I can has Statements: Another Statement LCR build

[Gusta]

Deleted (was referring to a different design).

[jyqureshi]

Just finished assembling crossovers for The Statements, and tested them out with the drivers.
Both boards are 7" x 11 3/4".
The inductors are about 10-11 cms apart.
Here are the pics:









J

[deewan]

Looks good. How did they sound?

[jyqureshi]

Here I have drawn what I did underneath, please point to any problems if you find any.



Deewan:
The drivers sounded very detailed, there were tiny little details coming out of the tweeter and the mid, also I just tested to see the crossovers are working. But there was a big difference in sound for sure.

I just can't wait to have everything ready. It's been raining in and out and having a townhouse without a garage makes things dependent on the weather, busy with family last weekend, plus I ordered some router bits a few days back waiting for them as well.

J

[jyqureshi]

lol, since nobody replied to the above post, I can think of two things: either the crossovers are correct or totally screwed up

[deewan]

lol, since nobody replied to the above post, I can think of two things: either the crossovers are correct or totally screwed up

I agree with that statement.

I know the drivers hooked up the the crossovers will sound very bass-less and treble heavy, but I am sure looking forward to being able to hook mine up to test everything. That is my next "milestone" for my build.

[jyqureshi]

Question regarding the crossover here, to make it bi-amp, I just need to reconnect the woofer crossover with a separate input and keep the original input for the tweeter and mid, correct?

[Jim Holtz]

Yes...

Jim

[jyqureshi]

Hello guys,

Time for an update. Finally the weather was reasonable and I was able to make some progress last week. The cabinets for Statements are ready, the baffles are almost ready but not sure if they'll work so I ask here.

In the Statement's PDF file, the recess diameter is 8 3/4 and 4 15/16 for RS and W4 drivers respectively. To check I dropped in the drivers, but both these drivers almost fit in but not quite and I checked a few times to make sure that the recess diameter is according to the plan.

I just hope I don't have to make the baffles again 8O

Thanks

[deewan]

I had the same issue on my baffles. Lucky for me I only did one completely cutout of each driver and then tried dropping the driver in the hole. If you still have all your center pivot holes for a jog, just increase the diameter of the driver by 1/16 of an inch and you won’t have any issues. When I dry fit mine, there was a tiny gap between baffle and driver, but I didn’t cover the driver holes when I painted and finished that baffles and the paint clear coat ended up shrinking the diameter of the holes that tiny bit for a perfect fit. If you have already completely cut out your driver holes, like I had for one driver each, I ended up setting the driver into the hole (double and triple checking making sure it was centered) and traces around the driver frame with a mechanical pencil. I then took my router with a 1/2” straight bit set to the correct depth and very slowly manually traced out that circle. I took my time and ended up with a perfect circle. I worked in a counter clockwise direction and just let the router almost pull itself along the wood. I applied very very little pressure, basically just supplying the direct.

Not sure if there is a better fix. If not and you have further questions, feel free to shoot me a PM and we can talk.

[jyqureshi]

This just hit me, I still have the cutout discs and I cut the discs using a 1/2" upcut bit, I can insert the disc back in and use two or three 1/2" MDF pieces to bring the pivot hole to the center, this might work.

[deewan]

I tried that, but never made an cuts since I was never able to get the center hole in the center. But you may have much better luck than me. I would still suggest tracing the driver and watching as you use the jig to make sure you are not offset a little

[ahaik]

In my experience the drivers diameters change slightly from batch to batch.
Also the Jasper jig has a little play when you mount it to the router, I use that play to get a better fit, and I ALWAYS make a test hole first on a piece of scrap.
Asi.

[jyqureshi]

Oh, I sure will do a trace on it then. I will also put some masking tape around the disc to compensate for the waste until it fits tightly. Tonight I will try this, and hit you with PMs if I run into troubles.

[jyqureshi]

In my experience the drivers diameters change slightly from batch to batch.
Also the Jasper jig has a little play when you mount it to the router, I use that play to get a better fit, and I ALWAYS make a test hole first on a piece of scrap.
Asi.

The piece of scrap part I totally missed :cry:

[jyqureshi]

Success!

So I went to home depot and bought Crown Bolt 1 In. x 1/2 Nylon Spacers

Spacers, and Disc taped with three layers of masking tape.



Disc and spacers in place



Then increased the recess diameter from 8 3/4 to 8 13/16.

Before: Flange with 8 3/4 diameter recess



After: Flange with 8 13/16 diameter recess fits snugly



After each use, the spots on the disc that held the spacers had "dimples" so I made sure I put the spacers on a different spot of the disc for my next fix.

Edit: I used 1/2" outer diameter spacers because I used 1/2" spiral upcut bit to cut the holes.

I feel so relieved!8)

[Scottie2H]

nice job with that fix! great idea to use those spacers

[deewan]

Very smart use of the spaces. Well done!

[David_D]

Phweuw!
Crisis obverted!
I'm sure you are relieved. Very resourceful!

[jyqureshi]

Oh man, after so many screw ups, this could have discouraged me completely.

Phew!!

[jeffc]

I am using this! Good idea

[jyqureshi]

Jeffc,

Just make sure you have the right disc and the spacers should be of the same size as the bit you used to cut the hole.

Hope it works for you too.

[jyqureshi]

Hello guys,

Another "little" problem, one of the side was cut about 3/32" short so the corner is not really a corner yet and the cabinet is all glued except for the baffle, will bondo be strong enough to bear the distributed weight of the box on that corner?

Thanks in advance.

[Curt C]

I'd be tempted to use a loaded epoxy such as JB weld.

C

[jyqureshi]

Thanks Curt, I will try this.

[jyqureshi]

Hello everyone again,

Sorry to ask these questions ops:, can someone please tell me which of the bits I need? Just give me the Item#s

For mids: Chamfer/Roundover, but which size?
Chamfer bits
Roundover bits

For woofs:
Chamfer bits
Roundover bits

For Baffle edge rounding: I will be veneering the boxes with one full piece (sides and front)
Roundover bits

Thanks

[deewan]

Depending on if you are using a jig, you can get everything done for the driver cutouts with a straight bit. To roundover the back side of the driver cutouts on the baffle, you should use a 3/4" (#8656). Or you can use a drum sander and a corded drill.

[jyqureshi]

Thanks Deewan,

I will use the 3/4" roundover, using the router leaves a LOT less dust around, of course it's because of excellent DW621 used with a vacuum.

Also, will 3/4" work for the outside edges on the baffle's sides?

[jyqureshi]

I guess I'll go with 3/4" rondover bit for the front cabinet edges.

[Jim Holtz]

I guess I'll go with 3/4" rondover bit for the front cabinet edges.

That's what the original Statements have. :T

Jim

[jyqureshi]

Hello everyone,

I have a question: will Bondo be ruined by iron-on veneer method?

J

[David_D]

nope

[jyqureshi]

Thanks David, by the way I have your Statement Center's album bookmarked as a reference. You did an amazing job in designing the cabinets.

As to anyone curious about my progress, I'm making slow progress as it is my first ever DIY woodworking and speaker project so learning as I go and of course screwing up more often than not.

One of the screw up I did, out of many, was I made the recess circles for center woofers and one of the Statement's mid's a little too big, to fix that I used bondo and then used my "spacer trick with the original disc (post 151)" to set the recess circle the right size. I just didn't have energy to make a new baffle.

I will be posting pictures of the fixes of my screw ups when I get a chance, and I'm being patient and not trying to rush the build.

[soundemon]

That's what the original Statements have. :T

Jim

Would a 1/2" roundover do? or is there a 3/4" roundover bit available anywhere with a 1/4" shank?

[David_D]

Thanks for the props JY. I'm following your build. It's looking great! :T

Soundemon, I don't think you'll find a 3/4 bit with a 1/4 shank. That bit is BIG. I'm sure it's a physics thing about snapping the shaft.
IDK about the 1/2" round over but, 1/2 would be a pain to veneer around. OTOH, it's a good excuse for a heavy router. :W

Cheers
-David

[Jim Holtz]

Would a 1/2" roundover do? or is there a 3/4" roundover bit available anywhere with a 1/4" shank?

Acoustically, I don't think you'll hear a difference between a 1/2" and a 3/4" roundover. However, as David said, it could be a bit more challenging to veneer around. If you select the right variety, it should be doable though.

Jim

[jyqureshi]

Progress is sweet

Hello everyone,

Made lots of progress on Thursday, Saturday and Today.

On Thursday I took the baffles to my boss's house where I used his drill press to make the driver screw holes, took me 3 1/2 hours there 8O. The drill broke down about 70% way through but my boss was able to fix it, kudos to him for that and letting me use it for 3 1/2 hours!

Then on Saturday used 3/4" round over bit to make breathing rooms on the baffles for the drivers, except for the Fountek.

Then on Sunday, used router most of the day again to trim off the excess backs of the Statements, trimmed tunnels' back holes to squarish, attached the outside flares on the Statemnts, attached the chrome feet T-Nuts on the Statements' bases.

Roundover bit magic



T-Nut magic



T-Nut soaked in glue



Statement Center's Back



Tweeter and Mid crossovers in Statement Center cabinet



Three questions:
1. I'm using plastic ties to attach the crossover boards on the braces, will these ties cause any issues? I've made sure they're as tight as possible and there is hardly any wiggle room for the circuit boards.

2. When using wedge foam, what combination of the following do I need to apply:

a. Scallop the wedge foam.
b. Hold back the wedge foam 2" away from outside edge of the baffle.
c. Hold back the wedge foam 2" away from inside edge of the baffle.

3. Did I scalloped too much while making the breathing rooms for the drivers?

Sigh, still so much to do and so little time, but one day I will be enjoying these heavy speakers in my basement and laugh at the mistakes I made during the process...even thinking about this makes me smile :W

Thanks
J

[deewan]

Three questions:
1. I'm using plastic ties to attach the crossover boards on the braces, will these ties cause any issues? I've made sure they're as tight as possible and there is hardly any wiggle room for the circuit boards.

2. When using wedge foam, what combination of the following do I need to apply:

a. Scallop the wedge foam.
b. Hold back the wedge foam 2" away from outside edge of the baffle.
c. Hold back the wedge foam 2" away from inside edge of the baffle.

3. Did I scalloped too much while making the breathing rooms for the drivers?

Thanks
J

1. Plastic ties should cause no problems that I've ever read about.
2. Not sure, leave this one for the experts.
3. 3/4 inch roundover bit should be just fine. :T

[BeerParty]

...but one day I will be enjoying these heavy speakers in my basement and laugh at the mistakes I made during the process...even thinking about this makes me smile :W

That is a good attitude too have, and some nice work on the baffles. I am looking forward to future updates.

[jyqureshi]

Thanks Deewan and Beerparty

Now if somebody please kindly answer my question 2:
2. When using wedge foam, what combination of the following do I need to apply:

a. Scallop the wedge foam.
b. Hold back the wedge foam 2" away from outside edge of the baffle.
c. Hold back the wedge foam 2" away from inside edge of the baffle.

[ThomasW]

1. I'm using plastic ties to attach the crossover boards on the braces, will these ties cause any issues?

The XO board may rattle/buzz against the braces. If the ties are pressing on any component or wires, that could create a problem in the long run

2. When using wedge foam, what combination of the following do I need to apply

None

[BeerParty]

Now if somebody please kindly answer my question 2:
2. When using wedge foam, what combination of the following do I need to apply:

a. Scallop the wedge foam.
b. Hold back the wedge foam 2" away from outside edge of the baffle.
c. Hold back the wedge foam 2" away from inside edge of the baffle.

To expand Thomas' answer a bit...

You don't scallop the wedge foam and you don't hold the wedge foam back from the baffle, just from the driver. It should not touch the driver but should cover as much of the interior in the baffle space as you can.

You scallop the front edges of the 1 inch foam in the mid tunnel, and you hold it back 2 inches from the inside edge of the baffle.

[jyqureshi]

I see what you mean, basically the foam can be around the drivers cutout but not over it, so looking through the cut out while keeping the eye perpendicular to the baffle I should not see any foam in close proximity of the back of the driver.

If any part of the foam should touch the driver I should cut away that part, as it may happen in the Statement Center?

But, I had sent a private message to Jim asking him the same question and here is his reply, and I have seen similar response from him in some other threads:

The 2" wedge foam should be held back from the inside of the front baffle about 2". If the foam is crowding the RS225, scallop it a bit to not obstruct the sound waves from radiating back to the rear of the enclosure and be absorbed by the foam back there.

Essentially, place foam everywhere you see when looking into the cabinet through the driver cutout without crowding the RS225's.

So what I deduce from both replies is that the foam should not obstruct the driver itself and be not in the way of the scalloped breathing area of the driver cutouts.

Is that correct?

J

[Jim Holtz]

I see what you mean, basically the foam can be around the drivers cutout but not over it, so looking through the cut out while keeping the eye perpendicular to the baffle I should not see any foam in close proximity of the back of the driver.

If any part of the foam should touch the driver I should cut away that part, as it may happen in the Statement Center?

But, I had sent a private message to Jim asking him the same question and here is his reply, and I have seen similar response from him in some other threads:So what I deduce from both replies is that the foam should not obstruct the driver itself and be not in the way of the scalloped breathing area of the driver cutouts.

Is that correct?

J

Yes...

Jim

[jyqureshi]

Thanks guys for the help

Made progress today on Statement Center, here is a pic:


I lined the wedge foam 2" away from the baffle's inside edge and then lined the 2" space with 1" parts-express foam, this way most area is covered and the RS drivers are not crowded.

J