digital signal first and its absence it trys the analog. That isn't happening in my case and I suspect the 1066. I've contacted Rotel to see if this is a known problem with a resolution.

[TimGRA]

Do you have a hi-fi OUT on the tv. Try to send the analog from that to your processor and see if it will defualt to pro-logic. Let me know and if need be I will pull my stuff out and give you a for sure on the route. I know it is somthing simple.

The wife is watching a show or I would go do it now.

I know in my 1068 I have to set up a defualt for digital and analog on the same input. Is yours the same?

[chrisbr40]

No Hi Fi out on the TV (its a commercial plasma display with no tuner/no speakers).

On the 1066 you have three choices for default input; analog, digital optical, or digital coaxial.

Here's verbage from 1066 manual on Input Setup:

"...When a DIGITAL input is selected, the unit will check for a digital signal...if no digital signal is present, the unit will automatically revert to the analog input...when ANALOG input is selected, the unit will not access a digital signal, even though one may be present...assigning a digital input as default (with its autosensing) is the preferred configuration"

I

[bimmer528]

chris, I just discovered last night that when I hit a local channel with no sound, I hit menu on the rotel to bring up the osd, then I hit menu again to turn it off and boom, i have sound. Then when I change the channel and go back, no sound again.

[Bostonears]

I've got the Comcast (Motorola) DVR running into a 1068 and do not experience problems such as you describe. The DVR (normally) converts the audio from all channels (including analog channels) to digital output. Under normal circumstances, you definitely do not need to hook up any analog cables to get this combination to work correctly.

-When the system is in the state where you have no audio, if you power off the DVR for a few seconds (via the power button, do not pull the plug!!) then power it back on, does the audio come on? If it does, the problem is probably in the DVR, not the Rotel. The DVR might not be sending the correct header information with the digital audio output.

-Did the problem just start occurring recently, or has it always worked that way? Possibly the DVR received a firmware update (which happens automatically and unbeknownst to you through the cable).

You can try this procedure (courtesy of Scanpa on www.dvrchatter.com), which reportedly fixes some digital audio output problems.

Go to the DVR user settings menu. To do this, press Power off, then within two seconds, press Menu. You should see a menu that you do not normally see, with a white background, and various settings. Note your TV type, Output, and 4:3 Override settings at the top. (You will need to re-enter them in a minute.)

Go down to the last item on the page, RESTORE DEFAULTS, and select it.

Then re-enter your TV type and output settings at the top of the page.
Press Power to exit from the setting menu, then press Power again to turn the DVR back on.

Apparently the DVR has a hidden audio setting that is an underlying part of the user settings menu, and restoring the defaults fixes things if the setting gets screwed up after a firmware download.

Hopefully this straightens out the problem, and trying it can't hurt.

[TimGRA]

I have both a digital and anolog coming from the STB. It moves back and forth between the two as I change the channels. I am now wondering if I even need the analog. The processor is not going to change anolog to digital is it?

[Shane Martin]

You don't need the analog cables hooked up to be honest. I do not need them on my 6412 DVR and I leave it connected via a coaxial digital cable all the time. If I had a good guess the Motorola box converts the analog sound to digital.

[TimGRA]

I do notice that when I change from digital to analog channels, the analog channels are much louder. I will try to unhook the analog and see. I am using an optical cable. Maybe I will go get a good coax digital cable.

[chrisbr40]

I'll try your suggestions when I get home. One thing I should clarify; Comcast says that the analog service on lower channels (2-99) & digital on higher channels is not true for all locals and that eventually our local service will convert to 100% digital. Is it possible that your area is all digital?

In reference to your statement about the PVR converting analog to digital, the following is from Motorola support in reference to my 6412 PVR:

"The analog channels do not carry a Dolby signal and therefore no signal is transmitted through SPDIF output. The SPDIF output only works on channels that have Dolby audio (All high definition channels and most digital channels, analog will only have baseband audio)"

I'm assume this is also true for TOSS.

