1056 missing oomph!?

[scient]

Have my RSX1056 up with Studio 100's and Seismic 10's. But when I play any dance music it seems to be lacking the punch from the bass. Crossovers for my mains are at 80Hz. The little Cambridge Soundworks (w/ sub) connected my my computer seems to have more beat! I am obviously doing something wrong but can't seem to figure it out. Can anyone please help?

Thanks

[soundhound]

From the top, did you're reciever have that sound, and after something was changed it was lost? If a new install, have you performed all of the setup routines through the menu's such as speaker sizes, calibrations with an spl meter? Which "mode" are you using when listening to the music? Something that is often overlooked is that these pieces are machines, you don't just plug them in and get instant orchestra. Initial setup normally gets people quite close, and from there we find ourselves tinkering for a month or 2 sometimes just because. If you have an issue above setup post back with specifics and it will be quicker to track it down.

[benny]

Already experimented with various room posistions on the sub? Played around with the phase on the sub? Sorry if i'm pointing out the obvious here. I let my Studio 60's play full range and set my sub to a low crossover just to fill out the bass a little.

[KAP]

Is it possible that the 75 wpc that the 1056 puts out is not sufficient for the Studio 100's?

I have a 1067 driving Studio 40's and I very pleased with the sound. Actually, since it is a replacement unit for one that was professionally installed, I haven't even tinkered with it regardings settings. I guess I'll do that as soon as I get home!!

[basementjack]

Sceint,

You might want to boost the subwoofer output with 2 channel (you can do this with the rotel so that it only effects 2 channel listening), also - Bennys suggestion about sub placement is a good one, there's plenty of discussions on this forum about the need to equalize subwoofers due to room acoustics.

If you have a radioshack sound meter, and a CD with single frequency test tones, (not pink or white noise) you could play a lower frequency and walk around the room with the meter - you'll notice - and hear - a difference as you walk around - this is the effect of the room, and to some extent, moving the sub can sometimes smooth that out.

[scient]

Thanks for the suggestions people. Will try them all out, even what you think is an obvious suggestion is welcome.

Will post the settings on the system in a bit.

[shadow]

You are well informed but I would humbly suggest that you add a good two channel amp like the 1080 to drive the big Paradigms mains. Try the other suggestions, but when you have tried them all give a big stereo amp a try. I suspect that this will make more of any improvement than anything else.

[scient]

Listening to music in 2 channel mode with the sub. Use only the master crossover and it is set at 80Hz.

As for placement the sub is in a corner just behind my right mains. Should try moving it around as the others suggested but place can be quite a constraint for me.

Shadow: I have been thinking of getting a more powerful 2 channel as well but its going to have to wait a while am too broke for it at this point :B

[shadow]

Shadow: I have been thinking of getting a more powerful 2 channel as well but its going to have to wait a while am too broke for it at this point :B[/QUOTE]



Me too . But Audiogon tends to have good deals on Rotel amps.

[scient]

Thanks for the tip shadow will check it out.

[scient]

This thread of mine has been dead for a while so I thought I'll pick up where I left off.

The problem is still the same. Not enough bass

But even before I start to figure that out how to fix it, lets start at the basics and please correct me if I am wrong.

Bass is produced by the extremely low frequencies (17Hz to 150Hz). So in order to feel the punch from the bass the system should be able to effective reproduce these frequencies.

Setup:
As I mentioned before my main are Studio 100's and go down to 44Hz and my sub is a Paradigm Seismic and plays from 20 - 150Hz. 3
The system has been calibrated using DVE.
On the receiver the Sub has been set to Max and the crossover at 80Hz. Speakers to large.

While playing hip-hop or dance music the tracks seem to lack the punch, is this because
1. the recording itself is missing the frequency range to trigger the sub (how come they play well on my little Cambridge Soundworks??)
2. my receiver / sub settings are wrong
3. need a bigger sub
4. I am just being stupid

I must say though, with 5.1 the sub does just fine, it can shake the hell out of my walls

Thanks for any suggestions!

[grit]

Try setting the sub by ear. I've found that even when using a SPL meter and calibration DVD, the sub still doesnt sound right with music.

[Sim reality]

I have noticed that the thump from hip-hip and dance are actually just outside the 80Hz range at which my sub it set at. That said, your studio 100s shouldn't have a problem repilicating it but you wouldn't get the room shaking thud from the RSX-1056...

If you want the room shaking thud, I would move the crossover to ha higher frequency (but just be aware you need to put it back down for HT because any frequency much above 80 Hz is directional). This is what your Cambridge Soundworks setup is doing.

