The Benefits of Adding a Dedicated Outlet

[Adz]

I think I got this right but all you Electrical engineers and electronic officianados - feel free to comment or correct me where I've got it wrong.

If Total Power Consumption (Watts) = Volts x Amperes, then Amperes = Watts/Volts. Peak maximum output for a 5 channel 300w Amplifier would be 1500 watts. Divide 1,500 by the North American standard outlet at 120 volts and you've already consumed 12.5 amps. On a standard 15 amp outlet, that doesn't leave much room for your other components such as a projection TV or a subwoofer which draws a lot of power, pre/pro, DVD/CD player, game console, maybe another amp in a 6.1 or 7.1 set-up, etc.

Oh and what about everything else non-HT related in your room or floor that's drawing on that circuit as well, such as all your lighting. Granted the 12.5 assumes the amplifier is drawing full power which is rarely if ever the case, but you get the idea that adding a dedicated 20 amp circuit or two is the way to go to get the maximum performance out of your home theatre system that you may have spent so much money on.

To figure this out for yourself, look at the total power consumption reading on the back of all your components and add them up and divide by the voltage of your outlet. Again, its rare that everything would be drawing maximum peak power at the same time, but its incredible how much better your overall sonic performance especially those peak LFE effects sound with a dedicated circuit(s).

[jimmyp58]

Great points ADZ. I think, too, that as you indicated it is all the other non-ht stuff that can cloud the issue. Having a massive power amp on its own dedicated circuit plus increasing the amperage is a great idea. I know it's made a big difference in my setup.

[Adz]

As I've mentioned briefly in other posts, I wanted to share this with other Forum members (its not a revelation but you know what I mean) since I can say in all honesty its pretty much made the most noticeable audible improvement in my room as compared to other tweaks such as power cords, interconnects, terminations on interconnects, etc. Even some minor room treatments did not yield such a marked result. And the cost for an Electrician was not bad either and I live in Downstate NY.

[SpOoNmAn]

As I've mentioned briefly in other posts, I wanted to share this with other Forum members (its not a revelation but you know what I mean) since I can say in all honesty its pretty much made the most noticeable audible improvement in my room as compared to other tweaks such as power cords, interconnects, terminations on interconnects, etc. Even some minor room treatments did not yield such a marked result. And the cost for an Electrician was not bad either and I live in Downstate NY.

A friend and I did it on our own. Went to home depot, bought supplies, and started wiring. Dedicated circuits are the best thing one can do for their system, Ive said this for 2 or 3 years and I stand by it.

[jimmyp58]

:T

Jim

[jimmyp58]

:T

Jim

[jimmyp58]

Oopss...double post.

[LEVESQUE]

I totally agree. People are often neglecting this part of the story... Clean power result in clean sound and picture. :T

Dedicated sub-panel, dedicated 20A circuits, short lines directly from the fuse box and hospital-grade orange outlet...

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=2386341

Best ''tweak'' I have ever done in my system. Not a hiss, not a hum, clean power...

[number17]

a 5 channel 300w Amplifier would be 1500 watts. Divide 1,500 by the North American standard outlet at 120 volts and you've already consumed 12.5 amps. On a standard 15 amp outlet, that doesn't leave much room for your other components such as a projection TV or a subwoofer which draws a lot of power, pre/pro, DVD/CD player, game console, maybe another amp in a 6.1 or 7.1 set-up, etc

I am not disagreeing cleaner power = more stability for your system = better performance.

I just want to point out, 5 channel 300W amplifier does NOT draw 12.5A all the times. In fact, it should never draw 12.5A ... 300W pc is the PEAK power of your amplifier, not the nominal power. Some amplifiers will not even let you run at peak power for an extended period of time (system will shut down) while others will, but in any case you shouldn't be driving your amp so hot all the times ... if nothing else, at least for your ears' sake. Unless your room is the size of a mini-movie theatre or a banquet hall, otherwise 1500W of constant power into 5 x 8 Ohm or 6Ohm speakers everyday can damage your ears in no time.

