Official New Models Preview Now on Parasound Website

[Chris D]

Take a look at this page on Parasound's website:

http://www.parasound.com/new.php

The three new processor models are there, with pics and specs. (Also, notice that the C1 and C2 have been moved to the "discontinued" section, but not the 7100 yet)

[Chris D]

Note that they DO say that we're getting Audyssey MultiEQ and THX Ultra2 Processing! :banana:

The C3 and HDP70 do list an "AM/FM tuner", though, so this was probably copied and pasted from the HDR77. I wonder if any of the other stuff is inaccurate, too.

[brodricj]

Obviously there's no tuner in the C3, otherwise you'd see the AM/FM antenna connector similar to the one on the back of the HDR77. Too bad the C3 doesn't support a 2nd HDMI display, for those with a projector and flat panel display in their setup.

Edit: I wonder how many new C1's Audio Advisor are going to shift at the $5k price point now that it's been discontinued. They will be a tough sell.

[Chris D]

Yeah, I too wanted two HDMI outputs, for that very reason--one to go to my projector in the theater room, (my equipment room is not in the theater itself) and a 2nd output to go to a monitor display in the equipment room for preview and cueing.

[Eric Carroll]

Audyssey on the Cirrus DSP? Wow, nice work, Parasound. I wonder if they will support Pro as well in time. Very compelling product.

[mattburk]

Are they coming out with a replacement for the C1? I would like to see one more hdmi input.

[brodricj]

Are they coming out with a replacement for the C1? I would like to see one more hdmi input.

I think you'll find it's too late, the C3 only has 1 HDMI output. It will be a big deal with the hardware architecture to make such a drastic change at this point. We'll need to use a 1x2 HDMI splitter, and some logic to choose the active display (either IR port or 12v trigger). Hopefully you'll be able to store a display profile of some sort in the C3 with the correct settings for the chosen display. If you can't store a display profile in C3 then that would be a major flaw and deal breaker for me.

But I seriously doubt I'll buy the C3 in any event, despite being relatively happy with the service I've had with my C2. I'm just disappointed that the C1/C2 didn't receive much in the way of updates or new features after release. I wonder if C3 will have a universal power supply, or whether they are going to do separate 110V and 230V models??

[Chris D]

Actually, Parasound had told me that the power supplies are the same in the new models from the C1 or C2. (not sure which one) Everything else is new.

I think Matt was saying that he needs another input, for a total of 6. I too think that 6 is the right number. For me, though, I'll likely be using an outboard matrix switcher for all-home A/V distribution, and running the theater ouput from it into the C3. I'll have a couple other HDMI devices dedicated to only the theater, so I'll be using maybe 3 of the inputs. As mentioned, I'd like another output from the C3, but so be it.

(a 6x6 HDMI matrix or bigger would be great for my home distribution, but those start getting into 5 figures, so I gotta be careful)

Matt--yes, the C3 is intended to replace the C1.

[RJKuzma]

From Big Picture Big Sound Forum comes pricing & launch dates:
"Availability for the HDP70 and HDR77 is expected to be December, 2008 while the new Halo C 3 preamp is expected to ship in Q1, 2009. List pricing is currently pegged at:
HDP70: under $2500
HDR77: under $3000
Halo C 3: under $3500"

[mattburk]

Chris, thanks for the clarification.

[brodricj]

From Big Picture Big Sound Forum comes pricing & launch dates:
"Availability for the HDP70 and HDR77 is expected to be December, 2008 while the new Halo C 3 preamp is expected to ship in Q1, 2009. List pricing is currently pegged at:
HDP70: under $2500
HDR77: under $3000
Halo C 3: under $3500"

Wow, that pricing has taken me by surprise. Now it will be impossible for AA to sell new C1's for $5k (as currently listed) when you can wait until Q1 09 and 'get a C3 at sub $3.5k! I suppose the old and new models are so similar they share the same tooling, and the tooling setup costs have already been written down by the C1/C2 production. I wonder if the export version is going to have the same Auydessy platform as the US version (or be different like the Denon AVP).

[Chris D]

Thanks for the scoop, RJ!

brodricj, I would imagine from what we've seen of Parasound production in the past, that all models shipped worldwide will be the same, as far as capabilities and features.

[brodricj]

brodricj, I would imagine from what we've seen of Parasound production in the past, that all models shipped worldwide will be the same, as far as capabilities and features.

The US version C1/C2 has a different power supply than the export version, which is a shame (110V or 230v, non-switchable). It's just that I seem to recall from the Denon AVP thread on AVS that the Ausyssey licensing locks out some of the in-built capability for non-US versions. Time will tell what we end up with, can't wait until the first reviews are out. I'd like to read how C3 matches up against the Cary 11a (I don't need on-board video as I have an external scaler).

