Best Blu-Ray player

[H.T.C]

When standard dvds are no longer produced and if of course everyone trades in or recycles them then upconverson will no longer be necessary.

Movie studios should start a trade in program immediately at a reduced cost for consumers and start a recycling procedure for the soon to be obsolete format.

[RebelMan]

It's a prudent oxymoron to buy a Blu-ray player for it's DVD upscaling capabilities.

[impala454]

The advantage is in the hardware built into the PS3.

What advantage is that?

Re-read my statement!

I re-read it. Still didn't see the part explaining how the xbox has anything to do with what you were saying.

Convenience feature only, not performance.

Well conveniences are a large part of choosing the "best" player.

You are reading to much into this. Lighten up.

How am I reading too much into it? You're telling someone they're in the dark ages for not having wifi on a movie player and then tell me I need to lighten up?

The shape is awkward but it looks cool.

If you say so.

Do you own a PS3? :roll: It does DVD upconversion. If you were looking for the best DVD upconversion you don’t think PS3 nor any other combo drive for that matter. The issue is not moot but it is irrelevant. (The PS3 does DVD significantly better now than it did. Where were you?)

Again, with the still very small library of blu-ray titles, DVD upconversion is definitely not irrelevant.

[Hdale85]

It is sad because no MFG has released a Blu-Ray player that is better then the PS3 but that won't last for long there are some new models coming out that look very promising.

[gd]

Movie studios should start a trade in program immediately at a reduced cost for consumers and start a recycling procedure for the soon to be obsolete format.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[maseline_98]

The Xbox 360 elite is not needed. All the Xbox 360's now have HDMI the only thing the elite offers is its all black and it has a 120gig hard drive. Also I do not have a piece of gear in my system worth thousands and I know there are a lot of people on these forums that don't as well. Secondly the PS3 is not really aimed at big buck market its aimed at middle and lower class as thats the majority of people. The PS3 should be around 299-350 because its a game console. I would much rather have a standalone player then the PS3 and thats why I've waited. I have not purchased a PS3 because there are no big games on it and I won't purchase it just to play Blu-Ray movies.

In a few months of watching, We'll see so many PS3 owners crying the blues because the laser is no more. I can't tell you how many lasers my ps2 went through and that is just crazy for it being dvd(i wasn't even using it to watch movies) I mean dvd lasers have been out for a long time and they still couldn't get it right. The blu-ray laser has only been around for a few years. I'm much rather have a standalone as well...

[btf1980]

It's a prudent oxymoron to buy a Blu-ray player for it's DVD upscaling capabilities.

Exactly!!

[Nolan B]

It's a prudent oxymoron to buy a Blu-ray player for it's DVD upscaling capabilities.

thats too simplistic to me.

As a true movie lover owning Blu-Ray and HD DVD is not enough (BD on its own certainly isnt). As much as I hate it SD DVD is still part of my library and still part of my movie watching. Therefore in order to avoiding having 3 different player one needs a player which can handle SD DVD as well. To me personally "upconversion" means nothing as my plasma does a better job, but one of my players better be good at DVD play back.

Ultimately I want to buy 1 box which is good at most everything. I want a "player" which I dont look at as a BD player, HD DVD player or SD player, DVD A or SACD player, but equaly at playing everything.

Having more decoders in 1 box does not mean the qaulity must suffer.

[H.T.C]

thats too simplistic to me.

As a true movie lover owning Blu-Ray and HD DVD is not enough (BD on its own certainly isnt). As much as I hate it SD DVD is still part of my library and still part of my movie watching. Therefore in order to avoiding having 3 different player one needs a player which can handle SD DVD as well. To me personally "upconversion" means nothing as my plasma does a better job, but one of my players better be good at DVD play back.

Ultimately I want to buy 1 box which is good at most everything. I want a "player" which I dont look at as a BD player, HD DVD player or SD player, DVD A or SACD player, but equaly at playing everything.

Having more decoders in 1 box does not mean the qaulity must suffer.

Not always,if the player itself is expensive,say about $2500.00 to $3400.00 than quality will remain (of course that may not be always true).

[hifiguymi]

I'm going to toss my $.02 in here.

