B&W XT4

[GregLett]

Has anyone here heard the new XT4 speaker?

[dortiz]

They are playing all day here in my store. I have them on 200 watt mac system.
Are the 800s..no. Are they the best sounding smaller form factor and great styled speaker...yes.
Customers think they are competing with D#f T$4h but they smoke them and kill Bang and oofston.
I had to unplug the subwoofer in the room that was not on to convince a client it was all in the speakers. Great imaging, great sound. A deal. :T

[GregLett]

Now I've got to get to the dealer here! Sounds promising. h:

Thanks.

[MarcoJ]

I have read a review in a german audio magazine (stereo) two months ago and there were very positive about the sound/performance.

[GregLett]

I droped by the dealer on the way home. I didn't have any material, but he threw something on. OK. I'm impressed!! I only listened to two tracks, but
the soundstage was EXPANSIVE, abd the bass surprised me. I'm going back
with some of my material, ASAP. I hope Friday. If I like these, it will end my
WAF woes. She actually likes them.

[Nolan B]

They are playing all day here in my store. I have them on 200 watt mac system.
Are the 800s..no. Are they the best sounding smaller form factor and great styled speaker...yes.
Customers think they are competing with D#f T$4h but they smoke them and kill Bang and oofston.
I had to unplug the subwoofer in the room that was not on to convince a client it was all in the speakers. Great imaging, great sound. A deal. :T

houw would they compare to the FPM 6s? Have you ever hooked those up to the same amp? Just asking becuase they are about the same price and are also speakers that look great..

[dortiz]

houw would they compare to the FPM 6s? Have you ever hooked those up to the same amp? Just asking becuase they are about the same price and are also speakers that look great..

No comparison. The XRT sreally stand alone as a speaker. The FPMs are the best flat panel but are still a small solution. I like them but there is definitely compromise there on a large scale. Again, if I had to go form factor and use a small or flat speaker they would be my choice. The XRTs are a huge step up. In this case they are smaller than big tower speakers but still hang as a full speaker in their own right. If you can step up to them it would really be a huge difference.

[Nolan B]

No comparison. The XRT sreally stand alone as a speaker. The FPMs are the best flat panel but are still a small solution. I like them but there is definitely compromise there on a large scale. Again, if I had to go form factor and use a small or flat speaker they would be my choice. The XRTs are a huge step up. In this case they are smaller than big tower speakers but still hang as a full speaker in their own right. If you can step up to them it would really be a huge difference.

would that be the case if the FPM had a sub like the PV1? Its true the FPMs lack in reaching low frequencies becuase of their size, but for the levels they can reach they are an amazing speaker. Have you had them hooked up to the same amp? just curious. I have mine hooked up to a rotel 1055, and just wondering how much better they can sound.

[dan87951]

My dealer hasn't gotten a set in but I really don't like the looks of them. Kinda pricey too for what you get.

[GregLett]

Well... I think you should, see and hear them first before you make that judgement. It sounds like you haven't seen them in person yet. If you like the "Big" speaker look, you wouldn't like them.
The two tracks I heard on them certainally didn't sound like they were
coming from small speakers. I have to do some more listening next
week, but what I heard so far is good. "big sound" small package.

[DrJRapp]

My dealer hasn't gotten a set in but I really don't like the looks of them. Kinda pricey too for what you get.

Are you talking about pricey for size or their performance? I had a chance to listen to a pair today being driven "only" by a Rotel 1056 (75 wpc) and all I can say is that the bass was impressive. I too asked if there was a subwoofer hidden somewhere. IMHO I don't think they are all that pricey for (B&Ws) and their performance. Sometimes getting the big sound from a smaller package costs.

I was also impressed by the looks and build....very 2005. Nothing gimmicky like the snails or the 1970s R2D2 lok of the 800-802. Very nice techno design that will go well with my Shanling T-100 in my new study/library. I'm going to order a pair.

[RebelMan]

I was also impressed by the looks and build....very 2005. Nothing gimmicky like the snails or the 1970s R2D2 lok of the 800-802. Very nice techno design that will go well with my Shanling T-100 in my new study/library. I'm going to order a pair.

I wondered if you favored the XT series. Does this mean you have decided to forgo the 803Ds?

[DrJRapp]

I wondered if you favored the XT series. Does this mean you have decided to forgo the 803Ds?

