B&W 801D

[stuofsci02]

All,

I have the opportunity to pick up a pair of 801D's that were traded in on a pair of 800Di. These 801D's are a couple of years old and are in mint condition on display at my dealer. He wants to sell these and is willing to deal. I believe I can get them taxes in delivered for ~$10k (this is in Canada).

For the time being I will have my Chord amp only to power them. I have heard this combo before and it sounded great although I am sure they could use more power. The Chord is 130w into 8ohm, 170w into 4 ohm and 210w into 2 ohm. The amp although rated low is extremely stable into low resistance speakers. Obviously I would not be able to crank the hell out of them though.

Thoughts???? Thanks!

[akhter]

I know in Hong Kong a pristine used 801D will go for around 12k but that probably doesn't help. you can check audiogon.

[Pedro]

For $10K? I wouldnt think twice. Amazing speakers one of the best I ever heard even compared to big and two times more expensive.

Regarding your gear dont worry. They wont play all Its full potential (especially in bass area) but they will sound incredible as they arent too dificult to be loaded (minimum impedance doesnt down below 4ohms accordingly some measurements).

Then the only thing you would check is your room size. They will play a lot better if placed into rooms above 40sqm area.

[stuofsci02]

Thanks Pedro,

My rooms is quite large.. 15ft wide by 25ft long. It is actually even bigger then this, but this is the area I have my speakers centered in. The total area is 42 sqm. I also have room treatment.

See pics below. My 804s are 10 ft apart on center. and out 3ft from the back wall. I will sell my center speaker and gear and go strictly stereo..

[Pedro]

Great room, you wont have problem. I second you having a stereo setup especially if you dont enjoy too much movies and is more into the music and live videos. I´ve always had an opinion HT and stereo cant live in the same room, except when you have too much money to build a very large room where you can sit far enough from the speakes to get all that result.

Hope you can get them soon, dont lose that oportunity! Have you already got a chance to listen to them?

[Rod#S]

I wouldn't think twice about it. If you had no plans on say upgrading to perhaps 800 Diamonds at some point in the future having an opportunity on 801D's for 10K Canadian no less how can you say no, I mean really, They will absolutely destroy your 804S speakers. Many have preferred the 801D's over the 800D's back when both were being produced so that says a lot as to their qualities. Moving the 804's to the surrounds will be super sweet as well. As to the amp, don't sweat it, you can always upgrade that later if you wish, no biggie.

[stuofsci02]

Great room, you wont have problem. I second you having a stereo setup especially if you dont enjoy too much movies and is more into the music and live videos. I´ve always had an opinion HT and stereo cant live in the same room, except when you have too much money to build a very large room where you can sit far enough from the speakes to get all that result.

Hope you can get them soon, dont lose that oportunity! Have you already got a chance to listen to them?

Thanks Pedro!

I find I mostly use my system for stereo, so I would rather put the money into that. I will sell the 804s, the HTM3s and the amps for them.

Even when I watch Bluray music concerts I find I prefer in stereo instead of surround.

I will try to jump on this...

[stuofsci02]

I wouldn't think twice about it. If you had no plans on say upgrading to perhaps 800 Diamonds at some point in the future having an opportunity on 801D's for 10K Canadian no less how can you say no, I mean really, They will absolutely destroy your 804S speakers. Many have preferred the 801D's over the 800D's back when both were being produced so that says a lot as to their qualities. Moving the 804's to the surrounds will be super sweet as well. As to the amp, don't sweat it, you can always upgrade that later if you wish, no biggie.

Rod,

I have heard the same thing about the 801D.. Aside from being monsters people have said great things about them. I have no plans for 800Di.. I was thinking at some point for a some 802Di, but the used 801D is much less expensive and should also be amazing. Since I have the space for it, I think it makes sense.

Unfortunately the 804s and the HTM3s will have to go in order to make this a less costly upgrade (best angle to go with the wife). I have been wanting to go to a stereo only setup anyways as I listen almost exclusively to stereo.

Cheers!

Stuart

[stuofsci02]

Do you guys know of any good reviews of the 801D.. I can't find really anything.. When I type 801D into google I get a whole bunch of Youtube videos of Perdro's 801D's playing rock and roll...

[Rod#S]

Rod,

I have heard the same thing about the 801D.. Aside from being monsters people have said great things about them. I have no plans for 800Di.. I was thinking at some point for a some 802Di, but the used 801D is much less expensive and should also be amazing. Since I have the space for it, I think it makes sense.

