1066 and BM (again)

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  • donk
    Junior Member
    • Aug 2003
    • 4

    1066 and BM (again)

    Just bought a 1066/1075 (not even hooked up yet) and came across the "double bass" issue with the multi-inputs here.

    Sent Rotel tech-support an e-mail about the resistor cut fix and rec'd e-mail indicating that the "double bass concern is erroneous" and that there may be warranty issues (with the fix).

    Given number of posts here this seems to be a case where I have not contacted the correct people at Rotel. Can someone give me a heads-up on who to contact for the fix. Also, will most dealers perform the fix or will I need to ship it to Rotel.

    Thanks, sorry to bring this up again.

    DonK
  • will1066
    Senior Member
    • Aug 2003
    • 660

    #2
    Don, call 888-370-3740 and ask for Mike Sheehan.

    Comment

    • Andrew Pratt
      Moderator Emeritus
      • Aug 2000
      • 16507

      #3
      "Sent Rotel tech-support an e-mail about the resistor cut fix and rec'd e-mail indicating that the "double bass concern is erroneous" and that there may be warranty issues (with the fix)."
      Who sent you that reply?




      Comment

      • Bill Blank
        Senior Member
        • Sep 2002
        • 126

        #4
        donk,

        Mike's the guy I dealt with as well. I had my 1066 sent back to Rotel of America and had the Bass-management modification done as well as having my firmware updated. It only cost me shipping.

        Bill




        Rotel RSP-1066
        Rotel RMB-1075
        Rega Planet 2000
        Denon DVD-2900
        Mitsubishi WS-55411
        Paradigm Reference Studio 100 v3
        Paradigm Reference Studio CC-470 v3
        Paradigm Reference Studio 20 v3
        Velodyne CT-120

        Comment

        • donk
          Junior Member
          • Aug 2003
          • 4

          #5
          Andrew:
          Originally posted by Andrew Pratt
          "Sent Rotel tech-support an e-mail about the resistor cut fix and rec'd e-mail indicating that the "double bass concern is erroneous" and that there may be warranty issues (with the fix)."
          Who sent you that reply?
          my original e-mail:
          Rotel:

          Have ordered though not yet rec'd a RSP1066 (along with an RMB1075). I intend to play SACDs and have become aware of the "double bass" issue in this case.

          I have seen (on some BBs including "Club Rotel") recommendations of "resistor cut fix" to solve the BM issue.

          Are there are warranty issues involved with the fix?

          Can my dealer (Best Sound in the St Louis area) perform the fix?

          Any other information would be greatly appreciated.

          Thanks,
          Don Kridel

          Rotel response:
          Dear Don,

          Most certainly there are warranty issues! More importantly, the reports of double bass are erroneous. Please call me at the number below to discuss this concern directly.

          Best Regards,

          Tim Wyatt

          Technical Support Supervisor - twyatt@equityaudio.com
          B & W Loudspeakers - (978) 664-2870 - www.bwspeakers.com - Fax: (978) 664-4109
          Rotel of America - (978) 664-3820 - www.rotel.com - Fax: (978) 664-4109
          I was traveling so could not call until today. While on the road, cruised around here some more and it seemed clear there was a problem.

          Based on first response above, I have sent an e-mail to msheehan...

          Once I have facts straight, I will call...

          System won't be se up for a week or so, so would like to take care of this before it is ready (and I would miss it).

          DonK

          Comment

          • donk
            Junior Member
            • Aug 2003
            • 4

            #6
            Just rec'd e-mail from Mike Sheehan clearing this up for me; if Rotel or my dealer performs fix there is no impact on the warranty...

            Thanks for the help...apparently I just needed to get to the right guy.

            DonK

            Comment

            • Andrew Pratt
              Moderator Emeritus
              • Aug 2000
              • 16507

              #7
              thanks for the info on the email




              Comment

              • Danbry39
                Moderator Emeritus
                • Sep 2002
                • 1584

                #8
                Well, now I'm confused. Before it was if you attempted to fix it and screwed up, it was on your shoulders, but now it seems a little bit more nebulous. If a Rotel owner does the fix correctly, is the warranty impacted in any way? I'd try to call Mike himself, but don't have time right now. If I can squeeze it in next week, I'll do so, but I think we need something more definitive or am I misunderstanding?




