Rotel RSX-1056 vs NAD T763

[Viperv10]

I am considering a long awaited upgrade from my 10 Year old Luxman receiver, luxman cd player, luxman amp, and psb speakers.

I am considering the following options and was wondering if I could get some opinoins:

A/V Receiver:
NAD T763
Rotel RSX-1056

DVD Player:
ROTEL RDV-1040, 1050, or 1060
NAD D562
Denon DVD-2200
*Picture quality -> Movie Sound -> CD Sound -> Ability to do DVD-A, in that order of importance

TV:
Toshiba 51HX83
Toshiba 51HX93

Speakers:
PSB Image 5T Front
PSB Image 1B Surrounds
PSB Image 8C
PSB SubSonic 6i
Or
KEF Q5 Fronts
Recommendations for the rest?


Cables:
Own Audioquest G-Snake
Own Type 4 Speaker cables

Any options or links would be greatly appreciate. I know everyones time is really limited so if you can only comment if you can recommend one of these receivers 5.1 setup is most important and a DVD player that would be great.

Viperv10

[Bam!]

Hey bud!

Well since you like the sound of PSB....I' d probably go with NAD....that colored warm sound matches perfectly with PSB...

-----------------------

That being said though I went with the 1056 after researching just like you are doing....I checked out the Arcam also....while it had a better two channel sound the rest was no where near the 1056...IMO

------------------------

I will be listening to a 7.2 channel set up soon....he's running PSB's Bruston's and 1066 Pre/Pro....I'll tell you what I thought!

:T

[aud19]

Bam... I'm not sure if that was a slight at PSB or Nad??? :lol:

PSB's are actually very neutral speakers and a good pick IMO. They were on my short list with B&W's, Paradigms, Totems and the Energy's I eventually bought. So there you go those are probably the other companies I'd recomend listening to

Being that you're in Club Rotel (another reason I'm moving this) you'll get some biased Rotel opinions... and I'm no different! :B So I vote 1056 and 1040/1050 especially considering SACD isn't a concern for you and CD playback is. If you had to have SACD and CD's were less of a concern or budget required it I'd go for the 2200.

If your looking for a good TV on a tight but not cheap budget, Toshiba's probably the way to go. If you've got a bit more $$, go for one of the Hitachi or Mitsubishi sets. IMO they're a little higher quality and will more easily give you a better picture especially if you're a tweaker AND even more so if you get the set ISF'd.

Viper, sorry to do this but seen as how this isn't specifically a Rotel post I'm going to move it to a more appropriate area where it should get more traffic anyways. Sorry Bud ops:

Jason

[Viperv10]

Thanks for the quick replies and no problems on the move.

If its going to help the debate any I get Toshiba's at an excellent price so I will stick with that model line. As well my local NAD dealer can probably do me a better price then my Rotel dealer but I am still on the fence on the two.

Viperv10

[aud19]

No worries about the Tosh, especially if you can get a wicked deal. Just in case though, I thought this thread might interest you:

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=7377

Jason

[Toolatecrew]

Between the Rotel and NAD I picked a Rotel so I'm biased. Sound wise they are very close the NAD has more "power" and has more than 5 amps so it is a better"value". NAD's have fans. I hate fans. Rotel has better build quality and support in my opinion. I don't think you can go wrong with either. It depends on the sound you prefer and what your priorites and budget are.

I also listened to the PSB and Kef. I prefered the Kef a bit but the PSB was a MUCH better value.

I would not buy a PSB sub or KEF Sub. Sorry there to me are just much better and better VALUE subs out there. If in the US HSu or SVS and if in Canada Paradigm comes to mind.

I don't pretend to have done LONG comparisons between your DVD options in CD listening.

But based on your criteria:
Picture quality Hands down I think Denon has the best Pic quality. Testing seems to support this. The other 2 just don't seem to match up -> Movie Sound -> All will sound the same. At least they do to me. Its all a DIGITAL stream. The DAC in the receiver are the only real factor in sound. All the DVD does is send 1 and 0 over the cable to the receiver. If you can tell a differnce in movie sound I'd be shocked CD Sound -> I can't say I haven't done enogh comparison Ability to do DVD-A (All can do this If I'm not wrong.