Unfortunately the 804s and the HTM3s will have to go in order to make this a less costly upgrade (best angle to go with the wife). I have been wanting to go to a stereo only setup anyways as I listen almost exclusively to stereo.

Cheers!

Stuart

Going stereo eh, that's quite the move. It'll certainly help pay for the speakers though. If you had been thinking of the 802Di, can you get an opportunity to hear the 801D's and 802Di's at your dealer's, preferably in the same room? The reason why I bring that up even after saying people have preferred the 801D over the flagship 800D is that the concensus is that the new Diamond series are a very nice refinement to the speakers and are a noticeable imporvement over the original diamonds so it's possible you may like the 802Di more than the 801D.

Will you be selling your subs? If getting the 801D's and going stereo you may not need/want them anymore. If you still plan on using them then the combination of stereo speakers and subs may suit a 802Di system more than a 801D system. Just something to noodle on.

[Rod#S]

Do you guys know of any good reviews of the 801D.. I can't find really anything.. When I type 801D into google I get a whole bunch of Youtube videos of Perdro's 801D's playing rock and roll...

Weird, I just did a search as well and can't find any official reviews. There are reviews for the old 801 Matrix and 801N but nothing for the 801D which is strange. The reviews are all for the 802D and 800D.

[stuofsci02]

Going stereo eh, that's quite the move. It'll certainly help pay for the speakers though. If you had been thinking of the 802Di, can you get an opportunity to hear the 801D's and 802Di's at your dealer's, preferably in the same room? The reason why I bring that up even after saying people have preferred the 801D over the flagship 800D is that the concensus is that the new Diamond series are a very nice refinement to the speakers and are a noticeable imporvement over the original diamonds so it's possible you may like the 802Di more than the 801D.

Will you be selling your subs? If getting the 801D's and going stereo you may not need/want them anymore. If you still plan on using them then the combination of stereo speakers and subs may suit a 802Di system more than a 801D system. Just something to noodle on.

I have listened to the 801D and the 802Di, but not at the same time to compare. My dealer has both so I could do this. I did like the 802Di, but I also like the 801D. But when you consider $10k for 801D vs. $15K for 802Di it would be hard to justify even if I did like the 802Di better.

I think I will keep the subs for movies only. I still think the 801D would not have that on demand deep deep bass you need for movies.

[SPACEMANRICK]

Stuart, it sounds like you are maybe in for a nice upgrade to your already outstanding room and sound system. I only have my 802D's in 2 channel format and love it every time I sit down and listen to music with my IPAD and Squeezebox Touch (thanks again for that suggestion!). Fortunately the 804's still have very good resale value so the upgrade should not cost you too much after all is said and done.......go for it :T

[Pedro]

Do you guys know of any good reviews of the 801D.. I can't find really anything.. When I type 801D into google I get a whole bunch of Youtube videos of Perdro's 801D's playing rock and roll...

Sorry for that. I love them

Pls send me a PM with your email address and will send you a great review from hi-fi world published at B&W website years ago.

[bigburner]

Hi Stuart,

That sounds like a wonderful upgrade to me.

I'm intrigued to know how you will integrate your two subs because if I owned a pair of 801Ds then I'd probably want to listen to them at full range, which may require a more powerful amp as others have mentioned.

Nigel.

[Briz vegas]

What's the resale value on 804s as a percentage of the rrp? Of course I am in a different market. I figured the 804 would be hard to shift these days so I was going to keep mine either at the rears or stored in a spare room. They are still nice speakers so I would rather keep them than get poor resale due to a slow market.

[stuofsci02]

Stuart, it sounds like you are maybe in for a nice upgrade to your already outstanding room and sound system. I only have my 802D's in 2 channel format and love it every time I sit down and listen to music with my IPAD and Squeezebox Touch (thanks again for that suggestion!). Fortunately the 804's still have very good resale value so the upgrade should not cost you too much after all is said and done.......go for it :T

Rick.. Yours is a sweet setup. How are you liking that DAC.. It has been a while since we talked...

Just an FYI.... Logitech is cancelling the Squeezebox :cry: .. So if you want another, now is the time.

It is true the 804s have good resale. I am close enough to Toronto that I have 8 million possible customers within an hour... I don't expect to have any trouble selling them.

[stuofsci02]

Sorry for that. I love them

Pls send me a PM with your email address and will send you a great review from hi-fi world published at B&W website years ago.

PM Sent

[stuofsci02]

Hi Stuart,

That sounds like a wonderful upgrade to me.

