Halo JC1s raised to 7000USD pair?

[Zoran]

Is it truth that Parasound raises the price of JC1s to 7000USD per pair? Some people from audio forums around claim this is true, since confirmed by certain dealers...

How about the rest of Halo products - A21 power, particularly?

[bhuskins]

This is incorrect information.

JC1's retail for $3,000 each or $6,000 a pair (I'm a Halo dealer by the way.) This is as of Friday the 8th. No future announcements either. The A21 is the same price as well - $2,000.

Brent Huskins
Media Design

[Zoran]

Hi Brent,

Could You recheck once again with Parasound? I've just received confirmation on another forum from guy who called some dealers - they confirmed this dissapointing news...

Thanx,

Zoran, Macedonia

[bhuskins]

They confirmed something that is not correct. I'm one of the largest independent Parasound Halo Dealers in the U.S., no need to recheck. The pricing is what I already stated. It might be that the price you're seeing is the exported price? I'm not sure, but I know for a fact the JC1's are still $3,000 each MSRP here in the U.S. I would suggest looking for another dealer that's not trying to rip you off.

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HT Guide Sponsor

[bhuskins]

FYI...I'll sell you as many pairs as you want for $6,000...

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HTGuide Sponsor

[Indytown]

Brent, Have you ever paired the JC1 with B&W 800 or 802's.

[bhuskins]

Yes and it is a great match. I plan to use the JC1's with my Martin Logan Summits coming in very soon. The JC1's will make just about any pair of speakers sound phenomenal. You'll have a hard time choosing anything under $6k retail that sounds better. There might be a couple of equals out there but not much better. The new Cary Audio CAD 500 MB's seen here: http://www.caryaudio.com/products/audio/cad500mb.shtml are an excellent option as well. They retail for $6,000 a pair also.

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HT Guide Sponsor

[Indytown]

Thanks Brent, I appreciate the feedback. I won't waste your time asking about the sound characteristic I'll find a dealer that has them.

But, It's aways easier to ask someone who has had a chance to listen to a piece of equipment where the initial euphoria of the purchase has passed and one can use a critial ear.

How would the JC1 stack up sonically to Classe, Krell, McIntosh, or some Levinsons?

Slam, dynamics, top end air, bass response?

[bhuskins]

In some ways the JC1's out perform Classe, Krell and McIntosh, but not the Levinsons.

When price is a consideration it outperforms all 4.

All of the variables you mention the JC1 excels at...especially with bass response and dynamics.

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HTGuide Sponsor

[Indytown]

thank you

[bhuskins]

no problem...

Feel free to email me if you need a pair.

thanks,

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HT Guide Sponsor

[Indytown]

ok, thank you

[Zoran]

Brent,

Bad news indeed - this time from Bob Crump himself! He's just confirmed increasing the price to 7000$ pair from May 1st 2005, "due to increased part costs..."

Look at A-gon, forums, preamps/amps, thread "Simaudio W10 vs JC1"

Zoran

[goldear]

Besides the fact that Bob does indicate a price increase...that's also an amusing thread. I don't think poor Mahandave was prepared for the abuse he was due after calling the JCs binding posts "cheap plastic." It appears Bob also had to staighten out another poster who said the JCs couldn't handle tough loads without suffering sonic degredation in low-bias mode. It was a rather imformative thread.

[bhuskins]

It's not bad news...it's actually good news that you found out before it happens. You have plenty of time to get a pair before the price increase announcement.

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HTGuide Sponsor

[Chris D]

Hmmm... now if I can raise $17,500 in the next few weeks...

[Peter Nielsen]

My 2nd pair of JC1s are currently sitting on an UPS truck. I should get them today. :B

I will be using four JC1s to bi-amp my main speakers. An A51 drives the rest of the channels, which is more than sufficient except possibly for the center channel that probably would benefit from a dedicated amp. I will consider getting a 5th JC1 for the center if Brent can give me another good deal before the price goes up :W

Chris, why would you want to use JC1s for all channels? That is overkill if you ask me...

Peter

[nicholtl]

Cuz the C-Man's nuts like that!

[Indytown]

What is the full title for the A-gon site? www.XXXXX.com?

[Peter Nielsen]

Here's the Parasound JC1's vs. Sim Audio W10 thread on Audiogon

Peter

[Indytown]

thank you Peter, I'm still considering the JC1; trying to develope a common sense overview here about the product.

1) seems like poor quality control in the original batches of units produced few years back.

