Amp for 803S?

[Angioguy]

Hoping someone might be able to help me out here. Just started upgrading from an average audio setup: Adcom GFA (200 wpc) & GFP-555 preamp and a pr of B&W DM-330's.

Now I have a Pioneer Elite Pro 920 HD plasma TV and recently picked up the Arcam AVR-300 7 channel AV receiver (100 wpc), which I love-- but I want to upgrade my main and center channel speakers. I've always loved B&W, but the 330's simply aren't doing it for me. I listened to the 803S's and really liked them, but numerous people say that the Arcam isn't capable of driving these speakers to their optimum performance, especially where bass is concerned-- even if I biamp the Arcam. So now I feel compelled to get a separate power amp for the mains +/- the center channels. At first I thought my Adcom (20 yrs old but mint) might suffice, but again, the salesmen I've talked with say that 803's really need to be driven by amps from companies like Levinson, Krell, Classe, McIntosh and the like-- that Arcam, Rotel, Bryston just won't cut it! So I've been entertaining the possibility of grabbing one of these super amps with high power and high current in either the 2/3 channel flavor for the mains/center and also using the Arcam for the rears and as a preamp for the whole system.

My question is this: Does anyone think the Adcom (200wpc) will deliver with the 803S and the Arcam (100 wpc) driving the other speakers? Or do I need to upgrade the power amp? I'd really hate to get rid of the Arcam. I'm sure I could get like $20 for the Adcom-- it's the $5K I'll need to steal :E for the Krell that I might have a problem with.... suggestions?

Thanks in advance,

Angioguy

[Dmantis]

Difficult to answer. I will agree with the 803's needing higher end amps and gear to hear what they can do.

Funny B&W speakers are rated at 8ohms and by the number seem to be easy to drive. But when you put the N series on lower end gear, they sound terrible. B&W speakers are fussy. But when you have great gear they sound better then most speakers out there.

My best advise is to start trying some stuff out. See if your dealer will let you try a few things. Owning such great speaker does warrant owning great gear. Trying to get by is ok , but you will not take advantage of your new speakers.

It really comes down to personal taste. My taste for B&W N series is Krell. If home theater is your game , check out the Krell Showcase line as well.

mantis

[Indytown]

Difficult to answer. I will agree with the 803's needing higher end amps and gear to hear what they can do.

Funny B&W speakers are rated at 8ohms and by the number seem to be easy to drive. But when you put the N series on lower end gear, they sound terrible. B&W speakers are fussy. But when you have great gear they sound better then most speakers out there.

My best advise is to start trying some stuff out. See if your dealer will let you try a few things. Owning such great speaker does warrant owning great gear. Trying to get by is ok , but you will not take advantage of your new speakers.

It really comes down to personal taste. My taste for B&W N series is Krell. If home theater is your game , check out the Krell Showcase line as well.

mantis

What are your thoughts for the 802 and 800D series speakers and amp synergy.

I had a chance to listen to 805N with a B&K amp and it sounded fantastic; very holographic.

[grit]

I've not heard myself, so take this with a grain of salt - I've been told by people I trust that Classe equipment has "wonderful synergy" with B&W speakers.

Brief side note - I had no idea what synergy was until I looked in to high end audio. I tested some Lynn speakers on a Lynn amp. Then, to make the point, my dealer brought in a Rotel amp. Lynn's speakers went from sounding very pleasant to harsh. I don't know if the lack of synergy was between the speakers and Rotel's amp or between Rotel's amp and Lynn's source/processor, but it was definitely missing. That same Rotel amp power's my B&W 703's and I love it.

[lvhung]

Some Rotel lovers is now Krell lovers :lol:
May be you love too many things :rofl: ;x( :Z

[Dmantis]

What are your thoughts for the 802 and 800D series speakers and amp synergy.

I had a chance to listen to 805N with a B&K amp and it sounded fantastic; very holographic.

