Denon AVR3805 + Rotel RMB1075/1095 combo to drive my B&W's?

[Incognito]

Hello everyone,

I bought the following set of B&W speakers about a year ago:
B&W DM604s3 fronts
B&W DM602s3 rears
B&W LCR600 center

Right now these speakers are driven by a Denon AVR3805. Now I am thinking of buying a Poweramp and using my Denon as a preamp.

Now I hope some of you can help me with awnsering the following questions:
- Will the Denon be a ok preamp, or is the Rotel RSP-1068 a lot better?
- In which extend will the Rotel RMB1095 be better in my application than the Rotel RMB1075, concerning the rather large difference in price?
- Other suggestions for similar priced poweramps?

Thnx a lot for your awnsers and time

Hope to hear from you soon.

[grit]

I found there was a WORLD of difference in quality between my old Denon equipment and Rotel's equipment, including processor, amp, etc. For the speakers you have, I think the 1075 will drive them just fine. I'd test the 1068 vs your Denon. Either get the 1068 loaned to you for a few days to test it in home (best option) or bring your Denon to the dealer and A/B test it there. Be sure to use the 1075 amp in both cases.

[Incognito]

Thnx for your reply grit. I'm actually quite curious about the difference in my Denon & the Rotel RSP1068. Somebody told me the Denon actually has better Dacs than the Rotel does. For the RMB1075; that does make a world of difference for sure! I heard the pair of the RSP1068 & the RMB1075, and they really made my 604's sing, now I hope the AVR3805 is as capable as the RSP1068 is.

Which Denon equipment did you have before Grit, and did you ever test it as a preamp on your Rotel?

[grit]

I believe it was the 2804? 2605? Something to that effect. I was in the $800 price range. I heard it try to drive 803's, and the 803's sounded no better than the $500/pair Boston Acoustics I had at the time. I blame the vast majority of that on the amplifier.

As far as processors go for 2-ch analog, I'm surprised how much a piece of hardware can make. Speaker wires, interconnects, dedicated CD players... all have a definite affect.

My dealer TRIED to tell me to just replace ONE thing at a time, and I would enjoy and appreciate each upgrade. Oh how right he was. If I was in yer shoes, I'd buy the 1075 and see how you enjoy it. After the holidays are over, re-evaluate and see what's most important to you. Then look to upgrading that piece.

For me, 2-ch music is now FAR more important. At the time, I almost didn't care about music and just wanted a good HT system. I still think you'd really appreciate the difference the 1068 offers.

Oh, and something else. Get one of the calibration DVDs and a SPL meter from radio shack (or whereever) and play with the settings. I was surprised at what a difference that can make!

[Incognito]

I guess the 1075 should be it for now. After reading about the 1077 I got quite excited, but well, that's double the price too. Actually, I do listen a lot of 2-ch music, though, since surround on the Denon is better than 2-ch, I listen to 5 channel surround mainly.

For the calibration; that's the only thing that I can actually tell about the Denon that's awesome. It has a calibration mic so it does the calibration itself. The thing is though, this one actually works =D. I had a salesman from the store I bought my exuipment over at my place, and he was stunned by the difference it made. The receiver actually could determine the position of the speakers exactly (to the inch) from where I setup the microphone =P.

Thnx again for your reply.

[PewterTA]

You still can calibrate the speakers better than the Denon can. All you need is a sound meter... and it will sound better.

The Auto/mic calibration is okay...but doesn't beat doing it yourself. You still get a much better sound...but it (auto) takes some of the work out for you (ie inputing distances and the like).

The 1077 is a masterful piece of equipment...but yes, it is a lot more price wise. You might be better off (if just wanting two or three channels done), waiting for rotel's more power 2ch/mono block when they release them. Or hit up the NuForce amps... they are awesome. ;x(

[SRT-10 Viper]

PewterTA... What happened to your car?

[Incognito]

Is that with the Yamaha or have you experienced the Denon yourself? In comparisons the auto setup of the Denon came out almost flawless, while the Yamaha didnt... But you might be right that a soundmeter can improve the last bits, won't disagree with you at all there.

Anyway, what do you think the 2ch digital rotel amp would cost, and what do the NuForce amps cost? Since my budget is quite tight at the moment, I guess I'd better try the most reasonable solution right now (I guess the RMB1075), and make a bigger hit afterwards. What do you think?

On the other hand... I can get the RMB1075 for a bit over 1000 euros, while it retails for I think 1600? If I might aswel get such a deal on the 1077, let's say around 1700 (have to give it a talk), I might aswel make the big hit right away =P

[thyname]

PewterTA... What happened to your car?