[Chris Rein]

Excellent news! And they decided to keep the Ultra2 Processing and throw in Audessey!

Now, I need to find a buyer for the C1. At this point, if I could get someone to buy me a C3 I'd give them my C1 and T3 tuner! :T

I'm not even sure what I could sell the C1/T3 combo for (or separate) these days.

[brodricj]

I'm not even sure what I could sell the C1/T3 combo for (or separate) these days.

Recently on eBay I saw C1 "new in open box" for 2.5k and the T3 at $300. C2 got a bid at $1k.

[Eric Carroll]

Chris,

Has Parasound announced any specs on the C3 yet, like SNR? I don't see anything on the web page.

[psychdoc]

new models and Blu ray

I've got a couple of questions for the knowledgeable folks out there. I plan on buying a high end blu ray player (like the Denon 3800 or one of the upcoming new models from Sony or Pioneer) but I'd like to also buy the HDP-70 to replace my 7100.

First, will the HDP-70 do any of the functions that the Denon Blu ray does, and if so, which current or soon to be released high-end Blu ray player makes the most sense at this point if used in conjunction with the HDP-70? It doesn't make sense to buy two different components that do the same job.

Second question: what the heck is the difference between the HDP-70 and the C3 (besides obvious looks and XLR outputs?). Is there any difference that would justify spending another 1000.00??????? Thanks in advance.

[Eric Carroll]

Second question: what the heck is the difference between the HDP-70 and the C3 (besides obvious looks and XLR outputs?).

2 XLR inputs, 7.1 XLR outputs - that's the difference. For those of us who prefer XLR...

In fact if you chop off the row of XLR in/outs on the C3 the rows below on the back look exactly the same.

Oh, and don't forget silver vs. black.

[Chris D]

Eric, no, I don't think those specs are out yet. I got the impression at CEDIA that they were still finalizing all the features and build construction of the unit, much less actually going into the labs to do critical spec testing.

psychdoc, Eric summed it up pretty well. Unless something happens in final model production, all THREE units will be exactly the same, with the few exceptions that I listed in the original announcement here in Club Parasound.

As to your 1st question, if you do NOT buy a new HDMI controller, then to get full use from a BD player, you'll be requiring the BD player to do full decoding of the high-def audio streams, (needing Dolby True HD, PCM lossless, and DTS-MA capability to do it all right) then output over 7.1 analog cables (not just 5.1) to your 7100 multichannel 7.1 analog inputs. This will be going to the analog domain earlier, where you can get more signal loss. Also, remember that the 7.1 analog inputs are straight pass-through, so you will not be able to do ANY processing on the inputs, such as applying Dolby Pro Logic IIx.

If you already had a controller that could receive decoded high-def audio via PCM, like HDMI 1.1, then it woul be a different story. Bottom line, yes, if you really want to do it right, you'll buy another HDMI controller of some type, in addition to a Blu-Ray player that can do high bitrate streaming over HDMI, decoded or undecoded.

[psychdoc]

Thanks for the info guys! I guess I need both at this point (HDP70 and High end blu ray).

[brodricj]

I can't see an ethernet port on the back of C3!! Despite the attractive price no ethernet would probably be a deal breaker for me, even if it came in with rave reviews. I want to do TCP/IP control over ethernet, and software updates over ethernet, and access media servers over ethernet, just about every other high-end pre-pro has an ethernet port. Let's hope they can do ethernet with this.

[Eric Carroll]

Eric, no, I don't think those specs are out yet. I got the impression at CEDIA that they were still finalizing all the features and build construction of the unit, much less actually going into the labs to do critical spec testing.

Chris, you seem juiced with Parasound, any chance to get them to confess the audio performance specs in the near future? Even a hint (i.e. subject to change etc)...

[rocasi]

I have been eagerly waiting for a replacement for my C2 capable of HDMI switching. Based on some of the features not in the C3 I may have to look at other options. Sad, I have really enjoyed my HALO gear. Does anyone know if HDMI circuits will handle a 1080p/24p signal?

[Chris D]

Guys, I'm hearing grumblings that the new processors may be delayed past 1Q 2009. Chime in if you know more.

[teachsac]

What I heard about a month ago is that they have no working model, and hope to have one by CES. Looking at probably March or April for distribution.

S~

[Eric Carroll]

What I heard about a month ago is that they have no working model, and hope to have one by CES. Looking at probably March or April for distribution.

Well, I heard that it was put off due to economic & technical conditions... with more information to come as the economy shapes up. That isn't 2Q09. There has been a suggestion of a formal announcement on the web site in a week or so.

An update: it was suggested to me that this may only impact the C3. The point above came from Parasound.

[Chris D]

Yeah... now if the new processors get delayed too long, there'll definitely be a gap in the Parasound lineup, with the old processors already discontinued.

