Rotel RCD-1072 vs Dennon dvd-2910 Which one wins hands down?

[Trevor]

Just wanted some opinions on the Rotel cd player vs Dennon. I mostly use in two channel mode. I am running with adcom 555 series 2 amp and pre-amp. I am currently using the 804S for speakers. I am currently using the Dennon on demo. The sound is awesome compared to my 10 year old cd player. I was wondering if anyone out there compared both of these units?? My dealer does not have any Rotels in stock so I might take a chance on ordering one and having to keep it.
Thanks
Trevor

[Azeke]

Trevor,

Based on what I've heard that is no comparison for CD play, Rotel RCD-1072 wins handsdown. Just my humble opinion.

Best regards,

Azeke

[nyny]

Trevor,

Based on my comparison of the Rotel RCD-1072 and the Denon 3910 (big brother of 2910), the Rotel wins hands down. There is no comparison, IMHO.

Being a former owner of the RCD-1072 + 804S combo, I have to say that they are a great match.

Hope this helps.
Tony

[eelco74]

I owned a RCD-975 (born 1997) and compared it to a DVD-2900.

The 2900 is especially weak in the lower regions. The 975's bass was fuller and more controlled. The 1072 will always sound better, but then again, try to listen to it in a store and bring your own CD's. This will determine if the difference is big enough to have both a CD and DVD player.

[abqnmusa]

Re: Rotel RCD-1072 vs Dennon dvd-2910 Which one wins hands down?

A friend brought over his Denon 3910 DVD player. We compared it against my Rotel RCD-1072 and it did not take long to see the dedicated player won hands down. We tried blind listening tests and it was easy to detect the better sound of the Rotel.

The Denon played real DVD's as well as my Rotel RDV-1060. But has issues with playing home made DVD's, or DVD movie backups (DVD recordable media). All Denon DVD players I have seen have similar problems.

If you enjoy music from CD's get the RCD-1072 or another dedicated quality CD player.

[Clepto]

That's odd, as I have a 2910, and it's played everything I've thrown in it... DVD-R, CD-R, Dual Discs, DVD+/-RW

[Dmantis]

Denon Players can be hit or miss. They do have a high return rate. For cd playback I perfer the 1072. I think it has better clarity and weight. The Denon does a good just but lacks in the last word of detail, and thats when they work

Dan

[peterS]

Trevor,

Based on what I've heard that is no comparison for CD play, Rotel RCD-1072 wins handsdown. Just my humble opinion.

Best regards,

Azeke

uhhh having owned both and ultimately choosing the denon 2910 id have to strongly disagree... rotel doesnt play sacd or dvd-a... not to merntion it doesnt play dvd's :rofl:

maybe on 16bit cds id givew the rotel the slight edge... in real life entire package, denon by a landslide.... i think most of these above opinions are based on preconception not perception, as the rotel does look a lot nicer
the 1920 is crap though

[peterS]

I owned a RCD-975 (born 1997) and compared it to a DVD-2900.

The 2900 is especially weak in the lower regions. The 975's bass was fuller and more controlled. The 1072 will always sound better, but then again, try to listen to it in a store and bring your own CD's. This will determine if the difference is big enough to have both a CD and DVD player.

how is that possible for a player to be "weak in the lower reagons"

[peterS]

Denon Players can be hit or miss. They do have a high return rate. For cd playback I perfer the 1072. I think it has better clarity and weight. The Denon does a good just but lacks in the last word of detail, and thats when they work

Dan

so you sell denon i assume :roll:

[Kevin D]

maybe on 16bit cds id givew the rotel the slight edge...

This whole thread is about which one plays better in two channel mode on CD's. In which you agree with everyone else, the Rotel wins.. Please don't turn this into an arguement about how the Denon is a better hybrid player compared against only a CD player.

Thanks,

Kevin D.

[peterS]

This whole thread is about which one plays better in two channel mode on CD's. In which you agree with everyone else, the Rotel wins.. Please don't turn this into an arguement about how the Denon is a better hybrid player compared against only a CD player.

Thanks,

Kevin D.

i am refering to two channel as most sacd and dvd-a are in that format or available in it

http://store.acousticsounds.com/store.cfm

http://www.amusicdirect.com/

and i dont agree that the rotel "wins"
the DACs are nice but for them to out preform 24bit is silly
head to head w/ a regular old cd is too close to call from a subjective stand point
again aestheticaly the rotel is quite sexy

so if you will never use sacd, dvd a, dual disc, or watch an upconvert dvd (denon has both dvi and hdmi) only then consider the rotel

if a lowly dvd player is good enough for the conducter of the minnesota orchestra then its good enough for me (he uses a marantz)

[BWzes03]

i am refering to two channel as most sacd and dvd-a are in that format or available in it

http://store.acousticsounds.com/store.cfm

http://www.amusicdirect.com/

and i dont agree that the rotel "wins"
the DACs are nice but for them to out preform 24bit is silly
head to head w/ a regular old cd is too close to call from a subjective stand point
again aestheticaly the rotel is quite sexy

Peter, I have to disagree on this for a large extent. Why oh why do you think that a DAC with "24 bit and 192kHz" in the Denon is better than the 20 bit HDCD Burr-Brown backed by some extreme high quality opamps and high quality output buffer stages in the Rotel?

