Wavecor Ardent Journal - the first Builds

[JonMarsh]

100 watts per channel should be reasonable in most rooms- remember, you only pick up 3 dB going to 200W. That should be an 8 ohm rating. These need voltage, more than big current, though they are around 5 -6 ohms in much of the range. None of this 2-3 ohms stuff.

There's no reason you can't mount the crossovers externally- but I suggest paying attention to the cabling from the midrange and tweeter to the crossovers- I use Cardas SE10; another good choice would be Kimber 8TC for mid and tweeter, 12TC for the woofers. Interleaved or coaxial cables both keep down inductance and minimize stray field pickup.

[shootinnutz]

Thanks, Jon, I believe these are the speakers I have been waiting for

[kvardas]

Four Wavecor SW223BD01 drivers ordered [emoji106]


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[raygun]

This speaker is just stunning! Good job guys! 8O

[dar47]

Four Wavecor SW223BD01 drivers ordered [emoji106]


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Good to see another wading into the deep end.:T What your time table for your build?

[JonMarsh]

I'm clearly going to be spending some serious time on the CAD files and documentation PDF for this during the holiday break! :W

Good thing I'm taking two weeks off- approved already- barring issues at the special customer.

[BobEllis]

Here's hoping your vacation stays intact! (slightly selfish motivation) :^x :^x

[JonMarsh]

Here's hoping your vacation stays intact! (slightly selfish motivation) :^x :^x

It's a hope I devoutly have... there is a possibility/target to have everything wrapped by this Friday, but I'm not holding my breath planning on that...

[JonMarsh]

Jon,
the *Core Ardent has been added. But, I took out the crossover images, etc. to make it a little more compact to give a quick overview.
Now we just need the Nascent and a few others added.

I've heard through the grapevine that ET is seriously considering a re-vamp of the Nascent, based on using the modified LR3 instead of B3 crossover alignment, but things are still in evaluation. Nascent wasn't officially finished, last I heard. :W

[kvardas]

Good to see another wading into the deep end.:T What your time table for your build?

My timetable is extended diemen work commitments and a couple wife projects: built-in dresser and a dining room sideboard.

Took advantage of the sale price of the drivers.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[kvardas]

"Due to..." iOS spell checker correction error.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[JonMarsh]

Sometimes you have to strike while the iron is hot... there's many things I've done that way over the last 3-4 years otherwise you pass up some good opportunities!

BTW, the SW223BD02 seems to be compatible with the design also, (another 4 ohm variant), though obviously not the 03. (8 ohms).

[benthe8track]

Got a nice response from Wavecor.

Hello Ben,

Thank you for contacting us and sorry to keep you waiting.

I guess you might be in violation with our registered trademark “Wavecor”.
However, as long as you do not use the name for any commercial speakers we have no problems with what you do.

We appreciate you letting us know up front and wish you success with the project.


Best regards
Allan Isaksen
General Manager, Wavecor Ltd.

[JonMarsh]

OK! That's good news!

And my most recent shipment of SW223BD01's just arrived last night, too!

[Wayman]

A most gracious response! Although I don't really know anything about the company, based on this, I feel good about using their products.

Cheers, Wayne

[dar47]

Well good news, maybe we should design a little label for the grills or back and get Ben's buddy to laser cut them for us? The rest of my xover parts as well as amp for the IB sub are ordered and should be at the border by the weekend. Here's hoping I'm hearing stereo by Sunday! At least by the 18th when Ben shows up for a pre-Christmas visit and he can help dial in the grill felt and maybe get the IB singing too. :B

[JonMarsh]

That sounds like a great plan, guys! By the 21 I hope to have my new audio subnetwork and the new re-clocking system in place, and start working on the Ardent: Wavecor Edition documentation and construction hints. I'll likely want to run early versions of it by you guys for review, too, you know, to protect the innocent, reward the guilty, etc. :W

If my LF module experiments pan out, I might build a set or two to initially use just as subs with my Ardent's at GF's. Three woofers arrived last night, along with a big shipping refund from Solen. I don't know why they overcharge so much on that... happens every time. But I always get it back, too.

[dar47]

Ya 3 heads are better then 1 "supposing their sheep's heads". Will look at that model and tighten any thing up.

I don't know what's with Solen's online ordering but I usually talk to the sweet girl on the phone and Ben's right it's hard to get mad at them after you talk to her, haha. Maybe not as grand as picking up a bike from another state but I'm driving an hour and a half to the border to save over a $100 in shipping maybe 6% on duty and some cheap gas for the trip back. It's more enjoyable in the summer but you do what you got do.:W

[JonMarsh]

yeah, i was talking to that girl just last week I think... she's worth every penny they pay her, plus some!

Yeah, that drive has got to be a bit more of a chore this time of year- but then maybe it's a way for you to experience some warmer weather compared with Winnipeg? :W

[JonMarsh]

Californians are so weird...