Different location. The XT are for my study/library. Due to the addition of a lot of built-ins, my Klipsch Heritage Chorus IIs no longer fit. The XT4 sound surprisingly "big" for their diminutive size, plus the polished aluminum enclosure is just right for the "look" of this room. I just emailed off the order for the XT4s so that my dealer will get me on his list. This really is a bold move for me, I haven't purchased any brand of speaker other that Klipsch for my own personal use since 1990.

I was contemplating the 803d for my theater. I have decided to forgo the 802d or 803d for the time being at least. The small difference in sound (mostly 2 channel imaging) wouldn't justify the differential in price over my Klipsch. Since any change I make I want to be a true upgrade and not just a lateral move I'm waiting for two things to happen before I make any decisions on the theater speakers. 1st, the new Klipsch RF 83 (replacement for the RF7?) are due out in January. Second, the update to the Wilson Sophia is due out any moment. The Sophia's are my current speaker of choice, except I'm not a big fan of their high end. The update is going to give them the tweeters from the Watt Puppy. So i'm waiting to hear if that change helps. The Sophia has a much better (cleaner/tighter) bottom end than an 802, but the top end is way too smooth for my liking, and lacks the "air" that I am seeking. I think that if I am going to spend $12-13K on a pair of speakers then the should be nearly perfect.

[GregLett]

Went back to hear them again. Boy!! They really did a good job on these speakers. I should be picking them up next month.

You get a trully fill range speaker in a small package.

[akhter]

I got a chance to listen to the new xt6, and also the 805, the cm6, and the 602, all basically side by side. The xt6 sounded surprisingly big, and my dealer was saying that the 7 series is going to die pretty soon as the xts are that much of a good value--i can't say i disagree. The sealed design prolly has a lot to do with it. They sounded so BIG. In the end, i would still pick the 805 over any of these as the sound is just an order of magnitude better than any other b&w line, but i was shocked at how good these were.

[GregLett]

The 805 is good, but no Bottom end. I like the full range sound of the XT4, and the price point makes it a great deal. A marked improvement over these would be the 803 or 802.. IMO.

[jim777]

I got a chance to listen to the new xt6, and also the 805, the cm6, and the 602, all basically side by side. The xt6 sounded surprisingly big, and my dealer was saying that the 7 series is going to die pretty soon as the xts are that much of a good value--i can't say i disagree. The sealed design prolly has a lot to do with it. They sounded so BIG. In the end, i would still pick the 805 over any of these as the sound is just an order of magnitude better than any other b&w line, but i was shocked at how good these were.

I'm pretty curious to hear the XT series because my 703's still have the FST and go a bit lower in the bottom end than a XT... but for those with the zen flat screen HDTV look, XT's are the best companion for sure!

[GregLett]

Jim once you hear the XT I think you would have a change of heart about the bottom end. The XT ends my WAF struggles :B you should have heard the insults hurled at the B&W line before she saw the XT.

[DrJRapp]

Jim once you hear the XT I think you would have a change of heart about the bottom end. The XT ends my WAF struggles :B you should have heard the insults hurled at the B&W line before she saw the XT.

Same here.

[tdiciple]

Haven't heard the XT yet, the dealer at my location do not carry the XT.

Does everyone think that XT4 without FST is better than 703 with FST then?

[jim777]

Haven't heard the XT yet, the dealer at my location do not carry the XT.

Does everyone think that XT4 without FST is better than 703 with FST then?

I didn't hear the XT4, but I would find it pretty funny if people start saying that the FST isn't important anymore...

Anyway, my guess is that it will depend on the electronics... the 703 doesn't sound good on some systems (IMO including some or most Rotel). The FST-less B&W's are kind enough to still do something oK with any system. The XT4 may sound less analytical on sub-3000$ electronics (CD+pre+amp).

If I couldn't have buyed a McIntosh MA6500 instead of a RB1070/RC1070 combo, I would have sticked with a FST-less speaker...

[dlam]

xt4 better choice for ht & music

is the xt4 a better choice for ht & 2-channel music than the 805s since it has a reasonable matching center speaker and better bass? is the xt series closer to 7 series & 6 series than the 8 series? thanks.

[GregLett]

Dlam,

I haven't heard on of he speakes in an HT setup. In 2 channel, I would choose
the XT4 over the 805's anyday. I feel the XT4 offers better over all performance.

I haven't heard the 700 or 800 series, but I owned the CDM 7NT. I like
the XT4 better than them.