Place a Philips CD-101 (1981-82 design) against a new Denon and prepare to through that Denon in the trash.

New tech and high-bit/bit-rate specs does not equal quality.

[peterS]

why? because ive owned both
i prefer the denon over the primare too

[BWzes03]

Purely subjectly speaking then, ok...
But to state anything about bit-rate and DACs like that is just silly...

[peterS]

how so? to me its important and a sacd version of miles davis "live-evil" sounds better than the 16 bit version, already the rotel is severly disadvantaged in my mind

now i have also owned the 1920 and the rotel was superior
to say that the 2910 is inferior is tough for me to swallow though
call it ugly all you want though-lol

fyi i was not able to find out any info from texas instrument
on the differences from the PCM-1791 and 1732 D/A converter.... they stated the denon was a "very good one" but had no info on rotel's but stated it was in the same family
maybe an EE can step in here

[BWzes03]

That might be because the DAC is not Texas Instuments but Cirrus Logic...
Cirrus (Crystal) bought Burr-Brown the original maker of the excellent PCM-17xx series dacs.

OOPS : wrong ...... sorry about that..... Texas Instruments bought Burr-Brown... ops: ops:

[BWzes03]

Sure, but spinning a normal Redbook Audio CD things might be a bit different. I happen to have a heavily modified Pioneer DV-747A which was the very first multi-player, which was midified for better audio performance.
Playing the SA-CD hybrid 'Brothers in Arms' from Dire Straights (not everybody's cup-of-tea though..), there is not very much difference from the SACD layer and the HDCD encoded CD layer on the Rotel.
Ofcourse this is apples to oranges, but the fact of the matter is, Redbook CD of very good quality can sound extremely good on the Rotel, while it can sound different on a DVD-player.

Advice to Topic Starter: Listen for your self, demo the two together and do an A-B comparison.

[peterS]

That might be because the DAC is not Texas Instuments but Cirrus Logic...
Cirrus (Crystal) bought Burr-Brown the original maker of the excellent PCM-17xx series dacs.

i thought texas instruments owned burr-brown

[BWzes03]

@PeterS : found it using google....

http://www.datasheetarchive.com/datasheet/pdf/16447.html

Look for the 1732, it seems to be a 24 bit HDCD DAC.

[peterS]

ive posted the link on another forum were it should generate some technicaly sound responses..... id love an excuse to repurchase the rotel-lol
its just that hdcds are IMPOSSIBLE to find
all cd's should be hdcd imo

[Clepto]

Peter, I have to disagree on this for a large extent. Why oh why do you think that a DAC with "24 bit and 192kHz" in the Denon is better than the 20 bit HDCD Burr-Brown backed by some extreme high quality opamps and high quality output buffer stages in the Rotel?.

The Denon has HDCD and Burr-Brown DACs...

Burr-Brown 24/192 Audio DACs (DSD/PCM Discrete) PCM-1791
Burr-Brown 24/192 FL/FR, 24/96 C/SL/SR/Sub

[Clepto]

In response to the OP, I guess the biggest question is do you plan on listening to SACD or DVD-A at all (or even MP3s on DVD or CD).

[jim777]

The RCD-1072 even beats the RDV-1050 with a big margin so I just can imagine how much the Denon must sound...

The big problem is that I listened to the new McIntosh MCD201 lately... it shows how much the 1072 is a great bargain at it's price but it also made the 1072 sound veiled and unexciting in direct comparaison - then again the 201 cost at least four times more..

[peterS]

The RCD-1072 even beats the RDV-1050 with a big margin so I just can imagine how much the Denon must sound...

The big problem is that I listened to the new McIntosh MCD201 lately... it shows how much the 1072 is a great bargain at it's price but it also made the 1072 sound veiled and unexciting in direct comparaison - then again the 201 cost at least four times more..

the rotel 1050 has different dacs

[Jason Brown]

Rotel hands down

About three years ago I wasn't aware that sources had much impact on sound -- I thought it was all in the speakers. At that time I had all my CDs loaded into four Pioneer 300-disc changers. I had recently gotten into DVD-A and wanted to get into SACD as well, so I bought a Denon DVD-2900.

Just for kicks one day I threw a CD into the 2900 and was amazed at how much more detail I was getting out of it compared to the megachangers. I was hearing things I'd never heard before. This was my first revelation.