I'm in line at at Starbucks this morning at 6:30 AM... this 30 ish gal in front of me has on a long wool peacoat, a knit scarf wrapped around her through and shoulders, and a heavy knit cap on her head. Oh, and BTW, it's 66 degrees outside. Usually I wear shorts when it's that warm that early in the day...

Yeah, there's going to be a big front coming through later this morning with high winds and very heavy rain. NOTHING she had on was water proof or water resistant. If it had been my daughter, I would have sent her home to change...

[BobEllis]

A bit overdressed even for upstate NY, where we are in the low 30s with snow flurries for the next few days. We had a foot of wet snow yesterday and overnight. Don't you wish you lived here, Jon?

[Steve Manning]

Californians are so weird...

I'm in line at at Starbucks this morning at 6:30 AM... this 30 ish gal in front of me has on a long wool peacoat, a knit scarf wrapped around her through and shoulders, and a heavy knit cap on her head. Oh, and BTW, it's 66 degrees outside. Usually I wear shorts when it's that warm that early in the day...

Yeah, there's going to be a big front coming through later this morning with high winds and very heavy rain. NOTHING she had on was water proof or water resistant. If it had been my daughter, I would have sent her home to change...

Yep ..... that's shorts weather ...... though we had a guy I used to work with that was from Africa, used to wear a winter coat in the summer. In southern Virginia during the summer, it's 90 - 95 degrees and the humidity is about the same. 8O

[JonMarsh]

A bit overdressed even for upstate NY, where we are in the low 30s with snow flurries for the next few days. We had a foot of wet snow yesterday and overnight. Don't you wish you lived here, Jon?

Oh yes, Bob, no doubt about it... I'm packing as you read this! :??










:roflmao:

[Renron]

Jon, Your missing the point. That Pee coat was all about what she was saying with "her styling", it's all about looks here in Ca. Wussies. After living in Tahoe for >20 years real weather is when all you can see of your truck is the antenna. And the roads are all gone. (buried) Wifee and I remember '81 News years eve, it snowed 8 feet overnight.

Back to thread topic. I needed a new RO sander, after my 15 year old Bosch started smoking, and Christmas is coming. So I was looking around for the PC 390 you recommended so highly and it has been discontinued... ? Why? Finally found one on Grizzly website, on sale too! Just over $100 after tax and shipping. I told the wifee that Mirka Sandpaper would make good stocking stuffers too. Dusty Clause is coming to my Garage this year.
BobEllis, I'm watching your build with great interest.
Merry Christmas,
Ron

[JonMarsh]

I lived in Boulder/Denver area for 15 years, can appreciate a lot of what you say about Tahoe weather, my GF used to have a cabinet up in the Truckee area. Worst I've ever experienced in Boulder/Denver was actually during a visit, in which we got about 40" of snow that started on a Friday morning and finished on a Saturday morning- it was the first time Denver airport was shut down.

As to the 390, that's a real bummer, because I really like that one! The 382 is kind of a wussie kid brother, and the 7345 doesn't have the dust extraction! I'm going to have to take care of that baby, or it's DeWalt or Festool!

[TEK]

Got a nice response from Wavecor.

Hello Ben,

Thank you for contacting us and sorry to keep you waiting.

I guess you might be in violation with our registered trademark “Wavecor”.
However, as long as you do not use the name for any commercial speakers we have no problems with what you do.

We appreciate you letting us know up front and wish you success with the project.


Best regards
Allan Isaksen
General Manager, Wavecor Ltd.

That's a nice response!
However, I do think that Wavecor Ardent is adding a bit much weight on the Wavecor drivers. All of you folks have done so much work on these, that it is the whole - all the drivers, the crossower as well as the design.
So I would suggest to use a different name.

One idea is from Jon in a different thread. The other one is my own suggestion.
1) Ardent MkII
2) Ardent, Wavecore edition

Personaly I think Ardent MkII is a great name. It tell that this is a evolved version of the first Ardent, and that all parts of the design has evolved - not just the bass drivers.
It will be interesting to see what you end up calling the design!

[---k---]

Shouldn't it be Ardent MarshII

[JonMarsh]

Shouldn't it be Ardent MarshII

:roflmao:

Nah, I don't think so.... :W


OK- the big compromise-

Ardent MkII, Wavecor edition (there was the Ardent 1.5/2 started with Illuminator SS woofers, technically - )

In my mind, the MkII is about three things -

• developing a low frequency system with performance comparable to the midrange and tweeter
• Switching from the Duelund to the Quasi LR-3 type crossover to reduce size and cost, and increase the immediate roll off transition, (which means we didn't have to play games with parallel LCRs, which reduced crossover cost) and...
• Improve overall system power handling and lower distortion at higher playback levels.

And for those who don't like this suggestion, well, a rose is as sweet by any other name, just call it "Ralph" I guess...