In all likelihood you're drawing at most 6-8A with your amp under normal circumstances, and even that should get your neighbour to complain to you already. That still leaves 7A of power for your other devices such as DVD player, processor etc which don't nearly draw as much power. TV is a different story, and that's why I recommend keeping TV and amplifier on different power outlets.

But for most average HT users you won't really trip the breaker with your HT system, and you shouldn't be worrying about getting adequate power to your system.

[SpOoNmAn]

I am not disagreeing cleaner power = more stability for your system = better performance.

I just want to point out, 5 channel 300W amplifier does NOT draw 12.5A all the times. In fact, it should never draw 12.5A ... 300W pc is the PEAK power of your amplifier, not the nominal power. Some amplifiers will not even let you run at peak power for an extended period of time (system will shut down) while others will, but in any case you shouldn't be driving your amp so hot all the times ... if nothing else, at least for your ears' sake. Unless your room is the size of a mini-movie theatre or a banquet hall, otherwise 1500W of constant power into 5 x 8Ohm or 6Ohm speakers everyday can damage your ears in no time.

In all likelihood you're drawing at most 6-8A with your amp under normal circumstances, and even that is a lot. That still leaves 7A of power for your other devices such as DVD player, processor etc which don't nearly draw as much power. TV is a different story, and that's why I recommend keeping TV and amplifier on different power outlets.

But for most average HT users you won't really trip the breaker with your HT system, and you shouldn't be worrying about getting adequate power to your system.

dont forget about LFE subs, and those of us who have powered towers in all locations need the extra circuits.

My system(all ratings are Max). Id rather have more headroom and good wiring then NOT have it

LFE Sub: 8 amps
Left main: 3 amps
Center: 2 amps
Rght main: 3 amps
Right surrounds: 3 amps
Left Surrounds: 3 amps
Projector: 400 watts
xbox: 100
dvd/cd/pre/pro: 125 watts
amp: 10 amps

I have amp, xbox, and projector together(no choice due to cord lenghts) (11 amps)

On another circuit I have 2 surrounds and the main sub. (14 amps)

last circuit I have mains, center, cd/dvd/prepro. (9 amps)

I tried to spread it out all as evenly as possibly, and with every tower having a power cord, it got tricky.

[brucek]

There are certainly good reasons (other than the obvious load requirements) to install a dedicated circuit.

I do feel that there's a bit of overkill in the number of circuits that some people install, but that is usually a matter of miniscule incremental cost increase when a single dedicated circuit is already being installed. It's not the same as the line in the movie Contact, "why build one, when you can build two at twice the price"...
In the case of a dedicated circuit installation, the second or third circuit is a mere fractional increase over the cost of one. So, why not, I guess.

But anyway, one of the major reasons for installing a 20A dedicated circuit is because it is just that - dedicated.

The benefits of a dedicated circuit are many. I highly recommend it.

Although there's nothing magic about dedicated circuits, it ensures a single run of cable from your power panel to a wall receptacle, with no interconnections between and nothing else plugged into the circuit except your system.

The receptacles in your room now may have up to 12 lights and receptacles on the same circuit. At each receptacle that the wiring runs through, there is a set of twisted connections inside covered with marrettes (wire nuts) that may be presenting a small resistance. The more of these connections, the more possibilities of poor, high resistive joints before the circuit finally reaches the receptacle that you are using. All these connections can become highly resistive.

In addition, there are the myriad of things like motors, fluorescent lamps, and computers that may also be plugged into this same circuit besides your system.
All this can result in a loss of power and increased noise at the receptacle you're using for your HT system.

There's also a large possibility that if you are using more than one receptacle in your HT room, that they may be on a different leg of the loadcenter.

These things are a recipe for problems of ground loops and other interference.

This is the reason many like to install one or two dedicated circuits direct from the power panel to behind their system.

When you use a dedicated circuit, and noise is introduced on a different circuit in the house, even though they return to a common point at the loadcentre, this noise tends not to travel down your dedicated circuit because of the extremely low source impedance of the mains at the panel. It acts like a pass filter to this induced noise. The noise rejection is quite high.

As noted by several posters so far, equipment power ratings calculated for full load will produce figures far exceeding the actual requirement of idle or even heavy use.

When you read a specification that says an amplifier is 300watts per channel, this is the RMS power that is drawn with a continuous sinusoidal test signal driving the amplifier into a load impedance of usually 8 ohms.
Music or movie sound tracks are not a continuous input signal. Don't believe for a minute that a 300watt per channel amp requires 300 watts per channel of AC power from the wall to run it in your home for normal HT service.

Most of the power for the bursty nature of music comes from the large well of power that is stored in the power supply capacitors in your amp.
Didn't you ever kind of wonder how the manufactures claim their amplifier is a "high current" amp and can supply say 80 amps of current when the wall can only supply the amplifier with 15 amps.
Well, the reason is because the AC current is only there to charge the large filter capacitors in the amplifier power supply - 'to fill the well', so to speak.

So it's not unusual to see a full system (that adds up to 20 amps) to idle at 5 amps and at fairly loud levels only slowly creep up to 8 amps....

The exercise of simply adding up all the spec'd power ratings of everything in your system is a nice start to get a general reference, but the only true method of determining the current that your system draws is to measure it. This isn't something you should attempt unless you're quite comfortable with electrical circuits. It involves 'breaking out' a cheater cord and actually sticking a current meter in line with your entire system to determine the idle current and a heavy load current.
As long as your power amplifiers aren't all Class A (which are inefficient and tend to draw a lot of current even without an input signal), then most systems will operate quite nicely on a single 15 amp circuit - but I would certainly recommend that the circuit be dedicated....

brucek

[jimmyp58]

Thanks for the awesome response brucek!

[ekkoville]

Brucek, in my very short stint here at the guide, I have had more electrical insight provided from you than I would have otherwise! Keep it going.

Erik

[Adz]

Thanks everyone - this is good stuff!

It would be great to hear from others.

To number17, I do realize and even mentioned twice in my original post that a 5 channel 300W amplifier does NOT draw 12.5A all the time, if ever. I was just trying to illustrate a point using a logical mathematical approach. I will tell you though, plug everything into your standard (non-dedicated) outlet and crank up a DVD with lots of LFE like Master and Commander and tell me if your lights in the room don't flicker and go dim - I bet they do!! Mine did bigtime!!!

I'm learning a lot and with all the discussion and debates that go on in this hobby around the validity of cable and wire upgrades as a means to delivering improved sonic performance, IMO this upgrade is one I can understand, clearly has scientific merit, and delivers immediately with very noticeable improvements to the overall sound in a HT system. Nice!

[ht_addict]

In my setup I have a Monster AVS2000 voltage regulator which has a digital meter readout for the total amperage being used. When watching a movie at my normal listening level I never go over 3A total draw(all but sub hooked to Monster HTS5000mkII which is hooked to AVS2000). My setup consists of:


Panasonic 47" RPTV
Marantz SR5400(pre/pro)
NAD S250(125wx5)
LG 7832NCX DVD
Paradigm Studio(v3) 40/20/570
Paradigm PW2100
Monster HTS5000mkII
Monster AVS2000

ht_addict

[number17]

Seriously, my lights don't flicker or go dim when I watch movies ... and as ht_addict pointed out, the total current draw should never go beyond a few amps, unless you have a REALLY kick-ass system like Levesque's, which I don't .

RadioShack and Canadian tires sell those power meter thingys that you plug into the power outlet to measure how much power you're really drawing. You may try that on your HT outlet. I suspect your power outlet is shared with a lot of other appliances and is near max load even before you turn any HT gear on.

I have another question for you ht_addict. Do you notice any improvement in sound / video performance with those Monster 'power regulators'? I have alaways been skeptical of the effect of 'cleaner power' to the gears ... but you can tell me.


Thanks,

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

Dedicated circuits are the best thing one can do for their system, Ive said this for 2 or 3 years

I guess that makes me a true pioneer – I installed my dedicated circuits back in ’96!

Yet another excellent post from brucek! Sure miss you over at HTF.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

[ht_addict]

Seriously, my lights don't flicker or go dim when I watch movies ... and as ht_addict pointed out, the total current draw should never go beyond a few amps, unless you have a REALLY kick-ass system like Levesque's, which I don't .

RadioShack and Canadian tires sell those power meter thingys that you plug into the power outlet to measure how much power you're really drawing. You may try that on your HT outlet. I suspect your power outlet is shared with a lot of other appliances and is near max load even before you turn any HT gear on.

I have another question for you ht_addict. Do you notice any improvement in sound / video performance with those Monster 'power regulators'? I have alaways been skeptical of the effect of 'cleaner power' to the gears ... but you can tell me.


Thanks,

Audio wise its tough to determine since I've switched out my pre/pro and amp as well as bi-amped my L/R speakers with AR Master Series 10G all before I got a good chance to listen with the new Monster. I can say that the soundstage is large and well defined. Vocals are crisp and clear and bass from my Studio 40's is nice and tight. Where I definitely see the advantage of the AVS2000 is on the video side as nothing has changed. First thing I noticed is that the convergence is almost dead on even when I first turn on the tv. And my set hasn't be ISF calibrated or converged by a technician. When i didn't have the Monster you could definitely see how much the convergence was off especially when the TV was first turned on. Was it worth the money? I think so. Not to mention for an extra $50 I got a full 9yr warranty on the unit.

ht_addict

[CWD]

My system is the only thing plugged into its circuit, so it's dedicated by default, I guess. However, I've never felt like I was getting everything possible out of my Rotel 1068/Outlaw 755 combination feeding my Paradigm speakers. So, after much research, I contacted Richard Gray's Power Company for one of their "free evaluations" as to how their products can be applied to your system. RGPC equipment cleans the power but also provides current capability (they say) because of the parallel power technology they use. They recommended the 400 MKII unit (4 plugs) with my HDTV, universal player, Sat. Rcvr, and Rotel plugged into that unit. The Outlaw 755 and Paradigm sub were recommended to just plug into the wall outlet given how the 400 MKII works. I stewed over this for 4 months. Would it really do something good? The electrical engineer in me was skeptical.

Well, I broke down and bought the 400 MKII a week ago and I have to say it really does work! The soundstage definitely improve and surround music doesn't have the gaps between the speakers I heard before. The power and pitch definition of bass is better. Feels like I turned up the level of the subwoofer. More details come out of the mix for CD, DVD, DVD-A, and SACD played through the system. I've listened to familiar music many times to make sure I'm not kidding myself, but it really does help bring out everything that's in the music. As for the video side, HDTV looks a bit better, but I haven't sat down to study how quality movies like LOTR The Two Towers look. Black level is definitely black and stable.

Does this mean my 5x200W amplifier + my 250W subwoofer + my RP HDTV needed some help as I orginially thought? I guess and the RPGC 400 MKII appears to provide a good solution.

[brucek]

brucek! Sure miss you over at HTF.

Thanks Wayne, I still read there, but don't post much. HTG seems to be such a great group that I don't stray too far from home. Glad to see you post here too.

.

My system is the only thing plugged into its circuit, so it's dedicated by default, I guess

That helps for sure, but one of the reasons for a dedicated circuit, is that it has no spliced connections along the route before it gets to your HT receptacle. In your case you have the possibility of a total of 11 cuts in your AC cable that have been stripped, twisted back together and capped to make the joint to carry onto the next receptacle. Each joint provides additional resistance, it's value dependant on the age of the connection and how well the original electrical worker performed his splice.

With the dedicated circuit, you have control over the gauge of cable, 12 gauge for a 20Amp capability, (even though you may breaker it at 15Amps). You will also have a splice free run all the way to a single high quality receptacle that is mounted near your equipment.

Here's a few pics I have around. When I first moved into my latest home the first thing I did was get rid of the 50 year old fuse panel and install a Siemans loadcenter. You can see my two dedicated cables in white.
.


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For my HT system I installed a Siemans whole house surge arrester and two 20Amp capable dedicated circuits. You can see the new circuits. One is hooked to the surge arrester, the other to a breaker on the same leg to reduce the possibility of ground loops.
One of the advantages of the 'breaker' type of whole house surge arresters as opposed to the 'standalone' whole house systems is that you can wire your HT system's dedicated circuit to the breaker of the arrester itself and if protection is compromised by a lightening strike, the breaker will trip and your system will remain protected until you do something about it.
.


.


It's also nice, if you're able, when you install 2 dedicated circuits that their lengths be somewhat similar and that they are run side by side. One of the reasons for ground loops is that the safety grounds of your AC circuits possess a slightly different potential. The safety ground can, and usually does, develop a small potential, through mutual inductance, wire resistance (created from a long run) and various other reasons that can be different between the two dedicated circuits. The best solution for this is to run the two circuits together so they are identical lengths and paths traveled. This helps to ensure the potential of the safety grounds are at the same potential. Of course, you've already ensured they are on the same circuit leg at the service panel.
Here's a pic of my two circuits running the same path.
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Here's a pic of one dedicated circuit with a 90degree Levitron plug and its heavy 10 gauge cable feeding half my system. Note the standard house outlet right beside it. Those are good for lamps I guess.
.



Anyway, that's my dedicated circuits... :roll:

brucek

[DrJRapp]

My system(all ratings are Max). Id rather have more headroom and good wiring then NOT have it

LFE Sub: 8 amps
Left main: 3 amps
Center: 2 amps
Rght main: 3 amps
Right surrounds: 3 amps
Left Surrounds: 3 amps
Projector: 400 watts
xbox: 100
dvd/cd/pre/pro: 125 watts
amp: 10 amps

I have amp, xbox, and projector together(no choice due to cord lenghts) (11 amps)

On another circuit I have 2 surrounds and the main sub. (14 amps)

last circuit I have mains, center, cd/dvd/prepro. (9 amps)

I tried to spread it out all as evenly as possibly, and with every tower having a power cord, it got tricky.

Sounds like you need your own utility company!!!!

Seriously now, while I agree that a dedicated circuit is ideal, and it may as well be a 20 amp circuit, it most cases it really isn't too necessary. All of my gear is on a 15 amp circuit. Everything else on that circuit was disconnected. I have the ability to monitor either current draw or voltage on my Monster HTS 3600 filter box. Normally voltage is monitored to see if there is a problem with the incoming line. Occassionally for test purposes I will monitor amperage. I have found that my 65" Hitachi RPTV actually draws about 2.5 amps in daylight and 1.8 amps in darkness. The balance of my equipment, a Rotel RSP1066/RMB1075/RB1070/Samsung DVD/Dish HD receiver, SVS PB2+ subwoofer and Sony CD changer combined pull a whopping 2 amps at idle and with extremely high SPL movie passages with lots of transients will go as high as 6 amps. That leaves me a "safety" factor of 100%. The reason for the low draw is that quality amps store energy internally in their power supply capacitors to meet demand. then refill those capacitors from whatever is available to them. They are in actuality a buffer for those of you that understand computers better than electricity. One of the ways to predict the quality of an amplifier is by purely looking at the size of it's power supply capacitors.

[Brandon B]

If you all want to feel you have not gone overboard, I have 4 dedicated circuits for my rack. Three 20A and one 30A. Most of this is for the 3 Crown macrotechs running my woofers and tactile transducer.

At reference I probably only draw twenty something total, but hey, followed the mfr recommendations in the crown manuals!

BB

[BlazeMaster]

Hi, an interesting option to further improve the overall performance of you HT system. I'd like to give it a try also. But how much does installing a dedicated circuit cost? Who do I call to set it up, PG&E? Please give more info for those that don't have a electrical engineer background or just started into this HT hobby like me. Thanks in advance.

[Adz]

You should use a licensed eletrician (although you could just have someone, such as a friend, who knows what they are doing and are comfortable doing the job for you, but personally I wouldn't, nor did I). Call PG&E to find out if they provide that type of service or in most cases just find a reliable Electrician from the yelllow pages preferably someone who comes recommended. Have them quote you either a per hourly rate or a single quote for the entire project. It really depends on how far away your panel is and how difficult it will be for them to run the line to your home theatre room. My electrical panel is on the same floor as my home theatre so all they had to do was a run from my panel in the garage to the basement room next to it. It cost me approx $300 including materials. Two other points - make sure they use a hospital grade AC outlet, preferably 20A (if you have enough room in your panel to run a 20A line), and you might as well have them install at least 2 circuits -- I found it wasn't much of an incremental cost, so I had them install 3 20 amp circuits. Good luck and report back if you take the plunge.

[DrJRapp]

Two other points - make sure they use a hospital grade AC outlet, preferably 20A .

There is no significant benefit to a hospital grade outlet unless you have provided for hospital grade wiring (independent insulated ground). Also, you can possibly INCREASE the potential for a ground loop with your satelite or cable by using Hospital grade because you are introducing a difference in potential between grounds. Leave the Hospital grade outlet to hospital equipment, which has be designed for it.

[Adz]

That's good to know. Sorry for the bad advice on that one Blaze. I can't recall who recommended the hospital "grade" outlet but I didn't make it up myself. Anyway, I'm actually using an ACME AUDIO's Silver Plated Cryogenic treated AC Outlets which Acme Audio took apart and silver plated all of the contact surfaces. They run about $40 each.

[Kodaz]

Adz,

Can you possibly tell me the benefit your cryogenically treated outlets and power cables make when the rest of the power wire from the outlet to the distribution box is untreated?

[DrJRapp]

That's good to know. Sorry for the bad advice on that one Blaze. I can't recall who recommended the hospital "grade" outlet but I didn't make it up myself. Anyway, I'm actually using an ACME AUDIO's Silver Plated Cryogenic treated AC Outlets which Acme Audio took apart and silver plated all of the contact surfaces. They run about $40 each.

Silver is a slightly better conductor than copper. But only slightly. It "sometimes" makes a difference in audio signals that are measured in milli or microvolts, but rarely does it make a difference at line voltages. It has the added problem however of developing a corrosion (commonly called tarnish) that is higher in resistance than copper corrosion. We found this out through extensive studies of what wiring to use for line power, 36, 24 and 12v sources for the International space station. Now if that plating on your outlets had been gold...that's another story. Gold is actually a slightly poorer conductor than either silver or copper by has the tremendous property of not corroding (or more properly corroding at an infantesimally slow rate).

[Adz]

It's my understanding that cryo benefits the metal components its applied to. Meaning what happens to the rest of the Grid means nothing to realize its benefits - what matters is what's feeding the gear. Not sure it increases sonic performance but what it does increase is the the outlet's longevity (its toughness and increases wear resistance). In addition, the surface of the metal becomes much smoother, ensuring a much better fit between metal pieces.

With respect to the performance of the outlet itself, I purchased one on a recommendation from an audiophile dealer who doesn't even carry them but swears by it. So I figured, hey, I've made much more costlier mistakes than this to get to where I am now. The Electrician installed one and right out of the box we compared it to my standard wall outlet. We put in Christina Augilera's CD (ok a little embarrasing but the sound is reference quality for 2 channel) - Track 2 from the upgraded outlet "appeared" more forward and detailed. Electrician agreed so I went with it. Simple as that. I've been a skeptic of late but they did sound different with the upgraded one sounding better. Did I "will it" to sound better, maybe; but the electrician had nothing in it for him.

[Adz]

Doc,

Can't argue with NASA!! I recall hearing the same thing but I also heard it could be something like 20-30 years before corrosion / tarnish sets in and that's what the cryo process is intended to minimize on metals. Again, the result seemed to yield a more detailed and cleaner sound so I'm happy with my $120 upgrade ($40 * 3).

[brucek]

It has the added problem however of developing a corrosion (commonly called tarnish) that is higher in resistance than copper corrosion.

Isn't it only silver sulphide (AgS) that deserves that quote, and not silver oxide - from my understanding anyway. 8O

Adz,

I think it's difficult to pass judgement on silver as a conductor because its electrical conductivity is greatly affected by the the alloys it's often mixed with, especially when it's applied as a plating.

The various alloys also determine what type of tarnishes will form in flavours of oxides (AgO, Ag2O) and sulphides (AgS) and chlorides (AgCL) etc...... and each with its own electrical conductivity.

Apparently only AgS is a problematic tarnish, but if you read papers on this, it tends to form in atmospheres with sulpher present in the form of Hydrogen Sulphide (H2S). The silver sulphide formed is non conductive. Here's the NASA study on that topic.

http://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/chudnovsky2002-paper-silver-corrosion-whiskers.pdf

Generally though, if you use silver connectors, the oxide that 'eventually' forms is a good conductor and relatively thin and not a problem for home use.

The typical silver conductivity definition you get in books or the internet is:

"Silver provides the best electrical conductivity of all metals. It is an order of magnitude less expensive than gold, but it has a tendency to tarnish (oxidize). The silver oxide layer is typically less than a skin depth so it has little effect on electrical loss."

Excerpt from an old PolyPhaser Technical Document PTD1010

"Silver oxide is the only oxide (that we know of) that is conductive. This is one reason why PolyPhaser's N-type coax connectors are all silver with gold center pins. Copper oxide is not conductive and the proper application of joint compound will prevent oxidation".

We put in Christina Augilera's CD (ok a little embarrasing

Hey, I like Christina Augilera...... :T

brucek

[Brandon B]

But do you like her music?

BB

[Kodaz]

Adz,

I beleive that even if the upgrades don't make any real difference to the music if they make you listen more often they are well worth it.

[Adz]

Switched outlets again to see if they burned in any better and if I could report back anything more. It's interesting actually. There is a much bigger difference when comparing CDs versus DVD soundtracks. The upgraded outlet really shines on CDs - the sound is definitely more forward detailed and alive sounding, even more so than when it was first installed!! My wife thought I was playing with the "controls" as she said, so that's proof enough. Definitely worth the $40. Unfortunately I am more of a DVD movie guy and it was harder to tell if there was a difference in sonic performance. I think dialogue and song tracks were cleaner sounding but not like the CDs. I need to test it again and not compare the CDs first. Anyone know why that would be?


brucek - thanks for the technical info, as always. Glad to know that corrision/tarnish shouldn't be even a long term issue (although I had heard what the doc had said before as well just can;t recall where, either online in a forum or in a magazine). Would like to know your view on the cryogenic craze which has made its way now into a/v.

As for Christina, any reason why her latest CD (Stripped) seems to be high resolution but its not stated anywhere on the cover? Its really my best sounding redbook CD.

[ht_addict]

I use a silver compound called SilClear on all my connection whether interconnects, speaker cable, power cords, etc.



ht_addict

[whoaru99]

As long as the subject of dedicated circuits is closely related, how would it be possible for 6 feet of very expensive power cable, or microns of some special plating, to improve the sound of an amp or something else when there are dozens, if not hundreds of feet of plain old copper wire feeding the circuit in the first place?

I'm skeptical it could make much difference, if any...

BTW - my 2x 20 amp dedicated circuits did improve my systems bass quality and dynamics at very high volumes. Originally, I had all my equipment (amps included) plugged into TrippLite surge supressor/noise filters. Now I have left everything plugged into the TrippLite unit except the amps and they are on the dedicated 20A circuits (amps are 3x Yamaha M80 @ 250 w/ch each). I believe the inductive filtering in the TrippLites were limiting current to the amps.

Likely scenario?

[ht_addict]

As long as the subject of dedicated circuits is closely related, how would it be possible for 6 feet of very expensive power cable, or microns of some special plating, to improve the sound of an amp or something else when there are dozens, if not hundreds of feet of plain old copper wire feeding the circuit in the first place?

I'm skeptical it could make much difference, if any...

Very controversial topic that has believers on boths sides as well as non believers. For me I look at it this way. The powercord is one area that manufacturers can easily save a penny or two. Now I don't believe in those thousand $$ power cords but for $100-150CDN I have a local builder who makes 9AWG with crytotreated components power cords(too many features to list). So I bought one to replace the thin piece of crap cord that came with my amp. I just didn't want the powercord to be a limiting factor.
Now as far as the Silclear goes. We use Artic Silver between our HS and CPU, we use oil to lubricate our engines, woman use makeup to fill in the craters on their face :T Connections between one piece of metal and another are not perfectly flat. With the silclear your filling in these gaps to increase the contact area. Not to mention the silver compound is conductive so your maximizing surface area for electrical transfer. Does any off this improve overall audio/video? Its upto to you to decide. I think it does.

