Is rsp-1098 Worth Twice The Price of rsp-1066?

[gostan]

The 1098's are now available. Does anybody think that the rsp-1098 is worth twice the price of an rsp-1066. I can purchase a 1066 for about $1300. The 1098 will run more than double that price. I was going to upgrade to a 1066, but I am thinking about waiting things out with my rsx-1055 and going for the 1098 later. This way, I will not lose as much by trading up twice. Has any new 1098 purchaser compared it face to face with a 1066? I assume that some early adopters will be 1066 users. I know that it has that TFT screen on the faceplate and better base management capabilities for multichannel sources, etc., but what else warrants a doubling of the price. Does it sound considerably better? I know that this is a question that a lot of upgraders will be facing.
Thanks,

Stan

[efarstad]

I'm curious as well...I would think that on 2-channel or stereo operation it may perform better but so much of that also depends on the other gear you have to actually hear those differences. But in HT applications I would be interested to hear if there are any differences. I guess we'll wait and see....

E





The Norwegian A/V Nut!
E-Cinema

[Scarp]

Hmm ... does for example a Lexicon MC12 warrant its 13000 euro price tag (the european price), since it essentially also gives the same features like Dolby Digital, DTS, better bass management, etc etc etc ...

For some the price is worth the sound improvement, does it mean that the Lexicon is 8 to 10 times better sounding than a RSP1066? I don't know (but you will need good hearing to actually hear 10x improvement, but sure, it will be better).
(btw.. i took the lexicon as an example, you can happily replace that with the tagmclaren av192 or similar products).

So, the fact is that the 1098 is a different machine than the 1066. It has more and different features, it has different processors, it has different DACs/AD converters, etc ...

So, sure it might not be two times the better sound, but still it is very very likely to be a better machine than the 1066.

I really like my 1066, but still am going to upgrade to the 1098. Why? I haven't heard it yet, but the Rotel sound appeals to me. Another reason is just improved features and the very likely much better sound. The TFT is cool, but not essential. In fact switching sources is a bit more clumsy because there are no direct buttons on the front anymore. But I use the remote anyway.

Any surround processor from the RSP1066 and up is a good machine, there is hardly any crap in the higher/high end of the surround processors and its up to the person whether he finds the machine worth the money.

So, the discussion whether or not its the worth its money is quite useless, since its up to everybody to decide whether he/she thinkgs its worth the money.
For me its worth the money and will be the last real upgrade of my system I will do for a while, so wanna do it good. Yes, I know there is better equipment, but usually for a higher price and none that matches the looks of my Rotel amps (and I want visual integration too).

Btw... the analog bypass should also provide better stereo performance

[Danbry39]

Count me in on those curious as to how much it improves on the 1066 too. I was almost set to pull the trigger, but decided to upgrade my speakers instead. Nonetheless, I would probably be able to put enough aside in about six months to make the changeover, but I'm just so happy with my 1066 that it will have to be a pretty substantial improvement for me to do so.




Keith

[ejfiii]

My totally unbiased $.02:

I have owned a 1065 in my HT for a total of 6 weeks now. Thats 6 weeks total for the HT. So I am a noobie. I wouldn't trade it for any receiver out there - I love it. Looks and sound.

I love the 1098 too. My only problem with it is the lack of balanced XLR outputs. It seems EVERY Pre/Pro in that class has that. When the time comes, and it certainly will, I will look closely at the Halo and Anthem processors because of that feature. I just hope the Rotel can compete without it.

I would love to hear others thoughts on this. Maybe its not as important as I think it to be.

E. J.




My HT

[Trevor_J]

Myself, I'm VERY interested in the Integra DTC-9.4 that was just released. It's in the price ballpark with the 1066 but it has a *TON* of new features, including balanced outs. One feature that piqued my interest is the ability to connect to an audio server or Internet Radio stations. I'd check out the Integra before I made the jump to the 1098.

