CP-700 vs. SSP-800 Two Channel sound

[FALCODEAN]

Dear Classe members,
I am currently a two channel only listener with the following set-up:
CDP 502
CP 700
2x CAM 400
My question is whether the SSP 800 would deliver the same two channel sound that the CP 700 delivers (as I am looking int HT options).
Falcodean

[aarsoe]

Funny, as I am wondering the same.

I asked B&W in UK and they stated that the SPP-800 is definitely better than the CP-500 in two channel - so I am guessing at least at par with CP-700 or better.
I would add, hopefully better, as I am not to convinced about Classé preamp's compared to say Krell or ML.

However anybody with real experience, please share..

[sikoniko]

Funny, as I am wondering the same.

I asked B&W in UK and they stated that the SPP-800 is definitely better than the CP-500 in two channel - so I am guessing at least at par with CP-700 or better.
I would add, hopefully better, as I am not to convinced about Classé preamp's compared to say Krell or ML.

However anybody with real experience, please share..

I've heard that one is not necessarily better than the other, they are different. It will come down to personal taste.

[rickc]

Keep your your CP700 and buy a used SSP600 or SSP800 and use the bypass. That is what I did. I also have the CAM 400's and a 5200 with all B&W speakers. I am close to buying a new TT (Clear audio or basis) and I Just ordered a Grand Prix Rack

BTW:

How do you like your 502? I have a CDP300 and may just end up buyng a demo CP202. That is the same CD that you have in you 502.

[sikoniko]

Keep your your CP700 and buy a used SSP600 or SSP800 and use the bypass. That is what I did. I also have the CAM 400's and a 5200 with all B&W speakers. I am close to buying a new TT (Clear audio or basis) and I Just ordered a Grand Prix Rack

BTW:

How do you like your 502? I have a CDP300 and may just end up buyng a demo CP202. That is the same CD that you have in you 502.

I'm sorry, but this is bad advice.

The CP-700 sells to a customer that wants pure analog. This customer uses analog from the CDP to the CP and gets the purist signal from his/her DAC's that are built on the CDP. The CP-700 also fits for a customer that wants to add the phono preamp and enjoy the vinyl collection. The HT by-pass was tested by a previous member, and while it works, was not a pure signal. This person chose to use the seperate inputs on his amps and plug the CP-700 directly into the amps in the XLR inputs, and the SSP-300 into the SE inputs.

The SSP-800 has an excellent bypass, while offering top quality DAC's on board. This product will attract the customer that wants a nice transport to attach to a system that can deliver the highest quality experience. The SSP-800 also offers world-class HT experience, that in my experience has yet to be rivalled in aural nirvanna.

My recommendation would be to sell your CDP-502 and CP-700 and buy the SSP-800 and a decent transport/ catalog system such as the Sonos or Slim options. My friend who had the CP-700 mentioned above sold his CDP-202/CP-700 in favor of the SSP-800 and has never looked back. He directly A/b both systems and often found himself unable to determine which was playing at any given time.

[rickc]

Sonnnico:

We went thru this ridicules chatter last time. Everyone on this sight is looking for advice and then they make decisions based on what they hear from the forum and their dealers etc. It seems that most of the Classe users on this site are interested in surround sound versus dedicated two channel. This guy has a great dedicated two channel start with the Classe mono blocks and CP700. He needs to get a turntable and he will have everything that he needs for great two channel sound.

Go into any high end audio dealer and none of them have an SSP of any brand (even if it was a SSP800) as their reference two channel front end. Going with separate purpose built equipment is the best way to go versus an all in one box like the SSP800.

I would also challenge your remarks about a pure siginal in the SSP mode? If you have your source pluged into the CP700 it does not have anything to do with the SSP from a two channel perspective. High end two channel (in my opinion still sounds much better then any SS siginal if it is set up correctly)

Just my two cents

[alebonau]

Sonnnico:

We went thru this ridicules chatter last time. Everyone on this sight is looking for advice and then they make decisions based on what they hear from the forum and their dealers etc. It seems that most of the Classe users on this site are interested in surround sound versus dedicated two channel. This guy has a great dedicated two channel start with the Classe mono blocks and CP700. He needs to get a turntable and he will have everything that he needs for great two channel sound.

Go into any high end audio dealer and none of them have an SSP of any brand (even if it was a SSP800) as their reference two channel front end. Going with separate purpose built equipment is the best way to go versus an all in one box like the SSP800.

I would also challenge your remarks about a pure siginal in the SSP mode? If you have your source pluged into the CP700 it does not have anything to do with the SSP from a two channel perspective. High end two channel (in my opinion still sounds much better then any SS siginal if it is set up correctly)

Just my two cents

I agree,

my cousin went down this path with extensive auditioning and the classe cp700 definitely a better choice for 2ch analog and is superb partnered with the very nice classe cd player and power amps.

[sikoniko]

Dear Classe members,
I am currently a two channel only listener with the following set-up:
CDP 502
CP 700
2x CAM 400
My question is whether the SSP 800 would deliver the same two channel sound that the CP 700 delivers (as I am looking int HT options).
Falcodean

Sonnnico:

We went thru this ridicules chatter last time. Everyone on this sight is looking for advice and then they make decisions based on what they hear from the forum and their dealers etc. It seems that most of the Classe users on this site are interested in surround sound versus dedicated two channel. This guy has a great dedicated two channel start with the Classe mono blocks and CP700. He needs to get a turntable and he will have everything that he needs for great two channel sound.

We did go down this path before. perhaps you should reread what the OP said. I highlighted it in bold since you didn't notice it.

BTW, you are flat out wrong and don't know what you are talking about. We did go down this road before and you based your opinion on your dealers recommendation, and not your own listening experience.

Next time, LISTEN to a product before judging it. The SSP-600 is inferior to the SSP-800 in every way. How do I know? Because I owned one. I didn't go off of heresay.

Go into any high end audio dealer and none of them have an SSP of any brand (even if it was a SSP800) as their reference two channel front end. Going with separate purpose built equipment is the best way to go versus an all in one box like the SSP800.
Just my two cents

first of all, a sales persons motive is to sell. In the case of "high-end" it is low quantity, high profit margin. Define "high-end" for me. When I think "high-end" I think half a million dollar systems that are custom built for an environment - think or brands like CAT. I don't think of Classe as "high-end". no, they would not have an SSP, because it does not have the profit margin or snob points of a "high-end" 2 channel pre. NOT because it cannot compete.

I would also challenge your remarks about a pure siginal in the SSP mode? If you have your source pluged into the CP700 it does not have anything to do with the SSP from a two channel perspective. High end two channel (in my opinion still sounds much better then any SS siginal if it is set up correctly)

fine, challenge them. where does that get us? a staring contest? who will blink first? 8O

Technology is changing. We no longer listen to 8-tracks. It's time you open your mind.

btw, your pure 2 channel idealogy only works in a dedicated system, not a hybrid. If you build a hybrid, you are making compromises on both systems...

[sikoniko]

I agree,

my cousin went down this path with extensive auditioning and the classe cp700 definitely a better choice for 2ch analog and is superb partnered with the very nice classe cd player and power amps.

I agree, if ones motive is 2ch analog. The problem is, that is the old paradigm. It is time for people to open their mind to the new possibilities of technology.

[style]

Hi,

for a purist 2 channel lovers is not a easy&simply choice
every person have at tv at home and today or tomorow the lust to see a mowie with a plasma that is in the livingroom run!

2 system or a 1 with the HC inside?? well the SSP800 is not a entry level to see a movie... a CP700 is sure not better vs. the SSP and v.v..
the 2 units are great, one have what the other dont's have, don't can.
(CP500 is SURE not at the level from the SSP, the CP700 is priced the douple and only for to the the best model in the catalog..)
for a 2 channel system CP700, CAM400 and B&W or others speakers is a superb system, ANALOG system! the cd player I dont will go with a 502..but this is another story...
If you DON'T have any intention the a future HT the CP700 ( :cry: )is a good choice. the magazine go write that the SSP800&CA5200 is "finally a system for the Music (at first) and movie) but I mus say that the CD700 is your choice.

Style

[lawoftrust]

@FALCODEAN

I would clearly follow the route of keeping the the CP700 and adding an SSP 800 using the Bypass function when listening to multichannel. Why? Becuase my comparisons clearly showed my that the CP700 is that bit better than the SSP800 for stereo listening. The SSP is an enormous package of processor for multichannel + high end stereo qualities but it is not top notch as the CP 700 is. Apart from this, the sound between SSP 800 and CP 700 is very different. If you like your CP 700 it might well be that you will not like what the SSP 800 does. It might of course also be vice versa. But that is just regarding the kind of presentation of the sound, overall, and hereby trying to be as objective as possible, I dem the CP 700 superior to the SSP800 in 2 channel .

[sikoniko]

@FALCODEAN

I would clearly follow the route of keeping the the CP700 and adding an SSP 800 using the Bypass function when listening to multichannel. Why? Becuase my comparisons clearly showed my that the CP700 is that bit better than the SSP800 for stereo listening. The SSP is an enormous package of processor for multichannel + high end stereo qualities but it is not top notch as the CP 700 is. Apart from this, the sound between SSP 800 and CP 700 is very different. If you like your CP 700 it might well be that you will not like what the SSP 800 does. It might of course also be vice versa. But that is just regarding the kind of presentation of the sound, overall, and hereby trying to be as objective as possible, I dem the CP 700 superior to the SSP800 in 2 channel .

I think you echo my original reply. They are different and one may prefer one to the other. which one will be subjective to the listener.

[style]

Hi sikoniko,

I agree with you but a 2 channel system i was my system don't go sure with a CP700 !!

have you sure listen a grest 2 channel with a preampli analog like Nagra, A.Arts,
Accuphase, Bustmester,A.Research,Ayre,Passlabs,VTL ... pre with valves,...:the CP700 and the SSP don't have any chance!!!

Sikoniko I'm a big fans for Classe but the evidence is really clear!!!

Style

[sikoniko]

Hi sikoniko,

I agree with you but a 2 channel system i was my system don't go sure with a CP700 !!

have you sure listen a grest 2 channel with a preampli analog like Nagra, A.Arts,
Accuphase, Bustmester,A.Research,Ayre,Passlabs,VTL ... pre with valves,...:the CP700 and the SSP don't have any chance!!!

Sikoniko I'm a big fans for Classe but the evidence is really clear!!!

Style

If I was building a dedicated 2channel system, I would struggle in choosing between classe and BAT. They both have their strengths.

[alebonau]

~

btw, your pure 2 channel idealogy only works in a dedicated system, not a hybrid. If you build a hybrid, you are making compromises on both systems...

this comment of yours to rikc is extremely flawed. I have heard and know I dont know how many people with hybrid combined 2ch / ht systems its not funny. I own one myself and basically it is 2 separate systems that basically coexist to give you the best of both worlds without compromising either. If you think it compromises either in anyway I dont think you have either set them up properly or ever experienced any thing decent.

as far as the cp700 I have heard it for pure analog in a full classe system with my cousin and no the 800 doesnt compare in the least for this purpose. if you are think the htbypass introduces some compromise another option is the twin switchable inputs most classe power amps you. you can hook up both a stereo pre amp and av amp to either input and that will serve the same purpose in a dual 2ch av system without compromise.

I an only imagine that those considering that a ssp like the 800 is at the pinnacle of 2ch av and not worth considering anything else perhaps have just not experienced anything else which is land locking their thinking :B

[sikoniko]

this comment of yours to rikc is extremely flawed. I have heard and know I dont know how many people with hybrid combined 2ch / ht systems its not funny. I own one myself and basically it is 2 separate systems that basically coexist to give you the best of both worlds without compromising either. If you think it compromises either in anyway I dont think you have either set them up properly or ever experienced any thing decent.

thats what you get for thinking.

as far as the cp700 I have heard it for pure analog in a full classe system with my cousin and no the 800 doesnt compare in the least for this purpose. if you are think the htbypass introduces some compromise another option is the twin switchable inputs most classe power amps you. you can hook up both a stereo pre amp and av amp to either input and that will serve the same purpose in a dual 2ch av system without compromise.

I believe I stated your option in my original post. However, I'm happy you heard the CP700. You do not state that you have heard the SSP-800 so you are basically talking out your ass. pretty typical of you.

