large monitor/bookshelf...

[mph33]

My room is 11(w) 19(l) 8(h)... floors are hardwood and there is an opening to the dinning room in the rear. looking for a DIY kit for 70% music, 29% ht, and 1% rediculous sound effects LOL. I want these speakers to be able to take some abuse but... sound good doing it. I was looking pi speakers but, the owner can't seem to keep AE and JBL drivers in stock. I'm thinking a dual mid and tweet. something elegant looking but has some balls. don't wanna spend over $1200 for the kit. wish I could build the cabinets but I live in a big city... no shop. ill probably ask a cabinet shop to do the box build. everything is fresh. going solid state for amps. would like this kit to have crossovers. any suggestions would be awesome. fir music... I listen to mostly metal. a sub will be in the design as well. still would like good midbass punch from the monitors.

Statement monitors?

[Hank]

Those would be good, as others, but you'll good advice from members here. I'm suggesting you consider the Parts Express cabinets, which will cost you less than custom-made cabinets with a similar finish. Here's an example: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=302-750

[mph33]

I can build the cabs... all I would need is someone to build the baffles. I.don't have routers. Is the statement monitor worth the build? I don't want a bookshelf that lacks bass

[mph33]

I see some if the drivers used in the statements are no long available. That's a real bummer. Are the mini statements too big for my room? I don't want to compromise bass in 2ch mode. For ht I will use a sub

[BeerParty]

The Statements are excellent, but they need proper positioning. If you have the room to place the speakers so they are out into the room (rear baffle ~18 inches from the wall, so front of speaker ~30 inches into the room) they are highly recommended. If you only have room so that the front of the speaker is ~24 inches into the room (12 inches of clear space behind the rear baffle) the Statement Monitors have an alternate crossover that will work that way. If you need them any closer to the wall I would NOT suggest the Statements.

Just so you know, alternate drivers for the full sized Statements are available.

I do not know if anyone sells built crossovers for any of the Statement series. If someone knows where to find them, I am sure they will chime in.

If you are looking for a kit with pre-built crossovers, you may want to check out the Madisound Speaker Kits.

[Silver1omo]

I see some if the drivers used in the statements are no long available. That's a real bummer. Are the mini statements too big for my room? I don't want to compromise bass in 2ch mode. For ht I will use a sub

If you are referring to the shielded RS woofers, you should be able to use the unshielded ones with no problems.
You can also buy a full kit from meniscus

http://meniscusaudio.com/mini-statements-p-1342.html

http://meniscusaudio.com/statements-pr-p-1338.html

I built a pair of statement monitors and they sound great, if you go with the statements series make sure you have the space they need behind them (18", or 12" the monitor with near wall XO).

If you plan to add a sub, then you probably don't need that much bass extension and if you plan to go loud, take a look at the stentorians:

http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/NS6project_1.html

[mph33]

So... I guess some of your are not to fond of the mini statements? Its either the monitors or the full size statements? I think the stenorians and the statements are too big for my living room. Trust me... I love big and loud.

[NPE]

Built statements monitor, love them... BUT, getting the double front baffle cuts, the rear for the port, it'll probably cost you.. Cabinets aren't that easy to make either.

Madisound has the baffles for some of the speakers, ex: http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com..._str=ZRT+2-Way These look to be right in your $$$, and 20$ for baffles is incredibly cheap... Locally, It would probably cost me 20x that to cut me the Monitor baffles... That with the crossovers already made, should be a good starter kit

[mph33]

That's a very nice speaker component but I'm a little concerned with frying those drivers. They seem to designed more for easy listening stuff... not metal lol

[Silver1omo]

So... I guess some of your are not to fond of the mini statements? Its either the monitors or the full size statements? I think the stenorians and the statements are too big for my living room. Trust me... I love big and loud.

I went with monitors because I don't have the 18" needed for the minis or full size.

If you want to go very loud then probably a PA solution:
Perhaps a econowave http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=150939
Or a BFM design http://www.billfitzmaurice.com/ a pair of TLAH and a THT should be loud.

[Silver1omo]

That's a very nice speaker component but I'm a little concerned with frying those drivers. They seem to designed more for easy listening stuff... not metal lol

What are you going to use to power them?

[mph33]

What are you going to use to power them?

An onkyo 5.1reciever(not sure which model yet) fir processing, and power the mains with an emotiva

[fbov]

My room is 11(w) 19(l) 8(h)... floors are hardwood and there is an opening to the dinning room in the rear. ... I was looking pi speakers but, ...I'm thinking a dual mid and tweet. ...don't wanna spend over $1200 for the kit. ...would like this kit to have crossovers. ...a sub will be in the design as well....

A word on kits...
There are true kits (drive a few screws and listen):

http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/2-way-speaker-kits/zaph%7Caudio-za5.2-tm-2-way-pair-with-cabinets/

And there are parts-only, no soldering kits (you build the box):

http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/2-way-speaker-kits/zaph%7Caudio-za5.2-tm-2-way-pair/

And there are KD kits (glue and paint, then drive screws and listen)

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-702

And there are components only kits (you solder XO and build box)

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-700

And finally, there are "DIY kits" where you take someone else's design and XO circuit, work up your own bill of material and build from there. Those are listed here:

http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?211558-Links-to-existing-DIY-speaker-designs

My questions to you are: How many speakers for $1200? and What kind of sound do you like?

I ask because you hint at two design approaches - MTM and compression driver (CD) - which are both well suited to your application, but which will sound very different from one another in your room. Both design approaches modify the sound field to limit energy based on direction. Both have reduced floor/ceiling output, and the CD limits lateral output as well, but that's where the similarity ends. The CD-based speaker will be louder, but in my opinion, the MTM will sound lots better. It all depends what your ears like. (Statements are WMTMW, and so behave like MTMs.)

Note that if you are building only two, I'd suggest neither approach. I find the stereo imaging to be poor with MTMs due to the same reduced room interaction that was a prime feature above. I've not tested CD-based designs in this respect, but I suspect the same lack of envelopment from them as from MTMs, compared with a simple, small TM sitting well away from all the walls, that simply disappears into an immense reverberant sound field. But that's stereo; in multichannel, MTMs are excellent (and I expect CD would be too, if you like their sound).

HAve fun,
Frank

[mph33]

[QUOTE=fbov]A word on kits...
There are true kits (drive a few screws and listen):

http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/2-way-speaker-kits/zaph%7Caudio-za5.2-tm-2-way-pair-with-cabinets/

And there are parts-only, no soldering kits (you build the box):

http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/2-way-speaker-kits/zaph%7Caudio-za5.2-tm-2-way-pair/

And there are KD kits (glue and paint, then drive screws and listen)

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-702

And there are components only kits (you solder XO and build box)

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=300-700

And finally, there are "DIY kits" where you take someone else's design and XO circuit, work up your own bill of material and build from there. Those are listed here:

http://techtalk.parts-express.com/showthread.php?211558-Links-to-existing-DIY-speaker-designs

My questions to you are: How many speakers for $1200? and What kind of sound do you like?

I ask because you hint at two design approaches - MTM and compression driver (CD) - which are both well suited to your application, but which will sound very different from one another in your room. Both design approaches modify the sound field to limit energy based on direction. Both have reduced floor/ceiling output, and the CD limits lateral output as well, but that's where the similarity ends. The CD-based speaker will be louder, but in my opinion, the MTM will sound lots better. It all depends what your ears like. (Statements are WMTMW, and so behave like MTMs.)

Note that if you are building only two, I'd suggest neither approach. I find the stereo imaging to be poor with MTMs due to the same reduced room interaction that was a prime feature above. I've not tested CD-based designs in this respect, but I suspect the same lack of envelopment from them as from MTMs, compared with a simple, small TM sitting well away from all the walls, that simply disappears into an immense reverberant sound field. But that's stereo; in multichannel, MTMs are excellent (and I expect CD would be too, if you like their sound). [\quote]

I figured my room was a Tad on the small side to run a high efficient system with pa drivers... CD's and what not. I owned some klipsch rf-83's and wasn't that impressed. Way too bright and they lacked midbass. I would love a two-way... 8" mid with a large format tweet that can play low. I like a lively sound with good kick-drum... an airy tweeter but not too revealing. We all know some metal music isn't recorded the best. Here's a mid I would live to use in a two-way... large bookshelf design.

http://www.europe-audio.com/Product.asp?Product_ID=6948

[mph33]

I figured my room was a Tad on the small side to run a high efficient system with pa drivers... CD's and what not. I owned some klipsch rf-83's and wasn't that impressed. Way too bright and they lacked midbass. I would love a two-way... 8" mid with a large format tweet that can play low. I like a lively sound with good kick-drum... an airy tweeter but not too revealing. We all know some metal music isn't recorded the best. Here's a mid I would live to use in a two-way... large bookshelf design.

http://www.europe-audio.com/Product.asp?Product_ID=6948

[mph33]

The $1200 is for the mains... possibly squeeze in a center channel

[Jim Holtz]

I figured my room was a Tad on the small side to run a high efficient system with pa drivers... CD's and what not. I owned some klipsch rf-83's and wasn't that impressed. Way too bright and they lacked midbass. I would love a two-way... 8" mid with a large format tweet that can play low. I like a lively sound with good kick-drum... an airy tweeter but not too revealing. We all know some metal music isn't recorded the best. Here's a mid I would live to use in a two-way... large bookshelf design.

http://www.europe-audio.com/Product.asp?Product_ID=6948

Some thoughts.

1st of all, the Statements (all versions) will be extremely revealing. If you listen to poorly recorded metal at high volumes, you won't be happy. Metal drivers and ribbon tweeters are NOT forgiving! 8O

2nd, the Monitors shouldn't be played over 104 db which I suspect will be a bit low in volume for you based on your previous posts.

The Statements series speakers sound great on well recorded music when played within the limits they were designed for.

Jim

[mph33]

Sounds to me the statements are for hifi snobs. I've always heard metal drivers were more suitable for faster aggressive music.... kick-drum and snare blast beats. I guess I was wrong

[cjd]

Sounds to me the statements are for hifi snobs. I've always heard metal drivers were more suitable for faster aggressive music.... kick-drum and snare blast beats. I guess I was wrong

So tactful. So full of information and knowledge to share!

Metal drivers are absolutely suitable for such things. They can render them amazingly well.

That same amazing rendering ability means they let out all the warts.

A great many hifi snobs do indeed like the Statements. I'm sure folks that aren't hifi snobs like them too - I know a few of those folks, though I suspect most of us here would self-identify as a hifi snob. I've not heard the Statements, but I've met Jim and trust his ear. If he says that's not the speaker for you, trust him on that.

Metal, as a genre, doesn't take as much in a speaker to render without you knowing when it's right or when it's just adding because it's already using a lot of distortion; pushing mics to their limits, etc. However, if "metal" includes "going deaf in a few months" loud, yes - you do have to pick your system with a little more care.

I've pushed metal-driver systems to levels that were too loud even with 30dB over-ear protection + foam plugs; I have no idea how they sounded, nor truthfully how long they might pull that off. Far too revealing to be pleasing on crap recordings, but still capable.

If you just want "blast it stupid loud" I'll second the recommendation for something based on pro drivers.

[craigk]

if you want loud go get some klipsch horns that are 100 db efficent speakers and play them so loud your head explodes :T and be happy.

[mph33]

For all the mini statement owners... listen to this drum recording at decent high level... not crazy loud but... enough to make your pants leg shake a little. If it sounds good... be honest and let me know. Thanx

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3Mtp3W0nqM4

[NPE]

For all the mini statement owners... listen to this drum recording at decent high level... not crazy loud but... enough to make your pants leg shake a little. If it sounds good... be honest and let me know. Thanx

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3Mtp3W0nqM4

I'm on crap JVC speakers and the audio quality and recording sucks balls, sounds like utter shit 8O Not bothering to play that on the Statements... So if that's the kind of crap recordings you listen to skip the statements and go for not revealing cheapo hifi speakers you can buy at bestbuy for instance... :lol:

Listen to a good drum recording and it'll sound sweet on Statements though...

[mph33]

I'm on crap JVC speakers and the audio quality and recording sucks balls, sounds like utter shit 8O Not bothering to play that on the Statements... So if that's the kind of crap recordings you listen to skip the statements and go for not revealing cheapo hifi speakers you can buy at bestbuy for instance... :lol:

Listen to a good drum recording and it'll sound sweet on Statements though...

Wow... are you serious? Thanx for pissing me off

[Face]

Youtube=Low Res.

[mph33]

Youtube=Low Res.

I don't know of any other way to get people to listen... I guess download it in loss-less format

[NPE]

Youtube=Low Res.

Not just that, that particular vid is at 240p, which is worst than 128 kbps mp3... Really sounded like tin garbage can...

http://www.h3xed.com/web-and-internet/youtube-audio-quality-bitrate-240p-360p-480p-720p-1080p

To be fair, there was another vid of that same track that sounded drastically better, but since statements were for audio-snobs I thought I'd give a audio snob reply... :T

[mph33]

Not just that, that particular vid is at 240p, which is worst than 128 kbps mp3... Really sounded like tin garbage can...

http://www.h3xed.com/web-and-internet/youtube-audio-quality-bitrate-240p-360p-480p-720p-1080p

To be fair, there was another vid of that same track that sounded drastically better, but since statements were for audio-snobs I thought I'd give a audio snob reply... :T

I think I came off the wrong way. I wasn't being.disrespectful when I said hifi snob... it was actually a compliment. Sorry, my father is British... are humor is a little dry.

So... did you listen to the tract on your statements? There's another band that I enjoy listening to that has recorded tracts.for each instrument on the album. Its like a double me CD feature. The drum tracts are recorded very well and the sound is amazing! Band is called Lamb of god. I would love to hear those drum tracts.on very nice hifi system

[mph33]

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=e_0QmFtNbPA

[Squidspeak]

At our last IRA meeting we were trying to decide between the Statement
Monitors or the Mini's while listening to the Drop kick Murphy's and could
not choose one over the other. AOH

[impala454]

I hate to disagree with Jim at all as he is the man on them but I built four of the Statements Monitors and while I do listen to plenty of hifi "snob" stuff I definitely also jam out with some loud rock/metal music on occasion too and must say they do very well, and with plenty of bass. I speak from the perspective of not building anything else, and not to mention not having the ideal room setup. I do, however have four of them along with the Statement Center hooked up to an Emotiva XPA-5 and listen to pretty much every genre of music and very loud sometimes. Just my $0.02 (and yeah it's only worth $0.02 :P)

By the way, what components are no longer available??!?

[mph33]

I hate to disagree with Jim at all as he is the man on them but I built four of the Statements Monitors and while I do listen to plenty of hifi "snob" stuff I definitely also jam out with some loud rock/metal music on occasion too and must say they do very well, and with plenty of bass. I speak from the perspective of not building anything else, and not to mention not having the ideal room setup. I do, however have four of them along with the Statement Center hooked up to an Emotiva XPA-5 and listen to pretty much every genre of music and very loud sometimes. Just my $0.02 (and yeah it's only worth $0.02 :P)

By the way, what components are no longer available??!?

Very good to hear! Im still torn between the monitors and the minis. I do like being able.to place the monitors next to the wall, but... if the sound stage and bass is stronger with the minis... I have to go that route. I don't want to compromise with this system.

As far as drivers not being available... I just checked. Their all available. I'm ready to pull the plug with this deal. I need to start on this ASAP!

[impala454]

Well keep in mind there may be a much better design for what you're wanting. I just wanted to throw it out there that the Statements Monitors can rock the house pretty well as far as my experience has been with them (had them about three years).

[mph33]

I think the minis are set in stone... anyother suggestions before I pull the plug?

[Silver1omo]

The tarkus look good:

https://sites.google.com/site/undefinition/tarkus

[mph33]

The tarkus look good:
https://sites.google.com/site/undefinition/tarkus

that's pretty nice! wonder what would be a good center to match up with that beast. I imagine an emotiva xpa5 would powering those towers biamped would work well... along with a center

[kmibb]

that's pretty nice! wonder what would be a good center to match up with that beast. I imagine an emotiva xpa5 would powering those towers biamped would work well... along with a center

No need to buy a multi-channel amp just to bi-amp. Just get an XPA-2 or a couple XPA-1 monoblocks and you'll be better off.

[Mr.Ed]

I think the minis are set in stone... anyother suggestions before I pull the plug?

You have a PM.
-Ed

I also have an XPA-2 for sale if. You're interested.

[rj45]

well, a contrarian

I've built the mini-statements several years ago, and they are a true reference speaker for me - able to reproduce the finest nuances as well as pump some pretty hard hitting bass and drum action.

That said, I turned them up real loud (14 x 16 x 8 living room), and they seemed to run out of steam around 106 dB according to my RatShack SPL meter. Maybe not quite the sound volume you're looking for.

If you want to get down with some metal, I'd suggest either the MagnaCumLaudes or the Stentorians:

http://speakerdesignworks.com/NS6project_1.html

The Stents will need a sub, they roll off around 70 Hz.

http://stories.parts-express.com/stories/2444-en_us/category/Speaker/story/16649/redirect.htm


regards,
don

[mph33]

I've built the mini-statements several years ago, and they are a true reference speaker for me - able to reproduce the finest nuances as well as pump some pretty hard hitting bass and drum action.

That said, I turned them up real loud (14 x 16 x 8 living room), and they seemed to run out of steam around 106 dB according to my RatShack SPL meter. Maybe not quite the sound volume you're looking for.

If you want to get down with some metal, I'd suggest either the MagnaCumLaudes or the Stentorians:

http://speakerdesignworks.com/NS6project_1.html

The Stents will need a sub, they roll off around 70 Hz.

http://stories.parts-express.com/stories/2444-en_us/category/Speaker/story/16649/redirect.htm


regards,
don

Man... both if those links don't work

[Silver1omo]

http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/NS6project_1.html

http://stories.parts-express.com/stories/2444-en_us/category/Speaker/story/16649/redirect.htm

[rj45]

Man... both if those links don't work

sorry, looks like someone fixed them for me.

[mph33]

http://www.speakerdesignworks.com/NS6project_1.html
http://stories.parts-express.com/sto...9/redirect.htm

and the second link doesn't work... just goes to the partsexpress projects page

[BeerParty]

and the second link doesn't work... just goes to the partsexpress projects page

It works for me, it takes me directly to the MagnaCumLaudes project. What browser are you using? I'm using Firefox.