TV I have a Toshiba 51H83. I like it. I wish I had the coin to go DLP. CRT RPTV is just not at the leading edge but in my price range its all I can get. Toshiba is a good value.


Basically all your choices are very nice. Just about any combo would make you very happy.

Look at you budget. Decide what is most important. Do you save a bit and go with PSB and spend a bit more on Rotel? Tough coice.

I would think about a sub from another supplier though. PSB is not horrible just that there is much better.

[Viperv10]

Well its great to see my first post got 164 VIEWS, but not as many on the POST side.

So does anyone else have opinions on the PSB SUBS? Or recommendation costing less than $600 Canadian.

Thanks.

[aud19]

Where do you live Viper? I'll point Andrew to this thread as he makes some very nice subs that will outperform pretty much anything you can buy for the same money. You may want to have a look at this thread too

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=7521

Jason

[Andrew Pratt]

Viper where are you located in Canada?

[Viperv10]

Doesn't Canada only consist of TORONTO? Just kidding down boys, down....

I looked at the www.paradigm.ca line they look like some nice speakers. I can't make heads or tails of there home theater package recommendations. Can anyone shed so light on this?

What would be the best www.paradigm.ca speaker packat for $2500 + tax.

Thanks.

[Andrew Pratt]

Viper I'd lean towards the Studio 20's and a matching centre for the front with something like the Titans for rears. I know that's not really the matching rears but they're good "little" speakers and will do fine for rear duty esp since they're cheaper which will let you spend more up front where its more important...esp. if music is important to you? For the sub as I mentioned in your other thread I'd actually recomend you not buy a comercial unit and build one yourself (or have one built for you)
Something like this kit with the maching plate amp would be well under the $700 budget yet be very tough to beat comerically for similar dollars. That's just one sub option as there's other's available that are more or less difficult to build...and if someone were to design and build one the doors wide open on designs and costs etc.

There's also the used market to consider as well...esp with your location

Like these Monitor 11's

Matching surrounds

These are pretty nice subwoofers and its very nicely priced

[aud19]

Well as I was going to add yesterday before my work's ISP crapped out :M ...

Well now that depends on the kind of deal you can get from your dealer :B Also does that price include the sub or would the sub be extra?

If you can, try to get the Paradigm Reference Studio 20's and say a sub by Andrew (or Paradigm)

Basically you're going to have to go listen and check out pricing to see what fits your budget and what you like. Just because I think Paradigms or any other company are good, doesn't mean that you'll like them. Always listen first

Check out some of the other companies as well, the more listening you do, the better. Also listen to a few speakers that are above your price range, you may not be able to afford them but hearing what a speaker should sound like is a good way to pick the less expensive ones that get the closest to that.

(Looks like Andrew and I agree on what Paradigms to get if you can )

Jason

[Toolatecrew]

Well as I was going to add yesterday before my work's ISP crapped out :M ...

Well now that depends on the kind of deal you can get from your dealer :B Also does that price include the sub or would the sub be extra?

If you can, try to get the Paradigm Reference Studio 20's and say a sub by Andrew (or Paradigm)

Basically you're going to have to go listen and check out pricing to see what fits your budget and what you like. Just because I think Paradigms or any other company are good, doesn't mean that you'll like them. Always listen first

Check out some of the other companies as well, the more listening you do, the better. Also listen to a few speakers that are above your price range, you may not be able to afford them but hearing what a speaker should sound like is a good way to pick the less expensive ones that get the closest to that.

(Looks like Andrew and I agree on what Paradigms to get if you can )

Jason

I would contradict one part of this advice.

Listening to speakers above your price range is VERY dangerous. Yes it can let you compare and say speaker x is in my budget and sounds ALMOST as good as Y so I'll buy x.

But it can also take some of the pleasure away from you new system.

I bought a 3 ch amp for my fronts a 140w Parasound 1203a to power my Paradigm Monitor 7s. I went to my dealer to pick up the interconnects they made for me. I was anxious to run home and hook it up to hear my speakers sounding better than ever. While waiting the guys said listen to these we just got them in.

http://www.genelecusa.com/ht/products/ht206b/ht206b.php

Self powered biamplified moniters from Genelec in Finland. About 5k canadian (about the same price as my entire audio portion maybe more. They blew me away. I've never heard that kind of impact from bookshelf sized speakers. The tight bass was stunning.

