B&W vs Avalon

**ssabripo** · 15 May 2007, 16:01 Tuesday

which Avalons did you listen to?

I love my 802s, and I'm very fond of the 800/802 line, but if you are comparing them to, say, the Avalon Eidolon, it is a no match contest I'm afraid.....the Avalon Eidolons are much superior I'm afraid.

but you will pay for them!

**dmccombs** · 15 May 2007, 16:41 Tuesday

Why are you afraid? We all know there are better speakers than the 802D out there. It's OK. Really... :W

Originally posted by ssabripo

which Avalons did you listen to?

I love my 802s, and I'm very fond of the 800/802 line, but if you are comparing them to, say, the Avalon Eidolon, it is a no match contest I'm afraid.....the Avalon Eidolons are much superior I'm afraid.

but you will pay for them!

**Dave999** · 15 May 2007, 16:50 Tuesday

I agree. I have compared them and the Avalon Eidolons are better sounding IMHO.

**jim777** · 15 May 2007, 17:23 Tuesday

No I was looking at quality for a given price. I wouldn't want to compare an ISIS with a 802D

I'm not sure of pricing, but I think that would mean choosing between the 803D and the Ascendant, or between the 802D and an OPUS. Does anyone know the pricing for the Avalons?

Thanks for your comments everyone. I would also like to know *why* you think one is better or superior to another.

Is it me or the B&W's have more of a "foot taping" factor (fun factor), or maybe I just prefer my electronics to those at the hifi store demoing the Avalons.

**RebelMan** · 15 May 2007, 18:14 Tuesday

Originally posted by ssabripo

I love my 802s, and I'm very fond of the 800/802 line, but if you are comparing them to, say, the Avalon Eidolon, it is a no match contest I'm afraid.....the Avalon Eidolons are much superior I'm afraid.

Interesting ssabripo. I didn't get the same impression when I heard the Eidolon. It wasn't a direct comparison by any stretch and while they did sound good with the equipment that drove them I wasn't amazed by what I heard. I thought they were somewhat dry and like jim777 a little less "lively". It was a demo held by representatives from Avalon and so I trust that it was an optimized presentation.

**tboooe** · 15 May 2007, 21:46 Tuesday

I have to agree with some of the sentiments given here. My very good friend has the Avalon Opus Ceramique and I used to own the 802D (which in my opinion sound different from the 703s). I have not had the chance to listen to both speakers with the same electronics and in the same room but I think I have a reasonably good understanding of the character of the Avalons and 802ds, of course these are just my experiences so others may have different opinions.

The Avalons are very crisp and clear in the mids and highs. Vocals and instruments sound airy and "light". Because of this, I would be concerned with matching them up with SS gear which could add too much to this character and make the system sound etchy and sharp. My friend uses all tube gear in his system. This has helped add some weight and texture to the midrange. Because of the size of the Opus speakers, bass is merely adequate. For a floor standing speaker I would prefer to get more bottom end. The bass that is produced by the Opus is tight and accurate. Overall I would say Opus is clear, detailed, fast, articulate, and uncolored.

The 802d strength is definitely in the midrange. I would rank its midrange as one of the most seductive and alarmingly real midranges that I have ever heard. There is a magic to voices coming from the 802d. There is just the right amount of weight and texture. Female vocals sound spectacular! I found the highs produced by the diamond tweeter to be very smooth and extended, though probably a bit too smooth for my tastes. I felt that highs lacked the leading edge, sounding a bit rolled off and a tad polite. Cymbals should have a sharpness to it that I did not hear with the diamond tweeter. The bass is a bit boomy and loose and well. That being said, the 802Ds are very easy to listen to. Is it the most accurate or fast or articulate speaker? No. But it is a very nice sounding speaker.

Since the Avalons and BW are such different sounding speakers I think your decision will depend on what kind of music you listen to, what electronics you have, and ultimately what you prefer to from the music.

**jim777** · 16 May 2007, 00:02 Wednesday

Thanks tboooe,

My electronics are McIntosh (MCD201 & MA6500). If I upgrade that later, I will stick with mac, that is the one thing I'm sure of.

As for the music I listen to, that's the catch. I listen to pretty much everything and if I got B&W 703s in the first place is exactly because it was the most versatile I've heard (in that price range). To me, they communicate emotion and rhythm (that foot-tapping factor!).

But then, I went to an audio show where I confirmed my preference for mac, but where I discovered Linn, Loagans and Avalons. Now the Linn just costs too much and Loagans are really very fun but they are not my cup of tea. However, the Avalons, with their unique sound stage (really far behind the speakers) is very special.