Funny as I have ran the N803's off a B&K receiver (avr307 then) and it was fantastic. I was shocked how well the 2 went together for music and movies. Killer if you ask me. I would be very happy with B&K running B&W speakers. I owned B&K at one time and I can tell you this, once you get past the damn clicking and popping when changing sources or channels, the damn thing sounded incredible.I considered gooing Ref50s2 with a Ref 200.5 or 7. But I rememeber Dynaudio not working as well with B&K like B&W does. And funny on the other hand I felt Dynaudio and rotel together sounded awesome.

Synergy is very real and if you don't match your gear correctly , you won't hear how good all of it is.

mantis

[UCLAman]

Well, I am running a Rotel 1095 (5 x 200watts) to run my N803s, HTM CNT center, and my inwalls. However my wife just bought me a Rotel 1080 (2 x 200) wich I plan on adding to my system. In fact this weekend I will be biamping my left/right, and center channel. My speakers sounded great. Now I can't wait to see what they sound like.

Of course with so many choices of amps out there there will be more than one choice. For my budget, my hi end sound shop recommended the Rotel. SLowly but surely I will continue to upgrade - thats forsure - upgraditis!!! :T

[Zoran]

Two "normal" (in terms of budget - 2000USD either) solutions:

Parasound Halo A21. Great headroom, spacious mids/highs...

Rotel RB-1090. Best Rotel amp ever. "Poor man Krell FPB".

For multichannel purposes, Halo A51 should be bb...

[dan87951]

Funny B&W speakers are rated at 8ohms and by the number seem to be easy to drive. But when you put the N series on lower end gear, they sound terrible. B&W speakers are fussy. But when you have great gear they sound better then most speakers out there.


mantis

THe 803's are rated at 8ohms but if you have ever seen a frequency/ohm chart for a set of speakers you will see that the ohms vary per frequency therefore some speakers like the 803's will put a load as much as 3ohms on your amplifer. Been a while since I read my 803 speaker manual but I'm pretty sure it states something about this in there. I'm currently running a Rotel RB-1080 with my N803's and it does sound great. Rotel builds beefy power supplies and uses great components and in my opinion provide a good bank for the buck compared to anything out there.

[gerardhn]

what dou you think of accuphase
top japanese brand
not so popular in this us forum... may be
any experiences?

[Ash]

Angio,

You can consider the Krell KAV-400xi, its a two channel integerated pre/amp. It delivers 200w into 8ohms and 400w into 4ohms. And it has HT passthrough, therefore, you can connect it to the AVR300 and use the volume in the AVR to control it. It will also serve as a better stereo preamp than the AVR300. I think it costs around $2,500.

I did not listen to this amp, so you might want to give it an audition.

[Claude D D]

We had the Krell KAV400xi( I also own one) hooked up too 803D's in our store a couple of days ago. The little Krell did a very good job of driving them.Good control and nice open mid and top end.. We had the Krell Showcase pre/pro and amp running them in our large HT room for a while and they sounded great. I was just going to get a pair of 804s but after listening to how the 400 was able to drive the 803D's I think I'm going to save up more cash and go for the 803D's. We ran a Rotel RCD 1072 cd player at first then switched over to the Krell SACD Standard. That's when the fun really started, much more musical and the bass had even more depth and control. Real nice combo. :T

[yfei]

nuforce ref 9s

I am using Nuforce Ref 9s with B&W N803, and very happy this setup.

[Angioguy]

Amp for 803's

Thanks for all your thoughts. Listened to the 803S's with the McIntosh MC-252 today and really enjoyed the sound. Assuming there is no hardware conflict, I'm going to drive the 803 (mains) with the Mc, and will drive the center channel HTM4S and rear Rogers LS4a's with the Arcam AVR-300.

Is 3.5-4% off msrp a good discount on about $12,000 worth of gear?

[george_k]

Angioguy,

Short answer is no,

There's tons of margin on the products your listening to. My B&W dealer pays for the taxes which amount to 14.5% here in Montreal. On some of his better clientel he goes beyond just the taxes and offers a 20% discount.

I figure you should atleast be able to get 10% off with some hangling, I don't know how often people walk into your dealer's store and drop 12k.

[Gump]

My salesman always gives me 10% off and that's without any "hangling". But, maybe things are different in the big apple...