[tdiciple]

It is just too bad my dealer do not have the XT4. Would love to hear them on and compare them with 804 that I had.

Anyone outthere whom have 804 or 803, would you compare them with the XT4?

[GregLett]

You're not near NYC at all?

[tdiciple]

I am in Oregon, coast to coast to NYC.

[GregLett]

Bummer! You should go to the B&w site and do a dealer search, maybe another dealer in your area would have them.

[Ryx]

I just did a demo of the XT4 speakers today and I must say that anyone who may be interested in these speakes should track down the closest dealer who has a set and give them a listen.
I was blown away by how good these little things really sound! no they don't have the performance of the 802Ds but I found it really hard to belive that what I was hearing was coming from those speakers. (I looked for a hidden sub as many others in this thread say they did as well)

Don't let there size fool you, they really are an amazing speaker in there own right! :T

[Lestat]

Hi, guys.
Found this fora on the net in my search for user impressions of the XT4, as I'm strongly considering getting them to replace my old JBL's. (I know a nearby dealer where I'll arrange for an audition to hear them myself).

What kind of amp would be able to drive these speakers decently? The dealer, when I initially talked with him a couple months back, was very adamant that no surround receiver would be able to drive them properly, without any qualifications. (I.e. no matter what kind of surround amp it was, it wouldn't do a good job, regardless of price).

However, at least initially, I'd like to drive them with my HK AVR-635, and it seemed odd to me that the speakers would be difficult enough to drive that Harman Kardons second largest surround amp wouldn't be able to do at least a decent job - it's only 75x7 watts, but it delivers at least the same current many other 100W+ amps do.

What do you guys think, is it a waste or will it work out? In time I'll probably get an amp stage to drive the fronts, but not right away.

L.

[GregLett]

Lestat,

A surround sound amp would drive them just fine. I heard them with Rotel's receiver, 100W.

[DrJRapp]

Hi, guys.
What do you guys think, is it a waste or will it work out? In time I'll probably get an amp stage to drive the fronts, but not right away.

L.

I auditioned the XT4s with a Rotel RSX 1056 which is only 75 wpc. They did fine in a medium sized room. This is not to say that down the road more power won't be better for you.

[Lestat]

Great, that sounds good. The room they'will be in isn't that large, I'll be sitting about 8 feet from the speakers. With my current speakers (which I think are 89dB sensitivity and I know they're 8 Ohm), I've had no problems with power what so ever, there's plenty of headroom.

I just got a little worried when the salesman started arguing that only high-end stereo amps could drive the speakers, which sounds decidedly odd, since B&W mentions HT as a possible application for the speakers.

Well, I'm certainly looking forward to hearing these speakers next week, it would be great to find such good sound in a smallish cabinet.

L.

[GregLett]

I don't like the sound of that dealer. The XT series comprises all the speakers
needed for a full HT setup. Seems he wants to push a high priced amp on you.
I'm quite sure he'll have them setup on one whe you do the audition. Another option (if he'll let you) is take your amp in and hook it up. A good dealer would let you do that.

[Lestat]

I've asked to have the speakers set up on a NAD with equivalent power to my own amp. The sound won't be quite the same, but it should tell me if they can be driven satisfactory.

I suspect he was critical of Harman Kardon because they don't carry them - the store as a whole is usually very good, but this salesman was a bit obstinate. Among other things he claimed that HK's ratings weren't all channels driven, but that's not true, HK specifically states that they rate all channels driven, as opposed to what many others do.

Anyway, I don't want to derail the thread with talk that belongs in a different fora.

Btw, what is the XT6 akhter was talking about in #15 - a typo or another XT series speaker that's on it's way? I can't find any info on it.

L.

[Ryx]

I would have to think it was a typo. I have not heard of a xt6 model, and considering they just brought the series out I don't think they will be adding to it just yet.
as with many things, the simplest explination is usually the right one!

[Lestat]

Yeah, 's what I thought, only he mentioned XT6 twice, so I though maybe I'd missed something. Doesn't really matter, I couldn't afford a bigger brother to the XT4 anyway.

L.

[akhter]

My (senile ?) dealer kept refering to them as XT6--looking at their website, it it clear that they were XT4s. Now that I think about it, he did confuse some other models numbers as well. Sorry for the confusion.