[gostan]

Scarp
I know that the 1098's twice the dollars (or Euros) does not equal twice the sound or listening enjoyment over the 1066 as the 1066 is a quality processing unit. I also know from having upgraded my computers time after time, that sometimes the newest and greatest is really good, but only infintisimally better than what I had been used to. So, I would think that real time use and attempts to compare differing speakers, cable and sound environments of various users will give us all something to chat about and discuss on this and other forums. We all agree that the 1098 is well worth looking forward to listening to. I will be curious to hear your thoughts after you upgrade.
Stan

[Scarp]

ejfiii, I think the Parasound C1/C2 its quite a bit more expensive than the 1098 is. XLR would be very nice, but I don't have a multi-channel amp that supports it anyway (my RB1090 does have XLR though).
But a TagMclaren AV32 doesn't have XLR either and still is a very good machine.

It would be possible for Rotel to make a board for XLR though with their new modular design (throw out the svideo/component connections and put some xlr in it instead (but keep the composite connections for the TFT)).

And sure, its a guess for now if it sounds better. I don't think it will sound won't sound worse and I originally intended the get this one, but couldn't wait and got the 1066 instead. So for me the upgrade decision is easy (besides that I get a good offer for the 1098 ).

Trevor_J: I've had an Onkyo TX-NR900 (Onkyo = Integra), with the Nettune stuff and I can tell you thats its not worth it. Its a nice thingy, but listening to mp3's or internet radio on a very good quality amp sucks big time, since you will hear all shortcomings of those formats. Also its a pain to set-up properly. Better just get a dvd player that plays mp3's, thats just as easy. Besides that the sound of an Integra/Onkyo is completely different than that of a Rotel. That onkyo never pleased my ears (even though its 120watts per channel) and only got some pleasure out of it after adding a RB1070 (also 120 watts per channel).

So, I guess some people will buy the 1098 without hearing it first (Like me!) and others will wait ... I just hope that Rotel spent the extra time well and made it more or less flawless this time.

[Azeke]

I have just purchased to 1098, I had the 1066 and enjoyed it's capabilities. I just hooked up the 1098 a couple of days ago, so I'm still tweaking and doing the burn in. Initial observations:

1) Digital and DTS sound more dynamic (could be psychological or due to the new dacs).

2) Clicking in the relay switches (Rotel states this normal pg.39 of the manual)

I will provide further feedback as testing continues.

Do I think it was worth the upgrade, so far I do, but everything has its own frame of reference (ask me in about 30 days, before the refund policy runs out).

I know we all suffer from upgraditis, but I'm trying to slow down and rest for a year, hopefully now I can with my current configuration.

Hope this helps,

Arman

[Andrew Pratt]

Firstly I wouldn't bother "upgrading" from a 1055 to a 1066 they sound extremely close to each other when used as a pre amp.

I should be getting a 1098 in a couple of weeks and I promise to write a lenghty review of it compared to my 1055. As others have mentioned is it worth 2X the cost? I think that largely depends on the gear you own and the ratio of music to HT...if you're mostly watching movies the nuances of the better DAC's in the 1098 will largely be lost in the comotion and onscreen action...if you're into music though the differences might be worth the cost. For me I need more digital inputs then what the 1055/1066 offer so for that alone its worth it. Add to that the improved bass management features and I'm sure I'll be more then happy with my 1098.

[Danbry39]

There are a lot of decisions to be made for each individual with regards to upgrading to the 1098. For some (if they are happy with the HT aspect of, let's say, the 1066 and listen mainly to redbook CD's), it might be a better solution to go with a two channel preamp such as a Rogue or Halo for the money spent.

However, I, for one, am very interested in hearing the upcoming comparisons. I have to admit that the new Rotel is tempting.




Keith

[LEVESQUE]

I first ordered a RSP-1098, then cancel the order to go with the Anthem AVM20. I sold my RSP-1066 after 8 months of "abuse".

I was able to have both the AVM20 and the RSP-1098 for 3000$ cdn (don't ask me how... my girlfriend is a model and always ask for the final price...hehehe...and it works all the time 8) )... Does the Anthem is worth 2 times what I have paid for the RSP-1066? After 1 month, I can say a really firm yes!

XLR output got rid of a really nasty white noise from the grounding of my house. Big improvment for 2ch and DVD-A compare to the RSP-1066. Better use, more agressive use of the surrounds and back centers. Better soundfield and "melting" of the center with the fronts ("did I plug my center?" syndrome)... Better resolution of details. Never ending list of tweaks (new version 2.10 out in 2 or 3 weeks)... Do I need a TTF screen? Nah...