A couple of days later I made my first trip to the Rotel dealer who ended up letting me take home an RCD-1070 for evaluation. I wrote him a check the next day. The 1070 was about as big a step up from the Denon as the Denon was from The Pioneers.

Now that I have a 1072, which is even better than the 1070, I have to assume it's better than the 2910 by a wide margin.

[JFugazzi]

Get the 1072! You'll love it. I replaced my 10 year old player about 6 months ago and was amazed at the sound quality of this player. I'm also using an Adcom GFA-555 amp but the rest of the system is all Rotel. You'll find yourself going through your whole CD collection to see what you've been missing.

Joe Fugazzi

[kurtholz]

wow,surprised at all the rotel believers, i have had the rotel 1060 and the denon2910, i think the denon was much better in every category, i changed to an arcam dv29, which is a huge improvement over both

if you want sacd, i'd look at the sony9000, i heard one with a levinson amp and old 801 matrix, it was stunning sound

i personally think the arcam is the best buy, especially if you have hdmi video,and an extra $2000 more


doesnt do sacd, but does dvda incredibly well

but i am no expert, just my own opinion

good luck

kurt

[grit]

Just a quick comment on Kurtholz post about the Rotel 1060 and Denon 2910. I purchased a Rotel 1072 AFTER I brought it home and tested it against my Rotel 1060 DVD player. A dedicated CD player will most likely sound better than a DVD player.

Also, remember that to get the most out of your CD's and player, you want to run analog L/R to the pre/pro, and use the bypass mode. Otheriwse, your pre/pro will convert the analog signal to digital to process it, and back again to analog.

[eelco74]

how is that possible for a player to be "weak in the lower reagons"

As far as I know it has to do with the power supply. All modified 2900 players get either a new power supply or a heavilly modified power supply.

I listened to a 599 Euro upgraded 2900 and the difference was quite noticeable. It ha dmodifications in the power supply, op amps, clock and capacitors. I all has to do what Denon can fit within the budget of the player and the margin for both manufacturer and reseller at the end.

Remember it is ony 500 Euro's more expensive than a RCD-1072. For that you get a progressive DVD player, SACD player and DVD-A.

[greve]

I came across this UK review of the RCD-1072 - not exactly mirroring the roses in this thread: http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/review_read.asp?ID=2751

[peterS]

As far as I know it has to do with the power supply. All modified 2900 players get either a new power supply or a heavilly modified power supply.

I listened to a 599 Euro upgraded 2900 and the difference was quite noticeable. It ha dmodifications in the power supply, op amps, clock and capacitors. I all has to do what Denon can fit within the budget of the player and the margin for both manufacturer and reseller at the end.

Remember it is ony 500 Euro's more expensive than a RCD-1072. For that you get a progressive DVD player, SACD player and DVD-A.

do you have any info on tutorials on those mods?!
here the price difference is minimal
rotel is about $500 and the denon 750 or so (i payed 450) so i am more than pleased with it

[sprout]

ive posted the link on another forum were it should generate some technicaly sound responses..... id love an excuse to repurchase the rotel-lol
its just that hdcds are IMPOSSIBLE to find
all cd's should be hdcd imo

I did not know which post of yours to choose, they are all so good

I have this Rotel CD player.
I believe it is excellent value for money, but I also own a 991AE which is marginally more to my taste.

I have been fortunate enough to own a lot of Denons: A1, A11, 3910 etc.

I compared the 1072 to the 3910 for CD. There was no point in pursuing for longer than 30 minutes. The Rotel was far superior.

Now I am a huge Rotel fan, but was very dissapointed with my DVD 1060, it was noisy (transport). It was good for 2 channel CD, better than the 3910, but did not have them at the same time.

I am very surprised at your findings but respect them.
I wonder if the rest of your system is the limiting factor and the Rotel is just too revealing :E

Or if not you are just lucky I guess to enjoy the sound of a much lesser player?

There is a lot of HDCD material around, lists on the net and remember, a lot is even though not labelled such :E

There is no point in mentioning SACD or DVD-A as it was not the OP question.

sprout

[gianni]

I came across this UK review of the RCD-1072 - not exactly mirroring the roses in this thread: http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/review_read.asp?ID=2751

Good point and any potential buyer should consider this and let his ears be the final judge. In a subsequent review in a different system, hifichoice did give the 1072 a better review.

[peterS]

seems im not alone.... http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthr...973#post238973

[BWzes03]

The only advice that is needed for the Topic starter is :
Listen to both, preferably in your own system at home, and judge for yourself.

