IDEA how to incorporate the HTM1D

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  • misterdoggy
    Super Senior Member
    • May 2005
    • 1418

    IDEA how to incorporate the HTM1D

    Couldn't sleep obsessing how do I do it

    This is with Glass (unbreakable) and using Apollo Mezzo soprano unit.

    This way the speaker sits on the floor and the TV sits on top

    Question: With 3 Big speakers like these in the front does one really need a Sub ??
    This is a lot of Bass power---- This could be the rational I have been searching for.

    I could tell my wife I am cashing out by selling the HTM2D and the ASW825 to get the HTM1D I come out with the speaker and some cash too.

    What doth the Peanut Gallery think ? Me thinks a Good Idea :T :T

    Attached Files
    Last edited by misterdoggy; 07 May 2008, 08:52 Wednesday.
  • audioqueso
    Super Senior Member
    • Nov 2004
    • 1930

    #2
    With such good speakers and equipment to match, I think you would be killing the sound if you "enclosed" its breathing space. I would suggest the amps and processors under, and the HTM1D on top with nothing else on its side or above it. Give it space.
    B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

    Comment

    • audioqueso
      Super Senior Member
      • Nov 2004
      • 1930

      #3
      Sorry, I just read that you would be putting the tv on top. I would rather hang the tv on the wall. Seriously, I think you will be using too good a speaker and equipment just to have it hindered by barriers on its side and on top.
      B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

      Comment

      • misterdoggy
        Super Senior Member
        • May 2005
        • 1418

        #4
        Originally posted by audioqueso
        Sorry, I just read that you would be putting the tv on top. I would rather hang the tv on the wall. Seriously, I think you will be using too good a speaker and equipment just to have it hindered by barriers on its side and on top.
        Its Glass and open all around on the sides behind in front completely open !!

        There is plenty of space behind too.

        Its not enclosed like in a cabinet, there are just shelves

        open front, open sides, open back and that is a pretty big opening where the speaker sits too....

        Comment

        • audioqueso
          Super Senior Member
          • Nov 2004
          • 1930

          #5
          Doesn't matter. I remember reading your posts where you played around a lot with speaker placement, but have you ever just placed the speaker out in the open with nothing in the way? It's not about how much mass of air you have available. It's about refraction. I posted a long time ago an example that I've used to explain to people. If you try this, you will see what I mean.

          "Think of it like this. You remember those 3D picture books where if you stare at it just right, you see a cool 3D image and it feels as if you're RIGHT THERE? It's almost the same thing. Our eyes see reflected light, our ears hear soundwaves. The speakers placed in a perfect setup (nothing inbetween, just enough space all around it, etc) will make perfect symmetrical waves, right? You're in the right chair, right listening position, so it's like you're focused just right on the picture image. When you see it, you get drawn in and it feels like you're right there in the picture, right? It's the same feel with speakers. Once you have just the right setup you can sit down and it feels like you're right there in the music. You put something in the middle of the picture page, and you no longer can see the image in 3D the same way. You can see part of it, but not the whole thing and not get the same feel where it feels like you're there. You put something bulky in between the speakers, and the soundwaves now refract and you no longer have perfect symmetrical soundwave, which breaks the intregity of the 3D image. Make sense? That's why I bring my speakers out now as much as I can because the less I have in the way of the soundwaves, the better/bigger the image. Hope this makes sense to you."

          In this case, we're talking about the (I hate to use this word), but harmony between the Left, Center, and Right. Give it a try. It makes a big difference in clarity and soundstage.
          B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

          Comment

          • beden1
            Super Senior Member
            • Oct 2006
            • 1676

            #6
            Originally posted by audioqueso
            Sorry, I just read that you would be putting the tv on top. I would rather hang the tv on the wall. Seriously, I think you will be using too good a speaker and equipment just to have it hindered by barriers on its side and on top.
            Your point may be valid, but, the OP has room constraints like many of us do, particularly given the size and weight of these center channel speakers.

