NateTTU's Statement thread.....

[NateTTU]

If you have a 5/8" round over bit, try it and see if it's enough when you test fit the drivers.

Jim

What do you mean by this statement? (no pun intended) Since I have never built any speakers before this doesn't quite make sense to me. I finally found a place with a 3/4'' roundover bit and I will try to pick this up tomorrow. However, if anyone has some pictures I would really like to see the chamfer/roundover used on the inside of the baffles for the Statements.

BTW, thanks Tempro. Those pictures explain a lot to me.

Nate

[Jim Holtz]

What do you mean by this statement? (no pun intended) Since I have never built any speakers before this doesn't quite make sense to me. I finally found a place with a 3/4'' roundover bit and I will try to pick this up tomorrow. However, if anyone has some pictures I would really like to see the chamfer/roundover used on the inside of the baffles for the Statements.

BTW, thanks Tempro. Those pictures explain a lot to me.

Nate

Hi Nate,

I assume you are cutting the driver holes and recesses before gluing them on the cabinet. So, once they're cut, you can take the appropriate driver and insert it into the baffle hole to see how it fits from the front and the back.

Sorry, I don't have any pictures of the inside round overs. I glue the 3/4" and the 1/2" baffles together and then do the round over on the back.

HTH

Jim

[NateTTU]

I'm down to buying minor parts and pieces to finish up the Statements lineup. Just to make sure, is this the correct port for the center channel? Also, I'm building a sonosub and was planning on wrapping it with carpet and noticed PE sells some jet black and latex backed black carpet for a good price. Has anyone used any of these or knows the difference between the regular and latex backed carpet? Thanks.

Nate

[Jim Holtz]

Hi Nate,

Yes that is what I used for the center port. It works well with out any port noise even with out flares. The space is very tight so I really don't think a flared port would have worked.

Jim

[NateTTU]

Is it necessary to create some sort of access panel to the crossovers throughout the entire life of the speaker or only for a little while?

[Sefferdog]

Is it necessary to create some sort of access panel to the crossovers throughout the entire life of the speaker or only for a little while?

Mine are accessible through the woofer cutout.

[NateTTU]

Mine are accessible through the woofer cutout.

That sounds like a good idea, could you explain a little more? Perhaps if you have photos that would be great also.

Nate

[Curt C]

Is it necessary to create some sort of access panel to the crossovers throughout the entire life of the speaker or only for a little while?

Assuming no errors of installation, the components themselves will be good for the life of the speaker. Just to hedge your bets though, mount the crossovers where you can access them by removing one of the woofers. Then, should a solder joint fail, etc. you can easily make repairs. -Or upgrade/tweak the crossover should you get the desire.

[Sefferdog]

That sounds like a good idea, could you explain a little more? Perhaps if you have photos that would be great also.

Nate

Unfortunately I do not have pictures of the crossovers installed. By the time I get to that point I an VERY near testing them out and I get so stoked up the camera is a forgotten item.

[NateTTU]

I have two quick questions:

1) My dad asked if the highlighted piece below is suppose to be one continuous piece or cut into sections as the other pic shows. I told him others had cut the piece into smaller sections so the tunnels don't actually connect but I didn't know a reason why and was wondering which way should it be.

2) Would it be okay if I made a square 5'' x 5'' cutout in the back of the center and minis just like the statements or does it have to be that 5'' circle?

[Jim Holtz]

I have two quick questions:
1) My dad asked if the highlighted piece below is suppose to be one continuous piece or cut into sections as the other pic shows. I told him others had cut the piece into smaller sections so the tunnels don't actually connect but I didn't know a reason why and was wondering which way should it be.
2) Would it be okay if I made a square 5'' x 5'' cutout in the back of the center and minis just like the statements or does it have to be that 5'' circle?

Hi Nate,

The tunnels could be connected but wiring for the ribbon needs to be available. There is flexibility in the assembly as long as you don't change volumes.

Square or circle, it doesn't matter. Do what is easiest.

Jim

[Brian Walter]

My dad asked if the highlighted piece below is suppose to be one continuous piece or cut into sections as the other pic shows. I told him others had cut the piece into smaller sections so the tunnels don't actually connect but I didn't know a reason why and was wondering which way should it be.

Nate, I drew up the drawings slightly different than Jim constructed his cabinet, and several people had constructed cabinets before the drawings were available. It shouldn't matter whether those braces are continuous or separate pieces. I drew them up as continuous simply because you needed less pieces that way and it would provide slightly more stiffness to the cabinet wall. Whether or not the additional stiffness would help or hurt panel resonances is hard to tell without actually measuring it.

