New B&W Nautilus Range

[uncle_git]

http://www.hificlube.net/common/ver_artigo.asp?id_artigo=490&seccao=Noticias&subseccao=Noticias

Some images there.

Anyone know if there will be a N802D and if so what price it's projected to be ?

[sikoniko]

I don't suppose anyone could translate that?

interesting that they changed the bottom of the 801. HTM1 is pretty big and ugly looking, but I bet it sounds amazing. You would need a dedicated HT for that one I would imagine.

[junior77blue]

So, there's no 804 replacement??

I really don't want to buy 805s and have to pay an arm and a leg for speaker stands. I made that mistake when I purchased my 705s, which I would have purchased 704s instead. And the 803s seem a bit out of my price range.

That center channel looks amazing!! But, yeah will only work in a dedicated home theater setup with either front projection or wall mounted display. Won't work with my rear projection LCD.

No sign of an HTM2 replacement?

[jlee]

New bottom for 801 looks great if you ask me. More curves to the cabinet to make everything match. It's probably a little sturdier to have those metal legs instead of the wooden legs. I've always thought those skinny wooden legs looked funny... they looked relatively "weak" compared to the rest of the speaker.

[KEF]

My best attempt at a translation

Portuguese isn't my strong suite, but I spend waaay too much time in Brazil, so here is my best attempt:

International market

BW NAUTILUS SERIES 800 D: THE DIAMONDS ARE ETERNAL

Report in London

Finishing up after arriving from London where I attended at the British Museum, the presentation of the new series BW Nautilus Serialize 800, I didn't want to leave without sharing with the readers the innovation already showing in the pictures of some of the models to open the appetite for the integral Report that will be published soon simultaneously in DN and in HIFICLUBE.

BW Nautilus 801D
At first view nothing has changed but all the new models “D” have a fabulous diamond tweeter that answers to the 70kHz range and the base driver is now manufactured from a new rigid carbon fiber material.

BW Nautilus 800D
They maintain all of the aspects of the previous models like the following: the "heads" of "Marlan", the elliptic form of the boxes, the absorption tubes, etc. The bases and the supports were redrawn. Inside the "crossovers" were simplified to the possible limit (the high pass filter, for instance, is constructed from a simple condenser in parallel) and the selection of components was very demanding.

BW Nautilus 803D
Entirely new is the model 803D that now has 3 (three!) bass drivers

BW Nautilus 805S
The models S takes advantage all the most recent innovations, less the diamond "tweeter", maintaining the previous aluminum version.

BW Nautilus HTM1D (central)
Absolutely unbelievable is the center HDM1 D that is the type of speaker that "takes no prisoners". Imposing, powerful and dominant. A column with "head" for strong spirits that like sound of integral movies.

[junior77blue]

Looks like they will have an 804 model, but no diamond series. Just a standard (S) series.

I think i'm just gonna get a 703/HTM7...or possibly 704 as these won't be out for a few months (after the CES show) plus price increases. Otherwise, I would have to upgrade electronics as well...not in the forseeable future/budget.

[Aussie Geoff]

Hi,

Here is a reply from B&W re a query from me on the speakers and also some pictures (same as on the Portuguese web site - must be a standard "teaser" publicity set...)

Looking at the reply I can understand B&Ws position - basically they don't want too many excited customers contacting stores until they have briefed their distributors, who can then brief their dealers. So we will see nothing on their web site for a while (perhaps after Christmas) when all world wide dealers are up to speed with the new range... Then we will have a flood of information with DVDs, white papers etc.

Of course - the internet being what it is - the horse will have long bolted before then and passionate consumers will know anyway and be planning (or have placed) their orders!

Dear Mr Costello

Thank you for your interest in forthcoming B&W products.

A new 800 Series was indeed unveiled to the world's audio press and our international distributors in two events - one in London and one in New York - on Wednesday last. I gave a presentation to the New York event, which was followed up the next day by a similar presentation to our North American retailers. As of now, no other retailers have been briefed on the details of the new products and it is therefore inappropriate for full information to be given to consumers until the full and proper support structure is in place and indeed, this e-mail form of communication is not suited to giving out that amount of information.

There will be a comprehensive armoury of information vehicles used to inform consumers about the new Series, and I suggest that you wait for this, which will be available to you through the normal chain of our Australian distributor, Convoy International, and our authorised retailers, well in time for the products' availability in Australia, the date of which is still under discussion. In addition to the normal brochure, there will also be a DVD, with about 2.5 hours of content, and a technical white paper, similar to those produced for the Nautilus 801 and Signature 800. In line with our general policy, new product information will not be available on the internet until it is available in all major global markets.

May I suggest that you contact Convoy International to register your interest and be put on the mailing list for this information, which will thoroughly inform you on the new products.

Best regards

Mike Gough
Senior Product Manager
B&W Loudspeakers Ltd.


Regards

Geoff

[jazznsoccer]

Just as I was ready to place the order...

Well I still have about 4 weeks before the flooring is in for the new room Would sure love o have speakers for the Christmas holidays. But would love to do a compare of N803D N802 and N802D.

If the diamond tweeters are 1250 each, then thats a bump of 6250 for the 5.1??

[jazznsoccer]

If the 803 D outperforms the 802, and the 803D goes for 4,000 each, then it would appear that the price of the 802 would have to drop.... (logic always gets me into trouble with the sales guys... 8) )

And will the SCMs have a "D" version tweeter or just the woofer/crossover upgrade??

[greggz]

Anybody besides me have this pop into their head when they first saw that new center channel?

[Lewing]

Wow... i never thought a center speaker could look like that.
8O

[Miroku]

That center is nuts! I think I will wait to see what sort of prices I can get on the current HTM1 and 804s in a few months.

[Aussie Geoff]

Everyone,

Remember the HTM1D is the new "statement" centre speaker from B&W designed to blend in with the 801D and 800D which are big speakers.

They also have the HTM2D which is more like the current HTM1 and designed for the 802D and 803D speakers or 801D and 800D owners who don't want to make quite such a statement with their centre speaker....

And then there is the HTM3 for the 803 and 804

and

the even smaller HTM4 for the 805 (why didn't they name it HTM5?)

A Nautilis Centre for every speaker front speaker type in the Nautilis range

Geoff

[Aussie Geoff]

Hi,

Some more pricing from Audio Asylum

Cost of B&W 800 Diamond : $20,000 (per pair)
Cost of B&W 801 Diamond : $16,000 (per pair)
Cost of B&W 802 Diamond : $12,000 (per pair)
Cost of B&W 803 Diamond : $8,000 (per pair)
Cost of B&W HTM1 Diamond Center Channel: $8,000

That's a serious centre channel!

PS - I'm told that the diamond tweeter cost is $750 a speaker - its the extra woofer in the 803D that adds the $500. So the logic is:

• Current 803 = $2,500 + $250 for series 2 improvement + $750 for diamond tweeter + $500 for 3rd woofer so 803D = $4,000 each or $8,000 a pair
• Current 802 - $5000 + $250 for series 2 improvements + $750 for diamond tweeter so 802D = $6,000 each or $12,000 a pair
• Current 805 = $1000 + 250 for series 2 improvements so 805S = $1,250 each or $2,500 a pair
• Current 803 = $2,500 + $250 for series 2 improvements so 803S = $2,750 each or $5,500 a pair
• Current 804 - $1,750 + $250 for series 2 improvements so 804S = $2,000 or $4,000 a pair

And for the 800D and 801D B&W adopted the pricing of their existing Nautilus Signature series speakers on the grounds that these new speakers well and truely exceeded the performance of that range...

Geoff

[Aussie Geoff]

Stereophile Review of new range next week

Hi,

Kalman Rubinson, one of Stereophile's senior reviewers will be posting a information article / review of the new B&W Nautilus range on www.sterophile.com next week...

You will all remember his reviews such as http://www.stereophile.com/loudspeakerreviews/600/ covering the B&W Nautilus 800 Signatures...

B&W clearly did

Geoff

[sikoniko]

I would think it is safe to assume that the 40th anniversary will bring the new signature series.

I wonder how well dealers are going to receive requests from people to upgrade their current nautilus speakers for the new series, especially if it is a similar model w/ the new enhancements.

Also, I wonder if they have done any redesign to their 'Nautilus' speaker.

Another question would be how much power it will take to drive these new speakers. B&W will probably do a lot of promo work w/ their classe stuff.. heheh.

[gostan]

It will certainly be interesting to listen to the sound of the new 800's. Good luck to all who were able to wait for series 2, instead of pulling the trigger like I did early last August. I love my 803's and HTM1 and could not be happier. Now, I am going to have to figure out how to upgrade my rear CDM1's to the series 1 805's or 804's before they are no longer available as I want to be sure to have a matching 5.1 set. I would expect about a 25 to 30% discount, but probably not that steep until the new series are almost available. Then again, if I win the lottery I could trade up to four 802D's and a HT 1 Diamond Center Channel.

PS: I assume that the new 803D's will be much taller than the existing 803's in order to have space for the third woofer.

[Aussie Geoff]

Hi,

Thanks to a helpful poster answering my questions at Audio Asylum we now have the prices for the rest of the Nautilus range

Cost of B&W HTM2 Diamond Center Channel: $4,000
Cost of B&W HTM3 Standard: $2,500
Cost of B&W HTM4 Standard: $1,300
Cost of B&W SCM Standard: $1,100
Cost of B&W DS8 Standard: $1,500

I think we now have the information on price to know "buy now" or wait for the new range to be available...

All we need now is to confirm the sound quality upgrade is everthing B&W are claiming!

Geoff

[sikoniko]

being that the SCM is the same price as the SCM1, I wonder which I should get... would it be too different...

[Phil Rose]

One of the things that I find interesting is the DS8 which I'm guessing is their di-pole surround. I always thought that this was an omission from the N line for really good side surrounds that were found in their lower lines. It just doesn't seem logical to me to have a direct radiator in the side surround position of a 7.1 system so, it would appear that this has been addressed with this new model.

Now if I ever get into a room where I need 7.1 it looks like I'll be able to get the DS8 to match my N802/HTM1/N804/HGS18 speaker system. :T

[Rags]

Any information / prices on the new subwoofers ?

[Lewing]

I am really looking forward to visit my dealer once the new B&Ws are out, to see and listen to those speakers in person. If i were to buy high end speakers i would definitely pick the new B&Ws but i am very sure that the new 800's can only be in my wish list for a very long time, dream speakers......

[uncle_git]

Current 802's are $4000 USD a apeaker - if those prices posted are in USD - then that's a 50% price increase for the 802D's !

Puts a 5.1 setup from around $15k to about $22k - that's one hell of a price jump. (Assuming 5.1 - 802's, HTM1, ASW850 , 805's )

[jazznsoccer]

Sticker shock

:E So the 5.1 setup of

N802 ($4000 each)

<<Geoff - where did you get an MSRP of 5000 or is that Aussie$?>>

HTM1 ($2000) and
SCM (1100 each)

if updated to Diamond series would be

802 D 12,000 ( a bump of 2k each = double ouch!)
SCM same at 2200
HTM2 = $4000 (I wonder what that is compared to today's HTM1??)

Adds $6000!! :E This puts the B&W very close in price to the Revel Ultima Studio + Gem + Voice set

And subwoofer - is the ASW850 unchanged??

And if 805s for the 7.1 would be an increase from 2000 to 2500 per pair.

This also begs the question of how well the standard series matches the timbre of the Diamond series if the 805 and SCM remain without D versions. I'll be looking forward to that stereophile review. And wondering what the discount will be on the standard models...

And you must really want to make a statement to spend $8K on a center channel THAT unique....

[Rags]

I have a feeling the US $ prices reflect the current weakness of the dollar - B&W are a UK company and profits in £'s are what counts. I suspect that UK prices will not go up by the same amount in % terms.

[Andrew Pratt]

Guys here's the press release.

B&W Press Release

[sikoniko]

so every speaker is a signature!!! That is sweet! Im wonderin if my dealer will let me trade up now for sure....

[Dan Schulze]

WOW!!! It's only been a week or two since I checked in this Forum, and I find this awesome thread!!

Now the decision has to be made - I have a 5.1 system with 802's, HTM1, and 805's. I have been thinking about adding rear speakers (two more 805's, for the match). I guess I better get down to my dealer and get them before it's too late!

I just got these speakers about a year ago and am very satisfied with them. Of course I could always dream of better, but the wallet is still screaming from my upgrades this past year!!!

Can't wait to hear the new line!

[Aussie Geoff]

Hi,

As promisied in the original "kick off" post for this thread (and suggested by Sikoniko!), I have changed the thread to be a sticky and updated the first post on the first page to be a comprehensive update of what we know about the new range.

Thanks everyone for your contributions so far. Take a look!!! Here's a SHORTCUT They look sweeeet

Geoff

[Aussie Geoff]

Sikoniko, (and others with upgraditus)

I received an interesting “off the record” Email from a B&W distributors representative I contacted with some questions.

“One of the design goals that B&W had for the new Nautilus range was to preserve the investment made by existing owners by allowing “mix and matching”. To support this, the new range deliberately retained the same visual look and aesthetics as the previous range. With the Nautilus range already being extremely neutral, maintaining a compatible sonic signature was also a natural outcome.

The new Standard or Diamond series front speakers can be added to an existing surround sound system using older model Nautilus rear speakers. Equally the new Standard range surround speakers (SCMS and DS8 ) can be added to systems with older model Nautilus front speakers. ASW subwoofers are fully compatible across the new and old Nautilus ranges.

B&W do, however recommend that the front speakers are maintained of the same series wherever possible to maintain a seamless soundstage. Recommended combinations are:
1) 800D or 801D or 802D with HTM1D
2) 802D or 803D with HTM2D
3) 803S or 804S with HTM3S
4) 804S with HTM4S”

Apparently B&W are (understandably) emphasising this message to their dealers etc.

I have added the relevant parts of this to the post at the front of the thread.

Geoff

[aarsoe]

Geoff

While I do "buy" the same visual look, I also think that creating a more advanced cabinet simply is not possible, even with the rise in the pricing.

PS: You did a great job on the sticky - but are you sure about the prices? 20 K USD for a pair of 800D seems to be a drop in price. The current model 800 Sig. is something like 30K USD here..

[Aussie Geoff]

Arsoe,

Thanks re the Sticky!

Re the Pricing - I am going on the information in an Audio Asylum thread for all my pricing. Are you sure that the older model Signature 800 were $30,000 - the Stereophile review HERE has them at $20,000? If you are talking a Danish price converted into US$ I suspect that you are dealing with the widely varying markups for different speakers by the importers in different countries. I have the same issue all the time in Australia where we seem to pay 30+% more for B&Ws that you would expect based on the US$ price.... If the new range aren't better priced in Australia I'm seriously thinking of flying to the USA or the UK and shipping them over...

Re the More Advanced Cabinet - I know what you mean, some of those cabinets were already amazingly complex internally but clearly B&W are striving for perfection here (having established their own Danish cabinet making factory!) so let me quote some examples from the press release.

On all models in the new series, the main curved part of the cabinet is formed from a single piece of layered ply, eliminating a join at the rear of the cabinet.

and

The 803S’s cabinet, and internal Matrix, have been revised to increase stiffness, which has resulted in an increase in weight of 11kg (25 lb).

So clearly there are some changes as B&W seek to make great even better :T

However for those 805 Signature owners you will be pleased to know that there are no changes to the already incredibly complex cabinet.

The 805S builds on the huge success of the Signature 805, offering greatly improved performance from the same cabinet design.

Geoff

[sikoniko]

Signature 800's are $20k USD for the pair.

Great work Geoff!

[Aussie Geoff]

Sikoniko,

Thanks....