                Keith
                Keith

                Comment

                • Glenn
                  Senior Member
                  • Jun 2003
                  • 109

                  #9
                  Well, I'm doubly confused! Of course the warranty issue is important to me, but of more concern is the direct statement from Rotel, "reports of double bass are erroneous". How is the double bass issue now erroneous?? I am sure there is an explanation to this statement, but can someone clear this up for me?

                  I am about to purchase a 1055, and a while back mentioned the double bass issue to my dealer. He didn't quite know what I was referring to. At the time I left it at that. I know my dealer has 1055 units in stock, but how do I go about requesting him to order a new unit, directly from Rotel (somewhere in Canada?), with the hardware modifcation done by Rotel themselves. Do I convince my dealer to call Mike Sheehan, as the contact in this discussion, to have the double bass issue explained?

                  I am not wild about my dealer doing this modification, when he hasn't even heard of it. And, simply, would rather Rotel perform the correction before it ships to my dealer in Western Canada.

                  My final question is who actually IS doing the modifcation? Rotel the factory in China; Rotel distribution plant in USA etc etc. Just wanting to know the specifics if anyone can help.

                  Lots of questions and concerns in this post, but I was quite confident and ready to explain the needed modification to my dealer upon my very soon purchase. Now I am confused and uncertain about the whole thing again.

                  Comment

                  • donk
                    Junior Member
                    • Aug 2003
                    • 4

                    #10
                    Glenn:
                    After I rec'd the e-mail from Mike Sheehan I called my dealer; they had not heard of the double bass issue either. They called Rotel (Mike Sheehan) to see whether they could do it or whether it required sending back to Rotel. Rotel faxed "instructions" to my dealer and they called winthin 30 minutes and said "bring it in and we'll do it".

                    It took at most 5 minutes (mostly to remove outer case)--snip, snip and done. Rec'd receipt acknowledging they performed the work...it was painless.

                    DonK

                    Comment

                    • Danbry39
                      Moderator Emeritus
                      • Sep 2002
                      • 1584

                      #11
                      You guys have better dealers than I did. When I first broached the topic with my dealer, he insisted double bass was a good thing, "Can't have too much bass." Huh???

                      My final question is who actually IS doing the modifcation? Rotel the factory in China; Rotel distribution plant in USA etc etc. Just wanting to know the specifics if anyone can help.
                      Rotel will do it in the U.S., but I'd call them first to advise them you want it done. If it is for a unit already owned, I'd get clearance on how they wanted it shipped. If for one on order, I'd call to see if they could do it prior to shipping it out in the first place.

                      As far as the comment that there's nothing to fix in the first place, I recall a release by Rotel quite a few months ago where they stated something to the affect that it worked as it should if your system had all full-range speakers, but I'm hazy on this. I do remember a lot of people complaining that the average HT doesn't have such a speaker setup.

                      I'm wondering if the information didn't make its way down the pipeline or whether there is no hard standard rule as to who does the fix? It is a concern.




                      Keith
                      Keith

                      Comment

                      • Andrew Pratt
                        Moderator Emeritus
                        • Aug 2000
                        • 16507

                        #12
                        I'm looking into it at the moment. I'd rather not say much more until I hear back from Rotel.




                        Comment

                        • Lex
                          Moderator Emeritus
                          • Apr 2001
                          • 27461

                          #13
                          It's general procedure that if a person modifies a factory product in any way functionally speaking, it voids the warranty. It's all in the legal mumbo jumbo, and not just for Rotel. Put a shift kit in your transmission for a new car and see if they cover it under warranty. Put headers on it and see if they cover it. This is very standard procedure.

                          You just can't modify a product under warranty UNLESS you can put it back exactly as it was before warranty repair, so they can't tell it was ever done. Then you could slide by. So, the issue of whether it's done right by an individual, technically doesn't matter. It was done, it's wrong, and they don't have to honor warranty. If they do it, different story.

                          Lex
                          Doug
                          "I'm out there Jerry, and I'm loving every minute of it!" - Kramer

                          Comment

                          • Aeromos
                            Senior Member
                            • Jun 2003
                            • 192

                            #14
                            I'm wondering if this "double bass" only applies to the 1066/1075 combo. I had tried out one of Rotel's CD player and amp (not sure what models) with B&W's 603's. I found they were pretty good with music until I popped in some hip-hop. The bass just went out of control. It became very boomy and muddy (if that makes sense). I was kind of surprised since so many here rave about the synergy and great sound that Rotel components combined with B&W speakers produce.




