B&W 803S vs 804S

[BWLover]

I'd like to start a general discussion about these speakers and there pros/cons etc. talk away!

[KyaDawn]

I've only demoed both of these speakers once, on the same day, but in different rooms, so it may not be the most accurate comparison, but I found the 803S was superior to the 804S in both authoritative bass and mid-range. The 803S had a "fuller" sound, as I recall, which is important as I thought the 804S was lacking in substantial bass for a floorstanding speaker.

[KyaDawn]

One thing I'd like to add is that the differences between the 804S and the 803S weren't as dramatic as the differences between the 803S and the 803D, however.

[specialized]

One thing I'd like to add is that the differences between the 804S and the 803S weren't as dramatic as the differences between the 803S and the 803D, however.

I had a different experience.. I feel a lot of diference between 804s and 803s. 803s had bigger soundstage, bigger sound and right bass.

When i compared 804s and 805s, i prefer 805s .


Also i have not chacne to listen in same room and same time 803D and 803S, but i didnt feel that big difference.. Seem that 803D need bigger room then 803s, and much better electronics to be able to feel the big difference..


Greetings

Darko

[KyaDawn]

I had a different experience.. I feel a lot of diference between 804s and 803s. 803s had bigger soundstage, bigger sound and right bass.

When i compared 804s and 805s, i prefer 805s .


Also i have not chacne to listen in same room and same time 803D and 803S, but i didnt feel that big difference.. Seem that 803D need bigger room then 803s, and much better electronics to be able to feel the big difference..


Greetings

Darko

Yes, the dealer was running Classe for all the demos so that might have been a factor. The differences between the 803D and 803S, for me, wasn't so much the bass, (even though the 803D did have even fuller bass than the 803S) but the overall soundstage, imaging and presentation. The 803D sounded more "real" and "live" to me than the 803S; in fact, very close to the 802Ds on first listen.

I agree with your preferences for the 805S over the 804S. The 804S does have a lower reach than the 805S, but I liked the 805S's overall tonal balance better, and it did impress me with the amount of bass that it could deliver for a 2-way stand-mount. For music, I would take the 805S over the 804S, and for HT as fronts, with a good sub, I would also make the same choice.

[specialized]

Yes, the dealer was running Classe for all the demos so that might have been a factor. The differences between the 803D and 803S, for me, wasn't so much the bass, (even though the 803D did have even fuller bass than the 803S) but the overall soundstage, imaging and presentation. The 803D sounded more "real" and "live" to me than the 803S; in fact, very close to the 802Ds on first listen.

I agree with your preferences for the 805S over the 804S. The 804S does have a lower reach than the 805S, but I liked the 805S's overall tonal balance better, and it did impress me with the amount of bass that it could deliver for a 2-way stand-mount. For music, I would take the 805S over the 804S, and for HT as fronts, with a good sub, I would also make the same choice.

I the feeling about 803D that they need very well dampened room, and high class electronics. I feel like 803S sound better in room with bare walls, no carpet etc... And also they dont need that high end electronics. But also if u give them higher price they can sing even better.

So for 803D i think there is need of bigger room, very well dampened and nice electronics. But if u have all that, then go for 802D. For me 802D are sounding much better then 803D. I feel 803S as a sweet spot in B&W line


If u have smaller room go for 805S. Very very nice sounding speakers.

I would avoid 804s at all.

Go for 803s if u have middle size room, and which is not dedicated.

I would also jump 803D and go for 802D if i have dedicated big very well dampened room.

This is just my opinion which dont mean i'm right


Darko

[KyaDawn]

I the feeling about 803D that they need very well dampened room, and high class electronics. I feel like 803S sound better in room with bare walls, no carpet etc... And also they dont need that high end electronics. But also if u give them higher price they can sing even better.

So for 803D i think there is need of bigger room, very well dampened and nice electronics. But if u have all that, then go for 802D. For me 802D are sounding much better then 803D. I feel 803S as a sweet spot in B&W line


If u have smaller room go for 805S. Very very nice sounding speakers.

I would avoid 804s at all.

Go for 803s if u have middle size room, and which is not dedicated.

I would also jump 803D and go for 802D if i have dedicated big very well dampened room.

This is just my opinion which dont mean i'm right


Darko

I agree with you for the most part. The thing about the 802Ds vs. the 803Ds, you are right that the 802Ds are significantly better, but I think the issue for most people is that they are also significantly more expensive! :B If they were the same or even within 20% in price, I think a large majority of people would choose the 802Ds between the two. But alas, the 802Ds cost around 40% more than the 803Ds, which is prohibitive for many.

It's funny you mention you think the 803S is the sweet spot in the B&W line, I've heard people say that for the 803Ds, at least for the 800 series, and I can see where they are coming from as they do provide at least 85-90% of the performance of the 802Ds. For me, I think the "sweet spot" is the 802Ds, which I find provide around 95% of the performance of the 800Ds! :B

[BWLover]

thanks guys. continue...

[scanido]

I did a comparison at one point between the 804S and 803S. I came to a conclusion that the 803S was worth the added expense!

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=24537

[specialized]

I agree with you for the most part. The thing about the 802Ds vs. the 803Ds, you are right that the 802Ds are significantly better, but I think the issue for most people is that they are also significantly more expensive! :B If they were the same or even within 20% in price, I think a large majority of people would choose the 802Ds between the two. But alas, the 802Ds cost around 40% more than the 803Ds, which is prohibitive for many.

It's funny you mention you think the 803S is the sweet spot in the B&W line, I've heard people say that for the 803Ds, at least for the 800 series, and I can see where they are coming from as they do provide at least 85-90% of the performance of the 802Ds. For me, I think the "sweet spot" is the 802Ds, which I find provide around 95% of the performance of the 800Ds! :B

It's strange how we agree most of the time, and in same time we have a bit different opinion Which is very good becouse if we all think the same there would be definitnly no need for forum like this

I agree with u.. But.. If someone is able to spend the money for 803D and for proper electronics for them, and also have a big enough and well dampened room.. Then that 40% of price is not a problem at all to go for better speaker


And also i agree with u about 802D I think there is no need to spend extra money for any speaker Above 802D becouse u are not getting improvement that u are paying.. I had a chance to listen Nautilus speakers connected to 6 McIntosh 501 Monoblocks. They sound amazing, but a bit light on bass. The feeling what i have was: Ok.. Great.. But is this worth that amount of money compared to 802D" ? And also becouse of light bass i was not that impessed. When i heard 802D connected on two 501 Monoblocks, i thought that there is live stage, i was that impressed..I have not compared 802D vs Nautilus in same time, but i got bigger impression from 802D then from Nautilus as i remember.


Darko

[wettou]

802D vs 800D I am thinking Revel Salon Ultra II instead8O

[BWLover]

i could save enough money for the 802D but then i wouldnt be able to spend as much on the gear. so the way i see it is i think it would be better to get the 803S and spend the remaing amount i would have spent on the 802D on gear.

[KyaDawn]

i could save enough money for the 802D but then i wouldnt be able to spend as much on the gear. so the way i see it is i think it would be better to get the 803S and spend the remaing amount i would have spent on the 802D on gear.

The 803S is less than half the price of the 802D so you can definitely can buy better electronics with the 803S using the same budget. You'd save around $8,000, enough to buy some amazing Classe gear if you wanted.

Going back to your original post, if you were deciding between 803S and 804S and can swing both, the 803S is superior in many ways and I would not hesitate to choose it between the two.

[ironcorn]

I just bought the 803S about 6 weeks ago for fronts and just ordered another set for the sides in a 5.1 set up.
After listening to the 804S, 803S, and the 803D, back to back, the 804 was good, the 803S was the same sound, but better bass and fuller, and the 803D was different, smoother, with even fuller sound. I also considered size and transportability (I move about every 3 years). The 803S fit the bill. If I listened to more 2 channel music, I would have had to consider the 803D again, but for HT, for me, the 803S satisfies. In the end, you can’t really go wrong; ALL the 800 series are nice.

[specialized]

i could save enough money for the 802D but then i wouldnt be able to spend as much on the gear. so the way i see it is i think it would be better to get the 803S and spend the remaing amount i would have spent on the 802D on gear.

I definitly agree with u.. I done the same.. Also 802D need much bigger space and better dampening of room.


Darko

[Horacio]

BWLover,

I suggest you take all our advice with a grain of salt and audition for yourself, ideally in your own room. There is ageneral tendency in audio that more expensive and bigger is better, but it not always is.