2) some of the reviews tauted it as having a tube sound. I have reasearch this somewhat;actually neutral to slightly forward, good bass extension, with a clear midrange.

Only opinions.

overall I have a positive overview of the amp and still leaning towards it at its price point.

[Peter Nielsen]

A picture always says more than a thousand words: Presenting four JC1s ready to rumble! :B



I haven't got the crossover yet (likely Bryston 10B), so it will probably be a few weeks until I finally bi-amp (or is this quad-amp!?! :B :W ) my MG20.1s.

[Indytown]

If you left them there long enough powered up I would imagine they would leave on the carpet a small burnt mark outlining each JC1.

Looks good.

[Indytown]

Peter,

what type of music do you listen to?

How are you going to handle the lower frequencies?

[nicholtl]

Pete, are you married? If so, how did you convince your wife to let you get all those?!

[Peter Nielsen]

What type of music do you listen to?

Mostly electronic music, industrial and rock. All-time favorites that immediately come to mind are Kraftwerk, Rush, Pink Floyd (Roger Waters).

How are you going to handle the lower frequencies?

The MG20.1s go down to 25Hz. I have a Martin Logan Descent subwoofer for anything below that :wink:

Peter

[Peter Nielsen]

Pete, are you married? If so, how did you convince your wife to let you get all those?!

Yes, I'm married. Didn't ask her :B I guess she is happy enough that I did ask her permission to get the MG20.1s while keeping the 6' tall MG3.6s as surrounds :dance:

Actually, I could always blame her that I got carried away. My original plan last fall was to use small MG1.6s as main speakers and be happy with an A51 (or 2205) and nothing more than that. When we auditoned the Maggies, she really thought the 3.6s sounded much better (who wouldn't agree with that), and we ended up with them instead... Well, from there everything changed. We decided to make the theatre a combined theatre & music room... Of course my wife was happy to get rid of the big SB-M1 we used to have in the living room (which is how I convinced her that now that they were gone, I *needed* the MG20.1s). The really good thing is of course that I now have more or less free hands when it comes to the threatre/music room (or my "play room" as she calls it).

Peter

[nicholtl]

Electronic, industrial, and rock! Wow, we have the same taste too. Only I think our favorite bands are a generation removed. The ones that come to my mind are M83, Therion, and Muse.

[Indytown]

Peter, I am considereing new speakers, BW800 or 802. I also listen to electric music, all types all generations.
Someone posted on avsforum to me that for the type of music I listen to the MG20 would not be appropriate. They are geared more towards classical.What are your thoughts.

[bhuskins]

My vote would be for the Martin Logan Summits...

Best Speaker I've Ever Heard Under $10,000...you can quote me... :B

http://www.martinlogan.com/itscoming/Summit.asp

The sub bass extension is incredible...perfect for all types of music including Electronic, Industrial, Rock or my personal favorite Acid Jazz. They even used JC1's to demo them at CES 2005. This is one all around awesome speaker.

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HTGuide Sponsor

[jericho]

Peter,

I'm the proud owner of a new pair Nautilus 800D.I now need a good amplifier and pre amp.I'm hesitating between Krell (Showcase 7.1) with FPB 400cx, the Classe SSC-600 with two CA-M400, the Mc Intosh MX-135 with two MC-501 or the Parasound C1 with two JC-1.
I can't get out, need some help but please be objective, I listen to all types of music and have also ordered the new center Nautilus HTM-1D.Later I'm going to get a pair of 803D as back surround.

[Peter Nielsen]

Peter, I am considereing new speakers, BW800 or 802. I also listen to electric music, all types all generations.
Someone posted on avsforum to me that for the type of music I listen to the MG20 would not be appropriate. They are geared more towards classical. What are your thoughts.

I chose Maggies because they are so good at reproducing really fast bass transients (e.g. steel-to-steel sounds in electronic music), and of course because of the great dispersion that makes it impossible to pinpoint the location of the speaker.

As an owner of both the MG20.1 and MG3.6, I can tell that they are TOTALLY different creatures. The MG20.1 is very well balanced and plays well with all sorts of music. The MG3.6, on the other hand, works great with some music and not-so-well with other music. My guess is that the comment "They are geared more towards classical" was uttered by somebody that auditioned the MG3.6...