                            Aeromos
                            Enjoy life, it's too short to waste!!
                            My Collection
                            Aeromos
                            Enjoy life, it's too short to waste!!
                            My Collection

                            Comment

                            • Glenn
                              Senior Member
                              • Jun 2003
                              • 109

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Danbry39
                              My final question is who actually IS doing the modifcation? Rotel the factory in China; Rotel distribution plant in USA etc etc. Just wanting to know the specifics if anyone can help.
                              Rotel will do it in the U.S., but I'd call them first to advise them you want it done. If for one on order, I'd call to see if they could do it prior to shipping it out in the first place.
                              I wonder if this would be possible if I walked into my Canadian dealer and requested them to order a 1055 for me. Where would it come from? Could I get far enough back into the distribution chain, to specifically earmark a US Rotel modified 1055 for me?

                              Comment

                              • sweetsoulsounds
                                Junior Member
                                • Apr 2003
                                • 18

                                #16
                                Yes, this BM issue is confusing.

                                I do not seem to have a problem with "double bass" while playing SACD on my 1066.

                                On the 1066 I have all speakers set to "large", sub crossover "off"

                                On my Philips 963A I have speakers set to "large" as well.

                                I've also used a Denon 2900 and again, did not have a "double bass" problem.

                                Comment

                                • Danbry39
                                  Moderator Emeritus
                                  • Sep 2002
                                  • 1584

                                  #17
                                  Glenn,

                                  I'd definitely give them a call on that. I'm pretty sure that they handle all of North America's sales, but I'm not positive.

                                  Andrew would know. Andrew?




                                  Keith
                                  Keith

                                  Comment

                                  • Andrew Pratt
                                    Moderator Emeritus
                                    • Aug 2000
                                    • 16507

                                    #18
                                    there is no stock for Rotel in Canada it all comes through the US to TO then distributed from there to the reps and dealers etc.

                                    Any Rotel dealer should be able to call Rotel and learn about the Bass issues that are there and are real. Make no mistake about it ALL 1055 and 1066 models have a bass redirect occuring on the multi channel inputs that can only be removed by snipping the two resistors.

                                    Donk I'm sorry you were told conflicting information regarding the bass issue and I can only assure you that the matter is being looked into by Rotel.




                                    Comment

                                    • Glenn
                                      Senior Member
                                      • Jun 2003
                                      • 109

                                      #19
                                      Since this bass redirect is a known issue, with a known correction ... why doesn't Rotel automatically make this circuit modification/correction on all currently shipped 1055 and 1066 units?

                                      My understanding is that all customers must still specifically request the modification to be made? Is this correct?

                                      And my final question regarding this topic is, will this modification eventually be done directly at the Rotel manufacturing plant?

                                      Thanks for all the posts on this topic, the discussion has been very helpful.

                                      Comment

                                      • Andrew Pratt
                                        Moderator Emeritus
                                        • Aug 2000
                                        • 16507

                                        #20
                                        Glenn I don't think Rotel has any plans of changing the BM issue on the production units since for a large percentage of the population that has tiny speakers and a sub the bass redirect actually is a good thing. Offering to do the resistor cut for free is their way of supporting those of us that do need a true by pass mode on the 1055 and 1066 and the new 1098 offers both options so they are listening to us.

                                        Now with regard to the fix itself what I'm being told is that simply put Rotel does not want users hacking their units on their own. They offer a free service to modify the unit and would much prefer you sent in the unit to Rotel's service centre. That said if a user were to snip the two resistors and didn't screw up anything else should that unit go in for service at some point the tech's not going to go looking for two snipped resistors and even if he did see them who's to say the dealer didn't do it? Now obviously for those that added a toggle switch on the back the issues a little more sticky since its obviously not something Rotel or its dealers would have done so use your own judgement on which method is best for you. Moral of the story is that when possible take Rotel up on its offer to have them do it but if that's not really possible and you're willing to take the risk (albeit a small one) then I'd advise you to snip the two resistors and not install the toggle switch.




                                        Comment

                                        • Glenn
                                          Senior Member
                                          • Jun 2003
                                          • 109

                                          #21
                                          Andrew

                                          Thanks for the additional insight / info on this topic. Appreciated.

                                          Comment

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