Lexicon MC-12 and high end processors, you pay for the name.

[Asahikasei]

People always assume that high end high priced audio will be superior in every aspect to your standard receiver, this can be true when dealing with analog 2CH setups but in home theater it is not. High end companies either do a direct rebadged and sell it for a huge profit or they design their own but as you will see there is nothing high end about it.

Lexicon MC-12.





Here we see the Digital I/O Board "top" and Analog I/O Board "bottom" obviously they are in no way superior to how a receiver is built/designed. Obviously there will be no sonic improvements using a DSP/DAC since the high end does not use anything special or better then what is used in today's receivers so the difference would be in the analog section of the product. As you can see there is nothing superior about the analog section of a very expensive Lexicon MC-12.

http://www.smr-home-theatre.org/Lexicon/mc12/smr_images.html

Here is where I found the pictures.

Halcro SSP100/200.

The halcro uses the Vinci Labs Titan OEM SSP platform.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=973556

http://www.avtalk.co.uk/forum/index.php?t=msg&th=18281&prevloaded=1&rid=0&SQ=0&s tart=0

In these threads we found out that they do infact use the titan platform.





As you can see by the back layout the halcro "top" and parasound "bottom" have the same layout and most of it is exactly the same. The halcro also uses the following DSP/DAC, Audio DSP: Motorola DSP56367 Audio DAC: ASAHI KASEI AK4395 The HDMI also has an Audio DSP: Motorola DSP56371.

Mcintosh MX135/136.



The DSP system Mac uses.

http://www.mds.com/products/product.asp?prod=DAE%2D5

The analog section for one channel.



This shows the power supply section of the mac, the two things I did like about the mac is the power section and the analog section when compaired to the lexicon.

[deke]

I don't doubt your thesis, but what are you expecting to see in these pics?

[Azeke]

I just was talking about the Lexicon MC-12 HD in another thread. I have friend who loves the McIntosh, but he is more of a music lover than HT, which is where the Mac excels, providing an almost "tube-like" sound.

FWIW, I actually think he is trying to show the quality differences in the build of the DACs between the Lexicon and the Mac. Just my $0.02.

Peace and blessing,

Azeke

[lvhung]

Ballance design concept of Rotel made many faulty AV receiver and processsor but they dont care

they feel no shame at all

[Alaric]

Yeah , Halcro isn't any better than Insignia. Parasound is as good as it gets. I don't seem to see any side-by-side photos of the same component/different manufacturer in your post? Is it possible that a circuit board may look the same-but the higher quality capacitors and that TI processor may have an edge over lower budget stuff? Just asking.

[Mig17]

I am not an expert but in my opinion
Texas Instrument and motorola are better than cirrus and crystal processor

[kgveteran]

This isn't the only place this happens.I owned a 1991 Plymouth Laser.It was a four cylinder dual over head cam five speed turbo.Top speed was about 145mph.It was a monster on the open road ( keeping in mind turbo lag ) .I had the car about 13 years and the fun I had driving that car was worth every penny, I paid $12,000.00 for it back then.

Denon recievers will be my processors of choice in the future.for $600.00-$700.00 it will do all you need for about 1/10th of the cost. You will never get bragging rights on the name, but when the lights go out and the action starts (the movie ) no one will really care about the name.

KG

[Alaric]

Further , how about the quality of the potentiometers , solder , internal wire..? You can build a kit-car that looks like a Ferrari--that doesn't make it as good as a Ferrari. I don't know enough about the guts of the components to prove or disprove the above comments , but I do know not to say "It looks the same so it must be the same".

[deke]

This isn't the only place this happens.I owned a 1991 Plymouth Laser.It was a four cylinder dual over head cam five speed turbo.Top speed was about 145mph.It was a monster on the open road ( keeping in mind turbo lag ) .I had the car about 13 years and the fun I had driving that car was worth every penny, I paid $12,000.00 for it back then.

Denon recievers will be my processors of choice in the future.for $600.00-$700.00 it will do all you need for about 1/10th of the cost. You will never get bragging rights on the name, but when the lights go out and the action starts (the movie ) no one will really care about the name.

KG

I've recently come to a similar conclusion - and rather than waiting for the high-end names to come up with a HDMI 1.3a solution, I got a Onkyo 805 and plugged it in as a pre to my Rotel 1075 amp. Am I completely at peace with my decision? No. But I'm cheap. And it sounds pretty damn good. 2 years from now I'll pick up a better name, but used. It's not easy being me.

[BasementJax]

I mean, yeah... Take a look at the interior of a Mark Levinson 326s:


Nothing but, resistors, capacitors, etc. How dare they charge $10k for this unit??!!! But, it's arguably one of the best sounding (and measuring) preamps out there.

Granted, we often pay an outrageous premium for "high-end" brands in this hobby. There's clearly a lot of snake oil out there IMO. But sometimes the whole really is greater than the sum of the parts.

[DL86]

You do have to take into account the engineering hours spent on designing and testing the products. The magic is how the resistors, capacitors, inductors, transistors etc... are put together in the final product and im also guessing components used would be very high tolerance which would lead to a higher price tag. IC's used would also be of the highest standard.

[whoaru99]

I mean, yeah... Take a look at the interior of a Mark Levinson 326s:


Nothing but, resistors, capacitors, etc. How dare they charge $10k for this unit??!!! But, it's arguably one of the best sounding (and measuring) preamps out there.

Granted, we often pay an outrageous premium for "high-end" brands in this hobby. There's clearly a lot of snake oil out there IMO. But sometimes the whole really is greater than the sum of the parts.

I agree. Some are quite happy to drive a Buick (I do) and some insist on only Lexus, BMW, etc.

I'm not going to argue the sonic differences, that's way too subjective.

However, the typical gear doesn't look at all like the insides of that Levinson or other high-end stuff.

To the OP, of course you pay for name. You do in everything...the house brand green beans are always cheaper than the Green Giant brand.

I've got a $300 St. Croix fishing rod, and I've got a $50 Berkley. Do I catch 6x more fish with the St. Croix? Heck no. But which one do I enjoy fishing with more? I'll give you one guess.