Peter

[Peter Nielsen]

Peter,

I'm the proud owner of a new pair Nautilus 800D.I now need a good amplifier and pre amp.I'm hesitating between Krell (Showcase 7.1) with FPB 400cx, the Classe SSC-600 with two CA-M400, the Mc Intosh MX-135 with two MC-501 or the Parasound C1 with two JC-1.
I can't get out, need some help but please be objective, I listen to all types of music and have also ordered the new center Nautilus HTM-1D.Later I'm going to get a pair of 803D as back surround.

FYI, The Krell preamp is not upgradable, so keep that in mind. I love Krell power amps, but unfortunately they are priced a little bit too high.

IMHO the JC1 beats the Classé CA-M400 when looking at the specs. The JC1 offers a much higher idle current (=more Class A power). I think the CA-M400 is overpriced, but OTOH I haven't auditioned it.

McIntosh. You can't go wrong there - if you can afford it :B

If you get Parasound, then go with the C2 and spend the extra money on something else (e.g. save them for a possible upgrade to a future C3 or whatever).

Oh, and don't forget to look at Bryston! They have some unique offerings like their 20 year parts and labor warranty that can be transferred to future owners!

Just my 5 cents.

Peter

[jericho]

Peter,

I also heard talking about a C3, is that also a pre that's comming out and is it superior to the C1???
Thanks for the info

[Peter Nielsen]

I also heard talking about a C3, is that also a pre that's comming out and is it superior to the C1???

It's supposedly a multi-channel audiophile amp. No digital audio processing or video switching inside.

Peter

[bhuskins]

If a C3 occurs it will likely be more similar to the new 7100 and not a C1/C2 replacement. Remember that the C1 isn't a bad choice though because it has a lot more room for expansion on its back panel. The C2 is very limited. Also, I find that my C1 sonically sounds better than my C2 and I have swapped them in and out of the same system more than once. I conclude that its power supply related...being that they have different power supplies.

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HTGuide Sponsor

[bhuskins]

It's supposedly a multi-channel audiophile amp. No digital audio processing or video switching inside.

Peter

That's the P2, not the C3. It's a multichannel preamp with no digital processing like Peter mentioned. You can see a CES 2005 picture here. http://www.enjoythemusic.com/ces2005/boylan3/

There's also talk of a P1 that would be a Preamp geared toward matching the quality of the JC1's. It might be based on the ultimate preamp from CTC Builders...the BlowTorch seen here.









Here's a review - http://www.tgaudio.com/pictures/Blowtorch_Review.pdf


Just for you Peter...Here's a picture of Bob Crump with the BlowTorch and 4 JC1's.



Another BlowTorch/JC1 picture



Brent Huskins
Media Design
HTGuide Sponsor

[Chris D]

Hey, Peter, if I haven't said it before, you're my hero. On the Maggies, would you say that a A21 and A51 are sufficiently powered to run a 7.1 Maggie setup? Or do you really need a JC-1? I realize the JC-1 would be preferred, of course, but could you make it work, or would you just be underpowering them? Magnepan's website doesn't really give hard and fast power rating numbers they suggest, instead they just say "go to a dealer and audition them at different power levels".

I wonder if you did do a 7.1 complete Maggie setup which speakers would be best to use--7 identical speakers? Or mix and match models depending on which channel it is. Let's say you had $15,000.00 to budget.

[Peter Nielsen]

On the Maggies, would you say that a A21 and A51 are sufficiently powered to run a 7.1 Maggie setup?

Yes. In my opinion it is. My initial setup was a 5 channel setup with a pair of MG3.6 for the fronts and a pair of MGMC1 for the surrounds and a CC3 for the center. (These 5 Maggies cost ~$6,100 if I recall correctly. Add another pair of MGMC1 for $750 and you have a great 7 channel setup. Going with the smaller MG1.6 for the fronts will shave off about $2,500. This might be a place to save if you're not going to use the system for music at all).

The required power depends very much on what kind of sound pressure you want to achieve. Because of this, it is also dependent on the room size and acoustics. If you don't go above normal movie theatre sound levels and your room is moderately sized (say < 15'x25'), then you should be fine. However, if you prefer to enjoy movies at ear deafening sound levels, then it might not work for you unless you go with the biggest Maggies and JC1s (even then it will never reach the deafening sound pressures you easily can achieve with big horns).