I an only imagine that those considering that a ssp like the 800 is at the pinnacle of 2ch av and not worth considering anything else perhaps have just not experienced anything else which is land locking their thinking :B

noone said the SSP-800 is the pinnacle of anything. I would wager to put it up against systems many times its price and summize that it would hold its own.

people should always consider options. there are many successful brands because there are many different tastes. And noones tastes are wrong. they are their own.

from an economical standpoint, unless you have money to burn, my opinion is that an SSP-800 for both HT and 2 channel is a high-value proposition that has a greater ROI for 90% of audiophiles than having a seperate 2ch preamp. So, if money is no object, I recommend looking to a custom CAT system (speakers and electronics made custom to your environment at the time of purchase) and forgo classe alltogether. If someone wants to keep their CP-700 and add an SSP-800, I say go for it. But realize the differences are small and you might find you prefer to alternate based on recording, not because one is any better than the other. they are just different.

btw Al, why doesnt your "cousin" come speak for himself?

[alebonau]

thats what you get for thinking.



I believe I stated your option in my original post. However, I'm happy you heard the CP700. You do not state that you have heard the SSP-800 so you are basically talking out your ass. pretty typical of you.




noone said the SSP-800 is the pinnacle of anything. I would wager to put it up against systems many times its price and summize that it would hold its own.

people should always consider options. there are many successful brands because there are many different tastes. And noones tastes are wrong. they are their own.

from an economical standpoint, unless you have money to burn, my opinion is that an SSP-800 for both HT and 2 channel is a high-value proposition that has a greater ROI for 90% of audiophiles than having a seperate 2ch preamp. So, if money is no object, I recommend looking to a custom CAT system (speakers and electronics made custom to your environment at the time of purchase) and forgo classe alltogether. If someone wants to keep their CP-700 and add an SSP-800, I say go for it. But realize the differences are small and you might find you prefer to alternate based on recording, not because one is any better than the other. they are just different.

btw Al, why doesnt your "cousin" come speak for himself?

i ssp will always be a compromise siko, a bit like the bmw X6 yeah sure its pretty good in a straight line and goign around corners and can go off road but a bmw m5 would have it for breakfast on the straight and twisting bits and a landcruiser would leave it bogged off road :B

what the hell do you know really of what I have listened to or not. Its been a long time I've even posted on the 800 as something my cousin long moved on from and I couldnt really be bothered with it anymore in the least. If anyone is talking out their ass it seems to be you. Which is blatantly clear from what you post.

And as far as my cousin we share many demoing experiences with some similar tastes and as crazy about similar stuff plus have followed each others journeys since we have been in the hobby as kids. His brother is just as mad but doesnt give a hoot about ht, he is just pure analog 2ch and valves. As far as my cousin not coming to speak from him self ?. He is an exec for one of the telcos working some 80 hr weeks with little time for forums or wasting time arguing with the likes of yourself :roll: any spare time he has like many he prefers just to enjoy the hobby rather than talking about it :T

I'd suggest anyone considering whether to stick with the ssp800 for both 2ch and av or go for a cp700 for 2ch to demo the both for sure. I know which I'd be swayed to for pure 2ch analog, but demo for yourself to come to your own conclusions

[sikoniko]

I'd suggest anyone considering whether to stick with the ssp800 for both 2ch and av or go for a cp700 for 2ch to demo the both for sure. I know which I'd be swayed to for pure 2ch analog, but demo for yourself to come to your own conclusions

here we meet on common ground. :T

[FALCODEAN]

Dear Classe colleagues,
thank you very much for all the feedback and the spirited discussion. It seems to be indeed more complicated than I thought - which indicates that either way I would end up with a great sound. For the time being I will keep the cp-700 yet will go and spend considerable time listening to the ssp 800 and compare both options at the store.
Again thanks.
falcodean

[Oddiophile]

Hi Falcodean,

I think you should seriously consider the SSP-800. Although prevailing wisdom would seem to indicate that a 2-channel preamp would work better than a multi-channel preamp for 2-channel purposes, you should perhaps read Robert Harley's very well-written and illuminating review in Issue 194 of the Absolute Sound. In a relevant passage he says:

"Next, I evaluated the SSP-800’s intrinsic sound quality as a preamplifier with the bypass test. This involves driving power amplifiers directly from a variable-output digital source (in this case the Berkeley Alpha DAC or the Meridian 808.2i) and then inserting the SSP-800 (with its volume control set to unity gain) in the signal path. No preamplifier is sonically transparent, and the bypass test immediately reveals the preamp’s colorations. The SSP-800 tended to shave off a bit of low-level detail, slightly reduce timbral liquidity by adding a touch of grain, and make the hall sound slightly smaller. No preamplifier on which I’ve performed the bypass test—and I’ve done this with some of the world’s great preamps—emerges without revealing some colorations. The SSP-800 was notable for not imposing a common coloration—a bright treble, hard textures, reduced dynamics, for example—over the music. Rather, the SSP-800’s departure from transparency was manifested as a slight reduction in resolution. In fact, the SSP-800 was significantly more transparent and lower in coloration than other multichannel controllers, and indeed, as neutral and free from artifacts as many $5000 two-channel preamps. That’s saying a lot for a multichannel controller. On this basis, the SSP-800 is fully up to the task of serving as the control center for two-channel sources including the output of a high-quality phonostage. I should mention that I evaluated the SSP-800’s DACs and linestage with reference-quality two-channel music sources under exacting conditions through the highly resolving Wilson Alexandria X-2 Series 2 loudspeakers and applied the same standards I use to judge high-end gear."


You should read the whole review which can be found at:

http://www.avguide.com/review/tas-194-class-audio-ssp-800-multichannel-controller

I am glad to see that you will be doing an expensive comparison of the 700 and the 800 and that you will likely be basing your decision on that. However, there is no reason to believe that you can't have the best of both worlds with the SSP-800. This should be no surprise as the SSP-800 incorporates the latest in Classe's design and technology. Ultimately your ears should be the deciding factor.

Best of luck and I hope this helps.

Jim

[SoundEngine355]

Dear Classe members,
I am currently a two channel only listener with the following set-up:
CDP 502
CP 700
2x CAM 400
My question is whether the SSP 800 would deliver the same two channel sound that the CP 700 delivers (as I am looking int HT options).
Falcodean

Doesn't the CDP-502 have a volume control? just connect it directly to the M400's!

[Bobpaule]

Late post but sharing my experience. I have a PR-SC5509 processor and 2x Sherbourn 5/1500A amps with biwired fronts. The HQV Vida VP in the Onkyo is superior to anything else for analog video upscaling (1200 DVD collection in Escient server). My A1UDCI does one step DSD conversions thanks to 6 very powerful DACs, plus it has a fully balanced stereo pathway.

Yep, greedy as I am, i need the best of both worlds.

I wanted to move to true biamping and also keep the signal pure on the analog stereo pathway. After all 300 of my 500 SACDs are stereo, many of them MoFi and Universal master recordings.

The reasons i went with the CP-700 are:

1. Fully differential balanced from ground up, even the PSU is separate and has two transformers built in, bravo Classe!

2. I can now do high quality biamping on the front channels.

3. It does line-level processor bypass.

The MBL 5010 and even a few tube amps were brief contenders but none come to this level.

As for some of the posts above lauding the benefits of A/V processors for two channel processing, all i can say that they defeat the purpose of a dedicated clear path analog stereo stage. Companies like Classe, Theta, or Krell to have enough liquidity to implement rapidly video processing features, while they focus on high quality audio. One strange beast is the Oppo hatchery spawn CP-800, a strange beast, really more like a DAC, a step back IMHO, eliminates outboard diff. PSU and adds tons of internal processing (USB), defeating the purpose. Actually at work I use a similar gadget which is justifiable in a minimalist setting, a DacMagic Plus with a Zamp v.3 and ProaAc Tablettes, this with separates USB cable (power and signal shielded two cables) and M1000i XLR to RCA interconns
yields surprising 32 bit processing results with the Foobar after the tedious tunneling job into the corporate firewall, BBC Radio 3 in 320kbps is amazing.

Now i need to go for the next weakest link in my system which are the stereo amps, 4x monoblock Classes to remortgage or not?