[bigburner]

I just got a little worried when the salesman started arguing that only high-end stereo amps could drive the speakers

Perhaps that's because the sensitivity of the XT4 is only 86dB? That's pretty inefficient compared to B&W's other models and grossly inefficient compared to the Klipsch range.

[Lestat]

Perhaps that's because the sensitivity of the XT4 is only 86dB? That's pretty inefficient compared to B&W's other models and grossly inefficient compared to the Klipsch range.

True, but I figure that if you don't even have 3dB headroom on your amp (the difference between my 89dB JBL's and the 86dB XT4's), then you're probably not going to be satisfied with most other speakers either. After all, 3dB is about the smallest volume change that everyone can recognize, so it's not exactly huge.

On the positive side, AFAIK lower sensitivity also means that the speakers aren't as sensitive to noise from the amp.

L.

[GregLett]

Well I'll get to hear how it performs on my old 120W Rotel in 23 days :B

[Lestat]

Well, I've auditioned the XT4's. They were hooked up to a C352 and a high-end Denon CD-player, don't recall the model.

I can affirm that they do indeed have a very impressive low end for such small (cabinet-wise) speakers. Very nice sound too.
One thing that no one has mentioned, but that I immediately noticed was that the soundstage was... wide! The sound was huge, much larger than I expected. It was decidedly hard to place the speakers as sources, it sounded more like one large speaker covering the entire front stage.
The instruments were easy to place, very good stereo seperation, so the sound wasn't diffuse. I actually like not being able to accurately place the source of the sound - ideally we want the soundstage to sound coheret and not like it's coming from two speakers on our right and left.

I listened to Dire Straits - Private Investigation, Tori Amos - Tales of the Librarian and Under Byen - Det er mig der... (Danish band that has a great grungy style with a large variaty of non-standard instruments - and they don't use guitars at all).
Private Investigations has a very wide dynamic range and from 3:00 and forward is a great test of how the speaker handles the highend with some accoustic guitar.
Under Byen has a song called "Mission" that has a very deep bass sort of organ like. (Not pumping techno-bass). The bass makes the song a good indicator of how the speakers handle the low end, and the XT4's did admirably with no muddying of the sound.
Finally Tori Amos has some songs that have a very wide dynamic range as well as a great voice. Again the XT4's did fine.

I think I'm going to order a couple of XT4's in the beginning of next month. I only got about 30 minutes with them in the store, but they really sound nice. The C352 had no problems driving them, despite being only 80W stereo. I'm sure a larger amp would have more control over the XT4's driving them to even more impressive heights, but it is definitely not a requirement for great sound. At some point I'm going to supplement my AVR-635 with a 2-channel amp for the fronts, but I don't feel like I need to do so in order to enjoy the speakers, which is nice.

L.

[GregLett]

Gald you got a chance to listen. I did mention that the sound stage was expansive in an earlier post. Great little speakers aren't they :B

[Lestat]

Gald you got a chance to listen. I did mention that the sound stage was expansive in an earlier post. Great little speakers aren't they :B

Sorry, missed that. But yeah, really impressive speakers. They aren't small per se, they are almost 115cm tall, but they are just so slim they disappear. Which is great for the WAF, and for smaller livingrooms like mine.
Can't wait to get them into the room and hear them on my HK setup.

L.

[Ryx]

I too noticed how wide the soundstage was. when I did my demo, there was a set of 703s well to the outsides of the XT4s and you would have sworn the sound was coming from the 703s, just because of how far outside of the XT4s the soundstage reached. (turns out the 703s wern't even wired up lol)

When I first saw the new series on the net I never would have thought they could sound that good, nor was I ever interested in getting a set of speakers like them. however after hearing a set I find myself seriously considering an upgrade from my 600 series setup to a XT setup which really would be an upgrade! (posably build a seperate 2 channel setup with the XT4s as the 600's do a fine job of movies for now)

[hemgath]

Hello all.
I notice yu speack a lot about my future choise for hifi/hc (xt4/xt2/xtc).
But my choice is actualy on the amplifier.
Actually i had a AVR 507 l.e (i think it's a french model for 50 anniversary of harman&Kardon, it's a 7x50 w hc amplifier) i want to keep it for control my future power amp.

My choice for the system is:
- Rotel RB 1080 for the 2 XT4
- RMB 1066 for XTC and the 2 XT2.

Because it's really hard to heard this type of system near my location, i need a pro advice (about the choice of the 2 powers ampli, the sound and the power)

Really thx