So now I'm trying to make an idea on what's best. It seams to me that the Avalons sound more detailed, but to the point where I wonder if it is real or not. The B&W diamonds are natural sounding to my ears, but they don't have that same 3D sound stage in any setup I've heard.

So I hope that these comments will help you help me clear my ideas

**tboooe** · 16 May 2007, 01:04 Wednesday

jim777: good point about the Avalon soundstage. My friends system has a deep and wide soundstage. It really does have a "being there" affect. In addition, I found his soundstage to be well above the top of the speakers. Because of this, you hardly hear any sound coming from the speakers, they truly do disappear.

I would say that the Avalons are closer to your 703s than the 802ds.

As for detailed, I would contend that this is what makes it sound more real and live to me. If you are at a live event, the leading edge of notes are raw and sharp, not rolled off. While roll off may be pleasant to the ear, I think it is not accurately reproducing the sound. The me, live music has an edginess to it. I recently, switched cd players to one that is much more detailed than my previous one. I too was worried it would sound too sterile and not life like. The opposite was true. The extra detail allowed me to hear nuances of the music that I never heard before. My new cdp really does a great job of capturing ambiance. I think these little details are what helps to recreate the "being there" sensation. In this regard, I think the Avalons maybe your cup of tea.

MAC should theoretically be a good match with Avalons. Like I mentioned, my friend uses all tube gear in his setup which helps to compliment the Avalons.

I hope this helps.

**ssabripo** · 16 May 2007, 11:11 Wednesday

Originally posted by dmccombs

Why are you afraid? We all know there are better speakers than the 802D out there. It's OK. Really... :W

true indeed...they are speakers after all :P

Originally posted by RebelMan

Interesting ssabripo. I didn't get the same impression when I heard the Eidolon. It wasn't a direct comparison by any stretch and while they did sound good with the equipment that drove them I wasn't amazed by what I heard. I thought they were somewhat dry and like jim777 a little less "lively". It was a demo held by representatives from Avalon and so I trust that it was an optimized presentation.

wow....very interesting indeed Rebelman 8O . The Opus and ascendant, while good in their own right, have more of the "airy" feel you describe. The Eidolon is a completely different animal though, and I'm surprised you heard it like that.

The soundstaging, as well as the front imaging of an Eidolon has only been bested in my auditions by a pair of Von Scweikert VR9SE's. The depth perception was extremely dimensional, and bass was articulate and accurate to the T (you can tell the group decay and transient response was indeed stellar, particularly for a non-dedicated subwoofer).

just goes to show that we should all audition the pieces ourselves and make an educated decision :T

**Briz vegas** · 17 May 2007, 05:41 Thursday

How do you guys get to audition all this expensive exotic gear.

Next time I am interstate I will have to check out some hifi stores so I can hear some of these exotics. I am also hoping to hear some beauties at our local hifi club, not that the ones I have heard so far have been slouches in the SQ stakes.

**jim777** · 17 May 2007, 08:09 Thursday

Originally posted by Briz vegas

How do you guys get to audition all this expensive exotic gear.

Next time I am interstate I will have to check out some hifi stores so I can hear some of these exotics. I am also hoping to hear some beauties at our local hifi club, not that the ones I have heard so far have been slouches in the SQ stakes.

I was in Montreal and this shop had Avalon ISIS AND Watt/Puppies amung other things...

**jim777** · 18 May 2007, 09:42 Friday

And now I got to hear the Sonus Faber Ilipsa on Ayre amplifition and a Krell SACD.

Now I like the Fabers a lot more than Avalons, even though they don't have anyway near the same 3D imaging. I think that I will spawn a B&W vs Sonus thread..

**beden1** · 18 May 2007, 10:27 Friday

Originally posted by jim777

And now I got to hear the Sonus Faber Ilipsa on Ayre amplifition and a Krell SACD.

Now I like the Fabers a lot more than Avalons, even though they don't have anyway near the same 3D imaging. I think that I will spawn a B&W vs Sonus thread..

I would think the only opinion you should follow is your own. Let your own ears be your judge, particularly since you seem to be just starting your audition/screening process for speakers.

**jim777** · 21 May 2007, 14:29 Monday

Thanks beden.

I will be buying speakers for myself so yes, I will be the final judge. However, like when trying a new car, I like to know in advance what pitfalls to look for. Just to make sure that I check out the things people don't all like to make sure that they don't bother me.

For example, I bought 703's two years ago even though everyone called the harsh. That was the case some electronics, but they sounded like silk with a McIntosh so I got the whole kit

B&W vs Avalon

B&W vs Avalon

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