I'm intrigued to know how you will integrate your two subs because if I owned a pair of 801Ds then I'd probably want to listen to them at full range, which may require a more powerful amp as others have mentioned.

Nigel.

I am not sure yet.. I have an Emotiva USP-1 preamp which has a built in analog crossover for the subs. This is how I do it now. So my 804s are crossed at 50HZ (which is the lowest).

With the 801D I might just run them full range, but with the subs hooked up too. For music I will turn the subs off, for movies I will turn them on and cross them on and cross them over low.

I haven't worked this out completely yet..

[stuofsci02]

What's the resale value on 804s as a percentage of the rrp? Of course I am in a different market. I figured the 804 would be hard to shift these days so I was going to keep mine either at the rears or stored in a spare room. They are still nice speakers so I would rather keep them than get poor resale due to a slow market.

The market here is quite strong.

I should be able to get $3000 for the pair. I think MSRP was $5000 + tax here in Canada.

For the HTM3s I should get $2200. I think MSRP was $3300.

I find in general the 800 series will hold at least 60% of its value.

In Canada where I live we have 13% sales tax, so buying used avoids this too, which I am sure helps the used market.

[akhter]

Thanks Pedro!

I find I mostly use my system for stereo, so I would rather put the money into that. I will sell the 804s, the HTM3s and the amps for them.

Even when I watch Bluray music concerts I find I prefer in stereo instead of surround.

I will try to jump on this...

I went a similar route:

Initially I had:
Anthem MRX700 receiver (sold)
B&W N804 fronts (sold)
B&W XTC Center (sold)
Velodyne DD12 subwoofer (sold)

Now:
B&W 802 Diamond fronts
Linn Akurate DSM pre
amp to be purchased.

Have a look at Linn Majik DSM.
It is the only integrated stereo amplifier that also has HDMI (LPCM) and a audiophile grade DLNA streamer and DAC. Currently I use this but will move to my second home in a few weeks after buying an amp as the Akurate DSM doesn't have amps.

http://docs.linn.co.uk/wiki/index.php/Majik_DSM

With the Majik DSM you will be able to replace your emotive preamp, the logictech squeezebox and the DAC for an overall better solution. The Linn also has a great ipad control app.

[Antus]

801D is the best speaker in the 800 series range. It too bad b&w discountinued it. for $10K, it a pretty good deal.

u will need a powerful amp to control the 15inch bass. I listened to 801D with Exposure MCX amp with around 200W/channel and the bass was only soso. may need something like Krell, Parasound JC1 or similier to make it punch.

804S are great speakers and one of the best wanted speaker in 2nd hand market. don't sell it too soon. when u regrate in the future, u will need to pay more to buy it back.

[stuofsci02]

I went a similar route:

Initially I had:
Anthem MRX700 receiver (sold)
B&W N804 fronts (sold)
B&W XTC Center (sold)
Velodyne DD12 subwoofer (sold)

Now:
B&W 802 Diamond fronts
Linn Akurate DSM pre
amp to be purchased.

Have a look at Linn Majik DSM.
It is the only integrated stereo amplifier that also has HDMI (LPCM) and a audiophile grade DLNA streamer and DAC. Currently I use this but will move to my second home in a few weeks after buying an amp as the Akurate DSM doesn't have amps.

http://docs.linn.co.uk/wiki/index.php/Majik_DSM

With the Majik DSM you will be able to replace your emotive preamp, the logictech squeezebox and the DAC for an overall better solution. The Linn also has a great ipad control app.

I appreciate the suggestion.

I would like however to match my Chord amp with the appropriate Chord preamp. I very much like the Squeezebox, so I will not be changing that out soon. I will however match with a very good DAC at some point..

Cheers

Stuart

[stuofsci02]

801D is the best speaker in the 800 series range. It too bad b&w discountinued it. for $10K, it a pretty good deal.

u will need a powerful amp to control the 15inch bass. I listened to 801D with Exposure MCX amp with around 200W/channel and the bass was only soso. may need something like Krell, Parasound JC1 or similier to make it punch.

804S are great speakers and one of the best wanted speaker in 2nd hand market. don't sell it too soon. when u regrate in the future, u will need to pay more to buy it back.

