HELP!! SNES and NES problems with my samsung ln-r409d lcd hdtv!!!

[roadhawg44]

HELP!! I recently purchased a mint SNES and a NES(side load model-lockout chip was replaced,works fine!) off of ebay (We won't discuss how much i paid
I hook either of these systems into my Samsung ln-r409d lcd hdtv and i get a really nasty yellow vertical streak down the middle of my screen. The two systems audio are fine, gameplay is fine. The video is hideous!! The in-game characters for instance, when they are slightly brighter or whenever theres is any brighter sprites there is a ghosting image on the far-left side of the screen! I have played multiple games on the snes and the nes, and i get the same video artifacting with both systems and all the games. At first i thought i got screwed by my seller on ebay. I tried the 2 systems on a sharp s.def 480i lcd tv and theres no image artifacting and no yellow streak either. I have two 32" tube tvs (1hd, 1 non-hd) no streaking or artifacting. My friend let me borrow his snes, i tried it on my samsung and i get the same image clutter and artfacting as i do with my own snes! I tried buying new av cables, i tried cleaning the tabs for both the cartridges. I tried all 3 of the yellow composite connectors on my tv, same image clutter. I tried every single display setting that exists on that freakin tv and that nasty clutter stays right there. I have a n64,sega genesis2,ps2,gamecube,xbox,x360, and a dreamcast, non of these other systems have any kind of image clutter whatsoever. My nes and my snes are the only systems having this problem with my new tv. I'm going crazy. Contra 3 looks absolutely hideous with all that image clutter! Please! Any information would be helpful !!

[Kevin P]

Sounds like your Samsung doesn't like the NES/SNES signal for some reason or other.

Are you using the composite output, or the RF modulator? Try both and see if you get the same results.

If all else fails, maybe a video stabilizer (timebase corrector or similar) will help. Or try running the game through a VCR and then to the TV.

Are you running the game directly into the TV, or through a receiver or switcher?

I had a similar situation: I have one of those Ms. Pac-man joystick game units with the 7 games in them that plugs into a TV. It works fine on a small Sony Wega (non-HD), as well as my Panny plasma, through my Sherwood pre-pro's component video upconversion. But one time I tried to run it through my projector (NEC 9PG fed by a Lumagen scaler), and the image was jumping all over the place, like the scaler couldn't sync to the signal coming from the game unit.

So, it's possible that some older or cheaper devices that generate video digitally may have timing issues that mess up newer digital TVs.

[roadhawg44]

Thank you so much for your info. Well, tried my gamecube cables with the SNES(the older,boxier model by the way), exact same thing. I tried the s-video connection from my snes to the tv, theres no signal. Swapped out cables for the NES (The nes uses just a yellow and white pair, the snes uses the same connector type as the n64 and gamecube). Same video artifacting. Something i didn't try before: My vcr has a AV input and a AV output. About half-hour ago, i ran my snes and nes AV through the vcr's AV in. Switched the vcr to the appropriate AV setting, then ran the AV-out from the vcr back to the AV-in on the TV. Exact same artifacts and ghost images. Doesn't solve anything, but it does answer a few questions. Again i have a genesis1&2, n64, a 3do (crappy games), and a sega cd. There is no artifacts whatsoever with these systems. Any ideas anyone ? I'll try to create an example for you of what i'm seeing. Say your playing Street Fighter with ryu and ken, both characters are standing in opposite sides of the screen without moving. Assume ryu is on the far right and ken is on the far left (a wacky example, i know). You would see a distorted out-of-sync image of ryu over where ken is standing at. Along with other artfacts that are in the same area that ryu(the ryu thats supposed to be there) is standing at.
The artifacting changes as the screen pans from side to side.

[dyazdani]

There is a well docmented issue of problems with older game systems and their use on HDTVs. Most descriptions have to do with lag created by the HDTV's scaler trying to upconvert the SD signal.

Solutions I've found include using a "game mode" on the TV that speeds up the scaler (I don't think yours has this, Samsung DLPs do). There is also what they call a "VGA box" - it takes a composite/s-vid signal and converts it to a 640x480 signal, specifically made for games.

It seems like some people had good luck with the RF modulator, I'd try it first. You MAY have to go through the VCR as well, but I'm not sure, just have to experiment I guess.

[roadhawg44]

VGA box? Hmmm sounds like worth a try
Tell me more!!! My tv does have a vga-in but it has no GameMode, SO THERE IS HOPE!!. Any brand that jumps at you??

[dyazdani]

Found this on another forum's thread describing the issue...

VGA Box

[Vinny]

It could be the new HDTV does not have at low rest support anymore(maybe SNES for its 320/240 but dunno about the NES). Yea a VGA box should help. I even used the computer monitor for the PS2 before I had the current 27" LCD TV(now the VGA box stayed in storage, of course :roll: )

[dyazdani]

It will upconvert the 480i/240p "low res" to it's native resolution I think. Apparently, many TVs have issues with upconverting the older game systems and getting a lag/artifact free picture.

I'd give the RF modulator a go first, it should be pretty cheap. The VGA box is a little more spendy.

[aud19]

That's a new one! Best of luck with it roadhawg and thanks Danish :T

[roadhawg44]

VGA box?? Hmmm........

Thanks a ton you guys for your input. I've been posting on other hdtv forums and most of them recommend a vga box. There's one i'm interested in made by Grandtec (grandtec.com) it's about $80. I'm tempted to give it a try. I don't have an rf modulator to try though. The last one i had was the one for the Genesis1 and it crapped out for some odd reason. I might give that Grandtec composite-VGA converter a try. It takes a composite or s-video 480i and can convert it up to 1024x768via vga-out I'll keep you guys posted on anything new.
The nes and the snes are the only systems that dislike my Sammy. The genesis1&2,3do,n64 display on the tv just fine.