When I got home and hooked up my amp instead of going wow I went yeah ts better but compared to those 5k speakers well its kinda a let down.

Budgets stretch but only so much. You might be able to say buy the NAD save a couple hndred and put it towards a SLIGHTLY more expensive speaker but keep everything in perspective. If you are listening to $700 a pair speakers by all means listen to the $800 a pair ones but be careful about the $8000 a pair ones or you'll have the upgrade bug before you even get your new ones home.

[aud19]

Well yes, within reason :B

Jason

[Viperv10]

Well we are getting a lot closer to a buying decision.

I have nailed down to NAD now.

Anyone got an opinion NAD T753 or NAD T763 (basically from what I can tell 6 x 70 vs 6 x 100).

I was even considering going for a T753 and then adding a seperate amp 2 x 150 for the fronts. Does anyone know if I can assign the built in channels then to say a seperate room or to complete a 7.1 system since this is capable but is missing the amps to do it. I would be left with 2 x 150 and the rest at 70.

I also need a speaker recommendation from these manufactures. Sorry to keep changing my mind but one of my local NAD dealers has killer pricing but doesn't sell PSB or Paradigm and since the pricing is so amazing I want to buy speakers from them as well.

So I need some recommendations from these manufacturers:
MISSION, KEF, ENERGY, and TOTEM.

Keeping in mind that the budget for speakers is $2500 + tax.

Thanks again for all your help.

[Charl]

Hi Viper, thought I'd offer my thoughts on your NAD issue.....

I've owned the NAD T752 (5x80W) and in general I was very happy with it.
After a few months I added the NAD C272 power amp (2x150w) to drive the mains, and this made a big improvement in the overall sound quality - both in HT and stereo. The biggest improvement was in the detail and power of presentation, everything seemed much clearer, defined and powerful. It was so noticeable, my wife thought I'd got new speakers!
The change was most evident because I was stepping up from 80W to 150W, with the added improvement in quality only a dedicated power amp can provide. In addition, the T752 internal amps were now used only for the center and 2 rears, which also meant a further improvement in sound quality.

My speakers are B&W 603 S3's (front) + LCR60S3 (c) + 600S3's (rears), with a Rel Q150mkII sub.

I found the sound of the NAD combo to be warm and musical, without being too laid-back. Yes I agree some might call it a 'colored', for it is not a 'clinical' sound. I would describe it as musical and engaging, punchy yet detailed. And yes, it can go loud.

I loved it to the point where now I'm almost sorry I sold it to 'upgrade' to the T163 and Rotel RMB-1075.

The T752 had enough features and was fairly simple to setup and use. I was also very impressed with the remote and used it to control 6 other components.

The only gripes I had were about the fact that the OSD was not available via component video output, and that damned fan noise (I think that has been resolved by using more and smaller fans in the new T753 range). I never experienced any of the other infamous NAD issues some guys are compalining about.

My honest recommendation - go for the T763 and then later add the C272 power amp when the budget allows. This combo will kick butt.
As for the speakers, I'm afraid I can't offer any advice other that saying I'm happy with B&W's and they seem to partner well with NAD. However, the local dealers are always suggesting NAD be partered with Mission speakers.

Best of luck, and enjoy the ride.....

[Toolatecrew]

Well we are getting a lot closer to a buying decision.

I have nailed down to NAD now.

Anyone got an opinion NAD T753 or NAD T763 (basically from what I can tell 6 x 70 vs 6 x 100).

I was even considering going for a T753 and then adding a seperate amp 2 x 150 for the fronts. Does anyone know if I can assign the built in channels then to say a seperate room or to complete a 7.1 system since this is capable but is missing the amps to do it. I would be left with 2 x 150 and the rest at 70.

I also need a speaker recommendation from these manufactures. Sorry to keep changing my mind but one of my local NAD dealers has killer pricing but doesn't sell PSB or Paradigm and since the pricing is so amazing I want to buy speakers from them as well.

So I need some recommendations from these manufacturers:
MISSION, KEF, ENERGY, and TOTEM.

Keeping in mind that the budget for speakers is $2500 + tax.

Thanks again for all your help.

I too was impressed by the NAD and considered it closley when I bought my Rotel. I would see if you can get an extended test and run it with some tough to drive speakers to see if the fans bother you.