I don't own, nor have I used, a PS3 so I can only speak about that from what a co-worker has told me and what I've read about it. The guy I work with thinks the scaler in the PS3 is quite good. He has a Denon DVD-2910 DVD player (which is no slouch) and a Sony KDS-50A2000 RPTV and thinks the PS3 has a better scaler than either his DVD player or TV. He does dislike the fact he cannot use his system remote to operate it because of the Bluetooth and I've has other customers complain about that as well. The best thing he likes about it is load times. It's much faster than any other BD player right now. I've had other customers say the same thing.

As far as it's other features go that is a mixed bag. It's not Profile 2.0 and Sony has not said for sure it will be (unless someone has a link to a Sony statement saying so) but who cares anyway. Do you really want to watch a PIP window telling you about all of the great memorabilia you can purchase from the studio while your trying to watch the movie? Do you watch special features at all? When I ask my customers about special features, 95% don't care about them at all and the other 5% like having them but they rarely watch them.

When it comes to the HD audio codecs, does Sony have something official that states the PS3 will decode them (speaking of dtsHD and dtsHD MA) internally and output the bit-streams? I haven't seen it myself and until they do, it's vaporware.

I'm not knocking the PS3, I just don't know if it's capable of everything people say it will be. We'll find out when Sony offers the next update. Beyond that it doesn't integrate into most peoples A/V systems as well as a stand alone player will.

As far as other players go, it depends on your system. With the two current Sony players, the BDP-S300 is pretty limited on the audio side of things. The only high resolution audio you can get with it is if the disc has a PCM track on it. If not, it's just DD and dts. If you have a receiver or preamp with HDMI inputs, don't bother with that one IMO. The BDP-S500 will decode and output the bit-stream of all Dolby formats (DD, DD+, DTHD). It will decode and output dts and dtsHD but not dtsHD MA.

The Pioneer Elite BDP-95FD will output all audio formats in bit-stream but will not decode dtsHD MA internally. It has a network connection and, along with firmware updates, it has Windows Media capabilities built in. If you have video files, audio files, or pictures on your PC you can stream them to the BDP-95FD. It will play them back at full resolution as well. It will not scale or "down rez" any of those files. This is the one we sell the most often in my company by a long shot. It's expensive, but it's a really nice player.

One thing I like about the Sony and Pioneer Elite players is you can bypass the internal scaler for DVD's and still have it output BD's at 1080/24P. I don't know of any other players that will do that. They have a feature called "Source Direct" that will output what ever is on the disc it's playing. If it's a DVD the output is 480i and if it's a BD done at 1080i that is what you get. If it's a BD at 1080P (which is most of them) that is what you get. If you have a TV with a good scaler, or an outboard one (or one in a receiver or preamp) that you want to use you can.

With the Samsung BD-P1400 it has the same audio capabilities as the Sony BDP-S500 but adds an Ethernet connection for firmware updates. Not necessary, but nice if you have a network connection at your A/V system.

The Panasonic has the same audio capabilities as the Pioneer Elite but without the network connection and Windows Media.

Neither the Panasonic or the Samsung have the ability to bypass the built in scaler either.

As far as the Profile issue is concerned, it depends on you. If watching special features while you're the movie is important than look for a 1.1 or 2.0. If not, then it doesn't matter.

Sorry this post is so long, I guess it's more like my $.10.

Eric

[Race Car Driver]

In a few months of watching, We'll see so many PS3 owners crying the blues because the laser is no more. I can't tell you how many lasers my ps2 went through and that is just crazy for it being dvd(i wasn't even using it to watch movies) I mean dvd lasers have been out for a long time and they still couldn't get it right. The blu-ray laser has only been around for a few years. I'm much rather have a standalone as well...

I still have the PS2 I bought within 6 months of release (my first two were sold for profit)

Works great, never had a problem with it.

Crying the blues? Naaa, If it fails I bought the 2 year PRP from Best Buy. Well worth it IMO.

[RebelMan]

What advantage is that?

Firmware upgradablity is virtually unlimited.

I re-read it. Still didn't see the part explaining how the xbox has anything to do with what you were saying.

The point was lost on you. It had nothing to do with the Xbox 360 other than establish a frame of reference regarding heat and noise.

Well conveniences are a large part of choosing the "best" player.

Can't argue here BUT compromises and sacrifices also come into play. The PS3 is less conducive for universal remotes, so what, minor issue. While you're still waiting for your standalone IR blessed BD player to react to the power-on sequence I'll be watching my flick, yes the PS3 is THAT FAST! NOTHING COMES CLOSE! Speed is by far more important then the slight convenience a universal remote would provide. What good is it of you have to wait and wait and wait for the player to respond to an IR command. I'll take the minor inconvenience of the BT remote any day, and so will others when they see the speed differences. Don't think so? Try me. (I wouldn't say that if that didn't happen already!!!)