As I said before, the 803s delivers more bass than 804s. "Fuller"...I don't know about that. Actually my dealer, who I've known for a fair amount of time talked me out of buying the 803s...Is more bass better? In some rooms it is. Will the 803s go down to 20Hz? Not even in dreams! To get there you will still need a sub (for stereo). I do this and I'm very happy with it.

It's tough to see through posts in a forum. The fact that some folks post a lot doesn't mean they know a lot. Bigger speakers demand more dampening? My goodness...

All in all, enjoy your search and trust your ears!

All the best,
Horacio

[KyaDawn]

BWLover,

I suggest you take all our advice with a grain of salt and audition for yourself, ideally in your own room. There is ageneral tendency in audio that more expensive and bigger is better, but it not always is.

As I said before, the 803s delivers more bass than 804s. "Fuller"...I don't know about that. Actually my dealer, who I've known for a fair amount of time talked me out of buying the 803s...Is more bass better? In some rooms it is. Will the 803s go down to 20Hz? Not even in dreams! To get there you will still need a sub (for stereo). I do this and I'm very happy with it.

It's tough to see through posts in a forum. The fact that some folks post a lot doesn't mean they know a lot. Bigger speakers demand more dampening? My goodness...

All in all, enjoy your search and trust your ears!

All the best,
Horacio

It's quite true that bigger and expensive is not always better. Personally, I find the 805S superior to the 804S! :B

No one has claimed any of the 800 series speakers, other than the subs, will go down to 20Hz. Even the mighty 801D is rated by B&W to "only" go down to 29Hz. The 803S is rated to go down to 35Hz, but the 804S even less, to 39Hz.

But "ratings" are not as important as listening. Granted I had only one session with both speakers and in different rooms, but in experience the 803S not only had "more" bass than the 804S, but a "fuller" sound. The larger woofers seem to not only affect the lower frequencies, but contribute to the mid-range as well.

The 804S is a very good speaker. As with the 800 series, it has beautiful detail and very good balance. I just find it a bit on the light side for on the bass for a floorstander, and I personally prefer the 803S between the two.

[kmcheng]

Count me in for another vote for 805S over 804S.

The problem with the 805S, however, is that it definitely needs a subwoofer for HT. Adding the dedicated B&W stands to the mix, you are paying similar money for the 805S combo as for the 804S.

When I was shopping, I liked the 805S better than the 804S. I thought the bookshelf sounded more open and effortless, possibly because it does not need to reach as low as its bigger brother. However, I could also imagine someone liking the 804S better because of the lower base.

[KyaDawn]

Yes, I agree as well. I think for music, it's not absolutely necessary for the 805S to be paired with a sub, but definitely with HT it's important. For HT, with no sub, I think the 804S would be better, but I would choose the 805S paired with a good sub over the 804S, with or without a sub.

[yourtoys7]

When I purchased my 804S, I listed to 804S, 803s and 802N. To me the differance 804/ 803 was very small, but going to 802N was huge + the looks as well. Sence I've sold my 804S, now looking for 802N used. I think for the money you get alot and most used are in very, very good cond.

[wywong]

Hi can you tell me what center channel speaker you use for the 804s. Is it the HTM4s or the HTM3s. The dealer said the official match is the HTM4s. But this forum said is the HTM3S. how do you folks like the HTM4s with 804S? Thanks for sharing your experiences.

[KyaDawn]

Hi can you tell me what center channel speaker you use for the 804s. Is it the HTM4s or the HTM3s. The dealer said the official match is the HTM4s. But this forum said is the HTM3S. how do you folks like the HTM4s with 804S? Thanks for sharing your experiences.

The HTM4S is made to be paired with the 805S, not the 804S. Like the 805S, it is a two-way front ported speaker, shares the same drivers, and is basically the same speaker except for the enclosure and the addition of magnetic shielding. The HTM3S, however, is a three-way speaker with two woofers and a FST mid-range driver, like the 804S. The HTM3S is designed to match with the 804S and 803S.

I've never heard the HTM4S matched with 804S fronts, but I can imagine a timbre mismatch due to the lack of the woofers and FST mid-range in the HTM4S.

[dknightd]

I'd like to start a general discussion about these speakers and there pros/cons etc. talk away!

Pros: Some prefer one speaker over the other. Usually the 803 would be preferred over the 804 - B&W is careful to make it that way for most people.

Cons: The 803 cost more than the 804

Buy what you like and what fits your budget best. Ignore me.

:evil: