N 802 Replacement prices.

[Race Car Driver]

Well, previously ordered a tweeter for $89, as many others have.
But needing a woofer as of late because my Sunfire processor freaked out on me
I called up Equity International in MA and checked the prices.

New bass driver $178 and to fullfill my curiosity a new mid is $129.

Hehe, $4000 cabinet has less then $600 retail in speakers in it.... But boy do they sound good.

[Wizard-of-Odd]

It's the sum of the parts that make B&W great, not the $um of the parts.

Kevin

[Karma]

HI,
It's really simple. If you like them, buy them. If you don't, don't. Then don't look back. B&W does not promise cheap. They do promise good. I don't see much point in bitching about price.

Sparky

[Miroku]

I dont really see much bitching. Looks to be more of an observation.

[RobP]

Well, previously ordered a tweeter for $89, as many others have.
But needing a woofer as of late because my Sunfire processor freaked out on me
I called up Equity International in MA and checked the prices.

New bass driver $178 and to fullfill my curiosity a new mid is $129.

Hehe, $4000 cabinet has less then $600 retail in speakers in it.... But boy do they sound good.

Just for giggles, I would like to see what the parts actually cost wholesale. Or even cost at the manufacturing level. That would be interesting.

[grit]

Just for giggles, I would like to see what the parts actually cost wholesale. Or even cost at the manufacturing level. That would be interesting.

I'm afraid I'd cry if I found out.

[Race Car Driver]

Actual cost would be about half with my experience.

And no.. im not bitching.. not in the least bit. Dont see how anyone could possibly come to that conculsion in my post.
Im rather happy im spending $178 instead of $500.

So with that, enjoy that little tidbit of info.

[caleb]

This is a very interesting observation RCD.

I replaced my bass drivers on my 802's a long time ago due to them fading in the sun.

I also was a little surprised as to how in expensive they were compared to the total speaker cost.

So I think that you had a good reason for saying what you did at trhe start of this thread, however, this forum is turning into a reall nasty place.

You can't say anything without a bunch of pratts jumping in with their vitriolic and insulting replies and tearing your comments to shreds, then taking the thread into a completely different direction.

I for one am getting completely pissed off with it.

I wish the moderators would take a stronger line with these ar*#%oles and just stop the threads when the go off topic.

[worldys]

i couldn't agree more with caleb about the mean spiritidness i am observing in this forum, i am new here and was excited to be able share my interest with others in such an easy to use environment, but since i still consider myself pretty ignorant about audio stuff, now when i post things, i get anxious about saying something stupid that some jerk will go off on, i don't think that is what this forum should be about

s

[RobP]

i couldn't agree more with caleb about the mean spiritidness i am observing in this forum, i am new here and was excited to be able share my interest with others in such an easy to use environment, but since i still consider myself pretty ignorant about audio stuff, now when i post things, i get anxious about saying something stupid that some jerk will go off on, i don't think that is what this forum should be about

s

Please dont let a few sour apples keep you from asking questions or sharing your thoughts, none of us here know everything, so when you encounter someone being a jerk, ignore them, they will eventually get tired of talking to themselves. :lol:

[Wizard-of-Odd]

I hope no one is referring to the comment I made. If so, please explain why it may of offended. I am starting to get a little gun shy. Maybe I'll just go back to lurking.

Kevin

[DavidB]

I would be amazed if you could but all the parts for less than the prices of the speaker. The cabinets must cost an absolute fortune, I would imagine they are only available from B&W and would cost at least £1000 probably more. The quality and shape of cabinet means they would be very expensive to make. The interesting thing would be how much the tweeter costs in the 802D's compared to the previous generation.

[dan87951]

Anyone upgrade to the new Rochell bass drivers? Just curious how much more they are over the regular 802 drivers?

Where are you getting the tweeter for $89? I called B&W and they wanted over $200? Are you buying just a tweeter diaphram?

[RobP]

I hope no one is referring to the comment I made. If so, please explain why it may of offended. I am starting to get a little gun shy. Maybe I'll just go back to lurking.

Kevin

I dont think your comment was off in any way. Stick around. :

[Karma]

HI All,
Please don't be offended by my comments. It's just that I get a little impatient when folks comment on individual component prices with the implication that the product is overpriced based upon the price of the individual component. They must know that the majority of the cost of any product lies elsewhere. These include marketing, research and development, losses, manufacturing costs, materials, materials research, intermediate markups, and a multitude of other costs that must be passed on to the customer in the form of the final product retail price. Who else are they to be passed to? If they are not, the company goes out of business.

The beauty of capitalism is that competition maintains a check on ripping the customer off. If B&W, or any other company, looses the balance between the perceived benefit to the customer verses the retail price verses profits, all is lost.

But you guys seem to think that if you add up the costs of the drivers, etc. you will come up with a fair price. That cannot be realistic. Don't you know that? Or am I misreading what is implied?

Sparky

[dyazdani]

I don't think anyone is complaining about the price of the speakers. Just making the observation that the drivers are fairly inexpensive compared to the overall cost. The materials + labor + overhead and the desired profit margin for B&W AND THE DEALER have to be added as well.

Can't we all just get along???

[Race Car Driver]

Yes, I know the cabinets are a work of art, and thats where most of the cost comes from, and also R&D, yes I know how capitalism works, ive been in audio (car and home) retail for over 7 years. (the most profitable electronics on the market)
No im not offended, yes im easy to get along with.

I just posted that info, as i have not seen it posted or anyone have the answer when brought up prior, allthough brought up many a time before.
Hence my comment, stating clealy... that a $4000 CABINET uses less then $600 RETAIL in speakers... Now add in the grilles (im sure they are made for next to nothing by the way) crossovers etc... im not stating in the least bit B&W is ripping anyone off.

And a FYI... The mid grill retails for $14 and the larger woofer grill RETAILS for $58.. cost should be in the $5 range... IMO.

So now you all know. And knowing is half the battle!
Enjoy your B&W's I know I do!

[kurtholz]

hey all

i think is is kind of shocking, what there parts cost are, i paid $89 for the tweeters on my 803's, my asw800 speaker was $700, that kind of gets to me a $2200 sub has a $700 main component

them must be some highly paid wood workers over there in China

hahahaha

well, it's been 2 day's, and i havent blown it up yet, but i'm trying

:-)

Kurt

[RebelMan]

I am excited about the low cost of replacement drivers. I like to think of it as a built in insurance policy. The premiums are paid up front and the price of the drivers are the deductables. I would be terrified if I had to replace a $1K diamond driver. I don't think they come insured. :lol:

Thanks for the FYI RCD.

[kurtholz]

true, very true, i gripe about paying $700 to replace a sub speaker ,but if they had said $1200 i would have still paid it

the $89 tweeters are the best deal, i was thinking $400- $500 easy

maybe we are all a bunch of spoiled yankee's , hahahaha

Kurt

[worldys]

just to clarify, i think it is only the voice coil and diaphragm that is 89, if your tweeter gets banged in shipping, it will put you back close to 200 for the complete assembly for the 803-805 tweeter and around 350 for the 800-802 tweeter

my 2c are that this is a business and the perfect business model would charge the maximum the consumer is willing to pay for the product (and be satisfied), irrespective of the cost of production, you can't resent a company for maximizing their revenue at the expense of the consumer, that is their purpose in being

b&w has a nice product that people are willing to pay substantial amonts for, i am personally glad that parts are a fraction of the retail cost, otherwise, buying used speakers without warranty would be a lot riskier and less fun

[Race Car Driver]

When i replaced my tweet, because someone took off the grill and pushed it in, it was $89, un spin the tweet, pop it out of the front holding piece, pop the new one in, plug it in, and spin the new tweet on.

I could see the cost of the whole piece being more, i dont remember the exact price, but I believe the tweet grill was about 25-40, then the assembly it sits in im sure is quite a bit more.

But if you ever blow a tweet, (the most common driver to fail) your out $89 and the $10 flat shipping rate. Not too bad IMO.

[Ryx]

hey all

i think is is kind of shocking, what there parts cost are, i paid $89 for the tweeters on my 803's, my asw800 speaker was $700, that kind of gets to me a $2200 sub has a $700 main component

them must be some highly paid wood workers over there in China

hahahaha

well, it's been 2 day's, and i havent blown it up yet, but i'm trying

:-)

Kurt

Don't forget about the amplifier. IMO the driver and amp are both main components (50-50 for importants). 1000watt of clean power isn't gona come cheap :

also I belive all there cabnets are made in denmark, not China

[RNKC]

Ah well - we're not at this level of the hobby 'cause it's cheap! We're here because we like it (and because we're somewhat addicted ...)

Anyhow, if you add up the pricetag of the parts in a Rolls Royce it probably won't come to that much relative to the actual price of the finished product. That's just the way it is.

Having said that, I once read online that KEF actually makes "better" speakers in terms of construction quality and parts used than B&W. While I took that comment with a grain of salt, the fact remains that B&W might and probably does use at least some relatively inexpensive parts. No real consequence though - the end product sounds perfect and that's truly what matters most.

[peterS]

R+D and 50% margin acount for much of the cost

great craftmanship and drivers but im sure seas are just as nice (same price for raw drivers)

the cabinet construction is somewhat labor intensive too for these guys
the bending of the wood is automated but the fiberglass work is a little more involved

tack on shipping and you've got yourself an expensive speaker

[JürgenW]

When I read this thread I thought about something that happend quite a few years ago. Dutch Apple was selling soft- and hardware for the not continued Apple /// for smashing clearing prices. Someone complaint publically about that Dutch Apple hadn't handled it well, because this and that ...
Dutch Apple reacted with: It was a clearing sale, shouldn't cost us to much. Otherwise we would have thrown it away.
There never was another Dutch Apple action like that one (as far as I know).
What do I want to say with this story? Complaining about the costs for a speaker, because the low costs of replacing parts of a speaker doesn''t lead to cheaper prices for the speaker, but probably to higher prices for the parts. (I'm not saying that the people in this thread are complaining.)
Another thing. Have a look into the demo-dvd by B&W. If it is true that B&W puts so much work in development of speakers as is shown than it's obvious that it has a nice influences on the price of a speaker.

So I'm happy if parts doesn't cost much. I already paid enough for the whole.

[Race Car Driver]

I recieved the driver the other day, still sitting in the box...
And well... it looks like a $178 driver... nothing to special, cast basket and all