So, I would say that the A21/A51 is definitely enough for the smaller Maggies (up to MG1.6). I belive that the power handling limit of the smaller Maggies stops about at the power level of the A21/A51. However, bigger Maggies like the MG3.6 can take a lot more. With the A51 I actually managed to blow one of the mid-range protective fuses in the MG3.6 (ouch!). This has not happened since I got the JC1, although I since then have had it play even louder than when I blew the fuse with the A51. I believe that this really indicates that I reached the power limit on the A51 and it started outputting those kinds of signals that makes the fuses pop. Perfectly normal, even though you woudn't expect to push the A51 that hard... 8)

If you had $15,000 to bugdet, and could accomodate for an acoustically transparent screen, then I would go with 2 pairs of MG3.6 in the front (one of the pairs being used for the center = a wall of sound), a pair of MG3.6 for the surrounds and finally a pair of MGMC1 for the rears. This would set you back 3x4375+750= $13,875.

Peter

[Peter Nielsen]

Just for you Peter...Here's a picture of Bob Crump with the BlowTorch and 4 JC1's.

Ohhh... I just wish I could line up my JC1s like that. Unfortuantely I have a center speaker that is stopping me from doing it...

Awesome pictures. Very interesting! Thanks for sharing them Brent! ;h

BTW, what speakers are those in the last picture. Electrostats?

Peter

[Chris D]

Peter, I'm just dreaming about my next significant theater upgrade, which will probably be several years off. If I could budget $10-15K, I would definitely want to go with electrostats, either Maggies or Martin Logans. I've already got the microperf projector screen (see my pics) so that's not a problem.

[Peter Nielsen]

Peter, I'm just dreaming about my next significant theater upgrade, which will probably be several years off. If I could budget $10-15K, I would definitely want to go with electrostats, either Maggies or Martin Logans.

Note that Maggies use a technology called "magnetic planar". Unlike electrostats, they DON'T require a power source. Also, unlike electrostats, the magnetic planar technology can produce frequencies all the way down to 25Hz (MG20.1) and no hybrid technology is needed as is the case with electrostats.

Peter

[bhuskins]

BTW, what speakers are those in the last picture. Electrostats?

Not sure...

They definitely look like some kind on electrostatic or planar speaker.

It's one of the reasons I posted it...I think they might be bigger than your MD20.1's. I got it off of Crump and Curl's CTC Builder site.

For those that don't know, Bob Crump and John Curl are the chief designers Parasound consults with for all of their amplifier design. JC standing for John Curl in regards to the JC1’s. I figure most of you know that already, but for the newbies it might help.

One of the biggest things to note about the multi-channel preamp coming out – the P2. It will be an extremely cost effective solution for excellent volume control for excellent sources…like a Parasound Universal Player or something similar. This unit is specified to have a full 110 db of channel separation on all 7 channels. This is unheard of in a 7.1 analog device. Even the Bryston SP1.7 (which is regarded as one of the best bypass devices available) only obtains 110 db of channel separation in 2 channel mode not 5.1 mode. A full, dual 7.1 input device with 110db separation across the board could very easily be one of the best sounding systems available as long as it has an excellent source. Why pay for an excellent source if you’re not going to use it.

Gives me another excuse to have my Denon 5900 mod’ed for superior analog performance…

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HTGuide Sponsor

[Peter Nielsen]

It's one of the reasons I posted it...I think they might be bigger than your MD20.1's. I got it off of Crump and Curl's CTC Builder site.

I have seen them before. I just can't remember the name/make of those 'stats! From what I recall, they are magnificient, and among the best electrostats you can get! I just wanted to refresh my memory... :W

They're physically bigger, yes. However, not necessarily that much better than the Maggies. To the "'stat fan", I vaguely recall that THOSE are among the most respected ones and very much comparable to the top-of-the-line Maggies...

For all I know, those are in the 100's and consequently much more expensive than Maggies. Makes the MG20.1 seem like a bargain @ $12k :B

Peter

P.S. They're DEFINITELY 'stats! Anyone could tell - the power cord!! D'OH! :rofl:
P.P.S Nevertheless, those 'stats are very impressive, and if I had a money tree in my back yard I would probably own a pair :B

Yes. Bigger is usually better... (I'd probably enjoy life in Texas :B )

[Chris D]

Since we've gone this direction on this subject, (and are vaguely still keeping it Parasound-stuff) Peter, do I take it then that you prefer magnetic planar speakers to electrostats in general? I'd love to hear your 20.1's someday. Maybe I'll get a chance at a dealer someday. I really haven't even ever heard Maggies in person, only know them by (very good) reputation.

All I know is, I think I hit the sweet spot once at a friend's house who was demoing Martin Logans for me, because I literally could not tell where the sound was coming from. It was lifelike, as if I was right there in the media itself.