I really hope the RSP-1098, for the same money, will be able to compete with the Anthem AVM20.

For me, the answer is YES, the Anthem AVM20 is worth 2 times the price of entry...

[Matt Sprouls]

Does the Anthem is worth 2 times what I have paid for the RSP-1066? After 1 month, I can say a really firm yes!

Thanks Levesque, you have confirmed what I suspected.

XLR output got rid of a really nasty white noise from the grounding of my house.

What amp are you using? I also have some noise with my 1055/1095 combo. Not bad but I know it's there.

Do I need a TTF screen? Nah...

This is where I have a problem. Maybe some think or do need the screen...I think this hurts the 1098 in the area of performance. Less money to spend on the sound quality. Without the screen they could have brought the 1098 in at a bargain price compared to the Anthem.

I love my 1055... but think I will be going to the Anthem in the near future.
I like the bass management on the Anthem. The choice of using the A/D converters or pure by-pass in my mind is the correct approach.

Regards,
Matt

[Scarp]

Azeke, many receivers have this clicking noise of their relays, so its not really a problem. It *would* be a problem when it happens during playing something, but when swithing sources, well ... thats nothing special.

Anyway, I have to wait till somewhere in august (more near the end probably) till my 1098 comes. Pricewise it will be more in the league of the rest of my equipment (B&W N804, RB1090, etc).

Anyway, lets wait and see.

[dali]

Perhaps another take on the "is twice the money worth it" would be to compare a package consisting of a RSP1066 and a dedicated 2ch amp with the RSP1098. Audiofiles say that you can get MUCH better 2ch performance from a dedicated 2ch amp than from HT gear at twice the price.

So, does that mean that a RSP1066 coupled with a 2ch amp in the same price range (let's say a Rotel RA1070) would be better than a RSP1098 (or a an AVM20)?

[LEVESQUE]

msprouls

I'm using a Bryston 4BSST (2X350w) and a Rotel RMB-1095 (5X200w). So I'm using balance XLR all around. Iwas having an awful white noise (mixture of hiss and hum..) with the RMB-1095. A cheater plug was helping alot, but going XLR completely got rid of this noise. Pure silence. So for me the lack of XLR outout on the RSP-1098 was a no-go...

[Scarp]

Perhaps another take on the "is twice the money worth it" would be to compare a package consisting of a RSP1066 and a dedicated 2ch amp with the RSP1098. Audiofiles say that you can get MUCH better 2ch performance from a dedicated 2ch amp than from HT gear at twice the price.

So, does that mean that a RSP1066 coupled with a 2ch amp in the same price range (let's say a Rotel RA1070) would be better than a RSP1098 (or a an AVM20)?

But you get incredibly lousy Home theatre from a stereo pre-amp, your sub, center and rears will not make a noise with a stereo pre-amp.
So, the comparison between a RA1070 and surround processors doesn't hold up. Offcourse you could buy both a stereo pre-amp and a HT pre-amp

But for power-amps, it can be true that a stereo power amp is better "sound" than a multi-channel power amp, but again this comparison is not fair, since some sacrifices are made to make it have 5 channels instead of 2. A good compromise is to use a stereo power-amp in combination with a multi-channel amp (or use 3 stereo poweramps, or use 5 monoblocks).

Anyway, let's just wait and see.

[dali]

Scarp, I seem to have been a little misunderstood ...

What I meant was that if you would compare this combo:

- RSP 1066 with a RMB 1075 for HT
- RA1060 for 2channel music

with this:

- RSP1098 with a RMB 1075

The price is pretty much the same, not counting speakers. What would be best value? The audiofiles' probably claim that the first package is better, with a separate 2ch system.

[Scarp]

Sure, theorectically you can compare this, but practically its quite useless I think.

How would you connect your front speakers? I assume you don't want two sets of front speakers, so either loop it through some input somehow. This gives a lot of extra problems.

I hope the analog bypass in the 1098 will make such things not needed anymore, since the pre-amp won't do much anymore.