[dar47]

Got some work done, mid and base xovers on boards are done with one mid board in place. Madisound was out on one of the MR Tweet caps so I'm waiting on Parts Connection before I can finish up.:M Using J. Superior and Carty ESA in the mid section with Carity MR in the tweet. The caps are to big to put the mid section in our base plate as Ben did so I employed a third option with the mid on a long and flat board placed inside and the base section on the base plate. I got extremely lucky as the lower base driver just passes one of the caps on the mid board.:E "Guess you have to be good to be lucky and ......" Still trying to get them closed up by Thursday.

[Wayman]

I checked some of your Photo-bucket shots and I'll be happy if mine look half as good! Nice work and good luck with your Thursday deadline.

Cheers, Wayne

[JonMarsh]

Got some work done, mid and base xovers on boards are done with one mid board in place. Madisound was out on one of the MR Tweet caps so I'm waiting on Parts Connection before I can finish up.:M Using J. Superior and Carty ESA in the mid section with Carity MR in the tweet. The caps are to big to put the mid section in our base plate as Ben did so I employed a third option with the mid on a long and flat board placed inside and the base section on the base plate. I got extremely lucky as the lower base driver just passes one of the caps on the mid board.:E "Guess you have to be good to be lucky and ......" Still trying to get them closed up by Thursday.

Looks good! :T

Can you get some good overhead shots of those boards before mounting them in the cabinets, that we can use in the PDF for a guide for alternative construction?

[Steve Manning]

Nice looking crossovers ..... those things look huge, what's the footprint size of those?

[dar47]

Thanks , guys

Yes, Jon when the MR cap gets here I take a shot of the 3 boards together. 1 mid is already in. Steve the 3 boards are, largest the mid 5" x 15" that has to have components flat to go on the side wall with the first 2 rows of caps tightly grouped, (see pics). Base is 5 1/2" x 8 3/4" put on the top of the base plate to fit in the bottom. The tweet board any thing close to 4 1/2" x 8" mounted on the other side wall.

Through the bottom base that has to pass the big cap (second row).



From the bottom.

[JonMarsh]

Good pics, saving these for the PDF. Good looking board builds, too! :T

Three more days until the holiday break...

And it looks like we'll wrap this Cupertino project by January 15! Hoorah!

[dar47]

Hey that's good news, sort of get your life back.:T

MR's were in the mail so just in the finishing Stretch. :B

Hope this will work for the PDF?

Image not available

[JonMarsh]

Yeah, that's great! :T

Got them downloaded. You know, this way I'll have something useful to do in those cozy warm evenings at home while GF is watching her Spanish language "Tele novellas" to continue to polish her language skills (ostensibly for the stop in Argentina on the way to Antarctica, but the reality is she's gotten hooked on these Mexican soap operas.... :W )

[kevinm]

Hey that's good news, sort of get your life back.:T

MR's were in the mail so just in the finishing Stretch. :B

Hope this will work for the PDF?

Man those look clean. Are you also using the Apex Jr bus wire in between components?

[dar47]

Yeah, that's great! :T

Got them downloaded. You know, this way I'll have something useful to do in those cozy warm evenings at home while GF is watching her Spanish language "Tele novellas" to continue to polish her language skills (ostensibly for the stop in Argentina on the way to Antarctica, but the reality is she's gotten hooked on these Mexican soap operas.... :W )

Haha, I guess they have those in every country. They probably snap up all the beautiful people in that country too. :roll:

Well I guess I lined every thing right as it all went in the first one.



Didn't screw up the wiring, got one playing with my Modula MK2's. Funny how similar xovers and voicing sounds through 2 different speaks. (did I tell you how good your Modula MK2's are!). Just taking a dinner break and then I will try to get the other one buttoned up. I am supposed to finish decorating the Christmas tree but TOO HELL WITH THAT I want to listen to the pair. :B

[dar47]

Thanks, Kevin. Yes 14awg. Learned that from the master doing the Modula MK2 build.

[5th element]

Those really do look very sharp. What I like is the size comparison to the Modula's on the right. This helps to show just how much more 'loudspeaker' you can actually get when you go with a compact, but well thought out, and designed, floor stander. Those dual wavecor bass drivers certainly make up for a lot of what the Ardents will give on the bottom end. All to often all you see is a 2.5 way design put into a floor standing cabinet that actually gives no more real extension over that of a good stand mount design. At least with the Ardent you really are getting something for you real estate, then there's the Be dome and the Accuton mid.

[wkhanna]

those are simply fabulous looking. :T

[dar47]

Well I got Stereo, they are fantastic :B

These Wavecor's are potent, they lay waste too my old RS225 based three ways i last had down stairs. Jon & Ben check out Patrica Barber's " To rich for my blood", great base attach. Still some work to do taming the grill felt and putting the room back together, Jon I'm so happy you went for these. :T:T:T

[dar47]

Thanks 5th.
I agree with you, When you add a small sub to the Modula's they are very potent. I was a little worried playing just one Ardent and one Modula, not big base. With 2 a whole new story. Wish more builders could reach for these they are very nice and well worth the effort.

[---k---]

Those look fantastic. Really impressive how they turned out.

[JonMarsh]

those are simply fabulous looking. :T

There's some real craftsmen up in Canada! :T