How am I reading too much into it? You're telling someone they're in the dark ages for not having wifi on a movie player and then tell me I need to lighten up?

Your relatively new here so I'll explain. I wasn't insulting Nolan and he knows it. I was, however, tossing a little sarcasm round and he knows that too. Nolan's an avid AV enthusiast with a passion that runs very deep. I know that and I prayed on it. Sometimes his passion gets the best of him and I will on occasion try to put things into perspective that is more realistic. We both want many of the same things from this hobby but look at satisfying those needs with different points of view. Unfortunately, his overly optimistic view leads him to high levels of frustration when things don't work out the way he would have prescribed.

Again, with the still very small library of blu-ray titles, DVD upconversion is definitely not irrelevant.

Agreed but DVD upconversion is not the focus for ANYONE looking for hires content. That the irrelevancy of it. Nevertheless, the PS3 is a good scaller and a far better DVD player than any other, sans scaling, on the market. Again ANYONE looking for a Blu-ray player of any kind is NOT motivated by DVD content. Only the obtuse seem to have a hard time grasping this simple concept.

[RebelMan]

It is sad because no MFG has released a Blu-Ray player that is better then the PS3 but that won't last for long there are some new models coming out that look very promising.

Which ones do you have in mind?

[RebelMan]

Ultimately I want to buy 1 box which is good at most everything. I want a "player" which I dont look at as a BD player, HD DVD player or SD player, DVD A or SACD player, but equaly at playing everything.

Having more decoders in 1 box does not mean the qaulity must suffer.

As an engineer I can tell you project budgets will dictate what can and cannot be included in a product with any measure of quality. Theoretically, with unlimited financial resources it maybe possible to have the everything box. Don't forget these manufactures are in business to make money. Business 101 teaches the importance of identifying the needs of the consumer and meeting them. Which consumer? That's up to the business.

[RebelMan]

When I ask my customers about special features, 95% don't care about them at all and the other 5% like having them but they rarely watch them.

True but people are heavily persuaded by specifications so whether they use them or not doesn't really matter. Feeling like they are getting a lot for their money does. It certainly doesn't help matters when the marketing departments try and push product uniqueness by promoting the unnecessary features. Eventually that gets ingrained into people's thinking that they gotta have it. If you doubt that just look at the misunderstanding that raw hires bitstreaming has caused for the latest example.

When it comes to the HD audio codecs, does Sony have something official that states the PS3 will decode them (speaking of dtsHD and dtsHD MA) internally and output the bit-streams? I haven't seen it myself and until they do, it's vaporware.

I'm not knocking the PS3, I just don't know if it's capable of everything people say it will be. We'll find out when Sony offers the next update. Beyond that it doesn't integrate into most peoples A/V systems as well as a stand alone player will.

True again. Just be patient. There are two planned updates coming this year that I know of. Sony knows exactly what they are doing.

One thing I like about the Sony and Pioneer Elite players is you can bypass the internal scaler for DVD's and still have it output BD's at 1080/24P. I don't know of any other players that will do that.

PS3 too. :B

[Hdale85]

Which ones do you have in mind?

The couple new ones Sony is releaseing as well as the Oppo. They all have my interest at the moment.

[RebelMan]

Speaking of firmware...

Sony Playstation PS3 FW 2.1

Conclusions

Like most game consoles, the PS3 is not what I would call a preferred video playback solution for standard DVDs. However, it is far and away one of the best Blu-ray players on the market today and an outstanding value for those looking to add HD support to their home theater system. But I would still recommend a higher quality stand alone DVD player for the more demanding home theater enthusiast.

[H.T.C]

As an engineer I can tell you project budgets will dictate what can and cannot be included in a product with any measure of quality. Theoretically, with unlimited financial resources it maybe possible to have the everything box. Don't forget these manufactures are in business to make money. Business 101 teaches the importance of identifying the needs of the consumer and meeting them. Which consumer? That's up to the business.