If not I would consider the 753 live with it for a bit and consider a separate amp. Not 100% sure of price difference between 753 and 763 but you would gain only 30 wpc. The NAD 2ch amp is an option but I would recommend from my own experience to THINK about a used amp. Something like this http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ult&1090085646 a Parasound 3 ch x 140 w amp can be had for about the same price or LESS than a new 2 ch NAD. I am not associated with the seller in any way. I DO own one of these amps that I bought used and paired with my Rotel. I would think that 140 w X3 across the front and the NAD driving only the 2 rears would be superior to both the 763 AND the 753 with only a 2 ch amp.

For speakers Misson has never appealed to me but that is personal.

Totem makes wonderful speakers but very pricy. You won't get a lot for 2500.

I would say Energy and Kef are best bets if you wish to buy from same dealer. My local NAD dealer carries both of these brands. I was impressed byt the Energy C5 and C 7s. Both werre very good. I only listend to the Kef in 2ch so I can only say I was impressed with them in that mode.

I would think Energy would be a better "value" but you gotta listen I guess. good luck.

[Andrew Pratt]

You're likely going to get the most bang for your buck with one of the Canadian brands given your location so the Energy or Toem line would be where I'd look first...of course you're not going to get a lot from Totem with that budget I'm sorry to say...they're very nice though The best thing you can do is just listen to as many speakers as you can using CD's you enjjoy listening to and pick the ones that sound best to you. I might love the Totem sound but if you don't who really cares what I think its you that has to listen to them every day. I also wouldn't discount the used market as speakers typically last a very long time and there are significant savings to be had buying used or demo. At the very least I'd strongly consider that Paradigm PW2200 sub I listed above as its one of the better subs you'll find an anywhere near that price from a comerical vendor and the price is quite good being used.

[aud19]

Ooooh that's tough... I'm not a big Mission fan...way too laid back IMO But Kef, Energy and Totem are all VERY nice :P

As you can see by my Avatar I'm a big Energy fan and they'll probably offer you the best bang for your buck out of the three... just do not buy one of their subs. Energy has awesome tweeters (airy and crisp without getting spitty or aggressive) but if you like a warm, laid back sound they might be too "bright" for some folks. What kind of music and movies do you watch? Might be a good mix with Nad's warmer sound....?

Kef I only listened to briefly but if I remember were quite nice but also fairly $$.

Totem... this is one of the only "moderately priced" companies that uses fabric tweeters that I actually like. (I find most too warm and laid back) They're gorgeous speakers and sound great but are more $$

But as Andrew pointed out there's no point in us telling you what we like... You have to listen, decide what you like and what you can afford... Knowing your musical tatstes might help us narrow it down but even that will still be just a guideline... (you may like the opposite of what we pick)

Jason

[Viperv10]

Can someone give tell me if these would be considered equal speakers to compare:

Energy Connoisseur C5
Energy Connoisseur C-C1
Energy Connoisseur C1

KEF Q5
KEF Q6c
KEF Q1

Paradigm Monitor Monitor 9
Paradigm Monitor CC-370
Paradigm Monitor Monitor 3

Paradigm Studio 40
Paradigm Studio CC-470
Paradigm Studio 20

Paradigm PS-1200
Paradigm PW-2100

I am looking at the NAD T753 and in the long term I'd like to add a NAD C272 (2 x 150Watts) to the fronts, and eventually two more for centre, rears and then replace the T753 witha T163. However 150Watts is above what most of these speakers can take. Most only go up to 125Watts. Can anyone give me input on this?

As well NAD wrote back to me saying that the T763 has a Holmgren power transformer, the T753 has a frame power transformer, anyone got an opinion on the difference?

Can any one tell me approximately the cost of these speakers?

Next week all this talk takes a leap to reality.... Going testing....

Thanks.

[Viperv10]

Went shopping and my local dealer told me high end stereo's have a power transformer shaped like a donut, any comments?

Also any opinions on the KEF Q7?

As well since there are energy fans here my local dealers said that energy was not good for the midrange, but I heard my friends and I don't remember them being poor in the mid range.

Getting closer to buying.

[aud19]

I happen to love my C9's midrange. They tend to be a bit more forward than other speakers, (front 20 rows vs mid hall) but it all depends on the individuals taste. I prefer a very clean but IMO pleasant midrange. Some people prefer what I would consider and overly full bloated midrange. Neither of us is wrong it's just individual preference.