[TimGRA]

OK.

I just pulled everything out and here is what I have

Analog out from STB to TV so (the wife) can watch tv without the processor being on.

Digital TOSS out from STB to processor. It reads both the HI-DEF channels in DD and then coverts the analog to my defualt Pro Logic II C.

The digital is at 48K on the processor, 1068, while the analog comes up 32K. The analog comes on much louder when I change channels. Anyway I can change the volume disparity? Future upgrade maybe?

Coax digital cable to processor?

[Bostonears]

I'll try your suggestions when I get home. One thing I should clarify; Comcast says that the analog service on lower channels (2-99) & digital on higher channels is not true for all locals and that eventually our local service will convert to 100% digital. Is it possible that your area is all digital?

I've been using this set up since last November without any problems, and Comcast only started the digital simulcast for a few of the lower numbered channels in the last month. I get digital audio output from the 6412 DVR over all the analog channels all the time. Using the diagnostic menus in the DVR, I can confirm that the analog channels are indeed broadcast in analog, and I guarantee that I get audio for every one of them with only the TOSLINK optical cable hooked up.

In reference to your statement about the PVR converting analog to digital, the following is from Motorola support in reference to my 6412 PVR: "The analog channels do not carry a Dolby signal and therefore no signal is transmitted through SPDIF output. The SPDIF output only works on channels that have Dolby audio (All high definition channels and most digital channels, analog will only have baseband audio)"

I concur that the analog signals as broadcast from Comcast do not carry Dolby audio, but the 6412 is capable of converting the analog audio to a matrix-encoded (ProLogic) Dolby signal output over SPDIF and TOSLINK. (Technically, this is not the same as "Dolby Digital", even though it is Dolby and it is digital.) Motorola's statement does not correspond to what I am experiencing with my Comcast/Motorola 6412 DVR. In fact, it's patently absurd, because the DVR has to digitize the audio from analog channels in order to store it on the hard drive. (Since this DVR buffers all programs to the hard drive, even when you're watching analog channels, you're watching a digitized version of them, and more importantly for this issue, hearing a digitized version of the audio.) Furthermore, the digital outputs from the 6412 can output 2-channel PCM, which is not Dolby-encoded. In fact, one of the reported bugs for the 6412 is that it sometimes outputs 2-channel PCM (like CD audio) when it is supposed to be outputting Dolby.

[bimmer528]

The problem is in the rotel not the dvr.

Tried those steps in the menu of the dvr, no luck.

[bimmer528]

omg I revisited that thread Bostonears posted and just hit that little SWAP button on my comcast dvr. I now have sound on all channels all the time.

YES!

[TimGRA]

What SWAP button?

[TimGRA]

Bostonears,

I mentioned a volume issue above. Does your 1068 do the same thing? Analog stations are much louder than digital when you switch back and forth?

tim

[bimmer528]

There is a pip swap button located on the very bottom of the comcast remote. Just hit that button and you will have sound on locals. It's the next day, my system has been shut off.. back on again and still sound

[chrisbr40]

I tried restoring values on the 6412 as suggested - non change.

I've corresponded with Rotel tech support and the put me on to something. Based on my description, the specualted that the STB was sending a digital trace signal which would trigger the 1066's digital recognition circuitry. The evidence of this was supposed to be the red digitial indicator on the 1066 display panel when listenign to an analog channel.

Sure enough, when I tried an analog channel the 1066 showed a flashing DOLBY DIGITAL signal. I tried hitting the 2 channel button and you see PCM initial on the scrolling banner which then quickly reverts to DOLBY PROLOGIC II. Also, I when I turn up the volume you can hear a faint 2 beat audible signal on the speakers.

Rotel support suggests getting a different STB/PVR (not acceptable to me) or using a seperate INPUT for the analog channels with analog cables (cumbersome). I'm going to pursue this with Comcast and/or Motorola.

I'd appreciate hearing from anyone who's got a different diagnosis.

Thanks