New 1098? This REALLY makes me angry

[Locutus2k]

:M
Ok i'm reading that the new 1098 models, the ones with newer TFT screen ad firmware version 3.x also had a new DSP board, much quiter and better sounding.
My 1098 is only 5 months old, old TFT screen (and DSP board) and i was wondering if the possessors of "olders" 1098 had a possibility to upgrade to the new DSP board.
I can't believe i have a NEW piece of equipment that has already been replaced by a better one! Tis drives me MAD! :M :M :M
PLease can someone confirm that the new 1098 production is an improved one?
Thx,

Locutus2k

[Tony]

Hi,

where do you read, that the newer 1098 will get a new DSP board?

Tony

[wernert]

I agree. Always tend to catch the products at the end of their life cycle, but then again like any other hobby, HT is expensive. My perception of the software upgradibility of the Rotels is that it is more of an avenue for the manufacturer to correct bugs, glitches,etc. and not a true upgrade option to for example add Dolby PL11x to a RSP1066. As opposed to the quality of the product it still remains good value for money. So I am also stuck with an older product (got my RSP1066 in Dec 03 and 1068 became available in Apr 04 here in SA).

[Andrew Pratt]

Let me look into this before we all get to worked up about it. The changes that I know that have gone on with the 1098 aren't something that Rotel planned on its more a lack of supply for one item that causes them to have to redo some parts to make the new item work in the old system. The TFT screen is like that but they still plan on making any firmware upgrades available to support all versions of the processor.

[will1066]

I guess this could potentially be a real example of that typical fine print you see with almost all products:

"We reserve the right to change colors and specifications without notice."

[Locutus2k]

Hi,

where do you read, that the newer 1098 will get a new DSP board?

Tony

Hi, according to some posts in this forum the 1098 models now on sale have the new DSP board. If you do some research you will find that someone already had the possibility to test and verify the new DSP board presence.

[DrBoom]

I have it black on white here that the new models have different DSP boards that ARE less noisy, in an email directly from Rotel Japan. (got it via my local sales rep)
They are aware the the "old" board produces noise at levels over 70, and they also acknowledge that the new board is less noisy.
It's not completely dead quiet but it's less.

[Kevin D]

Same thing happens with cars all the time.. Supplies of certain things runs out before demand of whole units does.. We're lucky Rotel isn't like some other companies that just stop producing and wait for new models.. I know Yamaha is like that. They buy enough pieces to make XX thousand units, once those units are sold you have to wait until the new models come out. I'm sure Rotel buys enough pieces to make XX thousand units, and if they sell out before a new model is ready, they do an on the fly design change to continue production. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's bad, as long as it meets the initial design specs there's not much too say.

I'm sure if the new DSP boards are a whole lot better than the old, Rotel will offer an upgrade (just like when the "new" 1066's started coming with 200mhz component boards)

Kevin D.

[DJDREW]

I have it black on white here that the new models have different DSP boards that ARE less noisy, in an email directly from Rotel Japan. (got it via my local sales rep)
They are aware the the "old" board produces noise at levels over 70, and they also acknowledge that the new board is less noisy.
It's not completely dead quiet but it's less.

Wow what sales rep give out information like that? I want to see.

[DrBoom]

Let's just say I'm well connected :roll:
I'm not going to post the mail literally here, since I don't want to betray his trust in me by sending it.
But I can say that Rotel knows the 1098 gets a bit noisy past volumesetting 70, and that the newer DSP board has less problems with this.
They don't say that it's completely gone, but it's less.

[Marcel B]

I do have a version 3.0 and I can hear some noise above 75 on an analog input which is connected to a VCR. TV, DVD etc are all powered on. Above 80 I can hear some noise from another input on the tape input, which is not connected (I believe this is standard with an pre-amp, I mean that you can hear noise om inputs that are not connected).

To be exact the version is v3.1.0-040525 on a silver 230V 50 Hz version.
This with Rotel RB981 amplifiers for front and center (bi-amp center) with loudspeakers that are about 90 dB efficient.(My maximum setting when watching a movie is 75 which is really loud )

[Tony]

Will the 1068 updated too?? Isn´t it the same board like the 1098??

[GosonFletchy]

Let's just say I'm well connected :roll:
I'm not going to post the mail literally here, since I don't want to betray his trust in me by sending it.
But I can say that Rotel knows the 1098 gets a bit noisy past volumesetting 70, and that the newer DSP board has less problems with this.
They don't say that it's completely gone, but it's less.

I have a hard time with this information. It may be true but I would think that more than one person would know about this if it was true. Maybe our friend Andrew Pratt can shed some light on this one and verify if this is the case or not. What do you say Andrew? Have you had any verification from Rotel on this one?

G.

:grab:

[Fox]

Mine 1098 gets a REAL notable noise at 65 dB, using DD or DTS. So I welcome a noise floor of 75 dB.

It even makes a sound (noise/buzz/hum) when their is a DD or DTS signal,
But no audio information during logo’s.
When I use the internal decoder from mini DVD player, though de analogue circuit everything is silent.

I would gladly pay for a new digital board and maybe they can also fix the loosing of digital lock.

[DrJRapp]

When a car changes model years and comes out with a better/upgraded engine you don't see manufacturers swapping many engines, do you? People who want the improved engine have to trade their cars in and buy a new one. I bought a 2002 Jaguar X Type. The car had many problems, most of which were design and manufacturing issues. I recently traded that car for a new 2004 X Type which is now a wonderful car after two years of refinement.