            The placement you suggest may not be possible for him, so is it better that he keeps the HTM2D, or replace it with the HTM1D and display it like he is asking?

            Comment

            • hifiguymi
              Super Senior Member
              • Mar 2007
              • 1532

              #7
              If you ran all three front speakers full range you can probably get away without a sub. As your wife gets used to the way it looks you can always add one later.

              Eric

              Comment

              • misterdoggy
                Super Senior Member
                • May 2005
                • 1418

                #8
                Originally posted by hifiguymi
                If you ran all three front speakers full range you can probably get away without a sub. As your wife gets used to the way it looks you can always add one later.

                Eric
                Eric,

                You are a man after my own heart. You see clearly the answer to my problems. Personally I never found the Sub that useful, only when the bombs were going off in Private Ryan or something do you notice its presence. However, with all the speakers set to large, there is a lot of Bass coming out of all the speakers already

                Originally posted by beden1
                Your point may be valid, but, the OP has room constraints like many of us do, particularly given the size and weight of these center channel speakers.

                The placement you suggest may not be possible for him, so is it better that he keeps the HTM2D, or replace it with the HTM1D and display it like he is asking?
                EXACTLY the point. In an ideal world, yes the speaker should be out there, but in my UNideal room where am I supposed to put the TV and all 4 AMPS and assorted equipment.

                The room already has no place to go....

                This is the best I can arrange.... It ain't too bad though.

                The listening position and Image are perfect. When its just stereo you could swear the center speaker was playing.

                Comment

                • beden1
                  Super Senior Member
                  • Oct 2006
                  • 1676

                  #9
                  Originally posted by misterdoggy
                  This is the best I can arrange.... It ain't too bad though.

                  The listening position and Image are perfect. When its just stereo you could swear the center speaker was playing.
                  If this is the case, then maybe you don't need the center at all?

                  I'm contemplating removing the center speaker and using the front mains. The only problem I see, is that those not sitting in the center, will probably have a disconcerting sound?

                  Maybe we should have an in-depth board discussion about this issue?

                  In case I'm wrong however, I need to replace my Nautilus HTM1 with an HTM2D in black like the one you are contemplating replacing! Do you think your speaker would enjoy a Trans-Atlantic voyage? :W

                  Comment

                  • misterdoggy
                    Super Senior Member
                    • May 2005
                    • 1418

                    #10
                    Originally posted by beden1
                    If this is the case, then maybe you don't need the center at all?

                    I'm contemplating removing the center speaker and using the front mains. The only problem I see, is that those not sitting in the center, will probably have a disconcerting sound?

                    Maybe we should have an in-depth board discussion about this issue?

                    In case I'm wrong however, I need to replace my Nautilus HTM1 with an HTM2D in black like the one you are contemplating replacing! Do you think your speaker would enjoy a Trans-Atlantic voyage? :W
                    IMHO the Center is THE most important speaker

                    If you are left or right of the sweet spot you will hear only the speaker thats closest to you.

                    This is why I love Trifield because the Stereo comes across the front 3 channels

                    Comment

                    • misterdoggy
                      Super Senior Member
                      • May 2005
                      • 1418

                      #11
                      By the way. My shelf design is only 43cm deep while the HTM1D is 58.5cm deep meaning it will be sticking out either in front or in back or slightly both

                      Comment

                      • beden1
                        Super Senior Member
                        • Oct 2006
                        • 1676

                        #12
                        Originally posted by misterdoggy
                        IMHO the Center is THE most important speaker

                        If you are left or right of the sweet spot you will hear only the speaker thats closest to you.

                        This is why I love Trifield because the Stereo comes across the front 3 channels
                        I like the idea of the Trifield. Do you use the Meridian and the Trifield function in lieu of a dedicated stereo pre-amp?

                        Comment

                        • misterdoggy
                          Super Senior Member
                          • May 2005
                          • 1418

                          #13
                          Originally posted by beden1
                          I like the idea of the Trifield. Do you use the Meridian and the Trifield function in lieu of a dedicated stereo pre-amp?
                          Absolutely. I used to ONLY listen to stereo. Hated DVDA and SACD as I don't like the sound all around me. I like that for HT.

                          But a truly fine tuned stereo has that center image perfect.

                          Trifield is the same except more of it and you don't have to be in the sweet spot to appreciate it.

                          Comment

                          • beden1
                            Super Senior Member
                            • Oct 2006
                            • 1676

                            #14
                            Originally posted by misterdoggy
                            Absolutely. I used to ONLY listen to stereo. Hated DVDA and SACD as I don't like the sound all around me. I like that for HT.

                            But a truly fine tuned stereo has that center image perfect.

                            Trifield is the same except more of it and you don't have to be in the sweet spot to appreciate it.
                            How is Trifield different than say if I just had the front three speakers assigned in the A/V processor? In this case, would all of the same signals just be sent to the front three channels as with Trifield?

                            Comment

                            • misterdoggy
                              Super Senior Member
                              • May 2005
                              • 1418

                              #15
                              This is taken from a review in ultimate AV Mag

                              "In Stereo it was good, in Trifield superb. At first, I was skeptical of the Trifield mode, with its synthesis of a center channel from 2-channel sources, but it provided a better sense of front-stage fullness than stereo or any surround logic mode. Naturally, if you're to pull this off, you'll need a good center-channel speaker that blends well with the main left and right speakers."

                              Comment

                              • beden1
                                Super Senior Member
                                • Oct 2006
                                • 1676

                                #16
                                Originally posted by misterdoggy
                                This is taken from a review in ultimate AV Mag

                                "In Stereo it was good, in Trifield superb. At first, I was skeptical of the Trifield mode, with its synthesis of a center channel from 2-channel sources, but it provided a better sense of front-stage fullness than stereo or any surround logic mode. Naturally, if you're to pull this off, you'll need a good center-channel speaker that blends well with the main left and right speakers."
                                Thanks! I'll have to do some research as it seems like a very viable option.

                                Comment

                                • misterdoggy
                                  Super Senior Member
                                  • May 2005
                                  • 1418

                                  #17
                                  Took the plunge and bought the HTM1D and a McIntosh 501 to drive it !!

                                  Comment

                                  • wgriel
                                    Senior Member
                                    • May 2006
                                    • 241

                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by misterdoggy
                                    Took the plunge and bought the HTM1D and a McIntosh 501 to drive it !!
                                    Congratulations! You know you had to do it

                                    Comment

                                    • misterdoggy
                                      Super Senior Member
                                      • May 2005
                                      • 1418

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by wgriel
                                      Congratulations! You know you had to do it
                                      Yeah.... It was like the Butterfly to the flame :lol:

                                      I'll take some foto's of the rig after installation

                                      I am having glass cut for the top 2 shelves

                                      Comment

                                      • kallagtunet
                                        Member
                                        • Jan 2008
                                        • 37

                                        #20
                                        Once you see it in real life you are sold....
                                        Attached Files

                                        Comment

                                        • misterdoggy
                                          Super Senior Member
                                          • May 2005
                                          • 1418

                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by kallagtunet
                                          Once you see it in real life you are sold....
                                          Wow Great Foto

                                          It looks great in Black

                                          :T :T :T :T :T :T :T

                                          Comment

                                          • dmccombs
                                            Senior Member
                                            • Sep 2006
                                            • 306

                                            #22
                                            So, do you notice any sound improvements with the HTM1D over the HTM2D? Are they significant?

                                            Comment

                                            • misterdoggy
                                              Super Senior Member
                                              • May 2005
                                              • 1418

                                              #23
                                              Originally posted by dmccombs
                                              So, do you notice any sound improvements with the HTM1D over the HTM2D? Are they significant?
                                              It has not arrived yet. I am waiting probably in a week or 2 even or more

                                              If its not better I will throw myself over a cliff (just kidding) :rofl: :rofl:

                                              3 large bass speakers and the Marlan Head. It probably sounds better than an
                                              802D :T :T

                                              Comment

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