I am not so sure about the powerful amp though. I would have thought this to be the case too, but Pedro sent me a very in depth review. And I quote:

"801Ds score over
NS1000Ms, and
in a massively
convincing way,
is their amplifier
friendliness. Yams
will eviscerate any
half-decent amp
that’s called upon
to drive them,
and simply start
to say, ‘come and
have a go if you
think you’re hard
enough’ (and few
amps are). But the
801Ds are a far,
far more forgiving
load. This means
that they’ll go loud
with surprisingly
few watts, and
not tax valve
amplifier output
transformers
either. For me
personally, this
is the ‘genius
move' of the
B&Ws. I’ll make
no bones about
it, I’m convinced
that high quality
modern valve
amplifiers are
musically correct,
and solid-state
ones aren’t.
Trouble is, there
are so few great
loudspeakers that
work synergis-
tically with valves,
and the good news
is that the 801D is
one – maybe even
the only one.
With my
World Audio
K5881 (about
17 watts per
side), the B&Ws
go ferociously
loud, and never
ever strain the output trannies; they
give the amp room to breathe, and
a great valve amp working without
strain is an amazing thing to behold.
B&W tells me that the company uses
big Naims and Krells with the 801D,
but from where I’m sitting even a
Sugden A21a 20W Class A transistor
integrated would get along famously.
For me, this is a superb facet of these
loudspeakers – they afford the chance
for low power, high quality power
amplifiers to fly."

So maybe my Chord which is 130w into 8 ohms, 170w into 4 ohms and 210w into 2 ohms would work well. The amp has no problem with current into low resistance (not that the 801D are low anyway).

Cheers,

Stuart

[Pedro]

I second you. I´ve been loading my 801D with small amps and surprisely they sang loud every time. As the reviewer wrote they arent hard to be loaded. What happens is, when using a big amp they will sound way more natural wider and fuller bass than using a small amp. I´ve auditioned mine with Krell EVO 402 amp and lately with my EVO 600e amps and that´s noticeable. The more power you give them, more relaxing and less forwarding they will sound.

Can drive them with your amp, you wont repent, they will sound much better than your 804S which are in my opinion a bit more difficult to load. Then when possible you upgrade your gear

[SPACEMANRICK]

Rick.. Yours is a sweet setup. How are you liking that DAC.. It has been a while since we talked...

Just an FYI.... Logitech is cancelling the Squeezebox :cry: .. So if you want another, now is the time.

It is true the 804s have good resale. I am close enough to Toronto that I have 8 million possible customers within an hour... I don't expect to have any trouble selling them.

He Stuart, all is well here now that the kids are back in school :T I can now sit down during the week and and enjoy the peace and quiet at my home office and then step out into my music room and spend an hour or more listening to some great music.

The squeezebox paired with my IPAD blows me away every time I use it, it is hard to believe 18 months ago I was walking back and forth changing CD's every time I wanted to change the music. I am enjoying the DAC also as it does warm up the sound but by far the biggest impact on my sound was the change from the AV receiver to dedicated amps and of course the change from the 804 speakers to the 802D speakers.

I looked back at my 804 speaker purchase over 6 years ago and I think the MSRP was $6,000 here in Canada and as you have indicated the net after discounts was around $5,000 + tax. It is amazing that the resale on them would still be as high as $3,000 or close to $3,000 after 6 years. Have you considered trading them in to your dealer to save the sales tax on the trade in value? Have you put any more thoughts into the possible upgrade?

Cheers,

Richard

[Briz vegas]

Hmm, maybe I should test the water here. 804 were 8000 in Oz and were rarely discounted if you believe the sales guy back in the day, he said the importer did not like them doing it. Of course I still kinda like them despite my niggle with them, they do alot right if you just like music, so maybe I will wait and see how I feel when the new speakers arrive.

[leo2498]

I have listened to the 801D and the 802Di, but not at the same time to compare. My dealer has both so I could do this. I did like the 802Di, but I also like the 801D. But when you consider $10k for 801D vs. $15K for 802Di it would be hard to justify even if I did like the 802Di better.

I think I will keep the subs for movies only. I still think the 801D would not have that on demand deep deep bass you need for movies.

Hi stuart I wondering if you will get the five years of warranty of this 801D from your dealer because if not I'm thinking that it is not a fair comparison because you could get a second hand 802di in this budget too.

[akhter]

N804/804S have incredible resale value.

I used my N804s for eight years and recovered 90% of what I paid for them. I did buy the N804 heavily discounted right when 804S came out.

I couldn't believe that I basically used the N804s for less than $100 usd/year

Thank you B&W for not changing the design dramatically between updates

[stuofsci02]

Hi stuart I wondering if you will get the five years of warranty of this 801D from your dealer because if not I'm thinking that it is not a fair comparison because you could get a second hand 802di in this budget too.