[Eric Carroll]

And there is a market window open right now: many are moving to HDMI so that causes a refresh of the SSP. In the case of the AVR, the window has been open more than a year. So if Parasound delays, it will have no legacy product to sell into this market (who will buy the old when the new is overhanging the market, and others have new stuff too), and, they will have no new product to sell into the technology refresh window.

Assuming you don't need a bank loan to do the development, why not continue it? Unless your sales contract so much you have to let people go overall, but then you have a different problem.

Puzzling development.

[Peter Nielsen]

Assuming you don't need a bank loan to do the development, why not continue it? Unless your sales contract so much you have to let people go overall, but then you have a different problem.

I don't think development is the problem, it's production! Production costs money. In order to get the production costs down to feasible levels, Parasound must order a *big* batch = $$$$$$ upfront costs. Most likely this requires bank loans...

Low production numbers is why some exotic gear is so ridiculously expensive. For instance, when ordering circuit boards or metal chassis parts, volume discounts have a very pronounced effect due to tooling costs and similar short run penalties. A part that costs $100 e.a. when ordered in small quantities (e.g. 10 units) may cost only $10 e.a. if 1000 units are ordered.

Peter

[Eric Carroll]

I don't think development is the problem, it's production! Production costs money. In order to get the production costs down to feasible levels, Parasound must order a *big* batch = $$$$$$ upfront costs.

Good point, probably they don't want to tie up too much capital in inventory especially if you have to do a largish production run and you are unsure of the market. However, Cary just sold out its entire first production run of the Cinema 11a and is on to a second, so there is demand.

[Chris D]

Huh... anybody want to place an order for 10,000 units?

Well, I'll take one, so 9,999 units?

[Vince Helm]

This is a very big launch for Parasound and I am sure that they do not want another "D3" out in the market place for 4 to 5 years.

VH

[Charlieu]

This is the back of Emotiva's upcoming prepro, the UMC-1.

http://emotivalounge.proboards54.com/index.cgi?board=updates&action=display&thread=2567&page=5#33843

Compare it to the back of the HDP70. It's been broadly hinted that Emotiva and Parasound have worked together in the past on amplifiers. There is a big difference in price between the two units, but Parasound is adding Audyssey and THX, while Emotiva is creating their own room correction software. With both companies serving up the same box, but with different software, I think it squashes the economics theory as to their delay.

Just a few weeks ago Emotiva said there was a good chance of their UMC-1 reaching the US at the end of December. It appears now that maybe the chances aren't as good as they thought. I would guess that it's technical difficulties holding up both Emotiva and Parasound.

Emotiva hasn't released any pictures of their XMC-1 prepro yet, but from the description it sounds like it will be the same as the Halo C3. If that is the case, Emotiva is stating a "sometime in the next 6 months" for a delivery date.

Considering what I've been reading on the Cary Cinema prepro, maybe we shouldn't be in a hurry to get a Cirrus chipset based system.

Charlie

[Eric Carroll]

Considering what I've been reading on the Cary Cinema prepro, maybe we shouldn't be in a hurry to get a Cirrus chipset based system.

Cary used only a single CS49700 in its solution (2 DSPs). Apparently 2 DSPs of the CS49700 vintage are not sufficient to support surround & EQ processing on top of HBR decoding.

Emotiva has said they are using 2 CS49700s. If Parasound is working alongside Emotiva in some way, then we would expect 2 CS49700s in the C3 (4 DSPs). Since they announced THX & Audyssey, I can't see them not having 2 CS49700s in the pre/pros.

Emotiva is apparently awaiting code from Cirrus that permits them to integrate two CS49700s. If true, this would be impacting Parasound as well.

[Eric Carroll]

The new page has been updated with the status of the new product line.

http://www.parasound.com/new.php

Update on new Parasound 7.1 models schedule

As many of you know, we previewed our new Halo C 3 and NewClassic HDP70 surround processors and HDR77 NewClassic receiver at the CEDIA show in September. Our introduction dates were targeted for early 2009.

We have elected to defer Parasound's new 7.1 models until the re are improvements in the economic climate and consumer confidence. We hope this occurs by the summer of 2009.

We made this decision after consulting with quite a few of our factory representatives, dealers, export distributors and, of course, our customers; everyone's support for this decision has been unanimous. While we are disappointed that the present economic climate is not favorable for the introduction of these new models, we believe that there is a place for them in our product mix - and in your homes.

Further schedules updates for these wonderful new 7.1 models will be posted on our website in the spring as we approach the revised release dates.

In the meantime, we thank you for your understanding and patience.
As always, we are working diligently to produce award-winning products which combine superb performance, dependability and affordability.

Richard Schram
President
Parasound Products, Inc.

[Chris D]

Bummer. This definitely leaves a gap in the Parasound lineup, with the previous processors retired.

For many reasons, let's hope the economy does turn around.