Kef makes very nice speakers, they tend to be a bit more expensive but they're very nice.

If possible go with the C-C3 centre for the Energy's, you won't regret it

Jason

[aud19]

By the way, just read a very favourable review of the Energy Veritas V2.4i system in Home Theater magazine. Here's a quote regarding the midrange:

What grabbed me first was the V2.4' and V2.0Ci's fluid, rich, natural midrange sound, something that was a major selling point on the former Veritas system and has only gotten better.

So I'm not sure what that dealer is listening too but I don't know how he confused Energy with bad midrange... 8O

Jason

[Viperv10]

May their confussing their commission with what the speakers sound like.

But I narrowed it down to a few options and will test when I come back from Vacation.

Thanks all.

[Viperv10]

Well well, who would have guessed NAD is CANADIAN owned. I was reading FORBES magazine on holiday and apparently the LENBROOK distributors own NAD and PSB. Who would have guessed. The guy at my local stereo store certainly did not know this. So that seals the deal as I am an ALL CANADIAN BOY.

So its pretty much decided now on NAD and some sort of ENERGY speakers/Paradigm Sub.

I have one final question to ask of the audio experts:
I am considering getting a NAD 763 (6 x 100 Watts) or getting a NAD 753 + a 2 x 150 Watt seperate amp to drive the fronts. The guy at my local stereo shop says that the fronts will be over weighted and pointed out that I might be doing this to buy over time verse buying the 763 (6 x 100Watts) right away. He thinks the 100 Watts all round would make for a better sound. But I don't really get that. I think the 150 Watts for music (60% of my listening will be music) would be better with the more powerful amp. In the long run my thoughts were to end up with 150 Watts all around and use a pre amp to replace my receiver (but this is way down the road).

So config would be between these two options:
763
FR 100 Watts
FL 100 Watts
C 100 Watts
RR 100 Watts
RL 100 Watts

or

753 +C272

FR 150 Watts
FL 150 Watts
C 70 Watts
RR 70 Watts
RL 70 Watts


Off topic but my speaker combinations I was thinking of:
Energy C-9
Energy C-C3
Energy C-3

Energy C-5
Energy C-C1
Energy C-C1

Paradigm 1200 or 2200

[aud19]

With your tastes leaning more towards music I'd vote 753 +C272 especially if you go for the C-9's. Even if you go for the C-5's I can't stress how much you should get the C-C3...just forget the C-C1 :B

Jason

[Viperv10]

Jason,

How about this:

NAD 753 6 x 70
NAD C272 2 x 150

Energy C9
Energy C-C3 (just for you Jason)
Energy C-1

[Charl]

Viper, I would suggest that you consider your future upgrades very seriously at this point. Most of us could have saved a truckload of money if we had planned better. You see unfortunately the upgrade bug doesn't let go easy, so no matter how good your system sounds now, you'll probably be curious about the next upgrade soon. The ride is awesome fun though!

If you are likely to go for seperates as the next logical upgrade, I would go with the T753 and the C272 for now. This way you could keep the C272 and add a dedicated preamp/processor and add a few more power amps (or a 5 channel amp) for full 7.1.
The 6x70w amps of the T753 will only be driving 3 channels in your 5.1 setup, so you'll end up getting approx. 3 x 85w anyway (according to NAD tech), which I assure you is powerfull enough to upset the entire neighborhood.
My T752 and C272 were outstanding value for money. I still have a C272 and can assure you it sounds awesome! I can only imagine having a few of them in a seriously good HT setup.
If you went for the T763 now and later added the C272, you will likely be adding one extra step (expense) in the eventual transition to seperates.

If however, you do not intend to move on to seperates at a later stage, I can assure you the T763 sounds good on its own and will be awesome when partnered later with a C272.

Another thing - I don't agree with your dealer saying the C272 will be "over weighted". The amp has a gain control, so all you do is calibrate it to balance with the rest of your speaker channels, i.e. equal volume all round. When you turn up the volume all channels will stay balanced at any volume level.
What will be noticeable is the improvement in detail, clarity and 'grip' - and you'll love this even more when listening to 2 channel music!

Hope this helps!