Leo,

While this is correct, you will be hard pressed to find 802Di on the used market (at least where I am)...

[stuofsci02]

He Stuart, all is well here now that the kids are back in school :T I can now sit down during the week and and enjoy the peace and quiet at my home office and then step out into my music room and spend an hour or more listening to some great music.

The squeezebox paired with my IPAD blows me away every time I use it, it is hard to believe 18 months ago I was walking back and forth changing CD's every time I wanted to change the music. I am enjoying the DAC also as it does warm up the sound but by far the biggest impact on my sound was the change from the AV receiver to dedicated amps and of course the change from the 804 speakers to the 802D speakers.

I looked back at my 804 speaker purchase over 6 years ago and I think the MSRP was $6,000 here in Canada and as you have indicated the net after discounts was around $5,000 + tax. It is amazing that the resale on them would still be as high as $3,000 or close to $3,000 after 6 years. Have you considered trading them in to your dealer to save the sales tax on the trade in value? Have you put any more thoughts into the possible upgrade?

Cheers,

Richard

Rick,

You made quite the investment in your system last year..! I remember watching your progress with envy!

Glad to hear it is still sounding good.. And while changing CDs can sometimes be enjoyable, the Squeezebox is just so great.

[tanwn]

I have the old N801, is it easy to drive like what is mentioned here about 801D? Should i still feel proud since it has been overtaken by 801D and 801Di

[Pedro]

The N801 are a bit harder to load, as they´ve got a lower minimum impedance (~3ohms). Also they´re not too much friendly when It comes to match the proper gear to drive them due their high frequency response be a bit louder than the diamond tweeter response.

But I think the N801 are still nowadays excellent speakers. If you can find a second hand 801D in mint conditions then that´s the way to go, or jump to 800di which are the most expensive since the new series doesnt feat a new 801di.

[stuofsci02]

Alright... I have reached an agreement with the dealer in order to get these things delivered and brought into my basement. My understanding is they are close to 300 lbs each in their packaging.

So they should be here on Friday.

I have already listed my 804s and HTM3s on Canuck Audio Mart if anyone is interested.

Thanks,

Stuart

[Rod#S]

Congrats! Be sure to post pictures of the arrival and once they get setup

[Pedro]

Sounds awesome!!. Hope we get a review from you soon

BTW in what finishing are they gonna come?

[SPACEMANRICK]

Wow Stuart, those are going to look and sound great in that music room of yours! I look forward to lots of pictures over the next few days ;x(

[dukester]

Congrats Stuart! Great to see the meticulous development of your system. Look forward to your review/pics :T

[madmac]

300 POUNDS!!! Holy crap!!. Ok, you've gotta' post some pictures of those monsters ok??!!

[stuofsci02]

Sounds awesome!!. Hope we get a review from you soon

BTW in what finishing are they gonna come?

For sure! They are Rosenut!

[stuofsci02]

Wow Stuart, those are going to look and sound great in that music room of yours! I look forward to lots of pictures over the next few days ;x(

Rick,

I am very excited...

BTW

I have already agreed to sell my 804s to someone. I posted them last night at around 5:30 pm, and the buyer emailed me at 10 pm (so 4.5 hours). Also I have had several other inquiries since then, so the market for 804s in the Toronto area seems strong.

[stuofsci02]

Congrats Stuart! Great to see the meticulous development of your system. Look forward to your review/pics :T

It has been a long and winding road....

On that note, I am looking forward to having a slice of Abbey Road at my house.

Since they used to use the 801D with Chord Amps I will have my own replica circa 2004.. Now of course they are using 800Di with Classe, but I am not going there..... YET....

[stuofsci02]

300 POUNDS!!! Holy crap!!. Ok, you've gotta' post some pictures of those monsters ok??!!

Yeah.. Holy Crap is right... I believe they are 260 lbs each once unpacked..

[htsteve]

Stuart,

Congratulations! That will be a great upgrade. I did a similar path, going from N804's to 802D's. It was awesome.


Looking forward to pictures and impressions.

[stuofsci02]

Stuart,

Congratulations! That will be a great upgrade. I did a similar path, going from N804's to 802D's. It was awesome.


Looking forward to pictures and impressions.

When I bought the 804s I thought.. Wow.. I finally have 800 series speakers.. I won't ever need to upgrade again... That was sure BS....

Now with the 801D I told my wife there is nowhere to go from here.. I am at the top... Then she said why did the guy trade them back into the store.... I said... To upgrade ops: