HTG official High Definition high octane DVD format war, the aftermath

[George Bellefontaine]

George,

Did you find these in NS? I've looked in the Wal-Marts in Halifax and New Minas (Annapolis Valley) and couldn't find any.

Brad

Hi, Brad. The Walmart store here in New Glasgow has several on display. They're called VENTURER and have two free HD DVD discs in the box. If they carry them here in this smallish market, they must have them at their Halifax stores. They've just been released so they may have not been on display when you last checked.

[Pez]

I am convinced the big box retailers want nothing to do with next gen DVD's, here is why:

Two DVD's came out today that I wanted to get, Harry Potter #5 and Bourne #3. I had already determined I wanted Bourne on SD DVD but was undecided about Harry Potter. I wanted to get the blu-ray version but being the collecting type with all my other Harry Potter DVD's in the SD version I kind of want them to be the same. I had this same situation over the weekend with Spideman 3 but couldnt justify spending $30 on a blu-ray DVD and am glad I didnt as it was rather disapointing. However when I was watching it I did wish the picture was better. I had the blu-ray version of Harry Potter in my hand when I noticed it was $35!!!! Are you kidding me, $35??? At least with HD-DVD you get two version (although pointless if you ask me) for the same price. If it was $30 I may have got it but there is no way I would spend that much for a movie not named Star Wars.

Honestly, how can either blu-ray or HD-DVD make any headway to SD-DVD when movies start at $35. Its as if the big box retailers are making sure we walk right past the next gen movie section. I dont mind paying a little extra for next gen as the pq and sq are better but there is a limit. And I am sure for the average non-HT junkie consumer that limit is much lower.

My memory may not be that good but I could swear that movie prices was a selling point for the blu-ray fanboys and that HD-DVD was more expensive. At least at Best Buy I find this NOT to be the case, prices are the same, way too much. These formats have been out long enough that $25-$30 should be the upper limit.

I had to get that off my chest.

FWIW I have both HD and BR players.

[Chris D]

Some big swings have been happening in the media war, that I can't account for, but it seems like every time things just go back to the same place, with BD selling about 1.75 times more than HD-DVD. http://www.eproductwars.com/dvd/

I don't know, maybe the swings are big holiday purchases.

[bmowis]

Hi, Brad. The Walmart store here in New Glasgow has several on display. They're called VENTURER and have two free HD DVD discs in the box. If they carry them here in this smallish market, they must have them at their Halifax stores. They've just been released so they may have not been on display when you last checked.

Hi George,

I've checked the Bayer's Lake location 3 times since you posted - as recently as yesterday - looking for the Venturer HD-DVD player. If it's sold in their electronics section, they're not carrying it right now. I've asked 2 or 3 of their personnel about it and they all say the same thing - never seen it.

...perhaps the format war gremlins are carrying them away.

Cheers!

Brad

P.S. I have to agree with Pez. $35 for an HD movie is pretty steep. I'm really looking forward to jumping into the HD scene, but not when I can get perfectly good SD versions for half the price. The HD cats are going to need to find a better way to attack the Joe Consumer market, because if pushovers like me are refusing to buy their product, there's trouble.

[Ovation]

I've seen a number of titles at Future Shop for 19.99$ and for 17.99$US at Best Buy in Vermont. I also took advantage of the BOGO Amazon sale today and picked up eight HD DVDs for 83$ (less than the SD for a number of the films I chose). I remember when SD DVDs first hit the market, they were not cheap either (and if you account for inflation, they were notably more expensive than many hi-def titles today). Prices will come down as volume increases. It happened with CDs, it happened with DVDs, it will happen with hi-def media.

[George Bellefontaine]

Hi George,

I've checked the Bayer's Lake location 3 times since you posted - as recently as yesterday - looking for the Venturer HD-DVD player. If it's sold in their electronics section, they're not carrying it right now. I've asked 2 or 3 of their personnel about it and they all say the same thing - never seen it.

...perhaps the format war gremlins are carrying them away.

Cheers!

Brad

Brad, maybe they have dealers for different areas. Did you try Zellers ? Anyway, you can probably find out where to buy them at the maker's website. By the way, it is a Canadian Company who has the product made for them in China. Their website is here:

https://www.venturer.com

[bmowis]

Brad, maybe they have dealers for different areas. Did you try Zellers ? Anyway, you can probably find out where to buy them at the maker's website. By the way, it is a Canadian Company who has the product made for them in China. Their website is here:

www.venturer.com

Thanks for the help!