I can see some SCMS's in your future - think of them as an even better match for your 803 - more musical and dymamic than the SCM1s you thought you would have to rush and buy! Your own pair of "better than Signature 805 rears"

... And then when you upgrade later (safely ensconsed in your new house) to the 802D / HTM2D combination you will still love those SCMS rears)...

Geoff

[KEF]

So here's my question

Prior to this there were a pair of N802s in my immediate future...

What are the odds that the N803Ds are really a sonic improvement over the current N802s? I am sure the highs will be better due to the tweeter, the mids and lows (in particular) are what I am interested in.

I suppose test will be the only way to know for sure....

Fun, fun, fun....

Cheers,
Keith

[jazznsoccer]

Hi Geoff -- MArvelous thread - I love it!!

Is the DS8 designed to be mounted on the wall??

[Aussie Geoff]

JazznSoccer,

Thanks... We all made this thread the best source of information on the new B&W range on the Web!

Yes the DS8 is designed for wall mounting like the SCMS

Geoff

[jazznsoccer]

Thanks Geoff!! - now all I need is a demo

[jazznsoccer]

I visited the local B&W dealer today and he said he should have demo equipment in before the first of the year for deliveries starting mid January.

[georgev]

Upgrade of existing Nautilus range

Is there any possibility of B&W offering upgrade paths to existing models? Possibilities of changing the drivers and the tweeters, as well as the midrange? Obviously the cabinets will remain the same.
Can there be such a huge difference from the existing range, which is already great.
George.

[EAmin]

The new N-series sounds like an awesome addition to the B&W line.

I think the 803D is a great idea for those that want performance, but don't want something as big as an 802 in their family/living room. This in combination with the HTM2D --- I can only imagine how good this would sound in my room.

[Aussie Geoff]

GeorgeV,

Is there any possibility of B&W offering upgrade paths to existing models? Possibilities of changing the drivers and the tweeters, as well as the midrange? Obviously the cabinets will remain the same.

Can there be such a huge difference from the existing range, which is already great.

Re the upgrade paths B&W have a standard answer to this in their FAQ Section which is:

Some ask if they can convert one version of a model to another (eg Matrix 801 Series 2 to Series 3). In general it is not easy to do this, because we have a tendency to change the way we put things together when we make a model change. That usually means that the new parts do not fit in the old system. That is certainly true of the Matrix 801 variants. In many cases it may be cheaper to trade in the older model for the newer one than buy all the new parts and have them fitted.

Re the huge difference - B&W and those few who have heard them to date seem to think so - so I guess we will have to wait for some more press and for them to come into the stores..

Geoff

[Aussie Geoff]

KEF,

What are the odds that the N803Ds are really a sonic improvement over the current N802s? I am sure the highs will be better due to the tweeter, the mids and lows (in particular) are what I am interested in.

This is one of those "time will tell" questions... However B&W seem pretty confident that the 803D is better than the existing 802... Improvements include:
>> Much better tweeter
>> Better than Signature series version of the FST
>> New Carbon Fibre sandwitch bass driver
>> Better Crossover

Makes you wonder how good the 802D must be!

Geoff

[Aussie Geoff]

JazznSoccer,

I visited the local B&W dealer today and he said he should have demo equipment in before the first of the year for deliveries starting mid January.

Excellent re the demo equipment...

Food for thought though is that we know that B&Ws production capacity is relatively limited - with Cabinets being a key bottleneck because of the very complex and time-consuming production technology. Remember for several months after the 700 series was released there were posts from frustrated people with one to 2 months waits for the model / colour that they wanted... I would not be surprised to see this again with the even more demanding to make 800 series...

Geoff

[sikoniko]

Remember for several months after the 700 series was released there were posts from frustrated people with one to 2 months waits for the model / colour that they wanted... I would not be surprised to see this again with the even more demanding to make 800 series...

While this is entirely possible, I dont see that as likely. Most companies learn from their past and know they need to keep the supply up with demand. I am sure they are preparing for this in one way or another.