BTW - my 2x 20 amp dedicated circuits did improve my systems bass quality and dynamics at very high volumes. Originally, I had all my equipment (amps included) plugged into TrippLite surge supressor/noise filters. Now I have left everything plugged into the TrippLite unit except the amps and they are on the dedicated 20A circuits (amps are 3x Yamaha M80 @ 250 w/ch each). I believe the inductive filtering in the TrippLites were limiting current to the amps.

Likely scenario?

Yes. My Monster AVS2000 has 4 high current sockets that can be used for amps. Monster claims they will not limit current.

ht_addict

[Glen B]

Brucek, what is that green wire I see running from inside your panelboard through a connector and landing on a lug on the back wall ?

[brucek]

The green wire is my cable TV ground wire that runs to its grounding block mounted beside the panelboard. I do my own wiring, so I ran it inside instead the service panel instead of screwing it to the panel outside. I don't use cable anymore, but the block and wire are there in case I ever do. I use most of the old cable TV cable to pass RF from one satellite receiver to the other for PIP.

The powercord is one area that manufacturers can easily save a penny or two.

Yeah, I agree HT_addict. Using whoaru99's logic - since we have 20amp (12 gauge) dedicated circuits up to the equipment, it would seem wise to replace all the cords with the appropriate 12guage power cord. In fact a lot of equipment comes with 16gauge cords, which has been sized by the manufacturer to the spec for that equipments current draw - but it's so easy to replace them with a 12gauge or better, why not. :roll:

brucek

[jimmyp58]

I just received my jar of SilClear the other day and will spend a part of this weekend applying it to my interconnects, etc. I'll report back if I notice any differences. Even if it is negligible, it only cost $35.

Jim

[whoaru99]

I appologize for the "tone" of the first part in my earlier post, I was only trying to reason through the power cable thing. Mainly in reference to an advertisment for some Nordost power cable i saw advertised for 6 feet at $2500.

I can understand the logic of how different interconnects could possibly change the sound of a system. The logic being that the signal coming out of the source component outputs are, in effect 100%, of what they can ever be for that component. The cables upon which the signal is conveyed cannot make something out of nothing, i.e. they cannot make the signal better than it was at the source; only lessen the degredation of signal in the transfer.

With power cables I was looking at it differently. Assuming the source is likely many miles away, the "signal", if you will, is being conveyed through many different switches, transformers, wires, splices, etc. on the way to the outlet in one's house. My logic was not equating the outlet as the 100% source, but equating the outlet as merely a point of connection to a source that has already been degraded by it's travels to the point of connection. Then couple that line of thinking with the known complexities of a low level audio signal versus the relative brute force and simplicity of a fixed 60 Hz (or 50Hz) AC power sine wave. Perhaps it is the same as the interconnect senario and I just need to rethink it.

[ht_addict]

I just received my jar of SilClear the other day and will spend a part of this weekend applying it to my interconnects, etc. I'll report back if I notice any differences. Even if it is negligible, it only cost $35.

Jim

So whats your opinion on the Silclear?

ht_addict

[ht_addict]

Still curious on your opinion on the silclear jimmyp58.

ht_addict

[Sithlord]

Silclear

Thats great Jimmy looking forward to your review. Mine still hasn't arrived and it's been over 3 weeks now. Chris form VH Audio must have sent it ground mail and that can take up to 7 weeks to get to Australia :cry:

[jazznsoccer]

Iy you want to invest a couple of k$ in power equipment, I would go with the PS Audio power regenerator. Why spend that on a cord when you can get really clean power right at the point of use...

But for right now I'll stay with the dedicated circuits (cheap since I'm adding on a room right now). Can't wait for the construction to end so I can go get teh new toys...