[Chris D]

I know people had expressed interest... major update available today for the PS3, including Divx, WMV, and Blu-Ray v1.1 support.

[bmowis]

For Canadian members...Future Shop will be selling the Toshiba A3 for $99 during their boxing day sale. That's a nice deal.

Future Shop Boxing Day Flyer

[George Bellefontaine]

For Canadian members...Future Shop will be selling the Toshiba A3 for $99 during their boxing day sale. That's a nice deal.

Sure is, but it's a door crasher so there will be limited quantity. Better get there early ( and wear a football helmet :lol: ) if you want one.

[Chetk]

Sure is quiet in here. 8) :rofl:

[impala454]

It was quiet long before today's Warner news.

[Chris D]

Yeah, another interesting turn in the format wars. I don't think it will be the nail in either one's coffin, but the saga continues.

[Race Car Driver]

Yeah, another interesting turn in the format wars. I don't think it will be the nail in either one's coffin, but the saga continues.

But the hammer may be ready to swing.

While in Best Buy today, I saw 8 sections of BluRay, vs the 4 of HDDVD discs.

[impala454]

Yeah it may not be the nail in the coffin but it sure is a huge blow to the HD-DVD camp. What would be nice is if this move was good enough to convince George Lucas and others to start cranking out their stuff in HDM.

[John Holmes]

Well, no matter how you slice it, this hurts HD-DVD. For it to be Warner that's jumping ship, makes this a big deal.

[littlesaint]

Well, no matter how you slice it, this hurts HD-DVD. For it to be Warner that's jumping ship, makes this a big deal.

Funny, people said the same thing about Blu-ray when Paramount dropped it. All this does does is change the landscape a little. If people want to watch Universal and Paramount films in HD, they still need to buy an HD-DVD player. Hardly any nails in the coffin.

[littlesaint]

But the hammer may be ready to swing.

While in Best Buy today, I saw 8 sections of BluRay, vs the 4 of HDDVD discs.

It's not how many they stock, its how many the sell. Twice as much crap, is still crap. The Warner move will get to buy a BD player by May, but until this announcement, there wasn't a whole lot of BD exclusives that caught my eye. A lot of people I talk to who are "purple" own far more HD-DVDs than Blu-ray discs.

[Chetk]

Funny, people said the same thing about Blu-ray when Paramount dropped it. All this does does is change the landscape a little. If people want to watch Universal and Paramount films in HD, they still need to buy an HD-DVD player. Hardly any nails in the coffin.

How can HD-DVD survive without Disney, Sony, WB, etc.? Blu-Ray has proven it can withstand not having Paramount/Dreamworks and Universal.

WB has seen the numbers. They stated in their press release that people are no longer purchasing DVDs in anticipation for HD media. And everybody knows that box office numbers are down.

Can we all agree that, since it is still somewhat early in the HD media market that Blu-Ray has now become that better option for consumers? Forget about all of the players sold and our individual stances and look at future consumers? Why would anybody that is looking into purchasing their first HD player go out and buy and HD-DVD player at this point? The sooner everybody embraces Blu-Ray, the sooner we can start the battle against DVD.

Twice as much crap, is still crap.

If Blu-Ray software sales are crappy, then that would make HD-DVD sales sub-crappy. Or, in other words, twice as crappy. That's what matters. Everybody knows HD media won't take off until there's a clear winner. Nobody expected software sales to boom initially. They just needed a clear indicator of what consumers want. They were looking for trends and they got them loud and clear. 2 to 1 and sometimes 3 to 1 sales is all they needed. HD-DVD didn't win ONE week in 2007.

Universal will be the first to join Blu and then Paramount will be next. Mark my words.

[littlesaint]

How can HD-DVD survive without Disney, Sony, WB, etc.? Blu-Ray has proven it can withstand not having Paramount/Dreamworks and Universal.

WB has seen the numbers. They stated in their press release that people are no longer purchasing DVDs in anticipation for HD media. And everybody knows that box office numbers are down.

Can we all agree that, since it is still somewhat early in the HD media market that Blu-Ray has now become that better option for consumers? Forget about all of the players sold and our individual stances and look at future consumers? Why would anybody that is looking into purchasing their first HD player go out and buy and HD-DVD player at this point? The sooner everybody embraces Blu-Ray, the sooner we can start the battle against DVD.

As long as Universal and Paramount are releasing quality films on HD-DVD, it will survive just fine. This is not a zero-sum game like everyone makes it out to be.

WB can say anything they want in a PR. All they know is for their films, they are selling more BD than HD-DVD so it makes sense they would go that way. Paramount saw it different. The actual overall numbers show that HD is a spec in sales numbers regardless of format.

Blu-ray is not the better option for consumers. The players are still to expensive, and there still is no platform standardization which is confusing to average consumers. The best option for consumers is still DVD, and sales numbers prove it. J6P just doesn't see what the big deal is compared to upconverting players (assuming he has an HDTV in the first place), and with discs still costing 2x and players more expensive, he's not buying.

Why purchase an HD-DVD player? Simple, to watch Universal and Paramount films in HD. The same reason I'll purchase a BD player come May; to watch Warner films in HD, and pickup the few Fox, Sony, and Disney films I'm interested in.

If BD is producing 2 to 3 times as many films (with all those studios involved), shouldn't it be expected that they sell 2 to 3 times as many? Like I said twice as much crap is still crap. And that's still insignificant to the number of DVDs sold. This debate is purely academic. There is no winner.

[Nolan B]

Sure is quiet in here. 8) :rofl:

there is just so much to read about whats going from various insider threads...everytime I hit refresh I get more to read. Its veyr interesting how this is all unfolding. A lot went on over the last couple of weeks.

From what I have read so far by various insiders is was close to going either way in fact a deal was put together for WB and Fox to go HD DVD and the last minute Fox pulled out and both WB and Fox went BD.

Interesting time to be in this hobby.

[Race Car Driver]

It's not how many they stock, its how many the sell. Twice as much crap, is still crap. The Warner move will get to buy a BD player by May, but until this announcement, there wasn't a whole lot of BD exclusives that caught my eye. A lot of people I talk to who are "purple" own far more HD-DVDs than Blu-ray discs.

Also while in Best Buy I spoke with the HT/Magnolia sales mgr. Asked him what he saw more sales of. He said BD. More players to sell, more players go out, and more people are picking up the BluRay discs.

On my way out I walked through the isle, thats when I also notices there were twice as many discs on the shelf.

[Race Car Driver]

Blu-ray is not the better option for consumers. The players are still to expensive, and there still is no platform standardization which is confusing to average consumers.

How so? I still have my first DVD player I bought, same day I picked up The Matrix on DVD.

Sony player was $299, The Matrix was over $20. Seems to be more than the $200 Tosh HD player at the moment, and close to the $400 BD players/discs.

The HD media hardware/software is not too expensive, just more expensive than another option.. that option being DVD.

To all those stating consumers dont want to spend the money..... look at Flat panel prices, and sales. They are all up up up! Consumers have the money, and are willing to spend it.

[Hdale85]

Yeah but flat panel displays have come WAYYY down in price since they first came out.

[Race Car Driver]

Yeah but flat panel displays have come WAYYY down in price since they first came out.

Very true, I guess I was just pointing out that in general flat panels are more $$ than CRTs were, and people are spending the money on them.

[hifiguymi]

As long as Universal and Paramount are releasing quality films on HD-DVD, it will survive just fine. This is not a zero-sum game like everyone makes it out to be.

HD-DVD will not be "just fine". Now that WB as gone BD exclusive, customers will see fewer movies on the shelf and retailers will devote less space for them. With only one company making hardware (and at margins that are horrible for the retailers so they are less motivated to stock and sell them) they won't be in front of customers as much either. That combination is deadly for HD-DVD. As BD gains momentum because of increased choice and exposure, Paramount and Universal will have to start making BD software if they want to make any money. As more players BD are sold (yes, that would include the PS3) Paramount and Universal will have to make discs that will play in them.

WB can say anything they want in a PR. All they know is for their films, they are selling more BD than HD-DVD so it makes sense they would go that way. Paramount saw it different. The actual overall numbers show that HD is a spec in sales numbers regardless of format.

Paramount wasn't selling much of anything on either format, so that in not a valid argument. What WB saw was an overall customer preference for BD and that is the way they went. If Paramount was doing both the numbers would have been similar. There are more BD players in people's home and that number continues to grow at a faster rate then HD-DVD.

Blu-ray is not the better option for consumers. The players are still to expensive, and there still is no platform standardization which is confusing to average consumers. The best option for consumers is still DVD, and sales numbers prove it.

BD is not the better option because the players cost more? The price difference is not that great and will continue to narrow so I don't see that being an issue. As far as platform standardization goes, the average consumer doesn't care. The average consumer just wants to watch a movie with the best picture and sound quality. Having in movie PIP just doesn't matter to the average consumer. I talk to customers every day about things like that and very, very few care about all of the special features that come with movies. They just want to watch the movie.

Why purchase an HD-DVD player? Simple, to watch Universal and Paramount films in HD. The same reason I'll purchase a BD player come May; to watch Warner films in HD, and pickup the few Fox, Sony, and Disney films I'm interested in.

I wouldn't recommend anyone to purchase an HD-DVD player now. The average consumer doesn't want two players and combo players will not get beyond a niche market. As I stated above, I doubt that Paramount and Universal will remain HD-DVD exclusive very long so those players will not be around very long.

If BD is producing 2 to 3 times as many films (with all those studios involved), shouldn't it be expected that they sell 2 to 3 times as many? Like I said twice as much crap is still crap. And that's still insignificant to the number of DVDs sold. This debate is purely academic. There is no winner.

There will be a winner because there has to be. As I stated above, the average consumer doesn't want two players. The only thing that will ensure long term viability is for there to be one format. With more studios going to BD exclusive there has been and will be more discs sold. That trend will continue, and grow because it's about momentum and BD has it now more than ever.

DVD sales do out pace HD discs, but the format has been around for 10 years so it had better.

Eric

[bmowis]

I wouldn't recommend anyone to purchase an HD-DVD player now. The average consumer doesn't want two players and combo players will not get beyond a niche market.

Combo players won't get beyond a niche market? To believe that, I think you have to believe that the format war will be over before dual format players can be offered at competitive prices. Any longer than that, and dual-format players will have gone through another year and a half of price depreciation and will look quite appealing to consumers looking to get the most out of their new LCD/Plasma TVs who are afraid to play Russian Roulette with their home theater investments.

If the market was ever dominated by format-agnostic players, there will not be any pressure on the Paramounts and Universals to pick a 'winning' format. I realize that some people here have mentioned this before, but I just wanted to qualify your 'niche market' statement with a condition. In my opinion, you have to be able to forsee the end of the war before you can really say that the dual format players will not have a significant impact on the war's outcome.

[littlesaint]

HD-DVD will not be "just fine". Now that WB as gone BD exclusive, customers will see fewer movies on the shelf and retailers will devote less space for them. With only one company making hardware (and at margins that are horrible for the retailers so they are less motivated to stock and sell them) they won't be in front of customers as much either. That combination is deadly for HD-DVD. As BD gains momentum because of increased choice and exposure, Paramount and Universal will have to start making BD software if they want to make any money. As more players BD are sold (yes, that would include the PS3) Paramount and Universal will have to make discs that will play in them.


Paramount wasn't selling much of anything on either format, so that in not a valid argument. What WB saw was an overall customer preference for BD and that is the way they went. If Paramount was doing both the numbers would have been similar. There are more BD players in people's home and that number continues to grow at a faster rate then HD-DVD.


BD is not the better option because the players cost more? The price difference is not that great and will continue to narrow so I don't see that being an issue. As far as platform standardization goes, the average consumer doesn't care. The average consumer just wants to watch a movie with the best picture and sound quality. Having in movie PIP just doesn't matter to the average consumer. I talk to customers every day about things like that and very, very few care about all of the special features that come with movies. They just want to watch the movie.


I wouldn't recommend anyone to purchase an HD-DVD player now. The average consumer doesn't want two players and combo players will not get beyond a niche market. As I stated above, I doubt that Paramount and Universal will remain HD-DVD exclusive very long so those players will not be around very long.


There will be a winner because there has to be. As I stated above, the average consumer doesn't want two players. The only thing that will ensure long term viability is for there to be one format. With more studios going to BD exclusive there has been and will be more discs sold. That trend will continue, and grow because it's about momentum and BD has it now more than ever.

DVD sales do out pace HD discs, but the format has been around for 10 years so it had better.

Eric

Don't know why I get sucked into debating fanboys, but at least its not as bad over here as AVS.

Sorry, but I have to disagree on every point you make. You make a lot of assumptions that have no basis and argue as if these formats are huge money makers that the studios will live and die by. They're not. The numbers in both disc and players pales to DVD sales over the last year. Truth is, the average consumer doesn't want either player. Universal and Paramount will not be switching over anytime soon. In fact if you read some other forums, WB and Fox almost went HD-DVD, so clearly there's enough "numbers" there to keep the HD-DVD format viable.

[Chris D]

DVD sales do out pace HD discs, but the format has been around for 10 years so it had better.

This is a true point. Remember, everyone, that VHS tapes still out-sold DVD until about a year or so ago. I don't think we're going to see HD formats die, even if they don't become a dominating sales force. I think it's inevitable that something will replace the DVD, and the way the HD formats are now, I think they have that capability, much less the way they're already evolving and improving.

So far, I haven't paid much attention to downloadable content, mostly because it doesn't have the capability of providing the quality and fidelity that I can get on HD discs, (much less being able to own it and play it anytime I want on any player) and won't have that capability for quite some time. I suppose it's possible that it's downloadable content that will replace the DVD instead of HD discs, but we'll see. But again, one way or another, DVD's days are numbered, whether they're many or only a few.

[hifiguymi]

Combo players won't get beyond a niche market? To believe that, I think you have to believe that the format war will be over before dual format players can be offered at competitive prices. Any longer than that, and dual-format players will have gone through another year and a half of price depreciation and will look quite appealing to consumers looking to get the most out of their new LCD/Plasma TVs who are afraid to play Russian Roulette with their home theater investments.

If the market was ever dominated by format-agnostic players, there will not be any pressure on the Paramounts and Universals to pick a 'winning' format. I realize that some people here have mentioned this before, but I just wanted to qualify your 'niche market' statement with a condition. In my opinion, you have to be able to forsee the end of the war before you can really say that the dual format players will not have a significant impact on the war's outcome.

Combo players will always be a niche market because they will always be more expensive than single format players. There are two sets of licensing fees, two processors, the laser has to be different (Blu-ray is more blue and HD-DVD is more purple so a dual formant player needs a different focusing aparatus) than a single format player, and fewer compnies are going to make them.

I didn't say Paramount and Universal had to pick one, I said they will have to make BD if they want to sell software. The can still make HD-DVD as long as they want, but with the number of BD players in peoples homes being greater and gowing they can't ignore that format.

Eric

[hifiguymi]

Don't know why I get sucked into debating fan boys, but at least its not as bad over here as AVS.

Sorry, but I have to disagree on every point you make. You make a lot of assumptions that have no basis and argue as if these formats are huge money makers that the studios will live and die by. They're not. The numbers in both disc and players pales to DVD sales over the last year. Truth is, the average consumer doesn't want either player. Universal and Paramount will not be switching over anytime soon. In fact if you read some other forums, WB and Fox almost went HD-DVD, so clearly there's enough "numbers" there to keep the HD-DVD format viable.

I'm not a BD fan boy, I'm a retailer that sees sales swinging heavily in that direction. I want one format (I don't care which one) so the buying experience is easy as can be for my customers.

I do like how you keep bringing DVD sales in this argument when it's about HDM. I know the sales of HDM are much smaller than DVD but that is not what this is about. You say the average customer doesn't want either BD or HD-DVD, but there have been recent surveys that people are purchasing fewer DVD's because they are waiting to buy an HD disc. They are not buying an HD disc because they want to choose one format. Studios know this. They want HDM to survive and flourish and replace DVD the way DVD replaced VHS. As HDTV's are replacing analog TV's in peoples homes HDM will replace DVD's as the way to watch movies. You can say that scaling DVD players look good, but most don't, especially compared to HD discs. People want the performance they paid for with their new TV.

Universal and Paramount don't have to "switch" to BD. They will have to start making BD software if they want to make money. There are more BD players in peoples homes (again that includes the PS3) and that number will grow and out pace HD-DVD players this year. I don't care that Fox and WB "almost" went to HD-DVD (if that had happened, then I would switch my stance). The fact is they didn't and now that WB is going BD exclusive, it will kill the HD-DVD format. There may be a few HD-DVD titles that sell OK now, but in comparison to BD it's not enough. With the WB switch, more and more BD players will be sold more BD software will be sold. As more is sold, it will drown HD-DVD. It will happen.

[Lex]

1 year topic anniversary, 1 year and the battle continues, lol.

[Race Car Driver]

Well I am biting the bullet.

Today in the Best Buy ad they have 10 free movies with any BD player.

So on my lunch break I will be picking up an 80gig PS3, free motostorm game, 5 free movies right away and 5 by mail.



EDIT: PS3 is excluded from the deal I walked, however while hanging around the BR isle for a good 20mins just looking over the movies offered, I can say I saw atleast 20-30 people looking over all the bluray movies and talking about it/buying, and not one HD DVD customer.... Lotta husband/bfs expalining 1080p to the wifes/gfs.

Their were more BluRay movies, however the quantites of each were quite low.

The HDDVD isle had less selection, but more of each in stock.....

[Race Car Driver]

Some interesting quotes from blu-ray.com

Following Warner's lead, sister company New Line has confirmed that it will support Blu-ray Disc high def releases exclusively. New Line has previously delayed their day-and-date new releases on HD DVD due to the format's lack of region coding, effectively making titles such as Shoot 'em Up, Hairspray, and Rush Hour 3 exclusive to Blu-ray. Although a 2008 release slate for the studio has not been released, an announcement may be possible at this year's Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas.

Outspoken director Michael Bay has once again posted his views on the format war, discussing how he feels about the recent announcement that Warner Brothers would exclusively support Blu-ray. After claiming HD DVD would "die a slow death", he gave hope to his fans that his recent blockbuster film 'Transformers' would one day be on Blu-ray.

8O

[rdram]

I too went to Best Buy today. Despite what I've read on similar posts, the quantity of HD-DVD and BD discs are equally displayed (at least here anyway). After looking over both aisles, I realized there weren't 10 BD's I was interested in. For now, HD-DVD seems to have a better selection. Think I'll order that A35 anyway, get my free HD-DVD's and see what happens. Wouldn't be the first time I've bought into a dead format. (where did I put that Beta-HiFi player...must be next to the Mini-Disc, which is next to my SACD player). I hate SONY.

[Race Car Driver]

I noticed that the selection varied from the two Best Buys I went too. The one close to work had twice as many BR, while the one close to home had the same amount.

[bmowis]

Combo players will always be a niche market because they will always be more expensive than single format players. There are two sets of licensing fees, two processors, the laser has to be different (Blu-ray is more blue and HD-DVD is more purple so a dual formant player needs a different focusing aparatus) than a single format player, and fewer compnies are going to make them.

PC drives are different than standalone players, I know, but LG already has a PC Blu-Ray / HD-DVD combo drive for a good bit less than many uni-format drives out there. It's only been available for a couple of months now and the price is already down under $300.

Dual format may always cost more than single format, but in a year and a half, when single format players are $200 and dual format players are $250, I'll chose the dual-format player.

I didn't say Paramount and Universal had to pick one, I said they will have to make BD if they want to sell software. The can still make HD-DVD as long as they want, but with the number of BD players in peoples homes being greater and gowing they can't ignore that format.

I wasn't attempting to put words in your mouth, but you might be missing my point. I'm saying that if dual format players get significant market share - which is possible, in my opinion, if this war drags on - these companies will have less reason to move to BD because dual format players will play their current format.

...I'm not really disagreeing with you, I don't think. If sales of dual-format drives don't take off, then yes, there is additional risk to stay loyal to a single format. Supporters of the losing side will have to consider crossing the floor.

I'm just not ready to call the dual format solution a 'niche market' quite yet.

Cheers!

[impala454]

If the BDA would have taken that $500 million to discount their Blu-ray players instead of bribing Warner & Fox, the format war would be over.

[Ovation]

Well, I still buy SACDs and DVD-As (and I have two MiniDisc players--a home deck and a portable) so I don't mind being "red" for now and being "purple" later.

[aud19]

I'm just not ready to call the dual format solution a 'niche market' quite yet.

Cheers!

Quite frankly you can call all three solutions a niche market :lol:

[impala454]

I think HDM is only a small market because of the format confusion. I know lots of people who own HDTVs and are on the fence about buying HDM. They see movies on both sides that are exclusive that they want. I think once one format takes hold we'll see a big boom in HDM. I read somewhere that Panasonic is coming out with a Blu-ray HTIB and that several manufacturers are building final profile Blu-ray players.

[Race Car Driver]

Yep, I have to agree, HDM will not be a nitch market. IMO it will suprass DVD.
ALOT of people are on the fence because no one likes to pay for a dead format.

If the one becomes "the winner" I think we will see rapid growth of that format.

[bmowis]

Quite frankly you can call all three solutions a niche market :lol:

Actually, I'd agree with that.

[Race Car Driver]

I think you can guess what line is what...

[Chris D]

If the BDA would have taken that $500 million to discount their Blu-ray players instead of bribing Warner & Fox, the format war would be over.

Wow, did that really happen? I haven't seen that in news anywhere. If you have a link to official information about it, that would be interesting to read!!!