The problem lies with the individual taste of each persona as to what features are needed and not ...if they just what frills a low cost player is good enough but highend is totally a differant matter...if manufacturers would make just a few 1-2 units per year in 3 separate categories say low/mid/high and include the basics out of the box such internet connection (blu-ray) or software upgrade by disc it would make choice easier.

obtuse ...round at the free end...not sure thats the word to use considering every one upgrading to hdtv still has low rez dvds

[audioqueso]

The whole PS3 thing lost me. I think the point that everyone is trying to make is that PS3 beating the rest is sad because those more expensive are dedicated players, and the more inexpensive PS3 is not. You take a $500 player that was dedicated to be a blu-ray player. All the money and designing was put to it being a blu-ray player. A PS3 is $400, yet all the money and designing put into it was not to be a dedicated blu-ray player. It was to be a game console.

That's like your neighbor throwing $125k on a Porsche 911 Turbo, and you go buy a $30k Mazda sports sedan and the Mazda surpasses it in everyway. The Porsche is a dedicated sports car. The Mazda is not, yet it is still superior. (IT'S JUST AN EXAMPLE... no on going on Porsche vs Mazda ha ha)

[Nolan B]

As an engineer I can tell you project budgets will dictate what can and cannot be included in a product with any measure of quality. Theoretically, with unlimited financial resources it maybe possible to have the everything box. Don't forget these manufactures are in business to make money. Business 101 teaches the importance of identifying the needs of the consumer and meeting them. Which consumer? That's up to the business.

Honestly Id like the Denon 5910 version of an HD player, but it doesnt have to be denon.

[RebelMan]

Honestly Id like the Denon 5910 version of an HD player, but it doesnt have to be denon.

For the universal features no doubt. To bad they weren't good enough for DVD.

[hifiguymi]

For the universal features no doubt. To bad they weren't good enough for DVD.

What!?!?!? The DVD-5910CI is an amazing DVD player!! The DVD-3930CI is also great.

Eric

[hifiguymi]

Honestly Id like the Denon 5910 version of an HD player, but it doesnt have to be denon.

The DVD-3800BDCI is very close to the DVD-5910CI. Denon has just started shipping them and I'll have one on display next week. I know it doesn't have DVD-A or SACD and that is a little bit of a bummer but most customers I talk to don't even know what they are.

Eric

[RebelMan]

obtuse ...round at the free end...not sure thats the word to use considering every one upgrading to hdtv still has low rez dvds

In the midst of all the confusion people equate HDTVs to widescreen TVs which is the format people want for their DVD's. I'm sure those pesky black bars have something to do with their interest rather than resolution. :W

[RebelMan]

What!?!?!? The DVD-5910CI is an amazing DVD player!! The DVD-3930CI is also great.

Sorry Eric I sprung a trap and you stepped into it. LOL Read between the lines.

[hifiguymi]

Sorry Eric I sprung a trap and you stepped into it. LOL Read between the lines.

I don't pay enough attention to those little faces. Oh well. At least you agree that those are killer DVD players.

Eric

[georgev]

The DVD-3800BDCI is very close to the DVD-5910CI. Denon has just started shipping them and I'll have one on display next week. I know it doesn't have DVD-A or SACD and that is a little bit of a bummer but most customers I talk to don't even know what they are.

Eric

Be keen to hear from you how it performs. When do you get it?

[Blindamood]

The DVD-3800BDCI is very close to the DVD-5910CI. Denon has just started shipping them and I'll have one on display next week. I know it doesn't have DVD-A or SACD and that is a little bit of a bummer but most customers I talk to don't even know what they are.

And if people want DVD-A/SACD in addition to their blu-ray, the Oppo DV-980H will do the trick for a paltry $170. I added one of these recently to my system, and it is wonderful for multi-channel music (via analog outs). Paired with my Sony BDP-S1, it makes a great solution for both worlds.

[H.T.C]

The home shopping (qvc or hsn) clubs or shows are selling sd-dvd players (upconverting) with vhs built in because most folks according to manufacturers rep are still using low resolution dvds which then the program host(s) go on to sell a hd-dvd television set ?

The show itself is causing contradiction when they should be selling blu-ray which has backward capability with standard dvds and becomes an additional expense later when the consumer trades up their standard dvd player for the higher resolution one.

there still is a lot of videotape around yet though.

[hifiguymi]

Be keen to hear from you how it performs. When do you get it?

I got the first three I had on order today and one was going to be for display. I sold it last night however so I have to wait until I get the next round of them.

I did get a DVD-2500BTCI and put that out yesterday. I didn't dig into it that much, but so far so good.

Eric