@PeterS:
A DAC alone does not a CD-player make....
The DAC is only one of many different components that make a good player.
Factor in these :
- Power supply (seperate analog and digital stages)
- transport and transport logic
- chassis shielding and build
- DAC's
- opamps in the analog stages
- buffering of the analog stages
- master clock
And there are several others, which I can't rememeber at this point.
All of these components are responsible for making the machine sound either good, briliant or sub-par.
Judging a machine by the specsheet alone is not good enough. As I have stated in an earlier post, a 1981 16-bit machine can be very capable of beating a 24bit/192kHz DAC having, upsampling, universal player, when spinning Redbook Audio CD's.

[spinners]

This thread started off with 2 channel stereo with cd playback, so don't get carried away with SACD, DVDA and all that. Rotel RCD 1072 wins hands down. Period. (in 2 channel stereo that is)

[Clepto]

This thread started off with 2 channel stereo with cd playback, so don't get carried away with SACD, DVDA and all that. Rotel RCD 1072 wins hands down. Period. (in 2 channel stereo that is)

Yes, but if it's truly '2 channel stereo' that _DOES_ include SAVD and DVD-A. Would a 24bit/192K stereo recording on DVD-A on the Denon sound better than the same CD on the Rotel?

This of course may better be answered with the Comparable Rotel DVD-A player vs Denon, but you still won't get SACD playback from Rotel.

[peterS]

Yes, but if it's truly '2 channel stereo' that _DOES_ include SAVD and DVD-A. Would a 24bit/192K stereo recording on DVD-A on the Denon sound better than the same CD on the Rotel?

This of course may better be answered with the Comparable Rotel DVD-A player vs Denon, but you still won't get SACD playback from Rotel.

contrary to some of the people in this thread who dont even know what a sacd is i own hdcd, sacd, and dvd audio and have played them head to head on the rotel and denon... my choice is obviouse.... got to find out the hardway i guess
wont go wrong with either.... this is a rotel forum so obviously very biased
you would not be able to hear the difference of 16 bit on either
24bit yes, and only the denon does it + upconverted dvds
so if you have a desire for a dvd player or atleast the ability to play sacd and dvd-a give the denon a shot

[Trevor]

I tested the Denon 2910 again and the sound is very good. I still have yet to demo the Rotel due to inventory availability. I called and got a price of 629.99 for a brand new Rotel in box? I wish I could demo but this other place does not allow. The Denon's price is 729 at the shop I normally go to or Ultimate has it for 699.99. I know everyone says that the Denon is good but I do not need sacd or dvd-a. I want something that will be worth the money and last for a good ten years or so if possible.
Dilemma at hand??? :
Thanks for the reply's
Trevor

[peterS]

I tested the Denon 2910 again and the sound is very good. I still have yet to demo the Rotel due to inventory availability. I called and got a price of 629.99 for a brand new Rotel in box? I wish I could demo but this other place does not allow. The Denon's price is 729 at the shop I normally go to or Ultimate has it for 699.99. I know everyone says that the Denon is good but I do not need sacd or dvd-a. I want something that will be worth the money and last for a good ten years or so if possible.
Dilemma at hand??? :
Thanks for the reply's
Trevor

dual disk falls under the dvd-a format... its kind of cool to be able to watch videos or art work along with the music.... i hope this is the dirrection music formats go...

[Kens1]

Had the Denon 3910 as a DVD player because I wanted to experiment with sacd/ dvd-a. I ended up selling it after not being very satisfied with the selection in those formats. The sacd's I did buy I never really listened to compared to cd's. I thought the Denon did pretty good for cd playback but now I have the Cambridge 640c cd player and the panasonic s97 dvd player both for less than the cost of the 3910 and the cd playback on the cambridge is definately better. I actually like the panasonic dvd player better as well for movies. I much prefer two channel audio. If you are looking for a universal though, the 2910 would be hard to beat - it actually got a better review than the 3910 in one magazine I read - go figure.

[Kevin D]

Having drifted, welcome to the 'Audio Hideout'.

Kevin D.

[comeup]

I agree with peterS the 3910 sounds better. I have the 1070 which sounds better than the 1072 to me. Before buying the 3910 I bought the 1072 and was not impressed at all, I returned it. Most of you are probably B&W owners and Rotel does sound good with B&W and I do have a Rotel two channel setup with B&Ws. I also have Kef Ref 201s for my fronts of my HT setup and this is where I thought the 3910 sounded better in two channel. I played with both a long time. Of course we all hear things differently no disrespect to anyone I just like the Denon Better.

I read somewhere that the 3910 was as good as a 1500$ dedicated cd player. every time I read about the 3910 there was talk about how good it is as a cd player and there is a lot of reviews on the 3910. I know reviews are sometimes BS but please read below I agree with this review.

www.audaud.com/article.php?articleid=1

Peace

[BWzes03]

@comeup: the topic starter wanted to compare the RCD-1072 and the Denon 2910, not the 3910. The 3910 is obviously a step further up the highend ladder than the 2910. (considering the 500-600 dollar price difference between the two)