Brian Walter

[NateTTU]

Can the port be installed in a through hole or does it have to be installed in a counterbored hole like the drivers so the outer face is flush to the cabinet? Also, how do you guys route the wiring to the mids in the tunnel and do you need something to plug up any holes this would create? Thanks.

Nate

P.S. Since my many questions are making this thread longer and longer, should I begin my own statements build thread?

[Jim Holtz]

Can the port be installed in a through hole or does it have to be installed in a counterbored hole like the drivers so the outer face is flush to the cabinet? Also, how do you guys route the wiring to the mids in the tunnel and do you need something to plug up any holes this would create? Thanks.

Nate

Hi Nate,

The port attachment makes no difference. Do it the easiest way that suits you.

I drill 1/8" holes in the tunnels for the wiring to pass through. It's tight but it works. Leave plenty of slack in the wiring so it can be tucked out of the way and enough to allow you to attach the driver outside the cabinet a few inches. If you want, a dab of silicone will plug the holes completely but it's a tight fit so I wouldn't worry about it, personally. Sealed is more particular about tiny leaks.

Edit: Actually, Thomas suggested that once a builder starts to build the cabinets and posts pictures, he'd prefer a separate thread that he can link to.

HTH

Jim

[NateTTU]

What, if any, exotic wood veneers do you recommend for speakers? I'm really digging the looks of mappa burl. Does anyone have any pictures of speakers built with exotic woods?

[NateTTU]

I'm assuming most of you veneer the speaker after all the cutouts are made. If so, what recommendations do you have to achieve a very seemless cutout? I can't use the trim bit as its way too shallow and I'm not very confident on my ability to handle a knife but it seems to be the only way. Also, would too much material be removed from the attachment points, wood screws, if I just rouned over the entire cutout edges in the back of the front baffle with the 3/4'' roundover? I don't really want to have to worry about marking the places where the screws attach and trying to avoid them with the router.

[Jim Holtz]

I'm assuming most of you veneer the speaker after all the cutouts are made. If so, what recommendations do you have to achieve a very seemless cutout? I can't use the trim bit as its way too shallow and I'm not very confident on my ability to handle a knife but it seems to be the only way. Also, would too much material be removed from the attachment points, wood screws, if I just rouned over the entire cutout edges in the back of the front baffle with the 3/4'' roundover? I don't really want to have to worry about marking the places where the screws attach and trying to avoid them with the router.

Hi Nate,

A 3/4" roundover on the back of the mid and woofer cut outs works fine as long as you've used a 1 1/4" front baffle.

I use this SC28B router bit by grinding down the bottom of the guide for cut outs. It works well and is inexpensive.

HTH

Jim

[NateTTU]

I have a few questions if anyone has the time to answer I would appreciate it.

1) Is there a specific brand of poly to use on veneer? I was just going to pick up some standard minwax gloss poly but if there is a better kinda I would like to know. I have a nice veneer that I just want to bring out its natural colors.

2) How thick should I leave the fiberglass insulation when putting it into the speaker? I know I need to stay back a couple of inches from the speaker but I probably also don't want to fill it full so the port becomes useless. I have the standard 3''-3.5'' thick.

3) I was thinking of places to put the crossover boards in the speaker and wondered if it would be a problem if the crossover board covered a good portion of the airflow. Attached is a picture of what I mean.

[Brian Bunge]

As far as #1, I buy my poly from unfinished furniture stores. Many of them sell a product under their own label that is made by a company called Old Dad's www.olddads.com. I know of several people who've contacted them and they've been able to direct them to a store in their area.

[Jim Holtz]

The crossover is no problem. You're good to go.

Jim

[ahaik]

As far as #1, I buy my poly from unfinished furniture stores. Many of them sell a product under their own label that is made by a company called Old Dad's www.olddads.com. I know of several people who've contacted them and they've been able to direct them to a store in their area.

In my case the store was a few hundred miles away, so they where very nice and shipped it to me.

[Sefferdog]

As far as #1, I buy my poly from unfinished furniture stores. Many of them sell a product under their own label that is made by a company called Old Dad's www.olddads.com. I know of several people who've contacted them and they've been able to direct them to a store in their area.

I followed Brian's advice on the Old Dad's and he was spot on, some VERY good stuff.