Another thing ... the influence of the pre-amp on the sound isn't that big as the poweramp. So I think using a good stereo poweramp would make a much bigger impact.

The poweramp in the RA1060 is quite underpowered and it would die with my B&W Nautilus 804's.

So I would much rather compare the following:
* RSP1098 + RB1090 + RMB1095 (on a 5.1 this leaves 2 channels
unused), against
* RC1090 + RB1090 + RSP1066 + RMB1095 (use some sort of switching
box that can switch the use of the RB1090 between the RSP1066 and
RC1090 and lets assume that that doesn't degrade any sound quality).

Lets assume european prices:
- The RSP1098 is 3500 euro
- The RC1090 is 1500 euro, plus the RSP1066 which is 1650 makes it
come below the price of the RSP1098.

I would go for the RSP1098 solution any time, just for being more practical Sound wise its a guess now, but I doubt it would be a lot worse than the RC1090.

[Mike Hayes]

I just want to say that it is very nice to have another Rotel option available. I don't know if the 1098 is worth twice as much as the 1066 but I'm sure it's an outstanding product. Can't wait to hear more feedback about the 1098 from the group who have owned both the 1066 and 1098.

[Andrew Pratt]

Another thing ... the influence of the pre-amp on the sound isn't that big as the poweramp. So I think using a good stereo poweramp would make a much bigger impact.

I'm not sure I'd agree with that statement at all. Providing you're not compareing an woefully inadaqute power amp that is way to small for what you're asking it to do the pre amp will make a much larger difference in the sound...the DAC's and volume control will both change the sound more then swaping amps around. (assuming of course we're not switching between tube and solid state amps)

[dali]

How would you connect your front speakers?

Well, I was thinking two separate systems, one for HT and one for 2ch. It would need a little more space, but the results may well be worth it.

The poweramp in the RA1060 is quite underpowered and it would die with my B&W Nautilus 804's.

Ooops, I meant the RA1070 (as in my previous post). But I seriously doubt that the RA1060's 2x60 Rotel-powered watts is too little for your speakers, even with their 89 dB sensitivity ... unless you play for your whole neighbourhood ...

[med]

Does anybody know if Rotel has any other pre/pro's in the pipeline? I know a lot of their recent efforts were to get the 1098 out the door, but is there any plans to make something to replace the 1066, or is the 1098 intended to?

[Scarp]

Another thing ... the influence of the pre-amp on the sound isn't that big as the poweramp. So I think using a good stereo poweramp would make a much bigger impact.

I'm not sure I'd agree with that statement at all. Providing you're not compareing an woefully inadaqute power amp that is way to small for what you're asking it to do the pre amp will make a much larger difference in the sound...the DAC's and volume control will both change the sound more then swaping amps around. (assuming of course we're not switching between tube and solid state amps)

Offcourse a yoko pre-amp (or whatever cheap brand you take) would influence the sound quality a lot. But in the range of just good pre-amps, the influence is not that much. I think the speakers and poweramps give much more influence.

Dali,
60watts is definitly underpowered for an B&W Nautilus 804. Sure you'll get some sound of out it, but its way too little to make the speaker come to live.

And I I where to setup two systems, one HT and one stereo music, then sure, I wouldn't use a Surround processor for the stereo room, just like you wouldn't use a stereo (pre-)amp for your HT room. But buying two sets of 804's is too expensive for me. If I had the money I would opt for spending the extra money on the speakers instead of spending it on a seperate stereo (pre-)amp, because speakers influence the sound the most.

[kendrid]

If the primary enchancement of the 1098 is music, you could get a 1055 and an incredible 2 channel preamp with the leftover money. That would be my choice if I were in your situation.




------
Kevin

[Scarp]

If the primary enchancement of the 1098 is music, you could get a 1055 and an incredible 2 channel preamp with the leftover money. That would be my choice if I were in your situation.

How would going from a 1066 + RB1090 going to a RSX1055 make an improvement?

[SaNdOkAn]

1098 Owners i am still anxious waiting for some pics off the 1098.

Please post some we all have been waiting so long....

Thanx in advance

[Azeke]

I will have pics soon, my wife took the digital camera to work and said she would bring it home today.

Azeke