My point is, while I have no idea if an upgrade to the DSP board would even be possible, from a practical perspective, if Rotel were to make it available, our cost for the board and the labor to install it with other required modifications could well exceed the cost of sell off your 1098 as used and buying a new one.

Right now the cost difference between a new and used 1098 is relatively slim, so this may be the ideal time to trade up if you must.

[Andrew Pratt]

Have you had any verification from Rotel on this one?

I just got an email this morning confirming that no changes have been made to the DSP board so far. DrBoom I'm not sure where you got your info but I'd love to see that email. If you could send me a copy I'd muchly appreciate it.

[Taito]

OK! All of you who are disturbed/angry about this, step back for a second.

Before hearing about this possible change, were you happy with the performance for your 1098's for the price you paid? I'd guess yes. Just because the 'deal' may have changed since your purchase does not detract from your purchase and should not take away fom your enjoyment of it.

HT involves technologies that are constantly changing. Rotel did not break any agreement with you if they upgraded their DSP boards, so my adivce would be to sit back, relax and do what you paid to do... enjoy your HT gear.

[Cracking Oboe]

Good one Taito :T

I can't disagree with what you've said. If we let every upgrade upset us, we would be replacing all of our equipment yearly.

I purchased my RCD 1070 a few months before the 1072 came out ops: . In spite of all the talk of how the jitter is much lower in the 1072 than the 1070 (along with other improvements), I have to admit that I still really like the sound of the 1070. The fact that the 1072 exists has done nothing to diminish my enjoyment of the 1070, yet I have always had some regret. Thanks for your objective insight.

Cracking!

[Aussie Geoff]

Hi,

I suspect what people are getting excited about here is the change to introduce a shielded DSP board that Rotel introduced in December 2003 or so on all new 1098s. It is a thin black metallic shield to reduce the level of interference the DSP board was generating in the pre-out channels (especially the centre) on some (i.e. NOT ALL) early 1098s). Rotel has been providing this shield as a free fit for anyone with the problem - they shipped a batch of them in January 2004 to about April 2004. I got one and it dropped my center channel noise by 10 db!

Regards

Geoff

[Michele Spinolo]

Hi,

I suspect what people are getting excited about here is the change to introduce a shielded DSP board that Rotel introduced in December 2003 or so on all new 1098s. It is a thin black metallic shield to reduce the level of interference the DSP board was generating in the pre-out channels (especially the centre) on some (i.e. NOT ALL) early 1098s). Rotel has been providing this shield as a free fit for anyone with the problem - they shipped a batch of them in January 2004 to about April 2004. I got one and it dropped my center channel noise by 10 db!

Regards

Geoff

Hi Geoff,

nice to hear Rotel offers this chance. :T
I'm one of the firsts europe 1098 owner, althought I do not experiment high noise level on all channels I would like to add the shield to my DSP board.
Could you please give more information about how to contact Rotel and receive this "upgrade"?

Thanks!

[Locutus2k]

Hi Geoff,

nice to hear Rotel offers this chance. :T
I'm one of the firsts europe 1098 owner, althought I do not experiment high noise level on all channels I would like to add the shield to my DSP board.
Could you please give more information about how to contact Rotel and receive this "upgrade"?

Thanks!

Me too!

[Aussie Geoff]

Hi,

This THREAD has a full history of the issue, including pictures, how to install etc.

Contract your local Rotel distributor, give then your RSP-1098 serial number - they can (with a day or two) tell you if your unit was one of the early ones without the shield fitted as standard. If it is, just ask them and they will get one for you from Rotel Japan free under warrantee and either fit it for you (or if you are confident) you can fit it yourself - as several of our members did

Geoff

[DrBoom]

Well apparantly there seems to have been some sort of mix-up in the emails I got from Rotel.
The issue with the DSP board doesn't seem to be as clear-cut as I thought it was, so my post might have been misleading to some.
So don't go writing emails to Rotel about this so called new DSP board and how to get it, because it doesn't seem to exist after all, and if it would in fact exist it would not be available as an upgrade and the differences would be slim to nihil.
It seems that Andrew was right about the whole situation, and my sources weren't :M

[Andrew Pratt]

What I've been told is that there has been some minor changes to various parts in the 1098 but they are all just necessary mod's to reflect a part change due to part sourcing changes etc. For example a type of chip they once used isn't available so they switch to a similar but not identical unit which requires a new capacitor value etc. One of these changes was the TFT screen which did require a few changes but its not any better then the older ones just different. For what its worth the VP of the company is still using a first generation model so if there were any significant changes you'd bet he'd make sure he had a newer model.

[will1066]

Well, we need something else to be angry about then.

I'm angry that my RB-1080 doesn't have the dual sets of binding posts. That REALLY makes me angry.

[PiDD]

I am getting my 1098 swapped out due to a bad function knob. The replacement is coming direct from Buffalo. I wonder what version I will get?

[will1066]

Hopefully, not the wrong color.

[PewterTA]

My RB-1080 has the dual binding posts...

But I don't really know what point that all proves....!?!?

[PiDD]

Hopefully, not the wrong color.

It better not be but who knows!

[Ossi]

As for the metal shield to decrease the parasitic noise that can on some units mainly affect the centre channel, let me had that I installed the shield quite some time ago and it really made a big improvement.
However be remembered that only some early versions of the 1098 had these problems.

[DrJRapp]

For what its worth the VP of the company is still using a first generation model so if there were any significant changes you'd bet he'd make sure he had a newer model.

He's probably waiting for his "beta" RSP1099! With as cost concious as Rotel is they probably would make him pay for a new one now....LOL