[David_D]

X-over Plates

Nate,
Those crossover plate look like aluminum.
Not Good as this will conduct electricity.
God with an insulating material. Plastic, wood, peg board, ect.
No Metal.
I just found your thread. Hope I got to you before it's too late.
-David

[Dennis H]

They look like painted Masonite pegboard to me.

[David_D]

Yes, I believe you are right Dennis - my bad.
David

[NateTTU]

Yes, Dennis is correct. Its just pegboard that so happens to be colored a silver color. My dad tested it with his voltage drop meter (I think) and it doesn't conduct electricity at all. I just got this piece because it looked better than the white version.

Since I'm posting I thought I would ask, how thick should the fiberglass be when I stuff the speakers? I bought the standard 3'' thick stuff with the paper backing.

[NateTTU]

In the mini statements crossover there are a couple of large inductors and I was wondering if it was important to keep some sort of orientation like it is with all the other air coil inductors. Attached is a picture of the type of inductor I am speaking of.

[Curt C]

Yes, all inductors shoud be orientated 90 degrees from any adjacent inductors. Spacing of 3" between them lessens the need for this orientation, but its good practice anyway.

C

[NateTTU]

Alright, with the odd shape of these iron core inductors the only way I can seem to arrange them in a 90 deg fashion isn't listed on that sheet, but it should look something like the image below. Would this be ok?

Edit: I took out the camera and for a quick shot to give a better picture of what I was talking about.

[Curt C]

Couldn't have done it better myself, Nate!

C

[NateTTU]

All the speakers and now have the crossovers in place and the wires installed. They seem to check out ok so now I'm going to begin putting in the fiberglass. However, before I get started I had a quick question. My crossovers are on pretty large boards (like in the picture but some are larger) and they are attached to the back of the speaker walls. With such a large surface area, sometimes directly behind a woofer, should I place some fiberglass over the crossover boards? I can take some pictures when I get home later if it would help describe what I'm talking about. I just want to make sure that the sound waves aren't bouncing around off those boards. I was planning on just covering them loosely with the fiberglass so I could remove the fiberglass if needed to have access to the boards in the future.

[Jim Holtz]

All the speakers and now have the crossovers in place and the wires installed. They seem to check out ok so now I'm going to begin putting in the fiberglass. However, before I get started I had a quick question. My crossovers are on pretty large boards (like in the picture but some are larger) and they are attached to the back of the speaker walls. With such a large surface area, sometimes directly behind a woofer, should I place some fiberglass over the crossover boards? I can take some pictures when I get home later if it would help describe what I'm talking about. I just want to make sure that the sound waves aren't bouncing around off those boards. I was planning on just covering them loosely with the fiberglass so I could remove the fiberglass if needed to have access to the boards in the future.

Hi Nate,

Loose is fine as long as it staysin place and doesn't get into the back of the woofers.

You're getting close! :T

Jim

[NateTTU]

Here are some pictures showing my current status. Hopefully tonight we can get most of the fiberglass installed and begin gluing the front baffles on. Pardon the mess as I'm moving to a new home this weekend so there is stuff everywhere. Also, does anyone put fiberglass on the back of the front baffle or just on all the other walls? I figured I would, but just hold back a couple of inches from each woofer.

[Jim Holtz]

Here are some pictures showing my current status. Hopefully tonight we can get most of the fiberglass installed and begin glueing the front baffles on. Pardon the mess as I'm moving to a new home this weekend so there is stuff everywhere. Also, does anyone put fiberglass on the back of the front baffle or just on all the other walls? I figured I would, but just hold back a couple of inches from each woofer.

Hi Nate,

The cabinets are coming together great!

No insulation on the front baffle. Side walls and rear wall only. Hold back from the front baffle on the side walls a couple inches to give the woofers some breathing room. Same thing with the foam lining on the mid tunnel. Hold back from the front baffle at least an inch or so and bevel the foam at a 45 degree angle.

Jim

[NateTTU]

Anyone please feel free to comment on the pics below. Thanks Jim for all your help, although I do feel bad for asking so many questions and it seems you are the one to always answer. I should bake you some cookies! BTW, the fiberglass does indeed suck, live and learn I guess. In any case if everything looks ok then I will go ahead and glue this one up for good. Other than placing the foam in the tunnel and making it look pretty, this project is almost done!! :B

On another note, I had the speakers in the center wired backwards, once corrected the speaker sounded a lot better. The statements kick it up a notch on the sound, at least for me, and the minis sound almost just as good. Thanks for the awesome design guys.