Really Dan (PewterTA), what happened to your car? Are you OK?

Have you heard NuForce digital amps for yourself? I have read good things about them.

[grit]

Is that with the Yamaha or have you experienced the Denon yourself? In comparisons the auto setup of the Denon came out almost flawless, while the Yamaha didnt... But you might be right that a soundmeter can improve the last bits, won't disagree with you at all there.

I bought a Denon (forget the model, again, around $800 price tag) in Oct of last year and let it try its thing with auto config. Then I re-did it myself and got better results. My guess is that auto config works better with particular room acoustics and equipment than with others, since it worked well for you.

For me though, one of the most entertaining parts is configuing everything by hand anyway, so the auto config took some of the fun outta it.

[Incognito]

That must be the AVR3805 then, I don't think cheaper models from Denon come with the auto config. But well, thnx for the remark, I guess I still could try a SPL-meter then, see how that works out then. Thnx!

[RobP]

Guys, does the Denon self calibration use a mic that resides in the unit itself or do you attach a mic and place it in your listening posistion? The reason that I ask is that you would want to calibrate your system from the point that you will be listening, not at the unit. That would be more acurate.

[PewterTA]

Yep I'm invincible!!!! lol...

No, really I'm O-kay luckily...

An 18 wheeler ran a red light right outside of where I work. I was going to lunch, sitting at the light, making a left. He goes through the red light and T-bones the car, and pushes it about 15 to 30 feet down the road. About 10K damage to the car (all cosmetic it appears -- which I'll take that over engine/trans damage). So car is getting worked on to be fixed hopefully by 2nd week of November... and we'll see how I like it as to what all I get done with it. I think about 700HP should make me feel better.

But I got out with only a minor scratch on my right hand with it being down on the shifter from flying glass. Minor soreness in the neck, shoulders area (to be expected)...but the seat and seatbelt kept me firmly in place so I didn't even notice the hit at all. I didn't see it coming so that helped me not tense up for the hit.

So I think I won that battle! lol

Just sucks that it was my baby that got hurt, it's a 2002 WS6 with only 15K on it...garage kept and everything. Oh well, now the fun modding starts (moreso that what I had done). Long Tubes, ORY pipe, and Cam sound like a good place to start.

Thanks for the concerns everyone, that's got me all choked up. Very nice of you all and makes me happy I'm a part of this community.

------------------------
I have heard the NuForce amp and was completely impressed by it. It sounds as good as the highest end Bryston, Krell, Classe, etc amps...but at a fraction of the cost... I think the Digital switching amp age will definitely be a good thing. Once everyone gets past the whole, "there's no way a small unit like this can put out that kind of sound," phobia... hee hee. The only thing I have to say is the digital switching amps seem a slight bit more forward and "in your face" than some of the more laid back amps. Sort of like what some people think about the "Rotel sound."

But over all... very very good. I'd definitely try to find someone around you that has/sells the NuForce and take a listen...I think you'll be amazed.

I'm waiting to see what Rotel puts out in their line up to decide if I switch to the Rotel or NuForce amp from my current RMB-1095/1080 combo.

[PewterTA]

Guys, does the Denon self calibration use a mic that resides in the unit itself or do you attach a mic and place it in your listening posistion? The reason that I ask is that you would want to calibrate your system from the point that you will be listening, not at the unit. That would be more acurate.

You take the mic and put it in the listening position...the big problem is they aren't going to give you the best mic. And in the case of both Denon and Yamaha, it just sits at your location, where it would probably work better on a tripod or something facing the front angled up (like when you calibrate).

[PewterTA]

Anyway, what do you think the 2ch digital rotel amp would cost, and what do the NuForce amps cost? Since my budget is quite tight at the moment, I guess I'd better try the most reasonable solution right now (I guess the RMB1075), and make a bigger hit afterwards. What do you think?

On the other hand... I can get the RMB1075 for a bit over 1000 euros, while it retails for I think 1600? If I might aswel get such a deal on the 1077, let's say around 1700 (have to give it a talk), I might aswel make the big hit right away =P

I'm not sure on the cost of the Rotel's digital amps, but I'm sure they will be up there, but not out of range of the current amps... As far as the Nuforce, to get the best prices I'd contact NextLevelAV.com (site sponsor), Jim (Piscitello) and Andrew (Pratt) are great people and will give you a heck of a deal!

I would say shoot for the 1077, it will definitely give you more than the 1075 would... as it's a closer (and probably still better) than the 1095 (plus gives you two more channels).

[thyname]

Great to hear you were lucky in that accident!!