[aud19]

Also I wouldn't be surprised if the bass in the small PC system is being artifically boosted

For "accurate" bass you really shouldn't have the sub set to MAX in your HT system as this copies bass to your mains and sub. It should be set to on, with your speakers set to small with an appropriate crossover point.

If you're going for artifically boosted bass though, MAX would be your best setting.

And yes to get deep bass out of your 100's you'll likely need more power than the 1056. It is a surprisingly powerful receiver but can only do so much when paired up with pretty sizable speakers. I also second the testing positioning of your speakers and sub.

[scient]

I did try setting the speakers to small and the crossover to 100Hz. Didn't do much though.

aud19: I agree with you that the 1056 is probably too weak for the 100's and I am waiting to buy the 1080 hopefully that will help a little. But I expect most of the bass out of my sub and not the speakers. Is that not right?

[shadow]

Try setting the sub by ear. I've found that even when using a SPL meter and calibration DVD, the sub still doesnt sound right with music.

This advice is a disaster waiting to happen. The point of calibration is that the human ear is relatively insensitive to bass volume changes. You set levels with a meter to assure that the calibrated sound is as close to what the artist intended when it was recorded. Most people who set by ear add way too much bass relative to the mids and highs. It might sound good with one CD and sound like a boom box on the next one. If you like it then do it, but if you want accurate sound this is not the way to get it.

[aud19]

I did try setting the speakers to small and the crossover to 100Hz. Didn't do much though.

aud19: I agree with you that the 1056 is probably too weak for the 100's and I am waiting to buy the 1080 hopefully that will help a little. But I expect most of the bass out of my sub and not the speakers. Is that not right?

That would depend on your crossover settings and the material you're playing

[Kevin D]

If you you've done everything you said you've done and still don't have enough bass, then it's your room and placement. Your sub is probably creating a null in the 80-100hz range. It's basically a spot where your room will eat bass and no matter how loud you boost it it just isn't going to happen.

To quickly find a rough 'good' spot, put your sub where you sit and then walk around the room. Where's it's loudest with your type of music is where your sub needs to go. Keeping checking until you find a spot it can actually live..

Kevin D.

[Kens1]

I have a paradigm pw 2200 sub and I had to turn the sub down to almost minimum volume to keep the house from falling down with both music and movies. I actually prefer bypass mode for music because the bass is much more realistic for music. This is running off the 1056 like you have. Adding a 1080, as I did, will give you more punch for sure but I did not find I absolutely needed it. The 1056 is still a strong receiver. Maybe you have a bad sub cable or a problem with the subs amplifier?

[scient]

If you you've done everything you said you've done and still don't have enough bass, then it's your room and placement. Your sub is probably creating a null in the 80-100hz range. It's basically a spot where your room will eat bass and no matter how loud you boost it it just isn't going to happen.

Will try that out today/tomorrow and see what I come up with. But then how come it sounds great with movies? Looks like it is able to reproduce the .1 channel perfectly.

..Maybe you have a bad sub cable or a problem with the subs amplifier?

For the same reason I mentioned above I think the cable and sub amps should be fine as well.

[aud19]

Will try that out today/tomorrow and see what I come up with. But then how come it sounds great with movies? Looks like it is able to reproduce the .1 channel perfectly.

Then the problem could lie with the positioning of your mains. Especially considering it could be the info above your subs crossover, in the 80hz and up area, that's missing. Combime a possible null from your room in that region with the 1056 not being able to send enough juice to those big 100's and that may be your weak bass issue

[scient]

Then the problem could lie with the positioning of your mains. Especially considering it could be the info above your subs crossover, in the 80hz and up area, that's missing. Combime a possible null from your room in that region with the 1056 not being able to send enough juice to those big 100's and that may be your weak bass issue

The crossover in the receiver is set to 100Hz. Maybe its not working? Is there anyway that I can check?

[aud19]

You could use test tones. Have only your mains play a test tone starting at say 150hz or 200hz and going down. Make sure the speakers are set to small with the crossover set at 100 or 80 (I thought you had it at 80...? I'd recommend 80 amyways as subs don't play as nice up that high) and as the signal gets to your crossover point your SPL meter should show the output dropping off below that point.

What's your subs crossover set at by the way....?

[scient]

What's your subs crossover set at by the way....?

Sub's crossover is at 150Hz. Will give your idea a shot over the weekend.

[Andrew M Ward]

I must say though, with 5.1 the sub does just fine, it can shake the hell out of my walls
Thanks for any suggestions!

Is the sub even on during 2 channel playback? Check that...

[scient]

Yup it does come on during 2 channel playback.