AVR-3805 full fledged reviews available?

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  • geirove
    Junior Member
    • Apr 2004
    • 9

    AVR-3805 full fledged reviews available?

    Hello,

    I have seen Kevin's mini review. I am an electrical engineer, but not being very much into Receiver / Multi channel recveivers I have a lot to learn :-)

    Are there any full reviews out there? Which site would provide good reviews? Links please.

    Geir Ove
  • George Bellefontaine
    Moderator Emeritus
    • Jan 2001
    • 7637

    #2
    Try this site. It used to be a good one. The reviews are user reviews. Not sure if there any on the 3805, but worth a try:

    AudioReview brings you user reviews and editorial reviews on speakers, amps, TVs and audio equipment reviews, news, forums, and used audio equipment listings and more.





    My Homepage!
    My Homepage!

    Comment

    • geirove
      Junior Member
      • Apr 2004
      • 9

      #3
      Hello,

      Thanks. There where no user reviews; no suprise since the 3805 is not even available yet in Norway where I live. I also prefert a "pro" review, allthough I know they alo vary a lot in quality.


      Geir Ove

      Comment

      • Kevin P
        Member
        • Aug 2000
        • 10809

        #4
        If you can't find any full fledged reviews and have questions about the 3805, go ahead and ask me. I tried to keep my review brief on purpose, but I probably know more about it than my review would indicate.

        Note that I don't have the 3805 on me anymore so I can't test out features that I didn't test while I had it, but I'll do my best to answer any questions you may have about it (at least, I'll be honest if I don't have the answer)

        KJP




        Official Computer Geek and Techno-Wiz Guru of HTGuide - Visit Tower of Power
        My HT Site

        Comment

        • geirove
          Junior Member
          • Apr 2004
          • 9

          #5
          Hello,

          Thanks a lot Kevin. Problem is, there's so much to learn about these Multi Channel Receivers, that I don't know where to start :?

          Let me try though: I will use the receiver for DVD (film and music) and CD music listening. I will have to invest in speakers as well.

          Questions:

          1) Is the 3805 missing any essential Surround Formats ? (I don't currently know the names of all of them)

          2) Speakers: Is there a good, commonly available Speaker Package (5.1) available at a max price of let's say $3000? What do you recomend?

          3) Hear a lot of: "Surround receivers can't do Stereo". From an Electrical Engineers tech. point of view, there is of course no reason why it HAS to be like that, but maybe cost will cause each amplifier stage to be less good in a multichannel amp. What I am getting at is: On a scale from 1-10, where 10 is perfect stereo, where would you place the 3805 in 2 channel stereo mode?

          4) How good is the auto calibration of the 3805?
          Is the microphone included, or can any mic. with the correct impedance be used?

          5) Since the 3805 auto calibration not only adjusts levels, but also cross over frequecies AND Q-value (widht of filters), I would guess the calibration routine should be able to get the best out of the Speaker+ Room + Amplifier combination. Any comment on this?


          Thanks in advance for all your help.

          Geir Ove

          Comment

          • Kevin P
            Member
            • Aug 2000
            • 10809

            #6
            Originally posted by geirove
            1) Is the 3805 missing any essential Surround Formats ? (I don't currently know the names of all of them)
            The 3805 is a brand new model and supports all the current surround formats, including ProLogic IIx and DTS 96/24. It even offers Denon Link, a proprietary digital input that allows digital audio connection to Denon DVD-A and (eventually) SACD players.
            2) Speakers: Is there a good, commonly available Speaker Package (5.1) available at a max price of let's say $3000? What do you recomend?
            Speakers are largely personal items, as different people have different tastes and requirements. I can't say that "you should get brand X or model Y" since you may like brand Z more than brand X, which is my preference. The best bet for speakers is to listen to them with familiar material for a few hours, so you can get a feel for the sound of the speakers. If you can trial them at home (say with a return policy), that's even better.
            3) Hear a lot of: "Surround receivers can't do Stereo". From an Electrical Engineers tech. point of view, there is of course no reason why it HAS to be like that, but maybe cost will cause each amplifier stage to be less good in a multichannel amp. What I am getting at is: On a scale from 1-10, where 10 is perfect stereo, where would you place the 3805 in 2 channel stereo mode?
            Well, there are a lot of things that can affect a receiver's musical performance. Note I say musical, and not "stereo" per se since it affects performance for multi-channel as well, but stereo music has a tendency to reveal weaknesses in sound quality that aren't as readily noticed when playing movies.

            One factor is the receiver's digital processing. All home theater receivers process the signal in a digital form (meaning, when you feed an analog signal in, it's converted to digital, processed in some way, and then converted back to analog). When using high resolution analog sources (e.g. SACD, DVD-Audio or vinyl) you lose some of that purity in the conversion. The digital circuits operate at high frequencies and can introduce noise into the analog circuits as well. In addition, HT receivers have video switching circuits that can introduce noise as well. Many of the better receivers, such as the Denon 3805, offer a "Direct" mode that bypass most or all of the digital processing for purer stereo sound. "Pure Direct" goes a step further by switching off the video circuitry and even the front panel display to minimize sources of noise.

            Last but not least, is the performance of the amplifiers within a HT receiver. Modern HT receivers cram 5, 6, or 7 channels of amplification into the same chassis as the preamp, digital signal processor, video switchers, and power supply. To keep the cost within reason, the amps in most receivers aren't as high quality as outboard dedicated amps. Loss of detail and imaging can result from crosstalk between the channels as well, due to the close proximity of the circuits and inadequate power supply filtering.