[David_D]

I AM SSSSOOOO JEALOUS!!!!!!
You are going to have the most rockin’ system on the block in a few days time.
Great pics. When are we coming over for movie night?

[David_D]

I'm finally going to begin ordering all the parts of the statements later this week and begin construction soon. However, this will be my first build and I probably will end up with a bunch of questions. If you can please bare with me, here are a few questions I currently have:

1) Is the BOM still valid, as far as all the part numbers are concerned? Besides ordering the port parts and everything on the BOM is there anything else I would need?

2) One thing I don't know much about is speaker foam/stuffing, is this necessary in the statements, if so how much, where, and what kind do I need?

3) I plan on deviating from the initial design a slight bit and won't do the base and will add an extra piece of MDF on the sides that will likely add a total thickness of maybe 1/2'' to the front baffle, would this matter? Here (post #18.) is the design I'm trying to follow.

4) Is the 14 gauge wire from Blue Jeans Cable good for wiring everything together? Also, I'm not sure what to get for the binding posts at the bottom back of the speaker.

5) Lastly, has anyone tried the parts express speaker laminate that is 2x18ft for only $20? I like the cherry and I think it would match some current furniture about the same color but was wondering about the overall quality of this product.

Sorry for all the questions, but I'm new to all this and greatly appreciate your advice and help.

Sorry so late....
5) The PE veneer grain runs the 8' length. it would be difficult to bend it cross grain over the radii. You have come this far, I suggest veneer from a different source. Preferably one close by so you can view the product before purchase. Although, Vennersupplies.com does sell concurrent sheets of paperbacked. BTW Joe was great & there heat-loc product was the bomb.

[NateTTU]

I would still like to point out that I'm still enjoying the statements. Now I'm just trying to fine tune my bass "needs" and have a couple of questions.

Attached to this post is a rough layout of my room using paint. My current sub is a 24'' cube Mal-X that is currently located in blue. I just was wondering with the open backed designs of the statements would a 24'' cube sitting beside the statements interfere with these?

I currently have a 60'' plasma that sits out about one ft from the wall and I definitely can tell that a lot of the sound coming from the back of the speakers gets traped. For this reason I'm planning on mounting the tv to the wall and hopefully this will free up the sound.

The problem is that 1 sealed Mal-X is not enough for me and I would like to build another or try a different alternative. In any case I'm just curious to know what size of cube could I set next to the Statements and not cause any interference with either the front or back waves of the speaker.

Hopefully this makes sense.

Thanks,
Nate

[ThomasW]

I just was wondering with the open backed designs of the statements would a 24'' cube sitting beside the statements interfer with these?............

The problem is that 1 sealed Mal-X is not enough for me and I would like to build another or try a different alternative.

Dude, build an IB.....

[NateTTU]

Dude, build an IB.....

Hahaha, I have seriously considered this option. I'm afraid, however, that since I live in a neighborhood that having the back wave in my attic would get me in trouble really quick. Besides just trying it, could anyone comment on just how loud it gets in the attic and around the house with an IB?

The lower portion of the closet as pictured won't be used. (RHS of closet when looking at closet door) I did think about using this to place some subs, but how much room does an IB need?

[ThomasW]

The IB forum has been running since 1999. Out of the hundred or so IBs built, 2 people have posted neighbor complaints regarding noise from their attic mounted units.

The rear wave is as loud as the front wave. That said most of it is attenuated by the insulation is the attic and the distance to the neighbors.

Optimal volume is 10 times the summed Vas of the drivers. How big is the space?

[NateTTU]

I just measured it and it looks to be roughly 48 cubic feet. Although this might be a little on the high side. It was kinda difficult to get measurements in the closet with so many boxes filling it. I would probably have to completely seal that part of the closet from the rest as it would otherwise filter back into the room.

[ThomasW]

Why would sound inside the closet go back into the room?

[NateTTU]

Why would sound inside the closet go back into the room?

Maybe not much of it, but there is a 3/4'' gap or so between the bottom of the door and the carpet. Also, I'm not sure if having that much backwave in the same space as all my other equipment would be ok. If it wouldn't damage any of my components I could try to seal the door using some weather stripping and such. I still need to open the closet door on a daily basis to get to the game consoles/blu player. The entire closet is roughly 135 cubic feet without anything else in there.

[ThomasW]

Small gaps aren't an issue. The door will need weather stripping to prevent it from ratting.

You will need to make an enclosure to separate the equipment from the rearwave off the IB.