            Would it be possible to create a HT receiver with top notch 2 channel audio performance? Sure, but it would cost as much if not more than separates of equal quality currently available. Chances are such a receiver wouldn't sell well enough to justify the cost of manufacturing it. After all, most people who buy multichannel receivers either don't care about sound quality (they're probably hooking them up to Bose systems) or aren't going to use it for critical 2 channel listening anyway.
            4) How good is the auto calibration of the 3805? Is the microphone included, or can any mic. with the correct impedance be used?
            I didn't try the auto calibration, as the microphone isn't included. It is sold separately. There is a section in the manual on using other mics but I didn't read up on it.
            5) Since the 3805 auto calibration not only adjusts levels, but also cross over frequecies AND Q-value (widht of filters), I would guess the calibration routine should be able to get the best out of the Speaker+ Room + Amplifier combination. Any comment on this?
            In theory it should, but it depends on how well it's impemented, how accurate the microphone is, how well placed the mic is when running the calibration, and how much precision is available in the equalization filter settings. It's probably a good feature for the newbie who otherwise wouldn't even bother balancing the speaker levels, but chances are anyone who knows how to use a RadioShack SPL meter to calibrate a home theater could do a better job than the auto calibration.




            Official Computer Geek and Techno-Wiz Guru of HTGuide - Visit Tower of Power
            My HT Site

            Comment

            • geirove
              Junior Member
              • Apr 2004
              • 9

              #7
              Hello,

              and thanks a LOT for a detailed answer :-).

              I do understand that speaker selection is a peronal choice, but what is your choice anyway?

              I would alao be keen to know where you place the 2-channel (and multi-channel) performance of the 3805 on a scale from 1 - 10 ?

              Geir Ove

              Comment

              • aud19
                Twin Moderator Emeritus
                • Aug 2003
                • 16706

                #8
                Geir, you may want to start a seperate thread on recommended speakers to get more responses. Letting us know what percentage of music vs. movies they'll be used for and your taste in music/movies as well. But I'll throw some of my favourites out there

                I'm a huge Energy Fan and totally recommend a bookshelf system of Connoisseurs http://www.energy-speakers.com/conno...speakers1.html (6-C-3's would be nice :P ) Energy, IMO, has one of the best tweeters out there for the money and they make great speakers. Then add an Adire, SVS, HSU, Velodyne, Paradigm or JBL sub for the bottom.

                Other speaker company's to look at B&W, Athena, PSB, Totem and Paradigm.

                Jason




                Need a new display? Questions about new display technologies? Visit RPTVs, plasmas, and other monitors @ HTguide
                Jason

                Comment

                • mwc
                  Junior Member
                  • May 2004
                  • 5

                  #9
                  Trigger thing

                  Hi Kevin,

                  At the risk of sounding like a newbie, could you tell me what the "trigger" option on the 3805 is about. Thanks!

                  Comment

                  • Kevin P
                    Member
                    • Aug 2000
                    • 10809

                    #10
                    Re: Trigger thing

                    Originally posted by mwc
                    Hi Kevin,

                    At the risk of sounding like a newbie, could you tell me what the "trigger" option on the 3805 is about. Thanks!
                    The 3805 has two trigger outputs that can be used to trigger (turn on) external amplifiers when the 3805 is turned on. The triggers can be configured to turn on either with the main 3805 or the secondary zones.

                    Comment

                    • mwc
                      Junior Member
                      • May 2004
                      • 5

                      #11
                      I do have the "main speaker" pre outs hooked up to an external amp(Odyssey Stratos) that I have been leaving on all the time. I presume that I could just plug it into the back of the 3805 rather than the wall plug and it will shut down and power up along with the 3805. This will be very useful. Thanks for the reply.

                      Comment

                      • Kevin P
                        Member
                        • Aug 2000
                        • 10809

                        #12
                        Originally posted by mwc
                        I do have the "main speaker" pre outs hooked up to an external amp(Odyssey Stratos) that I have been leaving on all the time. I presume that I could just plug it into the back of the 3805 rather than the wall plug and it will shut down and power up along with the 3805. This will be very useful. Thanks for the reply.
                        I wouldn't do that... the switched outlets on the back of the 3805 are only rated for 1 amp (120 watts). If your Stratos has a trigger input, connect it to the trigger output on the Denon and then they'll turn on together. But keep the amp plugged into the wall, not the 3805.

                        Comment

                        • mwc
                          Junior Member
                          • May 2004
                          • 5

                          #13
                          oops. I misunderstood about the trigger thing. I still don't know what it is. So I gather it has nothing to do with the power input sockets on the back of the 3805?

                          Comment

                          • Kevin P
                            Member
                            • Aug 2000
                            • 10809

                            #14
                            The 3805 has two switched outlets, which are regular power outlets that you can plug other components into, up to 1 amp (120 watts). They are useful, say for an older CD player or tape deck that doesn't have a remote power-on. However, amps draw too much current for the switched outlet to provide, so the 3805 also has trigger outputs. These are miniplug jacks that look like Walkman headphone jacks. This is connected with a mini-plug cable to a corresponding trigger input on your amp(s). This activates a relay in the amp, which turns the amp on and off along with the receiver.

                            Comment

                            • mwc
                              Junior Member
                              • May 2004
                              • 5

                              #15
                              Ah. Now I get it. Thanks!

                              Comment

                              • audiofan
                                Senior Member
                                • May 2004
                                • 272

                                #16
                                Kevin,
                                I have 3805 and i like it. I'm not an audiophile , but i like clean sound when listening to music. So, which 2 channel Amp. do you suggest so that I can pair with 3805?
                                thanks.

                                Comment

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